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[QUOTE=SilkkTheShocker]Im going with Reggie. He had a lot more success as the man of his teams. But its hilarious seeing Jordan homers prop up Reggie so much :oldlol:[/QUOTE]
he had a lot more success as the man of his team then a guy like paul pierce...would you put him ahead of him too?
[QUOTE=Goldrush25]Now that I think about it, I don't know one area of the game in which Reggie Miller is superior to Ray Allen.[/QUOTE]
You're probably right. But I don't think the Pacers advance as far in the playoffs if you replaced Reggie with Ray. Reggie just had an edge to him. Ray is a competitor with an amazing work ethic. But Reggie slit your throat for the sake of winning.
[QUOTE=Boston C's]he had a lot more success as the man of his team then a guy like paul pierce...would you put him ahead of him too?[/QUOTE]
Both were more talented players, but Reggie's teams just won. Pierce's biggest moment before the Big 3 coming together was a ECF run when the east was incredibly weak. Reggie played on some deep teams but he never had a running mate as good as any of Boston's Big 3. He clearly did the most with the least.
[QUOTE=SilkkTheShocker]Both were more talented players, but Reggie's teams just won. Pierce's biggest moment before the Big 3 coming together was a ECF run when the east was incredibly weak. Reggie played on some deep teams but he never had a running mate as good as any of Boston's Big 3. He clearly did the most with the least.[/QUOTE]
I guess we both have a different way of ranking players...nothing wrong with it
however...the rosters Allen and pierce played with before the big 3 era weren't very good...neither of them ever played with a competent big man before K.G (who is great obviously)
[QUOTE=Boston C's]I guess we both have a different way of ranking players...nothing wrong with it
however...the rosters Allen and pierce played with before the big 3 era weren't very good...neither of them ever played with a competent big man before K.G (who is great obviously)[/QUOTE]
Reggie is a hard player to really judge. I'm not saying I would definitely take him over Pierce/Allen. But at the same time I couldn't fault them for doing it. I'm far from a fan of arguing intangibles. I think it's a cheap way to prop up players. Kind how people will argue stupid things like "pure scorer" for Melo. But for Reggie I think it applies.
[QUOTE=SilkkTheShocker]Reggie is a hard player to really judge. I'm not saying I would definitely take him over Pierce/Allen. But at the same time I couldn't fault them for doing it. I'm far from a fan of arguing intangibles. I think it's a cheap way to prop up players. Kind how people will argue stupid things like "pure scorer" for Melo. But for Reggie I think it applies.[/QUOTE]
I hear you and the melo example is a good one too...as long as were on the same page that allen and pierce were more talented basketball players then reggie then I'm cool with the assessment
[QUOTE=Boston C's]I hear you and the melo example is a good one too...as long as were on the same page that allen and pierce were more talented basketball players then reggie then I'm cool with the assessment[/QUOTE]
Agreed for sure. :cheers:
[QUOTE=SilkkTheShocker]Agreed for sure. :cheers:[/QUOTE]
:cheers:
Ray.
Just better all-around, more skills.
[QUOTE=Stringer Bell]Ray.
Just better all-around, more skills.[/QUOTE]
So? It sure wasnt something significant that allowed him to dominate better than Reggie........ Even Tyreke Evans was better all-round than Reggie, "more skills".... Reggie didnt have many weapons, but he had a HUGE one, so huge that it allowed him to impact the outcome of the game more successfully & dramatically than Ray.... that weapon of his was clutchness/killer instinct, IQ, shooting, competitiveness and making his opponents break down mentally... Ray as the man of his team was nowhere near as impactful as Reggie was in same scenario (his entire career almost), he always was the starter and ALWAYS the go-to-guy in the 4th quarter DEMANDING the ball, even if Lebron James / Dwyane Wade was on that team, he would let them have their fun for 3 quarter and then it was "Miller Time" and the way he would deliver Lebron/Wade wouldnt mind that at all unless their ego stood in their way.... and most importantly he wanted to stay with his team his entire career, turning down opportunities to get a ring a la Ray Allen being a 3rd fiddle or benchwarmer....
Ray was better than Reggie in almost every aspect of the game, and had a bigger impact. Better defensive player (his D on Kobe during his game 7 brick-a-thon was excellent), ball handler, driver, passer, etc...
For a big shot late in the game: Reggie
For the other 47 minutes: Ray
Reggie gets overrated because he came up big against the Knicks, a big name team because it's in New York. I enjoyed the hell out of watching him sh*t on the Knicks, but he was not a better player than Allen.
Miller is taller than Allen, that's the only advantage he has over Allen. Ray any day.
Give me Ray Allen
2000-2010 Ray Allen is easily better than 1990-2000 Reggie Miller.
He could score in all the ways that Reggie could, plus drive to the basket and create his own shot way better.
And while not exactly being an all-rounder himself, Ray's all-round game was better than Reggie's extremely scoring-based game.
Ray Ray
Reggie seems to be one of those guys who history is being less kind to.
Ray was the better player though.
[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;14662224]Reggie seems to be one of those guys who history is being less kind to.
[/QUOTE]
It's actually completely the opposite.
During his own time, he only made 3 All-NBA 3rd teams and never ranked higher than 13th in MVP voting.
But flash forward a couple of decades, and for some reason he's on the NBA's 75 greatest players team over a guy with 5 All-NBA first teams and 3 DPOY awards.
Apparently reggie miller hasn't won anything in the so-called watered-down era. :confusedshrug:
Ray is probably considered greater, but I would take Reggie against certain defenses and in most playoff series.
Ray Alllen not only he is a 2 nba champion, but also a better franchise player than miller.
I'm 50, and watched most of both of their careers. Reggie was the 2nd best 2 guard all through the 90's IMO, and a cold blodded Mofo.
Ray's career was better, and up until the last couple of years listening to Reggie SLURP on Lebron every 5 seconds, I respected Reggie more.
Let's not forget Ray-Ray really stinking up the joint in the 2010 finals. Dude couldn't hit a shot to save his life. But his 2013 series winner made people forget.
Remember: without a single basket made by Ray, Lebron is 2/9 in the finals (most of us old heads don't count the bubble scrimmage - no travel, no fans etc.)
[QUOTE=Shaquille O'Neal;14876219]I'm 50, and watched most of both of their careers. Reggie was the 2nd best 2 guard all through the 90's IMO, and a cold blodded Mofo.
Ray's career was better, and up until the last couple of years listening to Reggie SLURP on Lebron every 5 seconds, I respected Reggie more.
Let's not forget Ray-Ray really stinking up the joint in the 2010 finals. Dude couldn't hit a shot to save his life. But his 2013 series winner made people forget.
Remember: without a single basket made by Ray, Lebron is 2/9 in the finals (most of us old heads don't count the bubble scrimmage - no travel, no fans etc.)[/QUOTE]
You waste your time posting that stuff
Give me Reggie.
Ray technically had a more complete game but the gap isn't big enough to the point where I can just ignore Reggie's intangibles. It's not like Ray was so good he could lead a championship team by himself.
Reggie could do close to 90% of what Allen could do but he shoots just as well. That in addition to being a total fukking killer. Any great team that Ray was on is probably improved by replacing him with Reggie, especially if there is another star player on the court who can take some attention away from Reggie.
"Miller Time" wasn't just a beer slogan.
It’s tough to say because Ray had the Lebron Advantage, either playing against him (which increases motivation and adrenaline) or playing with him (which naturally elevates and maximizes one’s skill set).
Meanwhile Reggie played in an era where ‘the guy’ might decide to play one year, another year he might not, and the whole decade was watered down by expansion anyway. So it wasnt an environment that brings out a player’s absolute best.
So all things considered I think you have to simply reject the premise that the two of them can be compared. It’s really apples and oranges.
Reggie was better in the playoffs. Not like it's a big advantage of anything but I'd go Reggie without thinking that hard.
[QUOTE=dankok8;14876499]Reggie was better in the playoffs. Not like it's a big advantage of anything but I'd go Reggie without thinking that hard.[/QUOTE]
Ray playoff career high is 51, Reggie is 41.
You would think Reggie high would be against his nemesis NY.
Ray's playoff average is 16.1ppg, Reggie is at 20.6ppg
Reggie's high was against the Bucks, beating Prime Ray Allen in the deciding game to win the series.
[QUOTE=Reggie43;14876884]Ray's playoff average is 16.1ppg, Reggie is at 20.6ppg.[/QUOTE]
This isn't really fair. Ray played a bunch of playoff games when he was out of his prime and/or not his team's #1 option. He averaged 25 ppg in the playoffs before he joined Boston.
[QUOTE=Reggie43;14876884]Ray's playoff average is 16.1ppg, Reggie is at 20.6ppg
Reggie's high was against the Bucks, beating Prime Ray Allen in the deciding game to win the series.[/QUOTE]
The Bucks were the 8th seed. That was actually Ray's first All-Star season and Reggies last.
[QUOTE=Reggie43;14876884]Ray's playoff average is 16.1ppg, Reggie is at 20.6ppg
Reggie's high was against the Bucks, beating Prime Ray Allen in the deciding game to win the series.[/QUOTE]
Thats actually a good measuring stick.
2000 Playoffs
#1Pacers vs #8 Bucks. Pacers win 3 games to 2.
Reggie avg 24/2/2 on 46%fg and 28% 3 point and 87% FT
Ray avg 22/7/3 on 44%fg and 38% 3 point and 90% FT
Not really trying to prove anything in my last post because I personally think the comparison is a matter of preference where could pick one over the other because they are the same level of players
Oh wow, the played in 99 too.
Pacers sweep 3-0
Reggie - 26/3/2 on 36% FG (yikes) 28% 3 pointer and 93% FT
Ray - 22/7/4 on 53% FG, 47% 3 pointer and 61% FT
[QUOTE=Reggie43;14876898]Not really trying to prove anything in my last post because I personally think the comparison is a matter of preference where could pick one over the other[B] because they are the same level of players[/B][/QUOTE]
Pretty much, even though I thought Ray was a better all-around player. But Reggie's classic playoff performances/moments is the reason why he will be remembered more by fans.