Team possessions per game (pace) divided by team apg = possesions per assist

[QUOTE=iamgine]2014-15 GSW = [COLOR="Red"]4.69[/COLOR]
2014-15 SAS =[COLOR="Red"] 4.52[/COLOR]

Damn these are terrible passing team huh what with Duncan hogging the ball making non-optimal plays.

:roll: :roll: :roll:[/QUOTE]


This possessions per assist stat he's trying to push is a joke. Trying to use it across multiple eras with different rules and strategies is even worse. It's actually embarrassing how much effort he puts into proving nothing. I honestly don't think he's seen any of these guys play ball except in highlights clips.

1. Teams shot higher FG% then (higher fg% more assists, you need to MAKE the shot for the assist to count)



2. Teams shoot more 3's today (a 3 point assist is worth 50% more than a 2 pointer 3 vs 2 etc) but both are only counted as [B]1 assist[/B] even though on average today's assist are worth more


/end thread

3ball loses

This proves that bran isnt a team player and thus a loser. I mean wade>pippen as a passer and jordan>bran too in passing. But instead it was bran who leads apg meanwhile jordan trusted pippen to play off ball.

Stupid argument, it collapses on it's own when you realize according to this a lot of move the ball oriented teams are considered selfish ball hogging ones.

[QUOTE=Bankaii]

And before you pull the whole "Lebron is too ball dominant for anyone else to be a playmaker" bullshit out MJ has a higher usage percentage for his team than Lebron in both the regular season and playoffs.
So despite MJ haven't the ball in hands the most for the Bulls, he still is quite far off from having a higher assist percentage for his team than Bron does for his teams. [/QUOTE]

Surprised to see idiots still confusing USG% and ball dominance. They have little to do with each other. Usage is a measure of FGA/FTA/AST while ball dominance refers to how much clock time a player has the ball in their hands. And Lebron is WORLDS more ball dominant than Jordan ever was.

[QUOTE=3ball]
1990 Bulls: 96.7/26.5 =*3.65
1989 Bulls: 97.0/27.0 =*3.59
1988 Bulls: 95.5/26.2 =*3.65
1987 Bulls: 95.8/26.1 =*3.67
1985 Bulls: 99.4/24.3 =*4.09
[/QUOTE]

Decent work but not sure it really says what you're wanting it to say.

[QUOTE=sam smith]Jordan had spit out the words

[B]2010 Miami Heat - 4.75
2009 Miami Heat - 4.41
2008 Miami Heat - 4.50

2011 Cavaliers - 4.43
2012 Cavaliers - 4.61
2013 Cavaliers - 4.47
2014 Cavaliers - 4.41[/B]

You really need to go out and get a life, dude.

[QUOTE=iamgine]2014-15 GSW = [COLOR="Red"]4.69[/COLOR]
2014-15 SAS =[COLOR="Red"] 4.52[/COLOR]

Damn these are terrible passing team huh what with Duncan hogging the ball making non-optimal plays.

:roll: :roll: :roll:[/QUOTE]

Those numbers aren't right.

[quote=dubeta]

[B]Teams shoot more 3's today[/B] (a 3 point assist is worth 50% more than a 2 pointer 3 vs 2 etc) but both are only counted as 1 assist even though on average today's assist are worth more

[/QUOTE]
You are misunderstanding the stat - the stat measures TEAM POSSESSIONS/TEAM ASSISTS... 3-pointers have nothing to do with it.

And the numbers aren't close - for [COLOR="Navy"][I]every single season[/I][/COLOR] of Lebron's career, his teams assisted [COLOR="Navy"][I]significantly less frequently[/I][/COLOR] than [COLOR="Navy"][I]every season[/I][/COLOR] of MJ's career... Like, the numbers aren't close AT ALL.


[QUOTE=dubeta]

Teams shot higher FG% then (higher fg% more assists, you need to MAKE the shot for the assist to count)

[/quote]
FG% was the same and often worse for MJ's teams, and Lebron's teams still had [COLOR="Navy"][I]significantly less frequent[/I][/COLOR] assists... It's not like the stats are close - Lebron's teams had [COLOR="Navy"][I]significantly less frequent assists for every year of his career[/COLOR][/I].

The data is very clear.. Lebron fans are destroyed by these stats - they prove Lebron-led teams aren't great passing teams.. Period.. Deal with it
.

[QUOTE=bdreason]

I honestly don't think he's seen any of these guys play ball except in highlights clips.

[/QUOTE]
I've played WITH them in actual college games.. That should shut you up


[QUOTE=bdreason]

Trying to use it across multiple eras with different rules and strategies is even worse.

[/QUOTE]
I smell desperation - rules and strategies have nothing to do with it - the formula is [I]team possessions per game/team assists per game[/I]... Possessions per assist.

You can't get any clearer than that.. The stat measures the frequency of assists - it's a clean stat.

It's funny though - we have a huge sample showing that everywhere Lebron went and for every single season of his career, his teams assisted at a FAR less frequent rate than every single season of MJ's career.

[I]It's not like the stats are close - it's a WIDE margin every year.. Every single season, no exception.[/I]

The data is very clear.. Lebron fans are destroyed by these stats - they prove Lebron-led teams aren't great passing teams - Lebron-ball leads to a team that doesn't assist each other very much.. Deal with it

[QUOTE=aj1987][B]2010 Miami Heat - 4.75
2009 Miami Heat - 4.41
2008 Miami Heat - 4.50

2011 Cavaliers - 4.43
2012 Cavaliers - 4.61
2013 Cavaliers - 4.47
2014 Cavaliers - 4.41[/B]

You really need to go out and get a life, dude.[/QUOTE]
3Ball you care to address this? Shouldn't their numbers look better without Bron?

And why did the Bulls have their best season following you fake stat when Jordan was out?

[QUOTE=Bankaii]

3Ball you care to address this? Shouldn't their numbers look better without Bron?

And why did the Bulls have their best season following you fake stat when Jordan was out?

[/QUOTE]
Assist frequency should be better/higher WITH Lebron, and it isn't.

Otoh, when you add the greatest scorer of all time to ANY team, you'd think the assist frequency would go [I]down[/I]... But instead, it remains the same or increased.. (1992 was the Bulls' highest assist frequency)

Why did the Bulls maintain or increase assist frequency despite adding the greatest scorer of all time??.... Because MJ has a higher assisted rate - his off-ball game creates MORE opportunities for teammates to assist, while Lebron's ball-dominance does the opposite.. Lebron's lower assisted rate is a statistical fact.. Like seriously - what's better for a team - a guy getting 30 ppg at a HIGH assisted rate, or a guy getting 30 at a low assisted rate... :rolleyes:

The stats are what they are - virtually every single one of Lebron's teams gets assists at a FAR lower frequency than MJ's teams.. Like, the stats aren't close, and the sample isn't small.. It's every single year of both player's careers.

I only read the first page. Has anyone brought up the differences in team offenses? Fast break opportunities?

[QUOTE=kshutts1]I only read the first page. Has anyone brought up the differences in team offenses? Fast break opportunities?[/QUOTE]
You should be able to see by looking at the data, that there is a huge gap in assist frequency for their ENTIRE CAREERS, which includes many years where the Bulls and the league played at a slower pace (2nd three-peat).

Also, I have yet to calculate the AVERAGE gap in assist frequency for MJ and Lebron's entire careers, but it's huge... In most seasons, MJ's teams assisted 30% more frequently... That's about what the average gap is...

Pace was never 30% faster, nor do we know whether faster pace even results in a higher assist rate... None of this matters anyway - because again - there is a huge gap in assist frequency for their ENTIRE CAREERS, which includes many years where the Bulls and the league played at a slower pace (2nd three-peat).
.

[QUOTE=3ball]Assist frequency should be better/higher WITH Lebron, and it isn't.

Otoh, when you add the greatest scorer of all time to ANY team, you'd think the assist frequency would go [I]down[/I]... But instead, it remains the same or increased.. (1992 was the Bulls' highest assist frequency)

Why did the Bulls maintain or increase assist frequency despite adding the greatest scorer of all time??.[/QUOTE]
Are you even looking your own stats? Everything you just said is horribly wrong.
The Heat went DOWN .20 the years after Lebron JOINED.
The Cavs went UP .35 when Lebron LEFT.
The Cavs went back DOWN .23 when Lebron JOINED again.

Otoh the Bulls IMPROVED by .11 in 1995 when Jordan was OUT from any other season Jordan played(1995 when he missed the season was the lowest, not 1992.)

In case you're too stupid to realize. Lebron's team were worse when he left.
While Jordan's team got better when he left.

Now admit you're a dumbass and your fake stat backfired and did nothing but prove Jordan is more ball dominant than Bron, dumbass.