ISH All-time Top 25 Guards Project: #2 Kobe Bryant vs Magic Johnson.

[QUOTE=juju151111]Total missed the point if you own evidence. Dumb has hell. It was a motivational tatic. MJ said it himself you dumbass. Phil knows how he ticks. I do agree with you through to an extent. I think Kobe deserves Atleast 4-5 and a few 2nd team. I don't know why this is relevant because a blind man can see Magic has no defense. Go watch any game and I mean any game when he vs a decent Pg.[/QUOTE]

Of course. Tex Winter was hypercritical to his legendary players. Its an exaggeration. It doesn't invalidate 11 all nba awards.

[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]I don't know. I watched the Lakers. I didn't Wesley Johnson play lockdown defense "according to the advanced stats" for one of the worst defenses in the league for 82 games.[/QUOTE]

well i do remember Wesley Johnson locking down Kobe Bryant numerous times last season.......that was probably the reason i had him there.

[QUOTE=JordanTime]Magic Johnson didn't guard opposing teams point guards.

Magic Johnson guarded either the 2,3,4. aka a Versatlie Defender.[/QUOTE]
Stop your horseshit. He guarded mostly pg. I am a MJ too, but stop. Baton lit his ass up mist of the time. He had no lateral movement.

[QUOTE=juju151111]Hmm I watch the lakes too. Ok since you do then you will agree with me that Kobe has turned into a roamer on defense and gives up 3 pointers all the time. He hasn't been solid in about 2-3 years. I mean you watch the lakes right?[/QUOTE]

Roaming is playing defense. Its a strategy, that has resulted in two titles and three years of a top 6 defense for the Lakers. Do you really think if Kobe wanted to sit on top of a guy at the 3 pt line in order avoid "his guy" from scoring at the expense of playing team defense it would make the Lakers a better defensive team?

[QUOTE=juju151111]Stop your horseshit. He guarded mostly pg. I am a MJ too, but stop. Baton lit his ass up mist of the time. He had no lateral movement.[/QUOTE]

Are you kidding me?

Magic Johnson was rarely guarding other team's opposing PG's. He was guarding 2,3,4, while Bryon Scott defended the 1's. C'mon man.

And i didn't say Magic Johnson was a good defender, i said he was a versatile defender.......................BIG DIFFERENCE.

[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot][B]BREAKING NEWS! Tex Winter said Michael Jordan is the worst passer in NBA History!!![/B]

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/8pUmr.png[/IMG]

:facepalm[/QUOTE]

And I care about this why ?

What's does that have to do with Kobe's overrated defense ? Deflection 101 at it's finest. Jordan has nothing to do with this thread. Stay on topic.

[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]Of course. Tex Winter was hypercritical to his legendary players. Its an exaggeration. It doesn't invalidate 11 all nba awards.[/QUOTE]
He wasn't being hypocritical. He clearly says Kobe rests on defense/roam now which is true. The MJ statement was a motivational tactic. How do I know that? MJ isn't the worse passer ever. Even if he was trying to motivate Kobe it didn't work because he kept doing the whole season+ playoffs.

[QUOTE=JordanTime]Are you kidding me?

Magic Johnson was rarely guarding other team's opposing PG's. He was guarding 2,3,4, while Bryon Scott defended the 1's. C'mon man.

And i didn't say Magic Johnson was a good defender, i said he was a versatile defender.......................BIG DIFFERENCE.[/QUOTE]
Nope he had that duty 90% of the time.

[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]Roaming is playing defense. Its a strategy, that has resulted in two titles and three years of a top 6 defense for the Lakers. Do you really think if Kobe wanted to sit on top of a guy at the 3 pt line in order avoid "his guy" from scoring at the expense of playing team defense it would make the Lakers a better defensive team?[/QUOTE]
:facepalm I have no words for how stupid your post is. :rolleyes: Who says Kobe can't play team defense? Kobe isn't some great help defender either. He conserving energy, go watch some 03 Kobe where he did both then come back snd talked to me. You have to recover to your man.

[QUOTE=Legends66NBA7]And I care about this why ?

What's does that have to do with Kobe's overrated defense ? Deflection 101 at it's finest. Jordan has nothing to do with this thread. Stay on topic.[/QUOTE]

Jordan isn't whats relevant. It's Tex Winter's criticism. Do you think Jordan was the worst passer in history because Tex Winter said so?

The problem seems to be people watched Kobe and don't think he's that good of a defender yet head coaches seems to think he is. Any explanation for this?

[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]Of course it does. Kobe's accolades are treated with a fine toothed comb. No other legend gets the same treatment. Do you see anybody really hyped about how many all defensive team awards Michael Jordan [I]really[/I] earned? When he won the DPOY did anybody bother to create some obscure formula like regularized adjusted +/- (RAPM) to find out that the best defensive player was probably some scrub big man who wouldnt even be in the league without his defensive abilities?

The idea of any player Kobe included winning awards based on his past reputation is even remotely controversial. The funny thing is you guys like to pretend this phenomena begins and ends with Kobe. Every single legend in this game has had a reputation that over inflated his perceived skills as their career progressed. Magic made the all star team for a year he didn't even play. He's won a Finals MVP on the basis of a single game.[/QUOTE]

Man you come of as such a homer. But please, do come up with some next Grassy Knowl theory. Formulas alone don't bring things into prespective. Watch the games and put things into context.

Pretend what ?? Did I make those articles come out of no where ? No I did not. You can find all the articles you want to deflect even more on this topic on Kobe's defense and I will stick on it.

The reason Magic made the all-star game was because people wanted to see him play one last time. He had the contraction of HIV. People wanted to see him again.

Oh and his Finals MVP wasn't deserved ?:

25pts 5 reb 9ast 9/12. Lead both teams in points and assists. But yeah he didn't deserve it. Nevermind the fact that MVP didn't matter, it was a damn touching moment to see Earvin Johnson play basketball in the NBA one more damn time.

My goodness, if you don't understand that then you are delousinal. There are moments in basketball history that go beyond that of a damn box score. Can't even believe I have to explain this to you.

[QUOTE=juju151111]:facepalm I have no words for how stupid your post is. :rolleyes: Who says Kobe can't play team defense? Kobe isn't some great help defender either. He conserving energy, go watch some 03 Kobe where he did both then come back snd talked to me. You have to recover to your man.[/QUOTE]

How about 2010 Kobe, when the Lakers were crowned champions on the strength of their defense? How did Rondo do? How did Ray Allen play? Are you telling me Kobe didn't play defense because he roamed off of Rondo?

[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]Jordan isn't whats relevant. It's Tex Winter's criticism. Do you Jordan was the worst passer in history because Tex Winter said so?[/QUOTE]

Bro, you just told me this before:

[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot][B]Hmmmmm NBA coaches [/B]or random internet message board posters???

[B]Which opinion should we value more?[/B]

Hating on Kobe has been a passion for many since he declared for the draft. I would be surprised if you could find any awards he has been given that wasn't accompanied on the net by some random internet message board experts arguing against its selection.[/QUOTE]

You tell me. I will be waitng for more B.S. or deflection. Which ever may come first.

[QUOTE=iamgine]The problem seems to be people watched Kobe and don't think he's that good of a defender yet head coaches seems to think he is. Any explanation for this?[/QUOTE]
There are about three to four seasons I would say Kobe didn't deserve to make an all-defensive team. 2005-2006, 2006-2007, 2009-2010, and 2010-2011. Every other season I would say Kobe was worthy of that All-NBA Defensive spot.

A lot of people get carried away though..