Scoring Wise:Kareem Abdul Jabbar vs Wilt Chamberlain?

[QUOTE=Pointguard]Kareem made that statement about '77 being his best year scoring year (when he averaged 8 points less per game) because he knew those guys shut him down when when he was a much more prolific scorer. Kareem was very sensitive to how he was compared to Wilt. He was very sensitive about the scoring thing in general. I remember he went to league office to campaign for shorter seasons to protect his scoring record.

Whoa, JL is on a role once again. My points were supplemented here and I don't think it possible to do it better than you did JL. I will add on the most basic level Kareem never had the energy to be at Wilt's level. At another basic level was mindset. KAJ just wasn't a guy that would lead the league in scoring for four or five years. Lastly, he didn't have the natural know how either. At the basic core (Mindset, Physicality, Knowhow and energy) KAJ's go to move isn't going to trump all of that.[/QUOTE]

I really think Kareem underachieved in the 70's, despite some huge seasons. And we both agree that had Magic not arrived in '80, that Kareem's career would have been viewed as very disappointing.

Still, it seemed like he could get up for some great individual battles. He ALWAYS took a HUGE number of shots against Wilt. In fact, in their 28 H2H meetings, he had 18 games of 30+ FGAs, with a high of 39. BTW, he only shot above 50% in six of them.

And going on memory, I believe he hung 46 on Elvin Hayes in his very first NBA matchup with him. And I think he had 40+ against Walton in their first encounter. We know that he torched Hakeem for three 40+ games, and his 46 point game against him was within a week, I believe, of his 40-9 battering of Ewing.

As for Hakeem...I will say this, he and Russell almost always played at near 100%. I tend to point out his flaws, only because one poster here constantly places him among the gods, but there was no question that he played with heart. And, yes, it was too bad that he was saddled with relatively poor rosters for much of his career.

In fact, IMHO, if Kareem would have played at the intensity level that Hakeem brought, he clearly could have been much more dominant. Even Wilt, for all that he did at BOTH ends of the floor, probably didn't play as hard as Hakeem did in his career. Still, both Kareem, and Wilt, along with Shaq (who I also believe could have been more dominant) were so naturally blessed, that they were greater players, despite playing at lower levels.

And I wonder how many rings that Wilt and Hakeem would have won had they been fortunate enough to have had a prime Magic for ten years, too.

[QUOTE=jlauber]
In fact, IMHO, if Kareem would have played at the intensity level that Hakeem brought, he clearly could have been much more dominant. Even Wilt, for all that he did at BOTH ends of the floor, probably didn't play as hard as Hakeem did in his career. Still, both Kareem, and Wilt, along with Shaq (who I also believe could have been more dominant) were so naturally blessed, that they were greater players, despite playing at lower levels.

And I wonder how many rings that Wilt and Hakeem would have won had they been fortunate enough to have had a prime Magic for ten years, too.[/QUOTE]

Yeah Hakeem was hard work and highly developed skill. I think Kareem was one of the few players that could play disinterested and still be head and shoulders above the pack in the later 1970's - as he did a couple of years. If he had the work ethic or energy of Wilt or Hakeem he's GOAT without question. In that scenario we are talking about 9 scoring titles, 10 MVP's, 10 block titles, 7rebounding titles, 8 field goal percentage titles, and very close to Russel in Rings. Amazing when you think about it and it isn't an exaggeration at all. I don't know if that type of drop off, the comparison of potential to actual, exist in another top ten player.

The only knock on a motivated Kareem was that he isn't by nature a leader or people person, his impact on the game mysteriously wasn't gigantic until Magic knew how to feature him, and persistence in all around game. Which is small, perhaps, in comparison to everybody else, cept Jordan.

[QUOTE=jlauber]

As for Hakeem...I will say this, he and Russell almost always played at near 100%. I tend to point out his flaws, only because one poster here constantly places him among the gods, but there was no question that he played with heart. And, yes, it was too bad that he was saddled with relatively poor rosters for much of his career. [/QUOTE]

It's funny that you always spam about Hakeem's "flaws" when Wilt and Russell both had more flaws. And we all know you haven't seen Hakeem play, and that's a fact, you only check basketball-reference and then you think you've seen it all. Even your stupid comments about Olajuwon's play in the WCF vs the Lakers and his match-up vs Shaq tells the whole story about how little you really know.

[QUOTE=jlauber]
And I wonder how many rings that Wilt and Hakeem would have won had they been fortunate enough to have had a prime Magic for ten years, too.[/QUOTE]

Personally I wonder how many rings Hakeem would have won if he had been fortunate enough to have two 20 point scorers and two guys putting up more than 15 points per game while two of them being HOF:ers, like Wilt's teammates in '67 and the same about the Laker teams he was on...

Kareem in the playoffs

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: @ the bullshit Fatal9 used to spew on ISH

Anyways, you take Wilt. He can get you 50 if you need 50, he can get you 25 on a ridiculous 68% (with over 7 assists) if you've got other offensive players. Prime Wilt is a more dominant scorer than prime Jabbar, no refuting it really.

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