The Wilt Chamberlain Offensive Scouting Report Project Thread:

[QUOTE=Psileas]That's an enlightening graph. Since "at rim" shots are considered only the ones taken from <3 feet away and the pretty much most "bulldozer" prime versions of Shaq, the player who had by far the most dunks than any other since the early 90's, were taking less than 60% and, at times, less than 50% of their shots from that range, any notion of young Wilt (=the one trying to play with finesse and style rather than with power) taking 60-70% of their shots at rim is ridiculous. I especially feel so for rookie Wilt, who shot by far a career-low in FG%, yet his FT% was the 3rd highest of his career. This makes me suspect that rookie Wilt had by far the worst shooting selections of his career and therefore not many "at rim" shots at all.[/QUOTE]

And again, I suspect that in his first four seasons, Chamberlain was probably shooting 40-45+% from the field from 3-10 feet, which was better than Duncan, and other's at times, in their careers.

A preliminary look at the offensive rebound scoring section

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=askEKNB1ydY[/url]

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]A preliminary look at the offensive rebound scoring section

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OENXKgHKmhQ[/url][/QUOTE]
:applause:

A lot of great audio. BTW I noticed that on the putback, Wilt often went back up strong with a right- or two-handed dunk. I do agree that the finger roll was pleasant to look at and he mastered it as well as anybody could, but it's nice to see that after grabbing the offensive board, it was usually all power.

[QUOTE=fpliii]:applause:

A lot of great audio. BTW I noticed that on the putback, Wilt often went back up strong with a right- or two-handed dunk. I do agree that the finger roll was pleasant to look at and he mastered it as well as anybody could, but it's nice to see that after grabbing the offensive board, it was usually all power.[/QUOTE]
Don't know how you watched it seems the video is stuck in 144p with a choppy frame rate because Youtube sucks at render times like that these days :oldlol: anyways yeah I'm pretty sure that's all his offensive rebound points I've collected, if not it's almost all of them, and most are dunks yes. The fact that he's off the ball too means he moves people out of his way inside virtually at will to get at the ball. You'll notice that as soon as Youtube decides to stop playing the video back at 144p

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]Don't know how you watched it seems the video is stuck in 144p with a choppy frame rate because Youtube sucks at render times like that these days :oldlol: anyways yeah I'm pretty sure that's all his offensive rebound points I've collected, if not it's almost all of them, and most are dunks yes. The fact that he's off the ball too means he moves people out of his way inside virtually at will to get at the ball. You'll notice that as soon as Youtube decides to stop playing the video back at 144p[/QUOTE]
Good stuff, I'll check out the higher quality version tomorrow, then.

From the footage I've seen, I don't remember anyone else being better at one handed, volleyball-style tip-ins than Wilt was. This kind of shot is a FG% pooper, yet Wilt seemed to score so at a pretty high conversion rate.

[QUOTE=Psileas]From the footage I've seen, I don't remember anyone else being better at one handed, volleyball-style tip-ins than Wilt was. This kind of shot is a FG% pooper, yet Wilt seemed to score so at a pretty high conversion rate.[/QUOTE]
I've read Wilt used to practice tap ins for hours in his youth.

minor update to the rebounding section [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=askEKNB1ydY[/url]

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]minor update to the rebounding section [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=askEKNB1ydY[/url][/QUOTE]
Anyone else watch this section yet? Thoughts?

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]Anyone else watch this section yet? Thoughts?[/QUOTE]
Is the content different from the one above, or is it just higher quality? I'll watch it when I get home.

BTW did you ever settle on how to split the video up (if at all)?

[QUOTE=fpliii]Is the content different from the one above, or is it just higher quality? I'll watch it when I get home.

BTW did you ever settle on how to split the video up (if at all)?[/QUOTE]
Haven't settled on whether or not I'm splitting the passing yet but definitely for scoring it will be

Right block

Left block

Deep catches

Lobs

Transition

2-man

ORB

Good stuff oftentimes the audio is so good I lose focus.

This is great. I thought you were going to do it in scouting report style...

Rebounds:

Ability to gather himself quickly,
Bounce and second jump,
tapping skills,
rebounding in traffic.

But its great the way it is.

[QUOTE=Pointguard]Good stuff oftentimes the audio is so good I lose focus.

This is great. I thought you were going to do it in scouting report style...

Rebounds:

Ability to gather himself quickly,
Bounce and second jump,
tapping skills,
rebounding in traffic.

But its great the way it is.[/QUOTE]

If I was to include text like what you pointed out above it would take me a bit longer and you guys would need to help create/suggest these sub-categories such as what you've just done here, i'd need you guys to review the greater collection of clips and help sort from there what his strengths appear to be. The audio I like to have just to mask the music, the music alone sometimes is 'blocked' in countries but if I mask it with dialogue/etc everyone can see it plus it's just cool to hear, I try to keep it pertinent to each section. Anyways, I'm open to labeling what he's doing if you think I should it will just take a bit more time and organization and I will need feedback from you guys like what you've just given. What do you think?

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]If I was to include text like what you pointed out above it would take me a bit longer and you guys would need to help create/suggest these sub-categories such as what you've just done here, i'd need you guys to review the greater collection of clips and help sort from there what his strengths appear to be. The audio I like to have just to mask the music, the music alone sometimes is 'blocked' in countries but if I mask it with dialogue/etc everyone can see it plus it's just cool to hear, I try to keep it pertinent to each section. Anyways, I'm open to labeling what he's doing if you think I should it will just take a bit more time and organization and I will need feedback from you guys like what you've just given. What do you think?[/QUOTE]

Audio is great - so good I have to watch it twice because I was distracted in a good way.

You don't need more than four categories in rebounding and three might be better??? I don't want to suggest everything but I will lay out a basic template and you should reject probably half on what you know you have. And other people here will come up with better ideas.

Off the top of my head from this and another one I seen lately:


Tenacity.
Agility Ability to run the court, alley oops
In transition



Defense
Range coverage
.......lateral quickness
.......Radius from the basket

Use of size and strength
......vertical extension
......timing

Intimidation and second guessing

Offense
Post moves

Adjustments
......Spins
.......Left or Right

Touch

This is probably good enough and limits the organization time down some.

Just watched the 720p version, good stuff. The clips look great, and the audio is excellent (no clue how you find these gems :cheers: ).

So I'm thinking my recommendation for the main video would be:

1) intro
2) left block:
-primary move
-counter(s)
3) right block:
-primary move
-counter(s)
4) offensive rebounding

I think this would cover the bulk of his half-court scoring, which I think was the inspiration for the video. Though that still leaves:

Deep catches
Lobs
Transition
2-man

Maybe you should group offensive rebounding in with those categories? What do you want to do with passing (is that part of two man, or are those scores by Wilt)?

Also, did you decide if you're going to include a segment on high post play, and include some of his top of the key shooting from college? You could also include passing and screen-setting from the FT line (though I believe you and several others have said the time he spent in the high post is largely overstated).

Actually, splitting into primary moves and counters might not be a great idea, since it'll remove the fluidity of the video and make it a difficult watch. Your call, you're the editing master here.

:cheers:

[QUOTE=fpliii]Just watched the 720p version, good stuff. The clips look great, and the audio is excellent (no clue how you find these gems :cheers: ).

So I'm thinking my recommendation for the main video would be:

1) intro
2) left block:
-primary move
-counter(s)
3) right block:
-primary move
-counter(s)
4) offensive rebounding

I think this would cover the bulk of his half-court scoring, which I think was the inspiration for the video. Though that still leaves:

Deep catches
Lobs
Transition
2-man

Maybe you should group offensive rebounding in with those categories? What do you want to do with passing (is that part of two man, or are those scores by Wilt)?

[B]Also, did you decide if you're going to include a segment on high post play, and include some of his top of the key shooting from college[/B]? You could also include passing and screen-setting from the FT line (though I believe you and several others have said the time he spent in the high post is largely overstated).[/QUOTE]

I absolutely concur. As I have stated before, there are those that claimed that Wilt came into the NBA with a good outside shot (at least to 15 ft.) And I honestly believe that an early-NBA Wilt was routinely taking 10-15 ft shots, which is one of the reasons his FG% was considerably lower in those years, than from the mid-60's on.

As a sidenote, I think Chamberlain's best footage comes in his "masked" season. He is just overwhelming in that footage.

Purely from scoring I've got:

Physical Profile/Attributes

Left Block

Lobs/Deep catches/Transition

Offensive Rebounding

In a relatively completed state, and the video is already 23 minutes long. Looks like I will be breaking up passing and scoring, because I haven't even put the Right Block and Backdoor/P&R/Give and Go sections together yet, which I'm guessing will be at least another 10-12 minutes.

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]Purely from scoring I've got:

Physical Profile/Attributes

Left Block

Lobs/Deep catches/Transition

Offensive Rebounding

In a relatively completed state, and the video is already 23 minutes long. Looks like I will be breaking up passing and scoring, because I haven't even put the Right Block and Backdoor/P&R/Give and Go sections together yet, which I'm guessing will be at least another 10-12 minutes.[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't have a problem with a long video, but I suspect that many other's might. Perhaps you should break them up into parts?

[QUOTE=LAZERUSS]I wouldn't have a problem with a long video, but I suspect that many other's might. Perhaps you should break them up into parts?[/QUOTE]
I am going to break it up, into scoring - and passing - and maybe a defensive video in the future. I'm going to at least keep the scoring all together though.

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]I am going to break it up, into scoring - and passing - and maybe a defensive video in the future. I'm going to at least keep the scoring all together though.[/QUOTE]

Excellent.

I mentioned it a while back, but what do you think of Chamberlain's "masked" footage? He is just flat-out overwhelming in the footage that exists.

[QUOTE=LAZERUSS]I mentioned it a while back, but what do you think of Chamberlain's "masked" footage? He is just flat-out overwhelming in the footage that exists.[/QUOTE]
Well it should, it's a glimpse of him in his prime, and the masked footage against Thurmond I believe actually was a few clips from one of his 40+ point games... some of the only clips we've got when he was in a genuine 'attack' mode. I've also got footage of him as a rookie that looks overwhelming so I think it's just a product of him being quicker and more agile than he was as a Laker and being less... disinterested towards scoring shall we say, which is how he is in most of the footage that exists. I stumbled on some new clips today that I forgot I had that show him duplicating some right block moves he put on Jabbar but from 10 years prior doing it to Bill Russell and his agility, lift and balance executing the identical move looks much greater in the footage of him at a younger age.

I am so excited to see this, no pun intended of course. Godspeed.

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]Well it should, it's a glimpse of him in his prime, and the masked footage against Thurmond I believe actually was a few clips from one of his 40+ point games... some of the only clips we've got when he was in a genuine 'attack' mode. I've also got footage of him as a rookie that looks overwhelming so I think it's just a product of him being quicker and more agile than he was as a Laker and being less... disinterested towards scoring shall we say, which is how he is in most of the footage that exists. I stumbled on some new clips today that I forgot I had that show him duplicating some right block moves he put on Jabbar but from 10 years prior doing it to Bill Russell and his agility, lift and balance executing the identical move looks much greater in the footage of him at a younger age.[/QUOTE]

Not that an earlier NBA Chamberlain wasn't dominant, but a mid-60's Wilt just slaughtered Reed, Bellamy, Thurmond, and Russell in his H2H's.

[QUOTE=LAZERUSS]I mentioned it a while back, but what do you think of Chamberlain's "masked" footage? He is just flat-out overwhelming in the footage that exists.[/QUOTE]
That one ASG (I think it's 62?) and the footage PHILA found from that game where Wilt breaks the scoring record I believe are both pretty good too IMO.

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]Purely from scoring I've got:

Physical Profile/Attributes

Left Block

Lobs/Deep catches/Transition

Offensive Rebounding

In a relatively completed state, and the video is already 23 minutes long. Looks like I will be breaking up passing and scoring, because I haven't even put the Right Block and Backdoor/P&R/Give and Go sections together yet, which I'm guessing will be at least another 10-12 minutes.[/QUOTE]
Nice.

[QUOTE=fpliii]That one ASG (I think it's 62?) and the footage PHILA found from that game where Wilt breaks the scoring record I believe are both pretty good too IMO.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, Wilt was very impressive in that ASG (42 points on 17-23 shooting.) It's just too bad that there is so little footage of an early-NBA Chamberlain.

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]Purely from scoring I've got:

Physical Profile/Attributes

Left Block

Lobs/Deep catches/Transition

Offensive Rebounding

In a relatively completed state, and the video is already 23 minutes long. Looks like I will be breaking up passing and scoring, because I haven't even put the Right Block and Backdoor/P&R/Give and Go sections together yet, which I'm guessing will be at least another 10-12 minutes.[/QUOTE]
Here is an upload of the sections i mentioned

EDIT (link removed, old)

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]Here is an upload of the sections i mentioned

[url]http://youtu.be/0iw95y9QiZ0[/url][/QUOTE]
:applause:

Just watched the Lobs/Deep catches/Transition section, good stuff.

I actually like the dub of Wilt as part of the audio. It's a nice touch.

Wait, 10-12 minutes for the right block and two-man stuff? That's good to hear, I was under the impression that there's not much good right block footage out there.

[QUOTE=fpliii]Wait, 10-12 minutes for the right block and two-man stuff? That's good to hear, [B]I was under the impression that there's not much good right block footage[/B] out there.[/QUOTE]
Oh there's plenty, right block is his primary outlet for the finger roll, there should be as much footage of him on the right block as there is of him on the left, or very nearly so, he was proficient on both sides.

[QUOTE=fpliii]:applause:

Just watched the Lobs/Deep catches/Transition section, good stuff.

I actually like the dub of Wilt as part of the audio. It's a nice touch.[/QUOTE]
2 new finger rolls in a row starting at 7:10 and another one at 7:25 added to the left block section, another ball fake dunk at 5:26

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]Oh there's plenty, right block is his primary outlet for the finger roll, there should be as much footage of him on the right block as there is of him on the left, or very nearly so, he was proficient on both sides.[/QUOTE]
Very nice.
[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]2 new finger rolls in a row starting at 7:10 and another one at 7:25 added to the left block section, another ball fake dunk at 5:26[/QUOTE]
Nice, just watched those plays. :cheers:

Anyone willing to help get some preliminary field goal counts?

[url]http://youtu.be/P2zwdINBRkM[/url]

Still missing the 2 sections (2 man game and right block) but I'm thinking I want to premise the final video by stating the estimated % of his career fgm that exists on film at the very start of the final project. If I get some counts of field goals of these completed sections it will be easier for me to just add them to the final two sections.

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]Anyone willing to help get some preliminary field goal counts?

[url]http://youtu.be/P2zwdINBRkM[/url]

Still missing the 2 sections (2 man game and right block) but I'm thinking I want to premise the final video by stating the estimated % of his career fgm that exists on film at the very start of the final project. If I get some counts of field goals of these completed sections it will be easier for me to just add them to the final two sections.[/QUOTE]
I can take a look at the left block when I get home. Maybe someone else can try the offensive rebounding and finishing/transition (the plays happen pretty quickly so it might be hard to keep track of them).

[QUOTE=fpliii]I can take a look at the left block when I get home. Maybe someone else can try the offensive rebounding and finishing/transition (the plays happen pretty quickly so it might be hard to keep track of them).[/QUOTE]
youtube has a .25 and .5 playback speed function now which should help

[QUOTE=CavaliersFTW]youtube has a .25 and .5 playback speed function now which should help[/QUOTE]
Ah, didn't know that. Well, I'll try it out then. Anything to help out. :cheers:

[QUOTE=fpliii]Ah, didn't know that. Well, I'll try it out then. Anything to help out. :cheers:[/QUOTE]
If I can find the time I'll count what fpliii doesn't. Slow mo helps a lot, it's the only reason I caught a missed fallaway jumper by Wilt that was tipped in by a teammate.