ISH: Where MJ and Shaq allegedly had a higher peak than Wilt Chamberlain

[QUOTE=Deuce Bigalow]Ok, you guys can stick to your high amount of weight Wilt could pick up.

But, lets talk about vertical because we actually have picture of Wilt.

40"+ vertical looks like

[IMG]http://dallaspenn.com/pics/albums/album02/spudwebb1.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://images.mylot.com/userImages/images/postphotos/2345247.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i1.squidoocdn.com/resize/squidoo_images/250/draft_lens9187791module81279371photo_1264468455vince_carter_vertical.jpg[/IMG]

Please no bullshit quotes, or that one video that makes me lol everytime cavs or jlolber uses[/QUOTE]
[IMG]https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-WtOXPzNdgQM/T0xwAy-SLYI/AAAAAAAADFA/uW-0_meZdeM/s800/Corbis-U1257039.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-SmzQLSELikw/UExn_Pq-AmI/AAAAAAAADnI/lAKbmCWEfpo/s800/IMG_3884.jpg[/IMG]

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW][IMG]https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-WtOXPzNdgQM/T0xwAy-SLYI/AAAAAAAADFA/uW-0_meZdeM/s800/Corbis-U1257039.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-SmzQLSELikw/UExn_Pq-AmI/AAAAAAAADnI/lAKbmCWEfpo/s800/IMG_3884.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]


Solid 20" vert:bowdown:

[IMG]http://ww1.prweb.com/prfiles/2007/02/05/502880/WiltChamberlainKansas2.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://www.texarkanagazette.com/Entertainment-Blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/wilt-dunking.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://img.spokeo.com/public/900-600/wilt_chamberlain_1971_01_01.jpg[/IMG]

Clearly not 40"

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW][IMG]https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-WtOXPzNdgQM/T0xwAy-SLYI/AAAAAAAADFA/uW-0_meZdeM/s800/Corbis-U1257039.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
Why post this one? It obviously an angle from the ground looking up
Nothing is even close to level.

[QUOTE=Deuce Bigalow][IMG]http://ww1.prweb.com/prfiles/2007/02/05/502880/WiltChamberlainKansas2.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://www.texarkanagazette.com/Entertainment-Blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/wilt-dunking.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://img.spokeo.com/public/900-600/wilt_chamberlain_1971_01_01.jpg[/IMG]

Clearly not 40"[/QUOTE]
:facepalm :roll:

[IMG]http://img607.imageshack.us/img607/4376/michaeljordan.jpg[/IMG]

2 can play this game. Same logic, MJ = "Clearly not 40". In fact, looks like he can barely squeak it over the rim! Gotta love cherry picking images.

[QUOTE=Deuce Bigalow]Why post this one? It obviously an angle from the ground looking up
Nothing is even close to level.[/QUOTE]
:oldlol: all the pics u posted are from "the ground looking up" genius

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]:facepalm :roll:

[IMG]http://img607.imageshack.us/img607/4376/michaeljordan.jpg[/IMG]

2 can play this game. Same logic, MJ = "Clearly not 40". In fact, looks like he can barely squeak it over the rim! Gotta love cherry picking images.[/QUOTE]
Except I can find dozens of him at the rim

[IMG]http://blitzsportsnetwork.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Michael-Jordan-vertical-3.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://www.nbadunks.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/MichaelJordan1985.jpg[/IMG]

[QUOTE=Deuce Bigalow]Ok, you guys can stick to your high amount of weight Wilt could pick up.

But, lets talk about vertical because we actually have picture of Wilt.

40"+ vertical looks like

[IMG]http://dallaspenn.com/pics/albums/album02/spudwebb1.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://images.mylot.com/userImages/images/postphotos/2345247.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i1.squidoocdn.com/resize/squidoo_images/250/draft_lens9187791module81279371photo_1264468455vince_carter_vertical.jpg[/IMG]

Please no bullshit quotes, or that one video that makes me lol everytime cavs or jlolber uses[/QUOTE]

Perception. Do you not realise that vertical jumps appear greater the smaller the person is?

:oldlol: at you posting pics of 5"7 Spud Webb IN A DUNK COMPETITION, 6"5 Jordan after a LOOONG run up with his legs bent back IN A DUNK COMPETITION, and T-Mac sitting on someones ****ing shoulders!! Not disingenuous at all :banana:

There should be no debate about it: Wilt Chamberlain had the best peak ever.

The man was dominant.

Btw, the WIP video is superb. Keep up the great work.

The guy two posts above me mistook FUC[COLOR="Black"]K[/COLOR]ING VINCE CARTER for T-Mac.

:yaohappy:

[QUOTE=oolalaa]Perception. [B]Do you not realise that vertical jumps appear greater the smaller the person is?[/B]

:oldlol: at you posting pics of 5"7 Spud Webb IN A DUNK COMPETITION, 6"5 Jordan after a LOOONG run up with his legs bent back IN A DUNK COMPETITION, and T-Mac sitting on someones ****ing shoulders!! Not disingenuous at all :banana:[/QUOTE]
No, that is not true at all

vertical is how far you leave the ground. Doesn't matter how tall, 40" off the ground will look like 40" off the ground if that is what they have. Spud's is nearly 50".

Wilt doesn't have a 40" vert.Hell, some of you old poeple think Wilt had a 50" vert :roll:

Who gives a shit what his vertical is? :facepalm

[QUOTE=Punpun]The guy two posts above me mistook FUC[COLOR="Black"]K[/COLOR]ING VINCE CARTER for T-Mac.

:yaohappy:[/QUOTE]

They're ****ing cousins, give me a break!! :oldlol: They look eerily similar in that photo. Even with you saying that it's hard to tell.

[QUOTE=oolalaa]They're ****ing cousins, give me a break!! :oldlol: They look eerily similar in that photo. Even with you saying that it's hard to tell.[/QUOTE]

Dude, no. This is one of the most iconic dunk ever. The DUNK OF DEATH BRUH. HE DUNKED OVER A 7"0+ guy . OVER HIM. During the olympics.

Carter.

:bowdown:

[QUOTE=oolalaa]They're ****ing cousins, give me a break!! :oldlol: They look eerily similar in that photo. Even with you saying that it's hard to tell.[/QUOTE]


You talking about the Vince Olympic dunk???

Its up there with the most famous dunks ever:oldlol:

[QUOTE=WillC]Who gives a shit what his vertical is? :facepalm[/QUOTE]

Jlauber.

[QUOTE=oolalaa]They're ****ing cousins, give me a break!! :oldlol: They look eerily similar in that photo. Even with you saying that it's hard to tell.[/QUOTE]

....but it's arguably the most iconic dunk of the 2000s. Everyone knows it's Vince Carter.

So, apparently, there is a black hole in my memory :cry: My only defense is that I wasn't heavily into hoops in the early 2000s.

Jordan would have averaged like 38-46 ppg/10+ reb/7+ ast back then depending on the season and would have had games of 80+ points a few times. Not sure why you don't think it's debatable that he, Shaq, and possibly KAJ had better peaks.

[QUOTE=OldSchoolBBall]Jordan would have averaged like 38-46 ppg/10+ reb/7+ ast back then depending on the season and would have had games of 80+ points a few times. Not sure why you don't think it's debatable that he, Shaq, and possibly KAJ had better peaks.[/QUOTE]

But Jordan [B]didn't[/B] play back then :facepalm

I haven't seen a lot of that footage, but man Wilt was a monster of a man.

You see him take Kareem to school a few times in that video, pretty cool.

[QUOTE=OldSchoolBBall]Jordan would have averaged like 38-46 ppg/10+ reb/[B][U]7+ ast [/U][/B]back then depending on the season and would have had games of 80+ points a few times. Not sure why you don't think it's debatable that he, Shaq, and possibly KAJ had better peaks.[/QUOTE]

MJ's assists would be less had he played in the 60's, not more. '85-'90 is probably the most assist inflated era in league history. Those years are to assists what the 60's were to rebounds. During the 60's only 2 players ever reached double digit assists for a season (Guy Rogers and Big O), and the high was 11.48apg. From '85-'90, which includes MJ's highest assist seasons, multiple players were topping 12apg, maxing out at 14+, and doing it in less than 40mpg. It took Big O 45mpg to reach his 11 assists.

[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/ast_per_g_yearly.html[/url]

[QUOTE=jlip]MJ's assists would be less had he played in the 60's, not more. '85-'90 is probably the most assist inflated era in league history. Those years are to assists what the 60's were to rebounds. During the 60's only 2 players ever reached double digit assists for a season (Guy Rogers and Big O), and the high was 11.48apg. From '85-'90, which includes MJ's highest assist seasons, multiple players were topping 12apg, maxing out at 14+, and doing it in less than 40mpg. It took Big O 45mpg to reach his 11 assists.

[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/ast_per_g_yearly.html[/url][/QUOTE]

I never suggested MJ would average 10+ assists (unless he was scoring only 25-33 ppg instead of 40+ ppg), but he would almost certainly average 7 assists simply due to the defensive attention he would draw as well as his aggressive playing style.

[QUOTE=PHILA][URL="http://wiltfan.tripod.com/chat.htm"]http://wiltfan.tripod.com/chat.htm[/URL]


[I][FONT=Comic Sans MS]NBA legend Wilt Chamberlain 4-18-97

Host Chris_MSNBC2 says:
M3 says:
Question for Wilt...watched you bench press about 465 lbs [B][SIZE=4]l[/SIZE][/B][SIZE=3][B][SIZE=4]i[/SIZE]ke it was a match stick[/B][/SIZE] at the Stanford gym when you were working out there for some reason...how much can you still push up?

Host Wilt_Chamberlain says:
Well, probably I can push up a little more than that right now, because I was bench pressing some great weights. I was a shot-putter and lifting weights was a great joy to me. I liked to show off, I don't do that anymore, but I could probably bench press more than 465 pounds now.[/FONT][/I][/QUOTE]

You know what? Wilt is the Chuck Norris of basketball. :roll:

Taking into account competition, impact, all-around skills, postseason play, and intangibles (leadership, play in crunchtime, etc) - it's still MJ.

[QUOTE=kuniva_dAMiGhTy]Taking into account competition, all-around skillset, impact, postseason play, and intangibles - leadership, play in crunchtime, etc - it's still MJ.[/QUOTE]
:oldlol: nope - MJ has no case here

OP doesn't understand peak. Wilt's was nowhere near the level of Shaq's or Jordan's. If you want to talk about careers, longevity or individual talent, sure. Wilt is somewhere in the mix. But peaks? Wilt shouldn't be in the conversation. #3 at the absolute best. Shaq's and Jordan's peak years were utter dominance.

[QUOTE=OldSchoolBBall]Jordan would have averaged like 38[B]-46[/B][B] ppg[/B]/10+ reb/7+ ast back then depending on the season and would have had games of 80+ points a few times. Not sure why you don't think it's debatable that he, Shaq, and possibly KAJ had better peaks.[/QUOTE]
:biggums:


Ridiculous. No. Peak MJ would be lucky to average Baylors partial season avg of 38ppg for a full season on slightly better efficiency in "Wilt's era". 46ppg is stupid to even suggest. MJ's peak is not miles beyond Oscars, or Baylors, or Barry's, or Jerry West's. You transport him into the era with increased offensive charge calls or particularly the few seasons with a narrower lane the guy is not going to be touching 40 points per game that is a totally baseless and random number you came up with.

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]:oldlol: nope - MJ has no case here[/QUOTE]

Don't be a fool.

[QUOTE=shaq2000]OP doesn't understand peak. Wilt's was nowhere near the level of Shaq's or Jordan's. If you want to talk about careers, longevity or individual talent, sure. Wilt is somewhere in the mix. But peaks? Wilt shouldn't be in the conversation. #3 at the absolute best. Shaq's and Jordan's peak years were utter dominance.[/QUOTE]
Shattering the record book by a mile and putting it so far out of reach that it still stands today with no challengers ever coming close isn't utter dominance? :oldlol:

[QUOTE=kuniva_dAMiGhTy]Don't be a fool.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNRo6RJNq6s[/url]

[QUOTE=OldSchoolBBall]Jordan would have averaged like 38-46 ppg/10+ reb/7+ ast back then depending on the season and would have had games of 80+ points a few times. Not sure why you don't think it's debatable that he, Shaq, and possibly KAJ had better peaks.[/QUOTE]First he'd have to learn to dribble the ball correctly. Jordan would be called for every violation known to mankind the way the game was called in the 60's. Traveling, palming, carry over. 75% of his moves would be illegal. Every crossover would result in a tweeeeet

MJ's per 36 minutes ppg in '87 was 33 ppg.

Regarding Wilt's 50 point seasons...his per 36 minutes ppg was 'only' 37 ppg. Adjust that for pace it would be much lower. If you factor that by playing 48 minutes means he also played in a lot of garbage minutes against 60's scrubs it would be lower still. Nice stamina though...

If Wilt was way better than Shaq and MJ, then where do you rank George Mikan in comparison to them?

I really could not give a **** what his vertical leap was or how much he could bench press.

Watch the guys college games. The way he explodes in the air on a block attempt and runs up and down the court is out of this world. It's not how high he could jump, it's how he did it with such quickness. Just the way he could move around the court, jump, and run were comparable to a guard. Wilt would still kill the NBA today.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/SXDDZ.png[/IMG]

[IMG]http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/002TeaMeJUedn/653x.jpg[/IMG]
Wilt after this playing days.

[IMG]http://sports.popcrunch.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/nba_g_oneal2_400.jpg[/IMG]
34-35 year old Shaq. I didn't want to post any of the Phoenix, Cleveland, or Boston pics..just not pretty.

Wilt took care of himself. The guy could have played into his 40's. Teams offered him contracts years after his retirement.
If you are 7'1" why do you need to jump more than 30-40 inches off the ground..not necessary, but Wilt does show it in some of the footage out there. A guy that is 5'7" or 6'6" needs every inch to get up higher, but a 7 footer doesn't have to jump that high for a 10 foot goal. Use some logic guys. Maybe if the basket was 12 or 13 feet high ok.

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]:biggums:


Ridiculous. No. Peak MJ would be lucky to average Baylors partial season avg of 38ppg for a full season on slightly better efficiency in "Wilt's era". 46ppg is stupid to even suggest. MJ's peak is not miles beyond Oscars, or Baylors, or Barry's, or Jerry West's. You transport him into the era with increased offensive charge calls or particularly the few seasons with a narrower lane the guy is not going to be touching 40 points per game that is a totally baseless and random number you came up with.[/QUOTE]

Hey look, it's one of those 20-somethings who think it's cool to go against the grain and be 100% all about the old school players. We get it. You know your history. But to suggest MJ's peak wouldn't average even close to 40 ppg in an era where teams were getting an absurd amount of possessions (and just assuming he wouldn't adjust to the different rules) is just stupid. I mean at his scoring best he was averaged 33-37 ppg, so to suggest he wouldn't even touch 40 in the 60s is ignorant.

Wilt's peak is right up there at the top for me. It's Wilt, Shaq, and Jordan in some order. But come on dude, you can like the players that actually played in your lifetime, too. You don't have to be that extreme with your old school love.

Sports fans in general are usually moronic. No respect for the history of the game or other eras, just "my era is the best era" kind of bullshit that will make them cry when the same uninformed morons from another generation will call MJ overrated and say he played in a weak era.

The disrespect of Wilt on this board is flat out embarrassing.

[QUOTE=ThunderStruk022]Hey look, it's one of those 20-somethings who think it's cool to go against the grain and be 100% all about the old school players. We get it. You know your history. But to suggest MJ's peak wouldn't average even close to 40 ppg in an era where teams were getting an absurd amount of possessions (and just assuming he wouldn't adjust to the different rules) is just stupid.

Wilt's peak is right up there at the top for me. It's Wilt, Shaq, and Jordan in some order. But come on dude, you can like the players that actually played in your lifetime, too. You don't have to be that extreme with your old school love.[/QUOTE]
MJ is oldschool too dipshit. And i've defended MJ many times on this forum but this specific topic is just a :facepalm

One man owns the recordbook by a mile and his name wasn't MJ, nor was it Shaq. People are making up so many excuses for MJ and / or Shaq. I'm only pointing out the obvious.

Being by far the best player on a winning team trumps stats.

It's kind of like if someone was running the 100m and was blowing everyone out of the water then near the end his legs just broke off and he fell to the ground. People would forever be saying, "But if he had finished, it would have been legendary."

Others would say, "He didn't."

-Smak