Was Scottie Pippen at least once robbed for Defensive Player of the Year?

[QUOTE=3ball;13993699]Where are Pippen's legendary defensive plays like MJ, lebron or tayshaun has?

Where are his signature shut-downs as the primary defender?

Why did the Bulls only rank 7th defensively for the 1st three-peat?? And worse than 4 of 6 ECF/Finals opponents?

The answer to these questions is are the same - Pippen is a vastly overrated defender[/QUOTE]

I don't know why you have this agenda against Pippen? It just makes you Jordan fans look insecure and it also makes it look like you just looked at raw boxscore stats without watching the actual games. Even Jordan said it himself "you can't say my name without saying Scottie Pippen".

Also, there's something called "synergy" that is very important in basketball and that's what Jordan\Pippen had at GOAT level, which is far more important than this "carrying to titles" agenda you have.

Now that I think about it, theres not very many players that have had more notable defensive plays and games as Pippen. Definitely not wing players. Hes just overshadowed by Jordan.

[QUOTE=HBK_Kliq_2;13993835]I don't know why you have this agenda against Pippen? It just makes you Jordan fans look insecure and it also makes it look like you just looked at raw boxscore stats without watching the actual games. Even Jordan said it himself "you can't say my name without saying Scottie Pippen".

Also, there's something called "synergy" that is very important in basketball and that's what Jordan\Pippen had at GOAT level, which is far more important than this "carrying to titles" agenda you have.[/QUOTE]

lol Clearly you are not familiar with our dear friend 3ball. He is mentally deranged.

[QUOTE=HBK_Kliq_2;13993835]I don't know why you have this agenda against Pippen? It just makes you Jordan fans look insecure and it also makes it look like you just looked at raw boxscore stats without watching the actual games. Even Jordan said it himself "you can't say my name without saying Scottie Pippen".

Also, there's something called "synergy" that is very important in basketball and that's what Jordan\Pippen had at GOAT level, which is far more important than this "carrying to titles" agenda you have.[/QUOTE]

Great points :applause:

[QUOTE=97 bulls;13993834]One more notable defensive playoff for Pip. Scottie Pippen is 1 of only 2 players in history (Olajuwan being the other) to record 5 or more blocks and 5 steals in 1 playoff game when he had 6 steals and 5 blocks vs the Bad Boy Pistons in the 91 ECF game 1[/QUOTE]

He also averaged nearly 2 blocks per game in the 1997 finals, how many wing players have done that for a final series.

[QUOTE=pauk;7346436]My brain simply can NOT percieve the thought of such a viciously awesome defender (perhaps the greatest perimeter defender and most versatile defender ever) never winning Defensive Player of the Year...

Was it just because of competition maybe? Afterall Hakeem, Dikembe, Robinson, Jordan, Rodman and Payton were around....?

What are your thoughts on this?[/QUOTE]
[url]https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/29150878/he-was-beloved-everybody-how-scottie-pippen-lifted-michael-jordan-chicago-bulls[/url]
10 time all defensive team (current NBA , anyone near that ? )

[QUOTE=Smoke117;13993764]I'm one of those guys that thinks it's a joke when perimeter players get DPOY as they never actually deserve them. Like Gary Payton? If we're talking about impact he wasn't even close to top 10. The DPOY of the year in 96 should have been David Robinson. Pippen was 2 in voting, but he shouldn't have won either. David Robinson basically had the Spurs at 3 on defense all by himself. You know how that's true? When he played 8 games in 97 they dropped to DEAD LAST. Having said that, Scottie Pippen actually DID deserve the DPOY in 95. He carried the bulls defense like no perimeter player ever had. Jordan and Grant were the other 2 best defensive players on Bulls during the first threepeat and he had neither and he had them at 2nd in defense while putting up 3spg and a block. He also led the league in drating. Of course, they gave it to Mutombo who averaged a lot of blocks despite the Nuggets being 13th in defense. It was a complete joke. It becomes an even bigger joke when weaker defenders like Payton and Artest were given the DPOY.[/QUOTE]

[B]This [/B] :applause:

[QUOTE=HBK_Kliq_2;13993835]I don't know why you have this agenda against Pippen? It just makes you Jordan fans look insecure and it also makes it look like you just looked at raw boxscore stats without watching the actual games. Even Jordan said it himself "you can't say my name without saying Scottie Pippen".

Also, there's something called "synergy" that is very important in basketball and that's what Jordan\Pippen had at GOAT level, which is far more important than this "carrying to titles" agenda you have.[/QUOTE]

MJ stans are insecure about MJ. They think if people recognize MJ had a great team with a great second superstar and other greats like Rodman that somehow diminishes or even negates MJ's greatness. It is lunacy but here we are and it only gets worse as the years go by.

Playoff Defensive Rating

Pip = 102
LBJ = 102

MJ = 104 :(

Awards don't mean much - Ron Harper was doing hard work for 2nd three peat & Jordan kept making all defense teams.

Guys acting like Mutombo didnt deserve his awards when he was averaging 12 pts 12 rebs 4 blocks with arguably the Goat interior defense. He was almost single handedly shutting teams down with his play. It was the goat era for defenders so nobody is getting "robbed" if one player gets it over the other because they were all great.

I'm sure I read somewhere the bulls players got off Phil's angries on defence if they said pip told them to .speaks volumes on his defensive accumen.
Better add that is a good thing

[QUOTE=Reggie43;13994361]Guys acting like Mutombo didnt deserve his awards when he was averaging 12 pts 12 rebs 4 blocks with arguably the Goat interior defense. He was almost single handedly shutting teams down with his play. It was the goat era for defenders so nobody is getting "robbed" if one player gets it over the other because they were all great.[/QUOTE]

There's nothing arguable about it. Both David Robinson and Hakeem Olajuwon were better defensive players than him. On that note, Mutombo didn't even defend Robinson and Hakeem one on one. The PF always did because his feet were too damn slow to play any kind of decent defense on them. Anyway, you say he was almost single handedley shutting teams down with his play...they were 14th in defense in 1995. That's beside the point that Pippen was completely carrying the Bulls to 2nd in the league in defense...AS A PERIMETER DEFENSIVE PLAYER. Go look at that line up if you want to talk about carrying a defense. If there was a time for a perimeter player to win DPOY it was 1995. Scottie Pippen was robbed plain and simple.

Wasn't that the year Mutumbo had arguably the greatest defensive sequence of all time when he logged like 4 blocks in one play?

[QUOTE=Smoke117;13994371]There's nothing arguable about it. Both David Robinson and Hakeem Olajuwon were better defensive players than him. On that note, Mutombo didn't even defend Robinson and Hakeem one on one. The PF always did because his feet were too damn slow to play any kind of decent defense on them. Anyway, you say he was almost single handedley shutting teams down with his play...they were 14th in defense in 1995. That's beside the point that Pippen was completely carrying the Bulls to 2nd in the league in defense...AS A PERIMETER DEFENSIVE PLAYER. Go look at that line up if you want to talk about carrying a defense. If there was a time for a perimeter player to win DPOY it was 1995. Scottie Pippen was robbed plain and simple.[/QUOTE]

Mutombo not defending Robinson and Olajuwon one on one is such a lie, its all available online with a quick youtube search. It easy to make a case for Pippen but lying about Mutombo's defense as if he was a bradley or Eaton type of defender is pretty pathetic

[QUOTE=Reggie43;13994380]Mutombo not defending Robinson and Olajuwon one on one is such a lie, its all available online with a quick youtube search. It easy to make a case for Pippen but lying about Mutombo's defense as if he was a bradley or Eaton type of defender is pretty pathetic[/QUOTE]

Except there is barely anything because he barely ever actually defended them as they were just too quick for him. He was a Mark Eaton type. That he has four DPOY and Robinson only has one is laughable.

[QUOTE=Smoke117;13994383]Except there is barely anything because he barely ever actually defended them.[/QUOTE]

[video=youtube_share;ZFEvxc6W9To]https://youtu.be/ZFEvxc6W9To[/video][video=youtube_share;mUtJmDgIFI8]https://youtu.be/mUtJmDgIFI8[/video]

You just proved my point for me. Go find more. Exactly. I’m telling you...he regularly played off them instead of defending them straight up.

[QUOTE=Smoke117;13994390]You just proved my point for me. Go find more. Exactly. I’m telling you...he regularly played off them instead of defending them straight up.[/QUOTE]

Prove your point about what? That games like these are obviously rare? (actually found two more for both players) Both games Mutombo defends them straight up with limited help easily exposing you as a shitty liar.

Reggie 1 smoke 0.lol

Team A: 2nd in defense, defensive rating of 104.3
Team B: 14th of 27 teams in defense, defensive rating of 108.2

Team B has the DPOY? :biggums:

Should have been Pippen.

But let's not pretend Mutombo wasn't a great defensive player. He was outstanding.

Playing with MJ probably cost Scottie one or two DPOY awards. Of course, it also won him a few rings, so you might consider that a fair trade.

The NBA in the 90's was enjoying new heights of popularity and profitability. Jordan was their cash cow, and the league was milking him as much as they could. Jordans face was in every NBA promotion, and we were told that he was the greatest of all time, the consummate competitor, and every time the Bulls were playing it was must-see-TV, or you risked missing history being made. With that mindset, they couldn't really let Scottie win DPOY, could they? One of Jordans teammates winning an award would take a little shine off of MJ himself, and the league wasn't going to allow that.

[QUOTE=baudkarma;13994580]Playing with MJ probably cost Scottie one or two DPOY awards. Of course, it also won him a few rings, so you might consider that a fair trade.

The NBA in the 90's was enjoying new heights of popularity and profitability. Jordan was their cash cow, and the league was milking him as much as they could. Jordans face was in every NBA promotion, and we were told that he was the greatest of all time, the consummate competitor, and every time the Bulls were playing it was must-see-TV, or you risked missing history being made. With that mindset, they couldn't really let Scottie win DPOY, could they? One of Jordans teammates winning an award would take a little shine off of MJ himself, and the league wasn't going to allow that.[/QUOTE]

This is a genuinely stupid conspiracy theory.

Maybe the media didn't want to give it up to Scottie. Then again they did vote him in the top 3 the year before, ahead of Patrick and Shaq and Malone (I'd have had him in top 2).

Dikembe blocks shots. Led the league the season before with crazy number and didn't even make the 2nd team (not that that's wrong).

Scottie doesn't do that and they weren't that good as a team that year.

[QUOTE=Whoah10115;13994582]Dikembe blocks shots. Led the league the season before with crazy number and didn't even make the 2nd team (not that that's wrong).

Scottie doesn't do that and they weren't that good as a team that year.[/QUOTE]

They were a better team than the Nuggets and were much better defensively.

Mutumbo was a one way player which is what capped him in all-NBA, especially since Hakeem, Robinson, Ewing, Shaq, Mourning all played C during his prime.

[QUOTE=Punpun;7346437]He fell to the hype machine that Jordan was. AKA, Jordan the ballhog stole a Dpoy from Pippen.[/QUOTE]

Jordan wasn't playing in 1994 and not long enough in 1995.

Now what?

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;13994608]They were a better team than the Nuggets and were much better defensively.

Mutumbo was a one way player which is what capped him in all-NBA, especially since Hakeem, Robinson, Ewing, Shaq, Mourning all played C during his prime.[/QUOTE]

Again, Scottie doesn't stand under the rim for legendary blocks. Dikembe blocks shots, and despite having like 4.5 a game or something the year before, didn't even make the 2nd All-Defensive Team.

[QUOTE=Whoah10115;13994635]Again, Scottie doesn't stand under the rim for legendary blocks. Dikembe blocks shots, and despite having like 4.5 a game or something the year before, didn't even make the 2nd All-Defensive Team.[/QUOTE]

Mutumbo wasn't doing this while he stood under the rim:

[IMG]https://thumbs.gfycat.com/HeartfeltHarshIlladopsis-size_restricted.gif[/IMG]

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;13994656]Mutumbo wasn't doing this while he stood under the rim:

[IMG]https://thumbs.gfycat.com/HeartfeltHarshIlladopsis-size_restricted.gif[/IMG][/QUOTE]
That’s one of the most absurd basketball highlights I’ve ever seen :lol

Unreal defense

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;13994656]Mutumbo wasn't doing this while he stood under the rim:

[IMG]https://thumbs.gfycat.com/HeartfeltHarshIlladopsis-size_restricted.gif[/IMG][/QUOTE]

At this point you're just not interested in talking. I said he should have won, but that the reason he was given the shaft had nothing to do with the league protecting the Jordan brand, because that's an actual stupid thing to think.

Ibaka was 1st Team All-Defense three consecutive seasons because they called him Iblocka. Shouldn't have been on a non-existent 3rd team, at least two of those times. Iguodala shits on him. But he got it, because he blocks shots.

[QUOTE=RRR3;13994658]That’s one of the most absurd basketball highlights I’ve ever seen :lol

Unreal defense[/QUOTE]

Yup, but unfortunately there is no stat to capture that so according to some it doesn't help the team win .:lol

[QUOTE]I said he should have won, but that the reason he was given the shaft had nothing to do with the league protecting the Jordan brand[/QUOTE]

Agreed.

I keep trying to tell you guys, Pippen was not as highly regarded back then (1994/1995) as he is today which perfectly explains his lack of votes.

Here is a quick sample of what people said in the 90's about Pippen's defense:

[B][U]1994 poll of NBA coaches:[/U][/B] [B]Best one-on-one defender: Bull forward Scottie Pippen (six votes) edged Spur forward Dennis Rodman (four). [/B]Olajuwon, Blaylock and Sonic guard Gary Payton (two votes each) were the only other players chosen by more than one coach. "Rodman used to be the guy. but he's slipped—he doesn't like to go too far from the basket anymore," says a Western coach, I think [B]Pippen can disrupt more than Rodman.[/B]

[url]http://vault.sportsillustrated.cnn.c...4903/index.htm[/url]

[B]Phil Jackson[/B]''A lot of people watch who score and that's wonderful,'' said Bulls Coach Phil Jackson. ''But [B]Scottie Pippen's defense is a one-man wrecking crew.[/B] He plays 48 feet at every position, both sides of court.''

[url]http://www.nytimes.com/1997/06/14/sports/let-us-now-praise-pippen.html?scp=3&sq=Scottie%20Pippen&st=cse[/url]

[QUOTE=RogueBorg;13994749]I keep trying to tell you guys, Pippen was not as highly regarded back then (1994/1995) as he is today which perfectly explains his lack of votes.[/QUOTE]

He still was robbed. That's the point.

[B][U]Jerry Sloan/New York Times:[/U] [/B]Scottie Pippen was buzzing John Stockton like an annoying gnat in the backcourt, filling the passing lanes the way Coach Jerry Sloan wishes his players would and taking a charge from Karl Malone under the basket. On the next Utah Jazz possession, Pippen caused more havoc.

[B]''He is probably the only guy in basketball who draws offensive fouls anymore,'' Sloan said [/B]today. ''He had a ton of them last night, I think eight or nine. That was about as good a display of being able to step up and take a charge as you'll see.''

Pippen, a roving linebacker in high-tops, is using the finals to [B][U]reaffirm his position as the game's most complete and chaos-inspiring defensive player[/U]. [/B]On Sunday night, [B]he was largely responsible for the lowest scoring total in National Basketball Association history since the advent of the shot clock, when the Chicago Bulls pulverized the Jazz, 96-54[/B], to take a two-games-to-one lead in the four-of-seven-game series.

Pippen roamed the floor, spreading his 6-foot-7-inch angular body from player to player on the Jazz roster.[B] Twenty-six Utah turnovers and an unprecedented finals rout later, everyone wanted to know how one player could cause such disruption.[/B]

He has obliterated the criticism he once received for not being physical enough. [B]This post-season alone, he shut down Charlotte's Glen Rice in the second round and discombobulated the Pacers' offense in the Eastern Conference finals.[/B]

[url]http://www.nytimes.com/1998/06/09/sp...art.html?sec=&[/url]

[B][U]Sports Illustrated/and MJ: [/U][/B]CHICAGO (AP) -- Say this for Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen's supporting cast, they're not stupid.

Ask any one of the Chicago Bulls whether Jordan or Pippen deserves the MVP award for the NBA Finals, and they come back with the most decisive of non-decisive answers.

"Both," Steve Kerr said, smiling. "Co-MVPs."

Jordan has won the MVP in each of Chicago's five championship seasons. But [B]even His Airness admits the Bulls might not be up 3-1 over the Utah Jazz -- let alone even in the finals -- if not for Pippen's smothering defense.[/B]

Pippen is a mainstay with Jordan on the NBA's All-Defensive team. But he's cranked his defense up a notch in the playoffs, disrupting Indiana's offense and squeezing off Utah's famed pick-and-roll.

[B]"Scottie Pippen is the reason, a major reason, why we're here," Jordan said Thursday. "He's a unique and creative type of player offensively and defensively. And [U]the harmony between the two of us is incomparable. You can't compare it to anything.[/U] That's taken time to deliver and trust each other to where we compliment each other."[/B]

[url]http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/bas...jordan_pippen/[/url]

[B][U]Karl Malone:[/U][/B] ''He could be the best defensive player playing,'' Malone said.

[B][U]Michael Jordan: "There is one guy in the league who can guard me. Fortunately he is on my team.[/U][/B]

[QUOTE=97 bulls;13994763]He still was robbed. That's the point.[/QUOTE]

No one thought he was robbed of anything

Only you 30 years later looking up his drtg on bballref

It's hard to overstate how dumb that is on various levels

Anyway, enough with you goat haters... I'm about to play ball myself.. I'll be playing before lebron

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;13994764][B][U]Jerry Sloan/New York Times:[/U] [/B]Scottie Pippen was buzzing John Stockton like an annoying gnat in the backcourt, filling the passing lanes the way Coach Jerry Sloan wishes his players would and taking a charge from Karl Malone under the basket. On the next Utah Jazz possession, Pippen caused more havoc.

[B]''He is probably the only guy in basketball who draws offensive fouls anymore,'' Sloan said [/B]today. ''He had a ton of them last night, I think eight or nine. That was about as good a display of being able to step up and take a charge as you'll see.''

Pippen, a roving linebacker in high-tops, is using the finals to [B][U]reaffirm his position as the game's most complete and chaos-inspiring defensive player[/U]. [/B]On Sunday night, [B]he was largely responsible for the lowest scoring total in National Basketball Association history since the advent of the shot clock, when the Chicago Bulls pulverized the Jazz, 96-54[/B], to take a two-games-to-one lead in the four-of-seven-game series.

Pippen roamed the floor, spreading his 6-foot-7-inch angular body from player to player on the Jazz roster.[B] Twenty-six Utah turnovers and an unprecedented finals rout later, everyone wanted to know how one player could cause such disruption.[/B]

He has obliterated the criticism he once received for not being physical enough. [B]This post-season alone, he shut down Charlotte's Glen Rice in the second round and discombobulated the Pacers' offense in the Eastern Conference finals.[/B]

[url]http://www.nytimes.com/1998/06/09/sp...art.html?sec=&[/url]

[B][U]Sports Illustrated/and MJ: [/U][/B]CHICAGO (AP) -- Say this for Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen's supporting cast, they're not stupid.

Ask any one of the Chicago Bulls whether Jordan or Pippen deserves the MVP award for the NBA Finals, and they come back with the most decisive of non-decisive answers.

"Both," Steve Kerr said, smiling. "Co-MVPs."

Jordan has won the MVP in each of Chicago's five championship seasons. But [B]even His Airness admits the Bulls might not be up 3-1 over the Utah Jazz -- let alone even in the finals -- if not for Pippen's smothering defense.[/B]

Pippen is a mainstay with Jordan on the NBA's All-Defensive team. But he's cranked his defense up a notch in the playoffs, disrupting Indiana's offense and squeezing off Utah's famed pick-and-roll.

[B]"Scottie Pippen is the reason, a major reason, why we're here," Jordan said Thursday. "He's a unique and creative type of player offensively and defensively. And [U]the harmony between the two of us is incomparable. You can't compare it to anything.[/U] That's taken time to deliver and trust each other to where we compliment each other."[/B]

[url]http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/bas...jordan_pippen/[/url]

[B][U]Karl Malone:[/U][/B] ''He could be the best defensive player playing,'' Malone said.

[B][U]Michael Jordan: "There is one guy in the league who can guard me. Fortunately he is on my team.[/U][/B][/QUOTE]

Great job Rock.

I think the job Pippen did vs Utah in that game was just as impactful as a guy dropping 50+ pts. I think he accounted for 16 of the Jazz 26 TOs. He was everywhere that night.

[QUOTE=3ball;13994768]No one thought he was robbed of anything

Only you 30 years later looking up his drtg on bballref

It's hard to overstate how dumb that is on various levels

Anyway, enough with you goat haters... I'm about to play ball myself.. I'll be playing before lebron[/QUOTE]

Lol yeah right. On a video game.

[QUOTE=97 bulls;13994763]He still was robbed. That's the point.[/QUOTE]

I agree

[QUOTE=3ball;13994768]No one thought he was robbed of anything

Only you 30 years later looking up his drtg on bballref

It's hard to overstate how dumb that is on various levels

Anyway, enough with you goat haters... I'm about to play ball myself.. I'll be playing before lebron[/QUOTE]

But said GOAT says the same thing about Pippen.

See...this is why you suck. Now ignore refuting me, as you are keen to do.