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[QUOTE=tpols;14028136]You dont need to be GOAT to beat Lebron.
Dwight did it and is barely top 50.[/QUOTE]
Dwight "held" LeBron to 38.5 PPG on 59.1 TS%, so it's a weird stance to act like his defense was affecting LeBron in that series. Obviously there were other factors at play. Maybe Ewing would be able to hold LeBron to 35 PPG...
i mean... hakeem was obviously better than ewing. just quicker and more skilled.
but pippen was easy work for him sans jordan.
and that's the point.
[QUOTE=tpols;14028149]i mean... hakeem was obviously better than ewing. just quicker and more skilled.
but pippen was easy work for him sans jordan.
and that's the point.[/QUOTE]
Are you under the impression the best players on each team just play 1 on 1 to determine which team wins? Because you post like it.
Let's throw Smits in there too.
[U]Ewing vs. Hakeem[/U]
1994 Finals:
Hakeem 27/9/4 56% TS
Ewing 19/12/2 39% TS
[U]Ewing vs. Mourning[/U]
1997 ECSF:
Ewing 24/12/1 52% TS
Mourning 19/9/1 50% TS
1999 1st round:
Ewing 15/11/1 48% TS
Mourning 22/8/1 57% TS
Ewing past his prime by 99' but Knicks blow a 3-1 lead in 97'.
[U]Ewing vs. Smits[/U]
1993 1st round:
Ewing 24/11/1 51% TS
Smits 23/8/2 61% TS
1994 ECF:
Ewing 22/11/3 54% TS
Smits 16/6/1 55% TS
1995 ECSF (the "finger roll" series):
Ewing 19/9/3 53% TS
Smits 23/6/1 65% TS
So Hakeem crushed Ewing in their one meeting, the year Ewing was MVP (and Hakeem, and Shaq, and Robinson, and Kemp, and Malone--everybody but Pippen).
Mourning and Ewing split those series, Ewing winning when still elite.
Smits, nominally Indiana's #2 option, actually outplayed the GOAT Ewing in Ewing's prime in 2 of 3 series. Maybe Smits should have won some MVP's?
[QUOTE]Are you under the impression the best players on each team just play 1 on 1 to determine which team wins? Because you post like it.[/QUOTE]
Yup. :lol
not at all. But the teams were of similar strength and Ewing clearly outplayed "MVP" pippen in that series.
in the words of nasir, it aint hard to tell.
[video=youtube;DI-DRbf_AZk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DI-DRbf_AZk[/video]
Listen to that bro and free your mind. All time classic.
Released in 1994 NYC.
:rockon:
Outplayed by Rik Smits twice in a playoff series but he's better than LeBron James :roll: :roll: :roll:
Inb4 tpols tells us Rik Smits was a superstar :lol
I've already heard that album.
I still can't believe Rik friggin' Smits shat on prime Ewing in two different series :roll:
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;14028098]Yup! :rockon:
It is bizarre. You could argue Ewing was better career wise or peak versus peak but they are contesting literally Pippen's peak years of 1994-1996. Their accolades tell the tale.
[U]1994[/U]
Pippen: 1st team all-NBA, 390 MVP votes, 7 first place votes (3rd in MVP)
Ewing: no all-NBA, 255 MVP votes, 1 first place vote (5th in MVP)
[U]1995[/U]
Pippen: 1st team all-NBA, 83 MVP votes, 1 first place vote (7th in MVP)
Ewing: no all-NBA, 230 MVP votes, 1 first place vote (4th in MVP)
[U]1996[/U]
Pippen: 1st team all-NBA, 226 MVP votes (5th in MVP)
Ewing: no all-NBA, no MVP votes (even Rodman and Terrell Brandon got votes)
Pippen was better in 95' and 96' than even these suggest. His MVP voting was dragged down by MJ coming back in 95' (which obscured him leading his team in every category--no stats doe). In 96' his stats were much better 2/3 through the season before he started having injury problems. If he stayed healthy he probably finishes 3rd. At any rate, if a "sidekick" is top 5 in MVP that is rare and speaks volumes.
1994-1996 VORP: Pippen 19.9, Ewing 12.1
1994-1996 BPM: Pippen 7.2, Ewing 3.5
1994-1996 PER: Pippen 22.2, Ewing 21.9
1994-1996 WS: Pippen 35.3, Ewing 29.4
1994-1996 TS %: Pippen 55.1%, Ewing 54.1% (a center lower?!)
How about covering 1992-1997? Both players were at an all-NBA level at the front and back end of this time frame.
1992-1997 VORP: Pippen 37.1, Ewing 25.1
1992-1997 BPM: Pippen 6.2, Ewing 3.6
1992-1997 PER: Ewing 21.8, Pippen 21.4
1992-1997 WS: Pippen 69.6, Ewing 62.8
1992-1997 TS %: Ewing 54.7%, Pippen 54.6%
Pippen has the clear edge again. When Pippen is ahead it is by a lot; when Ewing is ahead he noses ahead.
Keep in mind Pippen's stats were deflated by playing with MJ. It is no coincidence his two best statistical years were 1994 and 1995. Ewing, though, played in a context designed to maximize his stats.[/QUOTE]
94-97 Pippen was the only player unanimiously chosen first team all defense by every single coach. The ONLY player chosen first team all defense BY EVERY OPPOSING COACH. No other player has ever had that accolade. He was even voted first team all defensive team despite only playing half the season in 98, even. lol
How often does the supposed "MVP" get outplayed head to head and outsted in the playoffs by the 5th (?) best player then on comparably talented squads?
If Pippen was so much better than Ewing (or at all), explain Ewing beating him in the playoffs and outplaying him head to head in said playoff round.
When does that happen to other MVPs?
You can't have it both ways either and laugh at the Knicks in other threads for being a weak squad and having Starks as the no.2 option, and now try and weasel that back by saying "bu bu bu but Oakley, Harper!" because you're on the losing end of this argument. Especially when Toni Kukoc is the only reason the series was even competitive.
If Ewing isn't that great, what does it say then that he outplayed and beat Pippen head to head in the playoffs.
In 1995, another playoff oppurtunity where Pippen could have showed himself to be a top end player with Jordan clearly being rusty Pippen basically got outplayed by Horace Grant and to evens with Penny Hardaway.
Again how often does this happen to supposed MVP caliber players?
[QUOTE=RRR3;14028148]Dwight "held" LeBron to 38.5 PPG on 59.1 TS%, so it's a weird stance to act like his defense was affecting LeBron in that series. Obviously there were other factors at play. Maybe Ewing would be able to hold LeBron to 35 PPG...[/QUOTE]
To be fair, Dwight played lockdown defense on LeBron. LeBron couldn't get past Dwight. Remember Dwight picking LeBron up at half court and shadowing him?
[QUOTE]Outplayed by Rik Smits twice in a playoff series but he's better than LeBron James [/QUOTE]
Including in a series where his team committed the cardinal sin: winning 55 games and losing in 7 in the ECSF. Except he was actually outplayed by his match up (Pippen's match up went 8/3 or something) and missed the series winning finger roll.
[QUOTE]94-97 Pippen was the only player unanimiously chosen first team all defense by every single coach. The ONLY player chosen first team all defense BY EVERY OPPOSING COACH. No other player has ever had that accolade. He was even voted first team all defensive team despite only playing half the season in 98, even. lol[/QUOTE]
:applause:
Let's recap some of the bad faith arguments Pippen haters/MJ stans advanced:
*Playoff efficiency is king, therefore Pippen must suck but less efficient players like Robinson and Ewing (despite being centers) are better than him. Efficiency is irrelevant to them. It only counts for Pippen.
*Pippen can't be MVP because his team lost in the 2nd round--but Robinson and Shaq can be despite losing in the first round to lower seeds (Shaq actually swept). Robinson choking his way from 30 PPG on 58% TS to 20 PPG on 47%? Doesn't matter. Playoff results only count for Pippen. Why did he go from 22 PPG on 54% TS to 23 PPG on 52% TS in the playoffs?
*Pippen can't be MVP because of the Bulls' offense, even though it was better than the Rockets and Knicks' offense. Offense doesn't count for Hakeem and Ewing, only Pippen.
*Ewing>Pippen because the Knicks with a full deck won 57 games and the Bulls losing MJ won 55. The Knicks losing 3 games losing nobody>the Bulls declining 2 games losing the guy all these posters swear is GOAT at his peak.
*Pippen can't be MVP because the Bulls lost their division, but Robinson and Shaq can be despite losing theirs.
*Shawn Kemp, the second option on his team, deserved more MVP votes than Pippen.
*Ewing was MVP because he anchored the #1 defense--but the quality of that defense is irrelevant to Pippen's ECSF. Why didn't Pippen match MJ's great efficiency against the Knicks the previous year (spoiler: he was more efficient)?
*Karl Malone, on the 5th seed, deserved it over Pippen. 53 wins adding Hornacek>55 wins losing MJ.
*55 wins isn't enough to be MVP, but 56 because your team added Rodman or even 50 adding Penny is enough for other players. Or 57 or 58. Just don't give me "55."
*Because the Bulls sucked without Pippen and that reduced their win total, that is strong evidence Pippen was not valuable.
*Because the Bulls' offense sucked without Pippen and that reduced their season long offensive rank (still better than NY and HOU :lol ), that is evidence of Pippen not being valuable.
Did I miss any? These are the flat out bad faith arguments. I'm not even getting to the bad ones, like Pippen was a scrub but somehow was #1 in all-NBA and crushing prime Malone in first team forward voting.
It's just so eh how this conversation goes. Just stats being thrown at each other. No one talks basketball.
[QUOTE=RRR3;14028165]I still can't believe Rik friggin' Smits shat on prime Ewing in two different series :roll:[/QUOTE]
I didn't include 1998 because Ewing was past his prime but here is what happened:
Ewing 14/8/1 on 41% TS
Smits 17/6/1 on on 51% TS
Smits had his number.
Ewing played Parish in 88':
Parish 14/12/1 47% TS
Ewing 19/13/3 56% TS
Ewing outplayed him but was outscored by Gerald Wilkins and Johhny Newman on his own team.
Forgot this 1993 series against rookie Mourning:
Ewing 26/11/3 52% TS
Mourning 24/10/2 52% TS
Almost a wash, despite Mourning being a rookie and Ewing in his prime.
Ewing never faced Shaq, Daughtery, or Robinson in the playoffs.
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;14028275]I didn't include 1998 because Ewing was past his prime but here is what happened:
Ewing 14/8/1 on [B]41% TS[/B]
Smits 17/6/1 on on 51% TS
Smits had his number.
Ewing played Parish in 88':
Parish 14/12/1 47% TS
Ewing 19/13/3 56% TS
Ewing outplayed him but was outscored by Gerald Wilkins and Johhny Newman on his own team.
Forgot this 1993 series against rookie Mourning:
Ewing 26/11/3 52% TS
Mourning 24/10/2 52% TS
Basically a wash, despite Mourning being a rookie and Ewing in his prime.
Ewing never faced Shaq, Daughtery, or Robinson in the playoffs.[/QUOTE]
Jesus Christ. When the playoffs rolled around, he turned into PatBRICK Ewing.
They like to talk efficiency but bizarrely compare his to a SF (for one series against what they hail as a ATG defenses in the next post). Here are apples to apples, prime versus prime comparisons with Smits, Daughtery being added to the party for TS (RS efficiency in parentheses). These are the best offensive centers of the 90's:
[U]By eFG% (adjusts for 3’s being worth more)[/U]
Ewing 88’-97’: 48.3% (51.6%)
Hakeem 86’-97’: 53.8% (51.5%)
Robinson 90’-98’: 48.1% (52.5%)
Shaq 94’-05’: 56.2% (58.0%)
Mourning 94’-00’: 49.4% (53.0%)
[U]By TS%[/U]
Ewing 88’-97’: 52.8% (56.3%)
Robinson 90’-98’: 54.9% (59.0%)
Shaq 94’-05’: 56.7% (58.4%)
Mourning 94’-00’: 54.8% (58.7%)
Hakeem 86’-97’: 57.8% (55.8%)
Smits 94'-99': 55.5% (55.5%)
Daughtery 88'-94': 58.8% (59.2%)
If I am a Ewing partisan (even if on behalf of MJ), I don't plant my flag on an argument over playoff efficiency...in TS, he is 2% behind his closest comp and 6% behind the top of the class.
I don't feel like looking up Smits' or Daughtery's eFG% but anyone is free to do so. It seems TS % is the coin of realm here.
Yeah that's pretty sad.
98 playoffs? Is that the one after Ewing got shoved to the floor by Ervin Johnson and messed up his wrist, missing the last 56 games, the entire 1st round series, and even Game 1 against Smits and the Pacers?
That's a series where Patrick choked?
RRR3; isn't a great thing to laugh alongside a guy as useless as that. Talk about a lack of context.
[QUOTE]Talk about a lack of context.[/QUOTE]
Which your own post excludes. :lol
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock][B]I didn't include 1998 because Ewing was past his prime[/B] but here is what happened[/QUOTE]
Don't get the faux holier than thou stance. We have for weeks heard Ewing partisans (MJ stans cloaked as Ewing sympathizers but whatever) invoke playoff efficiency over one series against a perimeter player. A key plank of the argument for Ewing>Pippen is precisely that--in this very thread.
What's the matter? People actually fact checking Ewing's now? Where was your pearl clutching for those dozens of posts from a range of posters for weeks? There can't be one set of rules for Pippen, and free passes for every other contemporary of his.
This is the play: when the fact checking shows up, shut down the debate. :rolleyes:
There's no excuse for a 41% TS.
[QUOTE=RRR3;14028296]There's no excuse for a 41% TS.[/QUOTE]
So then what it does it say when Pippen got beat by this player head to head and outplayed in that series head to head?
All this from this thread alone, which revolves entirely around efficiency in one series against what--by their own glowing admission--was the #1 defense.
[QUOTE]got locked down and knocked out of the playoffs by Knicks in second round[/QUOTE]
Response to this:
[QUOTE]Ether.[/QUOTE]
Another response:
[QUOTE]I love Pip but this post will be ignored by the MJ haters.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]Pippen can never win MVP because he's not a dynamic enough of a scorer and he's not efficient enough[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]He didn't even score over 25 points in the second round. Not even once, and he was extremely inefficient.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]while outplaying Pippen head-to-head in their playoff round where Ewing's team beat Pippen's en route to the NBA Finals.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]On top of that Ewing beat Pippen head to head in the playoffs while outplaying him in that series[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]I'd rather be in the Finals than bounced in the 2nd round, maybe if Scottie was actually in fact a better player than Ewing he would have outplayed Ewing[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]His team had a better record, beat Pippen's team head to head[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]Patrick Ewing was better than Scottie Pippen that year, beat him in the playoffs while outplaying him soundly[/QUOTE]
I'm happy to adapt to the rules of engagement but we can't have one set of rules for one player and another for every other player in history...
[QUOTE=Soundwave;14028303]So then what it does it say when [B]Pippen got beat by this player head to head[/B] and outplayed in that series head to head?[/QUOTE]
Pippen didn't play center. Watch some 90's basketball kids. He was a SF. An old Bill Cartwright and Luc Longley were Ewing's match ups (congratulations, he could outplay them. What happened against real competition?). Pippen played Charles Smith (who was 8/3 or something).
By your own logic, Smits>Ewing since he routinely outplayed Ewing head-to-head (for real head-to-head, not Fantasy Island H2H). Rookie Mourning=93' Ewing. Etc.
What is the next #badfaith goal post move?
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;14028307]Pippen didn't play center. Watch some 90's basketball kids.
By your own logic, Smits>Ewing. Rookie Mourning=93' Ewing. Etc.[/QUOTE]
Pippen needed to play center to not get outplayed by Ewing and beaten by him the playoffs?
He also got outplayed by Horace Grant the next year in the 95 playoffs and played pretty close to even by a 2nd year Penny Hardaway.
You want to claim to be MVP, you should not be getting beat by the league's 5th best player one year and then equalled/bettered by two non-top 10 players the next season in your peak prime years.
That's not supposed to happen to MVP players. MVP players should dominate that level of competition.
Paging Whoa. See, now this invites scrutiny of Ewing's match ups. Decimated by Hakeem. Outplayed routinely by Rik freaking Smits. Matched by Mourning as a rookie. Contained by Parish.
:lol Grant outplayed Pippen now. Confusing TP? The previous TP was Penny.
[QUOTE]That's not supposed to happen to MVP players. MVP players should dominate that level of competition.[/QUOTE]
This is laughable. Use your own logic on other players.
Horace Grant did outplay Pippen in the Bulls-Magic 1995 playoff series. That doesn't happen to MVP caliber players.
If you want to laugh at Ewing for "sucking", sure OK, you realize that makes you look stupid when Ewing was the one who beat Pippen head to head and out played him when they went mano-e-mano in the 1994 playoffs.
That's not supposed to happen if Pippen was in fact a better player.
Grant roasted Kukoc. Pippen held him in check. These clowns blaming Pippen. :lol
[U]1994 1st Round[/U]
Robinson 20/10/4 47% TS (down from 30/11/5 58% in the RS.)
Spurs lose 3-1 to a lower seed.
[U]1994 Finals[/U]
Ewing 19/12/2 39% TS
Ewing outplayed by Derek Harper, John Starks, and crushed by Hakeem.
[U]1991 Vs. Bulls[/U]
Ewing 17/10/2 on 47% TS
Ewing has a game score of 8.9. Pippen 17.7, Grant 10.9, Armstrong 10.8, Jordan 26.1. Kiki Vandewedhe outscores Ewing on 59% TS.
I'm not even going to bother continuing. You saw the Smits, Mourning info. Robinson has many skeletons in the closet.
Jordan fans still can't formulate an honest, consistent argument. :lol
[QUOTE] Ewing was the one who beat Pippen head to head [/QUOTE]
On Fantasy Island. In the real world he played Cartwright and Luc Longley. :oldlol:
So in Scottie Pippen world, Scottie never loses if the best player on the other team is playing a different position?
That's how it works now?
Pippen was the "man" on the '94 Bulls. Ewing was the "man" on the 94 Knicks.
They had similar levels of supporting cast. Ewing beat Pippen and outplayed him on top of that. Ewing was the better player in that series.
Them's the facts.
Pippen should have stepped up in the 95 playoffs and elevated to an MVP level of play ... he clearly did not in that Magic series. Why? Because he's not capable of doing that. 40% shooting when the team really needed him in that series. Gonna blame Kukoc for that too or is that another excuse?
[QUOTE]40% shooting when the team really needed him in that series. MVP caliber my ass.[/QUOTE]
The hypocrisy is stunning. MJ stans are pathetic. :lol This is the same guy who for pages praised a center who went 39% on TS in the NBA finals (all the team needed was 40% for a ring--too much to ask for a MVP center?) and another center who shot 41% in a first round collapse with a 56 win team. It is as stunning as shameless.
Paging, Whoah. Whoah?
MJ stans: everybody outplayed Pippen! Penny! Penny! Penny had a lower GS in both Bulls-Magic series. Everybody is better than Pippen! Kemp! Mourning! Miller! This is why Pippen's stock has risen on ISH. You guys are so ridiculous it boosts him. How long before we here Tyrone Hill>Pippen?
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;14028333]The hypocrisy is stunning. MJ stans are pathetic. :lol This is the same guy who for pages praised a center who went 39% on TS in the NBA finals (all the team needed was 40% for a ring--too much to ask for a MVP center?) and another center who shot 41% in a first round collapse with a 56 win team. It is as stunning as shameless.
Paging, Whoah. Whoah?
MJ stans: everybody outplayed Pippen! Penny! Penny! Penny had a lower GS in both Bulls-Magic series. Everybody is better than Pippen! Kemp! Mourning! Miller! This is why Pippen's stock has risen on ISH. You guys are so ridiculous it boosts him. How long before we here Tyrone Hill>Pippen?[/QUOTE]
Ewing did outplay Pippen in the 94 Bulls Knicks series.
Grant did outplay Pippen in the 95 Bulls Magic series as the best 2nd player on either team and Penny was pretty damn close to even.
You want to dispute that?
[QUOTE=Soundwave;14028326]They had similar levels of supporting cast.[/QUOTE]
What a gem here. So he says the 94' Bulls without Jordan had=supporting cast to the 94' Knicks. Boys and girls, if this is true, and you add Jordan to the Bulls that means the Knicks, the Bulls' top competition, was...
A) Equal to the Bulls
B) Far inferior--they were equal without MJ so with the "GOAT" they>>>the Knicks.
You tell me? Should we do a poll on this?
Yes, we get it. Every 90's all-star>Pippen. Not a word on Ewing, Robinson, or the others. Ewing outplayed by Derek Harper and John Starks in a NBA finals. Nothing. He isn't useful to MJ stans' agenda for the finals, is he? Robinson melts down. Nothing. Smits owns Ewing. Nothing. Pippen, Pippen, Pippen from the most rattled fan base on the planet.
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;14028336]What a gem here. So he says the 94' Bulls without Jordan had=supporting cast to the 94' Knicks. Boys and girls, if this is true, and you add Jordan to the Bulls that means the Knicks, the Bulls' top competition, was...
A) Equal to the Bulls
B) Far inferior--they were equal without MJ so with the "GOAT" they>>>the Knicks.
You tell me? Should we do a poll on this?
Yes, we get it. Every 90's all-star>Pippen. Not a word on Ewing, Robinson, or the others. Pippen, Pippen, Pippen from the most rattled fan base on the planet.[/QUOTE]
The Knicks weren't the Bulls top competition, they were one of the teams that were up there by virtue of being in the same conference, but they could never beat the Bulls with Jordan. None of that is nothing new or amazing. No one ever claimed the Knicks were a dream team. Defensively they were elite, but not offensively.
If Pippen is a better player than Ewing, the Bulls should win that series. Part of being an MVP is actually playing like one when the chips are on the table.
Please do point out where I said every 90s All-Star was better than Pippen, I never said that. Patrick Ewing though? Yes, he was a better player than Scottie Pippen, sorry if that ruffles your panties.
[QUOTE]Part of being an MVP is actually playing like one when the chips are on the table.[/QUOTE]
This is embarrassing. Jordan fans are so dishonest they can't even see their hypocrisy. This is why I am for LeBron. To destroy this trash fan base so hopefully they disappear.
Pippen gets overrated in these conversations to replace MJ as Goat, which is the real agenda. Yeah, Pippen was a very good HOFer, but he was not elite and on Hakeem, Shaq, Barkley or David Robinson's level.
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;14028344]This is embarrassing. Jordan fans are so dishonest they can't even see their hypocrisy. This is why I am for LeBron. To destroy this trash fan base so hopefully they disappear.[/QUOTE]
Good luck with that because that's never going to happen, but yeah stan for a b*tch that goes running any time he doesn't have an actual top 10 player on his squad minimum.
If that was the way the NBA was in the 90s, Jordan would have far more titles if players were just bailing on teams the moment any situation got too hard. That's not what I watch pro sports for.
Go ahead and answer the question, did Pippen out play Ewing in '94 playoffs? Did he outplay Grant in '95 Magic series? Should he have?
You seem to not want to touch that one.
[QUOTE=Marchesk;14028345]Pippen gets overrated in these conversations to replace MJ as Goat, which is the real agenda. Yeah, Pippen was a very good HOFer, but he was not elite and on Hakeem, Shaq, Barkley or David Robinson's level.[/QUOTE]
Yes, that is the real agenda. Pippen being good exposes MJ as a fraud. Get a grip. What an insecure fan base.
Barkley was 10th in MVP and 2nd team all-NBA in 94'.
David Robinson? Per the standards of MJ stans themselves, he is a fraud. 41% shooting from a C, going from 30 PPG to 20 PPG in the playoffs and losing in the 1st round with a 56 win team?
Of course, if you are a MJ stan, simply move the goal posts. One set of rules for Pippen; another for everybody else. That is the only way the fragile Jordanstan ecosystem survives.
Pippen! Pippen! Pippen! Are MJ stans as jealous of Pippen as MJ was? MJ stans don't want to do any analysis of any other 90's players. Why not? You guys aren't shamed by blatant hypocrisy. Let's go series by series, line by line.
I'll start. What's the explanation for Rik Smits dominating Ewing routinely?
How many times is this dude going to be called out for his agenda and then label everyone not agreeing with his ruse a jordan stan?
Is Pippen some irreplaceable legend that is in a class of his own :roll:[I][/I]
Pippen is overrated by Roundball Rock. He was not better than Barkley, Robinson, Malone, 90s Shaq, or even Ewing.
Pippen is underrated by 3Ball. He was better than just an average replacement player obviously. He was a good player.
These two need to just rent a room and have some hate sex. Spare the rest of the forum.
LOL at that meltdown Soundwave had at the mere mention of LeBron. SHOOK.
In all seriousness, Roundball_Rock is the most disingenuous person I've seen here.
He should be banned. Has never watched anything. Just picks stats to try and push an agenda.
"Jordan fans Jordan fans".
Trash.
Pippen! Pippen! Pippen!
Why are MJ stans terrified of examining other players using the standards put forward by MJ stans themselves? MJ stans are always quick to point to how every 90's star was better than Pippen! So what is the fear here? Put others under the same microscope and they, unlike the fraud Pippen, will come out smelling like a rose, right?