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[QUOTE=Da_Realist]And a lot of them were at their absolute best in the 90's. Including Charles Barkley.[/QUOTE]
Actually I remember when Charles Barkley said he was a better player on the sixers than he was on the Suns of few years back on the Stephen A. Smith Show.
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers]Actually I remember when Charles Barkley said he was a better player on the sixers than he was on the Suns of few years back on the Stephen A. Smith Show.[/QUOTE]
Maybe, but he was with the Sixers through 1992. That Sixers team couldn't get over the hump (Celtics then Pistons then Bulls) and were surpassed even by the Knicks so his numbers may not attest to this, but he was a better player in the early 90's than he was in the late 80's. Physically? Maybe not. But overall? It's no question.
It's sort of an exercise in futility, anyway. I think the late 80's were closer in similarity to the early 90's than it was to the early-to-mid 80's thanks to the Detroit Pistons challenging the status quo on how to win championships.
Gone were the free passing offenses with jump shooting forwards and excessive running up and down the court. Detroit changed all that. All of a sudden, sayings like "defense wins championships" and "no layups" came into vogue. Not to say previous champions didn't play defense, but it wasn't the [I]focus[/I] like it was with Detroit. That was the only way they could win so they made it their hallmark. Chicago learned from that. Even though they had MJ, Chicago became the best defensive team in the league during their run. Teams realized they didn't need a dynamic 6'9" point guard and a HOF center or a clutch do-everything small forward playing with the best frontcourt in history to win the title. They were a little hard to come by anyway. So they focused on defense.
As much as I hated Detroit growing up, I've come to realize they were trailblazers in a way. They forever changed the way teams thought they could win championships. So I don't think we can accurately divide the two eras at year 1990, but rather at year 1988. 1990 was just like 1989 and 1988 in terms of the style of play, but 1988 was very different than 1987 and before.
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers]Actually I remember when Charles Barkley said he was a better player on the sixers than he was on the Suns of few years back on the Stephen A. Smith Show.[/QUOTE]
[B]Its true because when you reach your 30s your speed, potence, agility and leaping ability decreases but in the positive edge you are more mature and experienced so you make batter desicions.
A Players Physical Prime: 21-29 yrs of age
A Players Game Prime: 26-32 yrs of age
A Players Last Glimpses: 32-36
A Players Stubborness: 36 beyond[/B]
[QUOTE=Da_Realist]Maybe, but he was with the Sixers through 1992. That Sixers team couldn't get over the hump (Celtics then Pistons then Bulls) and were surpassed even by the Knicks so his numbers may not attest to this, but he was a better player in the early 90's than he was in the late 80's. Physically? Maybe not. But overall? It's no question.
It's sort of an exercise in futility, anyway. I think the late 80's were closer in similarity to the early 90's than it was to the early-to-mid 80's thanks to the Detroit Pistons challenging the status quo on how to win championships.
Gone were the free passing offenses with jump shooting forwards and excessive running up and down the court. Detroit changed all that. All of a sudden, sayings like "defense wins championships" and "no layups" came into vogue. Not to say previous champions didn't play defense, but it wasn't the [I]focus[/I] like it was with Detroit. That was the only way they could win so they made it their hallmark. Chicago learned from that. Even though they had MJ, Chicago became the best defensive team in the league during their run. Teams realized they didn't need a dynamic 6'9" point guard and a HOF center or a clutch do-everything small forward playing with the best frontcourt in history to win the title. They were a little hard to come by anyway. So they focused on defense.
As much as I hated Detroit growing up, I've come to realize they were trailblazers in a way. They forever changed the way teams thought they could win championships. So I don't think we can accurately divide the two eras at year 1990, but rather at year 1988. [B]1990 was just like 1989 and 1988 in terms of the style of play, but 1988 was very different than 1987 and before.[/B][/QUOTE]
That is BS. The NBA didn't just change their style of play in 1 year.
1987 League Average: 109.9 PPG...48 FG%
1988 League Average: 108.2 PPG...48 FG%
1989 League Average: 109.2 PPG...47.7 FG%
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers]They also dominated in the 80's. That's what made that era so great.
Guys who dominated the 90's like Charles Barkley, Michael Jordan, Hakeem, Ewing also dominated the 80's.
Barkley had seasons averaging 25-28 PPG while grabbing 12-15 RPG during the 80's. Jordan was MVP and DPOY in '88 also ROY in '85 and was ALL NBA First team 1987-1989. Hakeem reached the NBA Finals in 1986 and ALL NBA First team threw 1987-1989. Patrick Ewing averaged 20 PPG and 9 RPG during the 80's. Karl Malone was a top 3 PF in the NBA during the late 80's.
Now look at players drafted in the mid 90's. Kobe Bryant, Steve Nash, & Kevin Garnett didn't make much noice in the 90's. Rookies in the 90's did not make impact like rookies in the 80's.[/QUOTE]
how about shaq (arguably the best center ever) 2 finals appearances all nba
multiple times in the 90s or mutombo 2 time dpoy in the 90s penny hardaway 2 finals appearances chris webber alonzo mourning grant hill iverson
like i said in a previous post there are exceptions to every rule but there are some 90s drafted players that dominated that era
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers]That is BS. The NBA didn't just change their style of play in 1 year.
1987 League Average: 109.9 PPG...48 FG%
1988 League Average: 108.2 PPG...48 FG%
1989 League Average: 109.2 PPG...47.7 FG%[/QUOTE]
its funny how you read what you want to read. i believe he was more or less saying that the pistons played a style of ball that was played in the 90s and were very sucessfull against the lakers and celtics thus starting a trend. i firmly believe that the pistons were BETTER than the lakers in 88 and would have won had it not been for thomas ankle.
[QUOTE=guy]You say this is because the 80s drafted players had much bigger impacts right away then the 90s drafted players as your evidence that the 90s was weaker. But couldn't the 80's drafted players faster impacts have just occurred cause the 70s drafted players were much weaker? That should be a possibility. Either way, I'll agree with you, that the 80s drafted players are easily the greatest, but I don't see how that makes the 90s weaker, since the majority of those players played in the 90s.[/QUOTE]
exactly
[QUOTE=97 bulls]how about shaq (arguably the best center ever) 2 finals appearances all nba
multiple times in the 90s or mutombo 2 time dpoy in the 90s penny hardaway 2 finals appearances chris webber alonzo mourning grant hill iverson
like i said in a previous post there are exceptions to every rule but there are some 90s drafted players that dominated that era[/QUOTE]
[B]Only Shaq made a strong impact compared to the others maybe Iverson and Hill (although this guy lasted only about 6 seasons, he would have been the new Pippen). The rest of the players including Webber, Kidd, Garnett, Duncan etc could only dream of reaching the level Jordan, Barkley, Hakeem, Malone, Stockton and others had in the late 80s and early 90s. Its a fact that the 80s was the era where Most Talent was Drafted and you can even include Magic and Bird since they are 1979-80 right in there[/B]
[QUOTE=97 bulls]how about shaq (arguably the best center ever) 2 finals appearances all nba
multiple times in the 90s or mutombo 2 time dpoy in the 90s penny hardaway 2 finals appearances chris webber alonzo mourning grant hill iverson
like i said in a previous post there are exceptions to every rule but there are some 90s drafted players that dominated that era[/QUOTE]
80's Hakeem, MJ, and Barkley, K. Malone > 90's Shaq, Iverson, Hardaway, Hill
And most of the players you mention were in their prime in the 90's. The Only players you mentioned that were great in the 90's and 00's were Iverson and Shaq.
[QUOTE=97 bulls]how about shaq (arguably the best center ever) 2 finals appearances all nba
multiple times in the 90s or mutombo 2 time dpoy in the 90s penny hardaway 2 finals appearances chris webber alonzo mourning grant hill iverson
like i said in a previous post there are exceptions to every rule but there are some 90s drafted players that dominated that era[/QUOTE]
Shaq didn't have 2 finals appearances in the 90's nor did Penny Hardaway. Chris Webber didn't have a breakout season until '99, and Alonzo Mourning's first great season was also '99 and that Iverson's first great season also.
[QUOTE=Da_Realist]Nah... they weren't injured. I've been watching the 88 series all week. Danny Ainge was injured, but that was it. The Big 3 were not injured. The Pistons were just a better team that year.[/QUOTE]
Yes they were, they just sucked it up and played, so it's not clearly observeable. I mean players back in the day are tougher than the players these days, who, you know, eat bad hamburger and get sick.
[QUOTE=nycelt84]Shaq didn't have 2 finals appearances in the 90's nor did Penny Hardaway. Chris Webber didn't have a breakout season until '99, and Alonzo Mourning's first great season was also '99 and that Iverson's first great season also.[/QUOTE]
i stand corrected on the finals appearances, however, i was replying to the assumption that players drafted in the 90s didnt have an immediate impact on the league similar to the players in the 80s. webber was widely regarded as one if the top pf in the league from from his rookie season. and he put up stats similar to barkleys if you account for pace. hardaway was one regarded as the next magic johnson and would have put up similar stats if he played in the faster tempo 80s. iverson never had a bad season from his rookie until now. and the fact is none of the 80s players won just like none of the 90s players, some were close, just like some were close in the 80s. THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE.
[QUOTE=BrianScalabrine]Yes they were, they just sucked it up and played, so it's not clearly observeable. I mean players back in the day are tougher than the players these days, who, you know, eat bad hamburger and get sick.[/QUOTE]
they may have had nagging injuries but all players are hurt in some way shape or form.
[QUOTE=BrianScalabrine]Yes they were, they just sucked it up and played, so it's not clearly observeable. I mean players back in the day are tougher than the players these days, who, you know, eat bad hamburger and get sick.[/QUOTE]
That's just an excuse. Nobody, except Ainge, was hurt until DJ hurt his back late in Game 5 and Robert Parish hurt his knee in Game 6. The Pistons were already way on their way by then. And Kevin Mchale actually had a pretty good series. The Celtics weren't hurt, they just got beat.
[QUOTE=Da_Realist]That's just an excuse. Nobody, except Ainge, was hurt until DJ hurt his back late in Game 5 and Robert Parish hurt his knee in Game 6. The Pistons were already way on their way by then. And Kevin Mchale actually had a pretty good series. The Celtics weren't hurt, they just got beat.[/QUOTE]
I agree '88 Pistons > '88 Celtics
But the Celtics were past their prime by '88. They relied to much on their starting 5 in the late 80's. They had no bench what so ever. That's one of the reasons they lost the '87 Finals because their lack of bench.
[QUOTE=97 bulls]i stand corrected on the finals appearances, however, i was replying to the assumption that players drafted in the 90s didnt have an immediate impact on the league similar to the players in the 80s. webber was widely regarded as one if the top pf in the league from from his rookie season. and he put up stats similar to barkleys if you account for pace. hardaway was one regarded as the next magic johnson and would have put up similar stats if he played in the faster tempo 80s. iverson never had a bad season from his rookie until now. and the fact is none of the 80s players won just like none of the 90s players, some were close, just like some were close in the 80s. THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE.[/QUOTE]
[B]To Compare Webber to Barkley is a disrespect to to Basketball. Thats like comparing Bryant to Jordan. This is what Barkley did to Webber:rolleyes: [/B]
[url]http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=cAdMW4Hi8yI[/url]
[B]And this is Charles in his 30s, he was no longer in his Physical Prime:) [/B]
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers]I agree '88 Pistons > '88 Celtics
But the Celtics were past their prime by '88. They relied to much on their starting 5 in the late 80's. They had no bench what so ever. That's one of the reasons they lost the '87 Finals because their lack of bench.[/QUOTE]
im just curious, who on the 88 version of the celtics were past their prime?
[QUOTE=97 bulls]i stand corrected on the finals appearances, however, i was replying to the assumption that players drafted in the 90s didnt have an immediate impact on the league similar to the players in the 80s. webber was widely regarded as one if the top pf in the league from from his rookie season. and he put up stats similar to barkleys if you account for pace. hardaway was one regarded as the next magic johnson and would have put up similar stats if he played in the faster tempo 80s. iverson never had a bad season from his rookie until now. and the fact is none of the 80s players won just like none of the 90s players, some were close, just like some were close in the 80s. THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE.[/QUOTE]
You can chat all you want about how Webber and Hardaway having immediate impact impact on the NBA in the 90's but the truth is none of these players even come close to what Barkley, MJ, Hakeem did in the 80's.
Truth is Webber wasn't even an NBA All Star until his 4th season in the NBA. MJ, Hakeem, and Barkley were All NBA First team players by their 4th seasons.
[QUOTE=97 bulls]im just curious, who on the 88 version of the celtics were past their prime?[/QUOTE]
The Celtics as a TEAM were past their prime. They had no bench. Parish was getting old (34 yrs old in '88) as well as DJ (33 yrs old in '88).
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers]You can chat all you want about how Webber and Hardaway having immediate impact impact on the NBA in the 90's but the truth is none of these players even come close to what Barkley, MJ, Hakeem did in the 80's.
Truth is Webber wasn't even an NBA All Star until his 4th season in the NBA. MJ, Hakeem, and Barkley were All NBA First team players by their 4th seasons.[/QUOTE]
[B]A Prime MJ, Charles, Hakeem in their 20s and early 30s today would be schooling the whole league in Scoring, Rebounding, Steals, Assists, Blocking Shots, with PERs and FG% that would be flying out of this forum:rolleyes: [/B]
[QUOTE=Sir Charles][B]A Prime MJ, Charles, Hakeem in their 20s and early 30s today would be schooling the whole league in Scoring, Rebounding, Steals, Assists, Blocking Shots, with PERs and FG% that would be flying out of this forum:rolleyes: [/B][/QUOTE]
truthfully you guys are making my point for me especially 87 lakers about the dominance of . truth is jordan and company were dominating the 80s but could never win because they never had a team around them
[QUOTE=97 bulls]truthfully you guys are making my point for me especially 87 lakers about the dominance of . truth is jordan and company were dominating the 80s but could never win because they never had a team around them[/QUOTE]
Jordan got to the ECF in '89
Hakeem reahced the NBA Finals in '86
They could never win because they went up against the greatest teams in NBA History. '86 Celtics for Hakeem and '89 Pistons for MJ.
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers]Jordan got to the ECF in '89
Hakeem reahced the NBA Finals in '86
They could never win because they went up against the greatest teams in NBA History. '86 Celtics for Hakeem and '89 Pistons for MJ.[/QUOTE]
like i said, if they had the team, it would be different
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers]Jordan got to the ECF in '89
Hakeem reahced the NBA Finals in '86
They could never win because they went up against the greatest teams in NBA History. '86 Celtics for Hakeem and '89 Pistons for MJ.[/QUOTE]
and jordan and olajuwan drug those teams to the finals and championships
[QUOTE=97 bulls]and jordan and olajuwan drug those teams to the finals and championships[/QUOTE]
Actually no. Go look at that '86 Rockets roster 1 more time please. You had Ralph Sampson who averaged 19 PPG and 11 RPG and also hit the game winning shot in Game 5 of the WCF. Lewis Lloyd was a player who averaged 17 PPG and shot 53% FG. Their Point Guard John Lucas avergaed 15.5 PPG and nearly 9 APG. After 1986 people predicted this team to be the best team in the West for years to come and they would have if it wasn't for all the drug problems that team faced.
And for the '89 Bulls you had solid young players Scottie Pippen and Horace Grant.
And it's funny how you said...."truth is jordan and company were dominating the 80s [B]but could never win[/B] because they never had a team around them". And once I pointed out Hakeem was in the Finals in '86 and Jordan was in the ECF in '89 you changed to..."like i said, if they had the team, [B]it would be different[/B]."
Please stop talking out of your *** and think.
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers]I agree '88 Pistons > '88 Celtics
But the Celtics were past their prime by '88. They relied to much on their starting 5 in the late 80's. They had no bench what so ever. That's one of the reasons they lost the '87 Finals because their lack of bench.[/QUOTE]
True, very true. But that's life. Just like the Pistons were past their prime in 91. That's how the torch gets passed. Well, that's how it used to get passed. :)
[QUOTE=bladefd]I wouldn't put McHale over Charles Barkley/MosesMalone for the 80s. IMO, Hakeem could have played PF too. He was versatile enough to defend both PFs and Cs in his prime. I personally think McHale was slightly overrated on both ends of the court. :confusedshrug:
For the 90's, you can also do Shaq for C and Hakeem for PF instead of Karl Malone. Malone was a beast but I think a Shaq/Hakeem duo would be basically unstoppable front-court for the 90s.[/QUOTE]
[B]Barkley was the Greatest Powerforward Ever when he was in his Prime and Healthy Free from Back and Knee Injuries.That was from 1985 to 1995. No Powerforward was better than him those years. Anyone who disagrees should shoot themselves :banghead:
McHale was not underrated he was the Greatest Post Up Powerforward Ever and could score 18-19 ppg in 31-32 minutes of play with over 60% FG. Barkley called him the toughest PF to Guard in the Post. Malone was a Great Hard Worker, he could Run alot for a big Man and lived of the Beutifull Pick and Rolls that master organizer Stockton designed for him in that fast paced Sloan System.
McHale: 1980-81 to 1985-86 (Second Barkley, Third Malone)
Barkley: 1986-87 to 1995-96 (Second Malone, Third McHale, Fourth Webber)
Malone: 1996-87 to 1998-99 (Second Barkley, Third Webber)
Duncan: 1999-2000 to 2004-2005 (Malone Second, Third Garnett)
Garnett: 2005-2006 to 2007-2008 (Second Duncan)
Something like that:) [/B]
[QUOTE=97 bulls]i stand corrected on the finals appearances, however, i was replying to the assumption that players drafted in the 90s didnt have an immediate impact on the league similar to the players in the 80s. webber was widely regarded as one if the top pf in the league from from his rookie season. and he put up stats similar to barkleys if you account for pace. hardaway was one regarded as the next magic johnson and would have put up similar stats if he played in the faster tempo 80s. iverson never had a bad season from his rookie until now. and the fact is none of the 80s players won just like none of the 90s players, some were close, just like some were close in the 80s. THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE.[/QUOTE]
Chris Webber wasn't considered a top PF until he came to the Kings in '99, at the time he was traded there were people saying the Kings made a bad move trading Mitch Richmond for him. Iverson never had a bad season but his 1st 2 years were not great years, '99 was his first great season.
[IMG]http://farm1.static.flickr.com/27/93628583_d301537c0f.jpg[/IMG]
lol larry bird
I've always felt that he was utter garbage
[QUOTE=Koop1]lol larry bird
I've always felt that he was utter garbage[/QUOTE]
[B]How old are you? :rolleyes:
Larry Bird was and is the Greatest Smallforward of All Time:hammerhead: . Don`t be fooled by his unathletic looks. Ask Doctor J about his "Hick From French Lick" appearance which would disguise a cold bastard that could kill you by shooting, scoring, passing, rebounding and stealing the ball in the clutchest of situations[/B]
80s is good, with magic, bird, isiah, nique, dr j, and even mj as a youngster, but tha 90s put tha nba on another level in endorsements with food, sneakers, tv commercials, nba jerseys started selling like krazy, and even tha movie space jam, but tha game itself had mj's 6 rings, tha beginning of iverson, hakeem, barkley bustin ass, magic all star game in florida, knicks went to finals twice, I couldn't stand him but reggie made a name for himself, shaq, nba on nbc, do u want me to explain more??????
[QUOTE=willds09]80s is good, with magic, bird, isiah, nique, dr j, and even mj as a youngster,[B] but tha 90s put tha nba on another level in endorsements with food, sneakers, tv commercials, nba jerseys started selling like krazy, and even tha movie space jam,[/B] but tha game itself had mj's 6 rings, tha beginning of iverson, hakeem, barkley bustin ass, magic all star game in florida, knicks went to finals twice, I couldn't stand him but reggie made a name for himself, shaq, nba on nbc, do u want me to explain more??????[/QUOTE]
GREAT ARGUMENT!!!!!:roll:
I coulda swore when you said 90's ..I thought you more meant like
David Robinson
Shaq
Penny
Grant Hill
Iverson
Kobe
Kemp
Glenn Robinson
Larry Johnson
Mutombo
Mourning
Tim Hardaway
Kevin Johnson
etc..
Vs 80's (who were Jordan,Magic,Bird,Malone and Barkley etc..)Jordan dominated the 90's, but was from the 80's era.. same with some of the players I listed like Barkley..
Obviously the 80's would eat the 90's..hands down.
[QUOTE=23jordan23]I coulda swore when you said 90's ..I thought you more meant like
David Robinson
Shaq
Penny
Grant Hill
Iverson
Kobe
Kemp
Glenn Robinson
Larry Johnson
Mutombo
Mourning
Tim Hardaway
Kevin Johnson
etc..
Vs 80's (who were Jordan,Magic,Bird,Malone and Barkley etc..)Jordan dominated the 90's, but was from the 80's era.. same with some of the players I listed like Barkley..
Obviously the 80's would eat the 90's..hands down.[/QUOTE]
[B]Amen, but don`t say Jordan Dominanted. Say the JORDAN-PIPPEN DUO DOMINATED and With A Great All Around Team :rolleyes:
Then Again in 1996 The Bulls Won Again With An 80s Based Drafted Team!
Jordan: 1984 SUPERSTAR
Pippen: 1988 SUPERSTAR
Harper: 1986 (All Star Caliber for 5-6 over 20 ppg and A Top Defensive SG)
Rodman: 1986 All-Star. Defensive Player of The Year and Top Rebounder of the 90s
Sorry...but...
Kevin Jhonson is an 80s Player. Drafted in 1987 :)
Tim Hardaway is an 80s Player. Drafted in 1989 (at age 23, could have been drafter earlier maybe) :)
And Yes, David Robinson was drafted in 1989. He is 80s not 90s :no: and could have probaly entered the NBA even earlier in 1986 at age 21 but he decided to finish his Marine etc:)
On the other Hand. Yes 90s Was An Era of Marketing but 80s was More Passionete and Fan-Like by Far. Fans in the 80s Where Also More Blind and Rivalries Were Way Superior to the 90s [/B]:)
[B]1980s Rocks:pimp:[/B]
[QUOTE=Sir Charles][B]Amen, but don`t say Jordan Dominanted. Say the JORDAN-PIPPEN DUO DOMINATED and With A Great All Around Team :rolleyes:
Then Again in 1996 The Bulls Won Again With An 80s Based Drafted Team!
Jordan: 1984 SUPERSTAR
Pippen: 1988 SUPERSTAR
Harper: 1986 (All Star Caliber for 5-6 over 20 ppg and A Top Defensive SG)
Rodman: 1986 All-Star. Defensive Player of The Year and Top Rebounder of the 90s
Sorry...but...
Kevin Jhonson is an 80s Player. Drafted in 1987 :)
Tim Hardaway is an 80s Player. Drafted in 1989 (at age 23, could have been drafter earlier maybe) :)
And Yes, David Robinson was drafted in 1989. He is 80s not 90s :no: and could have probaly entered the NBA even earlier in 1986 at age 21 but he decided to finish his Marine etc:)
On the other Hand. Yes 90s Was An Era of Marketing but 80s was More Passionete and Fan-Like by Far. Fans in the 80s Where Also More Blind and Rivalries Were Way Superior to the 90s [/B]:)
[B]1980s Rocks:pimp:[/B][/QUOTE]
you most be crazy talking about it was fan-like by far in tha 80's, tha fans payed more attention to basketball in the 90's, mainly cuz of michael jordan, not to mention tha 80's had only a couple of basketballl video games, nba took ova in tha 90s, and u naming all tha greats who was drafted, DRAFTED, in the 80's, but they excel at their best in tha 90s! there's nothing u can say about that...:rockon:
[QUOTE=willds09]you most be crazy talking about it was fan-like by far in tha 80's, tha fans payed more attention to basketball in the 90's, mainly cuz of michael jordan, not to mention tha 80's had only a couple of basketballl video games, nba took ova in tha 90s, and u naming all tha greats who was drafted, DRAFTED, in the 80's, but they excel at their best in tha 90s! there's nothing u can say about that...:rockon:[/QUOTE]
[B]NBA became more of an international thing in the 90s Il give you that true! That was do to the Puppet Jordan but in the 80s Rivalries where superior. You had the Lakers vs Celtics. Celtics vs Pistons. Celtics vs Sixers. Bulls vs Pistons. Sixers vs Pistons. In the West Blazers vs Lakers. Rockets vs Lakers. Suns vs them too.
The Bucks, Cavs and Knicks in the late 80s where competitive too.
Play-Offs where more agressive and expectations where more. After the Celtic and Lakers Legacy Passed and then the Pistons got old, the Bulls where the only real contender for a Champioship.
In the case of Jordan and Barkley their Excelling years where 1986 to 1993. 1 more year in the 80s:). Jordan and Barkley by 1993 where 30 yeards old. Theire Physical Excell and Potence was definetly in the 80s but in the early 90s they had a more of a solid game
Yet, you can`t tell me Im wrong when i say that in terms of Finess and Athleticism "They were Better in the 1980s". That Era Set The Tone for the 90s Marketing! :rockon:
Maybe you just like the 90s better because you are a Jordan and Bulls fan and Jordan was not a Champ in the 80s when the Celtics-Lakers and Pistons ruled and kicked their asses daily :confusedshrug: [/B]
[QUOTE=Sir Charles][B]To Compare Webber to Barkley is a disrespect to to Basketball. Thats like comparing Bryant to Jordan. This is what Barkley did to Webber:rolleyes: [/B]
[url]http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=cAdMW4Hi8yI[/url]
[B]And this is Charles in his 30s, he was no longer in his Physical Prime:) [/B][/QUOTE]
while i agree that barkley was better than webber, webber wasnt a scrub. and brkley was the mvp and webber held as a rookie held his own.
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers]You can chat all you want about how Webber and Hardaway having immediate impact impact on the NBA in the 90's but the truth is none of these players even come close to what Barkley, MJ, Hakeem did in the 80's.
Truth is Webber wasn't even an NBA All Star until his 4th season in the NBA. MJ, Hakeem, and Barkley were All NBA First team players by their 4th seasons.[/QUOTE]
let get this clear. im not sayn that hardaway webber and co are comparable to jordan and co. but those player were def not scrubs as you guys basically saying. in my opinion jordan is the greatest ever. and barkley and hakeem are in the top 5 in their respective positions. but the fact is the 80s drafted players were already established in the 90s and it really not fair to compare them to 1st and 2nd year players tryn to make a name for themselves.
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers]Actually no. Go look at that '86 Rockets roster 1 more time please. You had Ralph Sampson who averaged 19 PPG and 11 RPG and also hit the game winning shot in Game 5 of the WCF. Lewis Lloyd was a player who averaged 17 PPG and shot 53% FG. Their Point Guard John Lucas avergaed 15.5 PPG and nearly 9 APG. After 1986 people predicted this team to be the best team in the West for years to come and they would have if it wasn't for all the drug problems that team faced.
And for the '89 Bulls you had solid young players Scottie Pippen and Horace Grant.
And it's funny how you said...."truth is jordan and company were dominating the 80s [B]but could never win[/B] because they never had a team around them". And once I pointed out Hakeem was in the Finals in '86 and Jordan was in the ECF in '89 you changed to..."like i said, if they had the team, [B]it would be different[/B]."
Please stop talking out of your *** and think.[/QUOTE]
i didnt contradict myself. i said they were dominating the 80s statisticly but never could win a championship. you picked out two seasons 86 for the rockets and 89 for the bulls as if those were the only two seasons in the 80s :rolleyes: and used those to support your argument. i responded by saying that they drug those teams to those two achievements. THEY GOT THERE IN SPITE OF THE TEAMS THEY WERE ON PERIOD. nad as far as the bulls 89 version scottie and horace were not the players they were in 91. they were IN THE LEAGUE TWO YEARS. how many players playin big roles win in their first 2 years. magic did but he was on a great team and bird did but thats not sn indictment on the rest of the league. not to mention magic and bird were coming into a weak league.