ISH All-time Top 25 Guards Project: #2 Kobe Bryant vs Magic Johnson.

[QUOTE=Gotterdammerung]It already started in the previous thread.

I wonder why Trolls think their opinions matter, when they're not even part of the voting process? :confusedshrug:

And I agree with your previous post because I said in the previous debate between West & Kobe:

[I][Kobe] has the potential to pass West, Jordan, and even Abdul Jabbar with the totality of his career, though - as long he stays healthy.[/I]

Apparently that won't satisfy Troll Logic, which interprets my statement as a Hater, because I twinged somebody's insecure, tiny ego. :facepalm[/QUOTE]

actually...you calling people "Troll's" is silly...especially when the so called Kobe "troll's" opinion reflects the majority of the basketball fanbase...


while your opinion is just plain silly....that hardly anyone would recognize.

[QUOTE=Gotterdammerung]Actually... I didn't call him a troll.

In fact, I did say that I agreed with him.

Perhaps English isn't your first language. :confusedshrug:[/QUOTE]

[quote]I wonder why Trolls think their opinions matter, when they're not even part of the voting process? :confusedshrug:

And I agree with your previous post because I said in the previous debate between West & Kobe:[/quote]

Are you dyslexic?

[QUOTE=catch24]Are you dyslexic?[/QUOTE]

Nope. Re-read that statement. There are OTHER posters in the thread prior to Crossover that fit the category of Kobe Trolls. Apparently that's too difficult for some people. :facepalm

They're in my ignore list so I can't read their comments, but it's a safe guess to say that they're cheerleading for Kobe and against anyone who dares to breathe a word of dissident.

[I]Ca-peesh?[/I]

Or is your handle a clear indication that you belong in my ignore list along with all those other trolls? :confusedshrug:

[QUOTE=Gotterdammerung]Nope. Re-read that statement. There are OTHER posters in the thread prior to Crossover that fit the category of Kobe Trolls. Apparently that's too difficult for some people. :facepalm

They're in my ignore list so I can't read their comments, but it's a safe guess to say that they're cheerleading for Kobe and against anyone who dares to breathe a word of dissident.

[I]Ca-peesh?[/I]

Or is your handle a clear indication that you belong in my ignore list along with all those other trolls? :confusedshrug:[/QUOTE]

you're an idiot

[QUOTE=Gotterdammerung]Been here a lot longer than you have. Just don't post as often.

1. I am part of the voting process. But... I've made far more effort in voting in this project than you have. :confusedshrug:
2. Since [B]you're ready to judge me after 1 pos[/B]t, it says far more about you than my single post. :oldlol:
3. Your response was absolutely trash. :facepalm[/QUOTE]

I'll use point form since obviously you lack basic comprehension skills.

1) Never said you weren't part of the voting project, I've simply stated I am in it as well (I was just defending the notion that [according to you] I am not part of the project).
2) I didn't judge you, I judged your post. In your original reply, I judged you. Well because, you confirmed to me that you're an idiot.
3) Use of emoticons only deteriorates your rebuttals further.
4) Let's do each other a favor and ignore each other; you lack comprehension skills and I lack patience for idiots like you.
5) Constantly calling other posters trolls, complaining about trolls and insulting other trolls; in fact, makes you a troll. Hopefully you have an epiphany over this last point.
6) Have a pleasant night, troll.

[QUOTE=Gotterdammerung]Nope. Re-read that statement. There are OTHER posters in the thread prior to Crossover that fit the category of Kobe Trolls. Apparently that's too difficult for some people. :facepalm

They're in my ignore list so I can't read their comments, but it's a safe guess to say that they're cheerleading for Kobe and against anyone who dares to breathe a word of dissident.

[I]Ca-peesh?[/I]

Or is your handle a clear indication that you belong in my ignore list along with all those other trolls? :confusedshrug:[/QUOTE]

I'm not a mind-reader. Like Crossover said, you really need to improve your writing skills. Judging by his response, he clearly thought you called him a troll and/or not apart of the voting process.

Do what you must; I don't give a shit, lol.

[QUOTE=Gotterdammerung][B][SIZE="7"]Been here a lot longer than you have. Just don't post as often. [/SIZE][/B]

1. I am part of the voting process. But... I've made far more effort in voting in this project than you have. :confusedshrug:
2. Since you're ready to judge me after 1 post, it says far more about you than my single post. :oldlol:
3. Your response was absolutely trash. :facepalm[/QUOTE]


:roll: WTF?....your'e join date proves what?....

You got Owned and called out.......

You on the "voting process" proves exactly what I've been saying all along....elitists fans are the worst fans in sports and ruin Basketball one post at a time....

you probably never even watched Magic Johnson:roll:

[QUOTE=Gotterdammerung]Nope. Re-read that statement. There are OTHER posters in the thread prior to Crossover that fit the category of Kobe Trolls. Apparently that's too difficult for some people. :facepalm

They're in my ignore list so I can't read their comments, but it's a safe guess to say that they're cheerleading for Kobe and against anyone who dares to breathe a word of dissident.

[I]Ca-peesh?[/I]

Or is your handle a clear indication that you belong in my ignore list along with all those other trolls? :confusedshrug:[/QUOTE]

Actually, it's your fault.
I had trouble just like catch24 did at understanding who exactly you were directing your comments towards. Perhaps being a little more concise at typing, will eliminate this confusion in the future.

If you were not in fact insulting me in the 1st place, then you can ignore my backlashes and accept my apology.

We should start the forwards list next; since we all know how this list will end up (as it should).

[QUOTE=crosso√er]I'll use point form since obviously you lack basic comprehension skills.

1) Never said you weren't part of the voting project, I've simply stated I am in it as well (I was just defending the notion that [according to you] I am not part of the project).
2) I didn't judge you, I judged your post. In your original reply, I judged you. Well because, you confirmed to me that you're an idiot.
3) Use of emoticons only deteriorates your rebuttals further.
4) Let's do each other a favor and ignore each other; you lack comprehension skills and I lack patience for idiots like you.
5) [B][SIZE="7"]Constantly calling other posters trolls, complaining about trolls and insulting other trolls; in fact, makes you a troll. Hopefully you have an epiphany over this last point.[/SIZE][/B]
6) Have a pleasant night, troll.[/QUOTE]



[IMG]http://www.thebuzzmedia.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/gears-of-war-2-screenshot-double-chainsaw-kill.jpg[/IMG]

Merked him bad.....



next

[QUOTE=Carbine]It's kinda funny that Magic will win this by a pretty easy margin, but when Kobe is 15+ removed from the leagie via retirement, it will end up being a 50/50 split at worst for Kobe....and 75/25 at best in favor of Bryant.[/QUOTE]
This.

[QUOTE=Gotterdammerung]

[B]Magic Johnson[/B] in a landslide. :cheers:[/QUOTE]
****kking idiot.

Magic Johnson

EASILY

Kobe is a fine player, but people calling him the greatest laker ever have got to be kidding.

Wilt
Kareem
Magic

are all better than Kobe. Kobe is not now in the discussion as GOAT, the three players listed above all have a case for GOAT.

Like I said Kobe is a fine player, but if you saw Wilt, Kareem and Magic play, I just don't know how you could see Kobe as in their class.

[QUOTE]It's kinda funny that Magic will win this by a pretty easy margin, but when Kobe is 15+ removed from the leagie via retirement, it will end up being a 50/50 split at worst for Kobe....and 75/25 at best in favor of Bryant.[/QUOTE]

Maybe because a lot of people will forget or never learn about his subpar finals performances and his overrated defense.

They'll just see the buckets he made in highlights, not the massive amount of chucking and bricking and air balling it over multiple defenders while teammates are open.

This is a similar debate to Kobe vs. West. It's a lot closer than most people like to admit, but having to choose, the clear answer is Magic.

No point in even making the thread for #1 imo, the answer for that one is obvious.

[QUOTE=colts19]Kobe is a fine player, but people calling him the greatest laker ever have got to be kidding.

Wilt
Kareem
Magic

are all better than Kobe. Kobe is not now in the discussion as GOAT, the three players listed above all have a case for GOAT.

Like I said Kobe is a fine player, but if you saw Wilt, Kareem and Magic play, I just don't know how you could see Kobe as in their class.[/QUOTE]
:roll: :roll: :roll:

Wilt the greater Laker?:roll: :roll: :roll:

Not in their class?:roll: :roll:

[QUOTE=crosso√er]Actually, it's your fault.
I had trouble just like catch24 did at understanding who exactly you were directing your comments towards. Perhaps being a little more concise at typing, will eliminate this confusion in the future.

If you were not in fact insulting me in the 1st place, then you can ignore my backlashes and accept my apology.

We should start the forwards list next; since we all know how this list will end up (as it should).[/QUOTE]

No problem. Half of this thread (including the previous project) are not visible due to posters being on the ignore list. Only those posters that make my Ignore list are trolls that don't really contribute to the discussion.

That may have led to the imprecise and vague nature of my post. So apologies on the misunderstanding, and I admit that my original post was exceedingly one-sided, "troll-bait" to incite a certain fanbase.

I'm still not sure about starting the forwards list because GOAT isn't back yet.

[QUOTE=Gotterdammerung]No problem. Half of this thread (including the previous project) are not visible due to posters being on the ignore list. Only those posters that make my Ignore list are trolls that don't really contribute to the discussion.

That may have led to the imprecise and vague nature of my post. So apologies on the misunderstanding, and I admit that my original post was exceedingly one-sided, "troll-bait" to incite a certain fanbase.

I'm still not sure about starting the forwards list because GOAT isn't back yet.[/QUOTE]


:lol did n!qqa backpedling....


10 Bias fans on da webz acting like it's serious business....

[QUOTE=ZaaaaaH]Again Haters fail to mention 2010 Boston since they want to make their argument sound much better. :lol

What a loser.:facepalm[/QUOTE]
Because Boston was a very good team. But he didnt face them in every Finals he's been like Magic did the Sixers, Pistons, and Celtics.

You call me a hater? The 24 in my name is for Kobe :facepalm

Magic, very easily.

[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]:lol did n!qqa backpedling....


10 Bias fans on da webz acting like it's serious business....[/QUOTE]

Logoff and save yourself the temper tantrum and broken keyboard..for like..the umpteenth time..You are outclassed any way you turn..next please.

[QUOTE=MasterDurant24]Because Boston was a very good team. But he didnt face them in every Finals he's been like Magic did the Sixers, Pistons, and Celtics.

You call me a hater? The 24 in my name is for Kobe :facepalm[/QUOTE]

That's because the best teams were all in the West for most of Kobe's title runs.


The early 2000s Kings, Spurs and Blazers are just as good if not better than any team Magic faced in the Finals.

[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]That's because the best teams were all in the West for most of Kobe's title runs.


The early 2000s Kings, Spurs and Blazers are just as good if not better than any team Magic faced in the Finals.[/QUOTE]
:roll:

[QUOTE=TrueAristotle]:roll:[/QUOTE]

Off Rtg: 105.0 (13th of 22) ▪ Def Rtg: 101.0 (1st of 22)

Off Rtg: 109.6 (5th of 23) ▪ Def Rtg: 103.9 (7th of 23)

Off Rtg: 108.3 (5th of 23) ▪ Def Rtg: 100.9 (5th of 23)

Off Rtg: 110.9 (6th of 23) ▪ Def Rtg: 104.4 (3rd of 23)

Off Rtg: 112.8 (2nd of 23) ▪ Def Rtg: 106.3 (5th of 23)

Off Rtg: 113.5 (3rd of 23) ▪ Def Rtg: 106.8 (9th of 23)

Off Rtg: 110.5 (6th of 23) ▪ Def Rtg: 105.3 (2nd of 23)

Off Rtg: 110.8 (7th of 25) ▪ Def Rtg: 104.7 (3rd of 25)

Off Rtg: 114.6 (1st of 27) ▪ Def Rtg: 105.2 (7th of 27)


vs

02 Kings

Off Rtg: 109.0 (3rd of 29) ▪ Def Rtg: 101.1 (6th of 29)

00 Blazers

Off Rtg: 107.9 (3rd of 29) ▪ Def Rtg: 100.8 (5th of 29)

01 Spurs

Off Rtg: 106.6 (6th of 29) ▪ Def Rtg: 98.0 (1st of 29)

:confusedshrug:

Blaze after Jordan stomps Magic in the final can we do top big men?

[B]Magic[/B] wins this easily IMO. Sure it's closer than some would think but Magic was SUCH an amazing player. I'm not sure anyone outside of Jordan, Bird and Shaq have had so much impact on a game. The man was incredible. I honestly believe if Magic didn't have to retire early and played till around 40... he would be considered the GOAT, not Jordan.

this is close but ill give the edge to magic... i feel that his imprint on the game goes a little farther then kobes and he was a better all around player... its pretty clear that magic is taking this with the votes by the ppl who have a say in this... although its entertaining to see all the kobe fanatics rage about how their boy should make it past magic by a landslide :lol

Kobe plays far tougher defenses than what Magic saw:

[url]http://www.backpicks.com/2011/06/29/who-played-the-hardest-defenses-adjusting-playoff-stats-by-competition-part-i/[/url]

[QUOTE] Kobe Bryant had the largest increase in playoff defensive quality by raw change, facing defenses 3.2 points stingier than what he saw in the regular season. Only Shaquille O’Neal faced teams that allowed fewer points per 100 (101.9) in the playoffs.

Coincidentally, another Laker had it the easiest. Magic Johnson might not have noticed when the playoffs began, because his typical postseason opponent during his 10-year run was right around league average. [B]In 27 playoff series against the West, Magic faced 16 below average defenses. 15 of his 22 conference opponents (68%) in the 1980s were below average in DRtg.[/B][/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Jacks3]In 27 playoff series against the West, Magic faced 16 below average defenses. 15 of his 22 conference opponents (68%) in the 1980s were below average in DRtg.[/quote]

How many [I]below average teams in DRTG [/I]did Bryant play?

[QUOTE=kuniva_dAMiGhTy]Magic, very easily.



Logoff and save yourself the temper tantrum and broken keyboard..for like..the umpteenth time..You are outclassed any way you turn..next please.[/QUOTE]


Yeah "outclassed"...by who?....Haters complaining about all defensive teams and Kobe copying Jordan?....:lol

come on son!...pretty much all the Laker Greats said Kobe is the best Laker of alltime..


I'm just agreeing....apply yourself.









next

[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]Yeah "outclassed"...by who?....Haters complaining about all defensive teams and Kobe copying Jordan?....:lol

come on son!...pretty much all the Laker Greats said Kobe is the best Laker of alltime..

apply yourself[/quote]

One of the Laker greats also said he could average 50ppg in the modern era. Of course, in your world, you pick and choose what you take as face value.

Apply myself? Like you do when discussing Kobe every other post? We are talking their careers dumbass. Take the c*ck flavored lollipop's out of your mouth..or should I say stop deep throating those pops. All this laughing..yet you cannot explain the dominance then and not since..why is that? Sup man? Your balls stuck on "not descending?" I love watching people laugh like you then get dropped like a sack of potatoes. I watched Big foot Silva talk shit then get dropped..kinda reminds me of you..all talk..then poof.."boom goes the dynamite" slapped wolf is out for the count.

Next, please.

[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]That's because the best teams were all in the West for most of Kobe's title runs.


The early 2000s Kings, Spurs and Blazers are just as good if not better than any team Magic faced in the Finals.[/QUOTE]
Good point, but none of those teams are as good as those teams Magic faced in the Finals. The 83 Sixers, the 86 Celtics, and the Bad Boy Pistons are widely considered to be some of the greatest teams of all time. Plus in the West back then, Magic also went through the Rockets(if it weren't for drugs, they would of been contenders for years), who was a very good team.

[QUOTE=MasterDurant24]Because Boston was a very good team. But he didnt face them in every Finals he's been like Magic did the Sixers, Pistons, and Celtics.

You call me a hater? The 24 in my name is for Kobe :facepalm[/QUOTE]

Yes they didnt face Boston every year because they came together at 2008.

And you also fail to mention Western Conference was much tougher then it ever was. Bottom line I dont need to go in detail with you since you dont even understand the fundamental aspect and try to leave out the other side of the story.

Please change ur number

[QUOTE=kuniva_dAMiGhTy]One of the Laker greats also said he could average 50ppg in the modern era. Of course, in your world, you pick and choose what you take as face value.

Apply myself? Like you do when discussing Kobe every other post? We are talking their careers dumbass. Take the c*ck flavored lollipop's out of your mouth..or should I say stop deep throating those pops. All this laughing..yet you cannot explain the dominance then and not since..why is that? Sup man? Your balls stuck on "not descending?" I love watching people laugh like you then get dropped like a sack of potatoes. I watched Big foot Silva talk shit then get dropped..kinda reminds me of you..all talk..then poof.."boom goes the dynamite" slapped wolf is out for the count.

Next, please.[/QUOTE]


:applause:



I really don't know what to say??......


You managed to incorporate Antonio Silva, MMA , Lollipops , p3niz's,Kobe ,Basketball , deep throating and puberty all in one post...

great job....



(walks away slowly....prays there are no sharp objects near Kuniva....hopes he has refill's on the meds)

[QUOTE=ZaaaaaH]Yes they didnt face Boston every year because they came together at 2008.

And you also fail to mention Western Conference was much tougher then it [B]ever was[/B]. Bottom line I dont need to go in detail with you since you dont even understand the fundamental aspect and try to leave out the other side of the story.

Please change ur number[/QUOTE]
:roll:

I was replying to AlphaWolf, who merely said that Magic only played the Celtics in 3 Finals. And just I said all the other times in the Finals they also played great teams. I don't see what I'm leaving out? Nor do I see the West in the early 2000's being [B]much[/B] tougher than the early 90's with the Spurs, Lakers, Trail Blazers, Suns, and Rockets all being very good teams. Along with the Run-TMC Warriors.

[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]

great job....



(walks away slowly....prays there are no sharp objects near Kuniva....hopes he has refill's on the meds)[/QUOTE]

You waited 20 minutes to reply and this is all I got? Notice how when Alphy pop cannot make a point..he changes the subject..? Geeesh..take a few more weeks off bud...

[QUOTE=kuniva_dAMiGhTy]You waited 20 minutes to reply and this is all I got? Notice how when Alphy pop cannot make a point..he changes the subject..? Geeesh..take a few more weeks off bud...[/QUOTE]


dang....I just read your comment a couple minutes ago....


you trippin??

[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]dang....I just read your comment a couple minutes ago....


you trippin??[/QUOTE]

2EZ...


















next, please

[QUOTE=kuniva_dAMiGhTy]You waited 20 minutes to reply and this is all I got? Notice how when Alphy pop cannot make a point..he [B][SIZE="7"]changes the subject.[/SIZE][/B].? Geeesh..take a few more weeks off bud...[/QUOTE]


what subject you talkin about?...lollipops or puberty?

[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]what subject you talkin about?...lollipops or puberty?[/QUOTE]

Explain why Kobe is better than Magic... without quotes from players and ex-legends. Break down their individual games. I'll wait pop rocks.

:oldlol: This shit ain't even close. I'll go with the GREATEST LAKER OF ALL TIME , AKA [B]KOBE "DA GAWD" BRYANT[/B]. :bowdown:

[B]Magic

- Smarter
- Higher B-Ball IQ
- Better Handles both left and right hands
- Better Rim Attacker (don`t believe me? Watch the Old Games Coast to Coasts)
- Better Post Player (Shoot Righ or Left Baby Hook)
- Stronger
- Way Better Creator and Passer

Kobe Better Shooter an 1 on 1 Player thats it[/B]