[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]If the superman in question didn
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[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]If the superman in question didn
[QUOTE=bladefd]
How is Thanos without the gauntlet stopping Superman's nuclear punches off speed blitzes of Flash speeds?[/QUOTE]
He's not stopping him... I think people fail to realize the vast array of tools Superman has at his disposal. Thanos desperately needs the gauntlet to deal with an DCCU Superman level opponent; it's a mollywopping otherwise. Maybe not the mollywopping Steppenwolf got, but close enough.
People fail to realize that the vast tools you credit superman for using....he doesnt. He didnt in the version discussed(the movies) and he doesnt in the comics. All the superman talks about what he could do center on him super speed dashing in with punches that would crush a planet....which you have never seen him do. You are fabricating his mode of attack but not giving the other side the same benefit of fighting using all the tools at their disposal in the most efficient way possible. Which is why people forever talk about superman beating people who can alter reality.
He can punch people. He can move fast)the rest of his powers are of no consequence in a speed blitz situation). Really that makes him no more a threat than the flash if you go into the subject of infinite mass....Flash at warp speeds could hit something as hard as it could be hit by anything.
But whatever you think he could do....he doesnt. Not in the DCU. Not in the comics. Supermans issue is the same as Thanos.
Not using his full power to end fights right away. He ****s around...just like Thanos. And even in that intentionally weakened state where they tried the "Come in at light speed and snatch it off" it didnt work:
[IMG]https://i.postimg.cc/s2Xn3281/main-qimg-ffe07913f67d8012070310b12820bfc1.jpg[/IMG]
You dismiss what happens in the comics to focus on the less powerful MCU version of Thanos....but when its superman we dismiss that hes out here fighting regular humans and losing by being outsmarted and not hurting people as physically weak as the flash.
All the things you credit him for doing is because you know from the source material he could....if he wanted to....and you get to decide how he fights. But you deny his opponents the same advantage because thats the only way superman is ever worth talking about.
Its always "Couldnt he just fly in at light speed and tear his head off?" based on his comicbook ability which he never uses in the DCU while ignoring that the comic book ability of Thanos which is not shown in the MCU...is him literally being the equal of god.
Why does only superman get "If he used his powers perfectly...." credit but not thanos?
Thanos could stop time at the first sign of conflict, teleport to another planet, turn the earth and everyone on it into dust and go take a nap.
Why do you give Superman best case scenario but keep his opponents fighting the way they actually fought?
The way superman ACTUALLY fights in movies or comics?
Hes not a threat. Hes too soft to do what needs doing right away. If we remove the plot induced stupidity from him why make all his opponents keep it?
Superman is a beta cuck. End of story.
[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]Why does only superman get "If he used his powers perfectly...." credit but not thanos?
Thanos could stop time at the first sign of conflict, teleport to another planet, turn the earth and everyone on it into dust and go take a nap.
Why do you give Superman best case scenario but keep his opponents fighting the way they actually fought?
The way superman ACTUALLY fights in movies or comics?
Hes not a threat. Hes too soft to do what needs doing right away. If we remove the plot induced stupidity from him why make all his opponents keep it?[/QUOTE]
Are you saying Thanos can manipulate space and time [I]without the gauntlet[/I]? I'm of the understanding he cannot without the stones.
[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]People fail to realize that the vast tools you credit superman for using....he doesnt. He didnt in the version discussed(the movies) and he doesnt in the comics. All the superman talks about what he could do center on him super speed dashing in with punches that would crush a planet....which you have never seen him do. You are fabricating his mode of attack but not giving the other side the same benefit of fighting using all the tools at their disposal in the most efficient way possible. Which is why people forever talk about superman beating people who can alter reality.[/QUOTE]
Superman used both his strength and his speed in dealing with Steppenwolf. He also did so during his encounter with the Justice League. He has done so quite often in the comics, and in the cartoons and animated movies, in addition to his other powers. What actual tools does Thanos have without the gauntlet?
[QUOTE]You dismiss what happens in the comics to focus on the less powerful MCU version of Thanos....but when its superman we dismiss that hes out here fighting regular humans and losing by being outsmarted and not hurting people as physically weak as the flash.[/QUOTE]
Thanos was beaten by Squirrel Girl in the comics... Squirrel Girl. Captain America gave him the business for awhile in the movie. Tony made him bleed. DCCU Superman would stomp. Bleeding would be the least of Thanos' worries.
If we're posting random panels from the comics...
[IMG]https://i.ibb.co/0XrXqvN/main-qimg-38146707d7d280c7a900031ae40d4c3e-c.jpg[/IMG]
We can start posting stills from the animated movies and tv shows as well.
[QUOTE=Kblaze8855][IMG]https://i.postimg.cc/s2Xn3281/main-qimg-ffe07913f67d8012070310b12820bfc1.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
Word?
[IMG]http://media.comicbook.com/2018/04/thanos-best-marvel-villain-squirrel-girl-1100644.jpeg[/IMG]
Squirrel girl stalemated galactus according to Spider-Man. If we are treating joke panels and so on as serious Superman beating Darkseid isn
[QUOTE]
Superman used both his strength and his speed in dealing with Steppenwolf. He also did so during his encounter with the Justice League. He has done so quite often in the comics, and in the cartoons and animated movies, in addition to his other powers. What actual tools does Thanos have without the gauntlet?
[/QUOTE]
If using his speed and strength resulted in no real harm to anyone including a powerless human what are we even talking about?
As I said he has not used what you suggest he has you are simply going off what you know he is capable of and giving him credit for it while not giving his opponent credit for what we know he is capable of.
If superman were as mighty as people suggest he wouldn
[QUOTE=bladefd]Dr Fate can hold Dr Strange in check. Easily.
Superman would make chutney out of Captain Marvel. Hell, Shazam aka the original Captain Marvel would spank Captain Marvel's ass red :oldlol:
Set Wonder woman and Captain Atom on hulk and superman on Thor. Shazam on Captain Marvel. Flash and hawk girl can keep Vision busy. Martian manhunter on the Scarlett Witch. Green lantern can take on Iron man. Batman on Captain America. It's a wrap.[/QUOTE]
Dr. Fate? Green Lantern? Martian manhunter? I'm sorry but this is a completely different JL universe than the one that exists today and the one OP is talking about.
Also, Shazam, with his intellect, gets destroyed by Captain Marvel.
[QUOTE=MaxFly]Were're talking MCU and DCCU versions of these characters and "what if" scenarios. I'm going off of what the OP posted and the title of the thread. Quite frankly, DCCU Superman, morals on and all, would humiliate MCU Thanos without the gauntlet. No morals and the credits are rolling as soon as the location shot of the fight is established. It's a laughable fight. Thanos is going to desperately need that gauntlet or some other sort of crutch against DCCU Supes. And even with the gauntlet, he better not hesitate.
Lol, after trying to talk Batman down and inhaling kryptonite gas a few times... and being nuked... in the space of 20 minutes.
He mollywopped Steppenwolf. Punched and threw him around the room and had him straining to get up. He went and did other things and came back to knock him around a little more, just for giggles, and all with a smile on his face. Dude was cracking jokes.
...unless the person wielding that power needs to snap their fingers or carry out some other machination to control time and space. If Superman knows anything about the gauntlet, Thanos is going to have to be exceedingly quick with his handwave, arm turn or whatever he needs to do to carry out his attack and to keep possession of the gauntlet. Again, the gauntlet gives MCU Thanos a big leg up, but even then it's not a guaranteed win if he isn't fast in using it. What is a guaranteed win is the one for DCCU Superman without the gauntlet... that's not even close... it's an embarrassing stomp fest to be honest given Thanos' dependency on the gauntlet.[/QUOTE]
I agree with you, without the gauntlet, DCEU Superman > MCU Thanos.
However, with the gauntlet the gap is even bigger in favor of Thanos not smaller.
You say "with knowledge/prep" Superman can do this and that, well if Thanos is also given knowledge of Superman, he could use the Time Stone to even see different outcomes the fight and adjust accordingly.
Without knowledge, Superman, the DCEU version, just stares him down maybe throws a punch, and then gets wrecked in so many different ways. End of fight.
Also, Thanos in MCU has shown some pretty impressive reactionary feats, you don't have to be lightning fast to react to something lightning fast. We have seen that in movies, Dark Phoenix was able to react to quicksilver despite never being nearly as quick. Thanos in the beginning of Infinity War was able to react and use his stones against Loki's surprise attack while Loki was inches away from him, and Loki has been known to be a quick sneaky character. There are plenty of others. I think if he can do that, he can react to Superman coming from distance yards away.
[QUOTE=MaxFly]My money would decidedly be on an unhinged, moral-less Superman... especially under a yellow sun. We've seen versions of this Superman in the past, but rarely uncaged and out for blood. The problem with Superman is that he simply has too many powers with which to adequately contend if he isn't holding back, and he can use them in concert: strength, super speed, flight, heat vision, super hearing, super vision, x-ray vision, freeze breath, hurricane breath, durability, excellent healing factor. His Flash-lite speed and ridiculous strength alone make it difficult to defend against him. Someone with his strength hitting someone with the kind of speed he can harness would leave almost all the Avengers dead within the first second.
.[/QUOTE]
Almost all the Avengers dead within the 1st second? What? :oldlol:
If he fought them like he fought the Justice League, he would be finished in NO TIME. Staring the avengers down, and waiting for them to attack, he would get destroyed. He may hold up physically but once Strange uses some magic, Superman is finished. And almost all the Avengers dead with 1 punch? Um lets see, Ironman no. Thor no. Captain Marvel no. Hulk no. Vision no. Heck even Captain America and Black Panther could take a punch from Superman and be alive. But "almost all" is a HUGE stretch for sure lol
Superman has a better chance against Thanos with the infinity gauntlet than the Avengers, and I think he has little to no chance against Thanos with infinity gauntlet.
[QUOTE=Doctor K]Almost all the Avengers dead within the 1st second? What? :oldlol:
If he fought them like he fought the Justice League, he would be finished in NO TIME. Staring the avengers down, and waiting for them to attack, he would get destroyed. He may hold up physically but once Strange uses some magic, Superman is finished. And almost all the Avengers dead with 1 punch? Um lets see, Ironman no. Thor no. Captain Marvel no. Hulk no. Vision no. [B]Heck even Captain America and Black Panther could take a punch from Superman and be alive. But "almost all" is a HUGE stretch for sure lol [/B]
Superman has a better chance against Thanos with the infinity gauntlet than the Avengers, and I think he has little to no chance against Thanos with infinity gauntlet.[/QUOTE]
It depends on whoever is writing.
Superman should be able to punch Capt and Black Panther and kill them. He's too fast and is another class too strong. But it depends if Supes is stronger than Thanos physically. Thanos punched Capt, but didn't kill him. With Doctor Strange, it depends on his reaction speed. If he uses his magic on time before Supes can attack, then he could mess with him. Especially if he has the time stone. If not, one shot, he should be dead. And it depends on what magic that Dr. Strange uses. Scarlet Witch would be the same thing as Doc Strange.
Thor, Hulk, Capt Marvel could all take a hit. IM could be similar too. He also took a few punches from Thanos and didn't die. Vision too maybe.
Supes do have a lot of powers and with no morals, he should be able to speed blitz all of them. The only ppl who could hurt him would be Doctor Strange, Thor, and maybe Scarlet Witch.
Capt Marvel, I don't know yet. While she would be able to absorb the heat vision and tap into her binary state, don't know if she's strong enough to handle supes. Might be able to hold her own for a time.
Hulk has to get angry enough to go into his max potential, but he got his ass kicked by Thanos.
But Thanos with the IG would be able to defeat Supes. He would just turn him into dust or he could turn him into anything he wants. But, it seems like he has to snap or do some physical movement with the IG to activate it in the MCU. So, if Supes knew about it, he could speed blitz Thanos and take it off. In the comics tho, Supes dead.
All in all tho, it's not TOO much of a stretch that he could kill some of the Avengers in less than a second using his speed. I don't think in the DCCU that Supes moved in light speed, but still has Flash like speed (could he go light speed in the movies?). With a person with that much strength and speed, he should be able take them out one by one with a upper cut or punch through their chest without them realizing what happened. But Supes is never written like that, even with no morals off except for a few instances. It tends to be a logical inconsistent, but it builds up drama.
Like remember this scene from Age of Ultron between Quicksilver and Capt?
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ec-p6BhGM6w#t=01m40s[/url]
Supes can move that fast. A punch from Supes with no morals off, that head goes off. This should happen with a few of the Avengers.
Someone wanna point out to me this no morals speed blitzing DCU superman and tell me how I missed him?
If he was no morals superman vs the justice league....he still didnt seriously injure anyone including a fully human batman who didnt even have the batman/superman power suit on.
The closest he comes to no morals is when he killed Zod but he was broken up about it. The no morals superman doesnt exist in the movies. And if thats the superman we are talking about....we are clearly giving him a hypothetical ruthless mindstate and assuming he does things he never actually does.
So again....why doesnt the other side get the same credit? And plus....we are giving Superman pre existing knowledge of the gauntlet and its weaknesses?
You think Tony Stark with pre existing knowledge of superman and his weakness wouldnt be able to kill him when Batman was able to but spared him? Give Thanos or Ironman advanced knowledge of superman hed be fighting under a floating chunk of Krypton the size of Brooklyn and die as he approached.
Plenty of people have kicked supermans ass just off knowing he needs yellow sunlight and is killed by kryponite. The Joker...Luthor....random humans with red light rooms and so on.
Thanos would probably stay on a planet under a red sun and wait. Even at light speed it takes several minutes to cross a solar system. If superman could even get there....he wouldnt be full strength....and Thanos would know about his other weakness(s). There are so many ways superman loses in a fair fight....but we only wanna give him the advantage I suppose. Because he needs it.
We talking stormbreaker Thor with that almost all Avengers dead in the 1st second stuff? No chance. Watch the Wakanda battle again. Supes isn't speed blitzing anything and ignoring Thor.