NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

[QUOTE=Rake2204]Man, that's a bummer. I definitely feel you on the block "suck-ins" though.

And not saying the dunks are flawless, but what was your particular issue with them?

Out of honest curiosity, which basketball game has done it better in your opinion than NBA 2K11?[/QUOTE]

2K9 was great. After that, 2K10.

Dunks attempted by the opposing AI are broken. Contact dunks and alley-oops dunks are more likely to be done by the AI than the player. The controlled player also has a tendency to try and adjust their shot into a layup in the middle of a dunk animation, even though the closest defender is five feet away.

----

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]If you are trying to get basketball out of something that has to compress 50 thousand human actions into 8 buttons and make it simple you are just looking for something to complain about.[/quote]

I'm looking for what I paid for. That's all there really is to it. I don't expect flawless and seamless gameplay... where in the world did you infer that?

[quote]Of course there is. Lebron and Wade types will make contact layups at a rate nobody else will.[/quote]

Again I'll stress the importance of the difficulty, settings, and sliders with which you play at. The game runs with the most realism at the Rookie/Pro levels with "Simulation" settings, but that's not saying much. LeBron and Wade have terrific touch around the rim on all levels of the game, but that wasn't my complaint. It's when a scrub can repeatedly run into a forward and hit consistent "And 1s" despite great defense that the game is ruined.

[quote]Again....you have 8 buttons to work with and it seems you want the entirety of possible human actions availiable.[/quote]

What do I want from the game that seems unrealistic in the slightest?

[quote]Low post scoring? Most people dont even attempt it. Im a beast in the post. The only game ive even seen approach 2k11 far as what you can do in the post is like live 04. Might have been 03. But its rare. Unless you mean it being too easy...in which case id tell you nobody seems to notice other than the hackers on mycrew games.[/quote]

1.) Low post scoring is completely broken in the sense that AI bigs will hit every shot within 10 feet of the rim at higher difficulties. It doesn't matter who is shooting- period. Fadeaways, bank shots, up-and-unders, whatever you want them to do, they will make it 95% of the time (offline) whether or not you play defense well enough. To compound this dilemma is the fact that the user team's AI plays at a low level.. whether its defensively or offensively. Late to contest, never cutting to the basket on fast breaks.. it's a JV league in the open court. If you're down by 10 playing on Superstar or Hall of Fame, you will never come back despite what you do. Taking the ball inside or trying to stretch the floor does not work no matter who you shoot with.

2.) I don't play LP because I'm a guard. There's no issue with what you can do with it, it's what the CPU does with it that's mind boggling.

[quote]You have issue with FTs?[/quote]

1.) Only with Shaquille O'Neal hitting 13/14 FTs. Or Deandre Jordan going 6/7. Again.. these are AI issues, not user controlled ones.

[quote]Shot stick timing?[/quote]

1.) More evident when shooting 3 point shots. A wide open 3 point shooter on your team will brick, as will you, on higher difficulties. CPU does not share this dilemma.


[quote]You are the kind of guy I think developers have to flat out ignore just to do their jobs. The level of detail ad depth.....just thinking of the effort that had to be put in to make that game? And you will write out a list of things that can be summed up by saying "Its not actually playing basketball".[/quote]

2K Developers will ignore me just like Bioware ignored every single criticism they were given about Dragon Age 2, because their games will keep making money regardless of their issues. That's the be-all, end-all of it.

[quote]I read a developer of some Madden game years ago talking about that. The closer you get to real the more the flaws stand out to people looking for things to complain about. make a joke of a game like Blitz people have nothing to say. Work your ass off to make it the greatest thing ever seen and people will ask why a guys hair doesnt move when he falls down.

If you are gonna bitch about jump balls you just dont want to be happy. Someone complaining about an issue like that will be playing in 2054 on a Super High Definition 6D Tv that actually transports you into an alternate dimension where you have the skills of Lebron and complain that Lebron could jump a little higher than they are letting you and the game is broken as a result.[/quote]

1.) A game's successful presentation of authenticity is and will always be an opinion.

2.) Jumpballs is just one of the many problems with [B]My Player[/B]. Not the rest of the game. I said as much, and it was off the top of my head. I chose not to bore you with the dire issues of My Player because I know they don't interest you.

[quote]We must know very different users...

Perhaps the people I know play video games looking to enjoy themselves?[/quote]

I like to enjoy games as well. I play with all difficulties. This game is great for casual gaming, house parties, or when you just want to smash Bryant's face in with Howard because he just dropped 50 on your favourite team in real life. But as for a game that can give me that feeling like I'm being challenged on the same level as the AI? It doesn't even scratch the surface.

[quote]We were paying 50 dollars for Live 95 to have players on ice skates....[/quote]

That was nearly 16 years ago. With how far technology has come, are people who spend $50 dollars [B][I]now[/I][/B] being unreasonable to expect better things for their money spent?

[quote]In 2002 my stepfather saw someone playing 2k on the dreamcast and thought it was real basketball.[/quote]

My father saw my NHL 11 game on an HD TV and thought he was watching a real game. But NHL 11 is still the same product NHL 09 was, with even more bugs. Point here?

[quote]Now near 2012 we have a game with 500 shots, custom dribbling styles, on the ball defense at a level you can draw a charge playing one on one, out of bounds lobs to the goal for a dunk with time running out, reverse pivot fadeaways in the post, created players with 80 custom details down to how they shoot a contact leaner going left or how they react to a hesitation dribble and 10 different Michael Jordans with season specific skillsets....

And people who cant be pleased are pissed off about one of the 400 custom Ft animations or something petty like that.[/quote]

This is a straw-man argument. Where did I complain about any of what you listed? Unless you're not referring to me, in which case I'd tell you people who hate the FT animations are nuts.

[quote]If you arent happy now you never will be. Gameplay wise there is little if anything left to really improve. Just tweak here and there to reduce things being exploited. Which again...is an issue of players being unfair. Not the game being wrong to include the animation.[/QUOTE]

I was elated with 2K9. 2K10 was good. I'm not upset with 2K11 because I'm an asshole. And the issue is with the AI being fair- I've reiterated this point many times.

Elated with 2k9?

I play on HOF and like the second time I played it I dropped like 58 with Ben Gordon then went on to murder everyone I played with him. Lebron could go coast to coast on any difficulty by just holding the stick in the direction he wanted to go. The 2 times I used the cavs back then(I never use the games elite players...I find it bitchly) I probably missed 5 total shots with Lebron with him dropping 60 each game. 2K9 and 10 you literally could shoot 90% on jump hooks no matter who took it. I remember it clearly because I didnt even buy a 360 till just before 2k10 came out so 2k9 was my only game for a while. I used to drop 40 and up off jump hooks with Rip Hamilton just to piss my friends off.

There is no such thing as a realistic basketball game. The closest anyone has ever come is 2k11. 2k9 didnt have nearly as many animation basic to playing basketball and if a shooter made 3 shots in a row he might not miss again.

If you look at the things you are capable of in 2k11 that simply were not possible in 2k9 I dont know how it isnt great progress. just on the basketball side.

We are really running out of things to ask of these people. 2k2 was probably 90% of what an animated person could be expected to do in a basketball simulation. We are going up percentage points and now pieces of points. We wont ever get to 100 but we will always have someone looking to stress Josh smiths release being a little off more than the fact that if you have to go that far to find an error you are probably just being a difficult and should go play basketball instead of something trying to simulate it with buttons.

[QUOTE]I'm looking for what I paid for. That's all there really is to it. I don't expect flawless and seamless gameplay... where in the world did you infer that?[/QUOTE]

If you pay 55 dollars for NBA showtime 98 and get garbage....and 59 for a leap so massive it defies description in 2k11....isnt the quality greatly outpacing the cost?

Never got the "I paid ____! And I want my moneys worth!" thing in these situations.

I paid 60 dollars for sonic on the sega CD and 49 dollars for GTA 4.

Games arent really more expensive. for the quality...they are WAY less expensive. They arent nearly keeping up with inflation.

For the quality 2k11 was cheap as hell. You want what you paid for? You(perhaps your parents) paid the same thing for Live 99!

You are getting a massive deal paying the same thing for what we have now.

Im reminded of a guy I saw on the 2kforums mad he was banned for hacking. "I paid 60 dollars. I didnt pay it to get banned because I wanna win! I expect a full refund!". Different situation but both make me laugh.

You pay the same thing for 10-15 years...get the best(or very near the best) thing ever created. But complain about its cost when its 40 light years beyond shit that cost the same in a time people made less money?

Perhaps I just now got old enough to see the big picture on that....

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]Elated with 2k9?

I play on HOF and like the second time I played it I dropped like 58 with Ben Gordon then went on to murder everyone I played with him.[/quote]

I'm not saying it's a better game. I'm saying 2K9 was great for the time it was released. Gaming has evolved so far in 3 years, and I have different expectations now than I did back then. Ben Gordon and almost any decent wing player could catch fire if you knew how to play with them. I torched my friend who was using the Celtics with a rookie Eric Gordon.... first time I'd ever played the game, and I went 8/9 from deep, had 45 points total and he was choked.

[quote]Lebron could go coast to coast on any difficulty by just holding the stick in the direction he wanted to go. The 2 times I used the cavs back then(I never use the games elite players...I find it bitchly) I probably missed 5 total shots with Lebron with him dropping 60 each game.[/quote]

That was LeBron in a nutshell that year, though. Obviously it was overboard but he was that good. And man I feel you on the elite player teams.. I've only ever used the Clippers and the only time we've had a decent team was 2K5 or some shit, with Cassell and Brand.

[quote]2K9 and 10 you literally could shoot 90% on jump hooks no matter who took it. I remember it clearly because I didnt even buy a 360 till just before 2k10 came out so 2k9 was my only game for a while. I used to drop 40 and up off jump hooks with Rip Hamilton just to piss my friends off.[/quote]

I don't ever remember that... but that's pretty damn hilarious.

[quote]There is no such thing as a realistic basketball game. The closest anyone has ever come is 2k11. 2k9 didnt have nearly as many animation basic to playing basketball and if a shooter made 3 shots in a row he might not miss again.[/quote]

Predetermined animations is exactly what ruins the AI at higher difficulties, though. Being "hot" or "cold" in 2K11 means nothing when you're shooting on Pro. On higher levels, however, shooters have zero consistency. It's always a crap shoot whether or not you'll hit your shot, even if you have perfect release and are uncontested.

[quote]If you look at the things you are capable of in 2k11 that simply were not possible in 2k9 I dont know how it isnt great progress. just on the basketball side.[/quote]

But I'm not upset at all with this! The progress is great. I'm glad you can do most of these things, but my #1 complaint has been the maladjusted AI on higher difficulties.

[quote]We are really running out of things to ask of these people. 2k2 was probably 90% of what an animated person could be expected to do in a basketball simulation. We are going up percentage points and now pieces of points. We wont ever get to 100 but we will always have someone looking to stress Josh smiths release being a little off more than the fact that if you have to go that far to find an error you are probably just being a difficult and should go play basketball instead of something trying to simulate it with buttons.[/QUOTE]

I really think you're arguing against a point I'm not making.

Im gonna stick with this because I think its the basis of the problem we have here:

[QUOTE]Predetermined animations is exactly what ruins the AI at higher difficulties, though. Being "hot" or "cold" in 2K11 means nothing when you're shooting on Pro. On higher levels, however, shooters have zero consistency. It's always a crap shoot whether or not you'll hit your shot, even if you have perfect release and are uncontested.[/QUOTE]

Its a crap shoot in real life....

Ray Allen has missed HUNDREDS(if not thousands) of wide ass open 3s he got off clean with his normal perfect release. But everytime he does it on 2k...."Oh thats some bullshit!". I know its like that around here. I play with a lot of people. we complain like everyone else. Human nature. I see a guy just let someone walk into the lane im asking "What the ****? He didnt even try?" complaining about the game. And yet every game in real life I watch Carlos Boozer do the same thing. If Lebron makes 8-9 jumpers in a row people say the game is broken.....ignoring that sometimes...he just does that:

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyd4NPvzKQg[/url]


Kobe goes off on the game"You superstarred me....real video game shit". As if Kobe never outscored the other team?

I bet if we had vide ogames in the 60s a guy would be saying "No way does wilt go 28-30 from the line!" ignoring that he did it last week when he dropped 100.

Crazy mistakes of AI( or...realI) happen.

But let it happen in a video game and the game is "broken".

People will bitch because they are prone to complaining. We all are. But that doesnt mean Ray Allen actually makes all his open jumpers.....


You call the game broken. No game has ever been...right. 2k9 and 10 sure as hell were not. no game I can score 40 off jump hooks with pointguards is...unbroken. No game I can drop 55 with Ben Gordon easily 2 out of 5 games is...unbroken. And it just gets worse going back. so what we are left with is the fact that...

If 2k11 is broken...every basketball game in history was broken. its never been done right. Not even close. Calling a basketball game broken is tantamount to saying...it not actually basketball.

If you look hard(and if you are pointing out jump ball problems you are looking hard) every basketball game was, is, and will be broken...because its a video game.

Its a complaint that will never go away because basketball cant be played with buttons.

Hei good post Kblaze

that was i thought for years.

I also hate when user controlling all teams in asso. to justify unrealistic trade they've claimed...

for my standpoint, just leave it as is & let the computer doing their magic.

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855] Its a crap shoot in real life....

Ray Allen has missed HUNDREDS(if not thousands) of wide ass open 3s he got off clean with his normal perfect release. But everytime he does it on 2k...."Oh thats some bullshit!". I know its like that around here. I play with a lot of people. we complain like everyone else. Human nature. I see a guy just let someone walk into the lane im asking "What the ****? He didnt even try?" complaining about the game. And yet every game in real life I watch Carlos Boozer do the same thing. If Lebron makes 8-9 jumpers in a row people say the game is broken.....ignoring that sometimes...he just does that:

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyd4NPvzKQg[/url][/quote]

- There is consistency in real life. There is none in this game. At the end of the day, yes, the odds of the ball going in are 50%. But how often does Ray Allen miss that open 3? Barely. He's a knockdown shooter. You expect more from him than you would from Blake Griffin. Leaving Blake Griffin open behind the arc in real life... worth the risk. Leaving Ray Allen open is plain stupid. But that doesn't translate at all in this game. Every shot behind the arc is 30/70, even for players who are [B]known[/B] to be threats from deep.

- We all complain, there's no argument there. I do it a ton. I'll be the first to admit I have the foulest mouth when I botch a shot/play. And if it happens because I messed it up.. cool, whatever. But when you have a game that's hard coded to intentionally throw you off, no matter what your shot rating is, then that's an issue. The developers even said during the patch that they "wanted to fix three point shooting".... when the issue never even existed.

- There were definitely points about his inconsistent jumper earlier this year (James'). Before the first roster update, Wade & LeBron could not be guarded at all because there was not a shot they couldn't hit, defense present or not. But as the year progressed and ratings/tendencies started to line up, I think LeBron going 8/9 isn't as much of a surprise to people as it was earlier thanks to his recent playoff run.

- I had to laugh at your Boozer comment because it's sadly true. But try playing a game where all your teammates channel Boozer's legendary defense and you'll catch my drift (Superstar/Simulation is perfect for this).

[quote]Kobe goes off on the game"You superstarred me....real video game shit". As if Kobe never outscored the other team?

I bet if we had vide ogames in the 60s a guy would be saying "No way does wilt go 28-30 from the line!" ignoring that he did it last week when he dropped 100.[/quote]

My problem isn't Kobe going off for 60, or Wilt dropping 100. That's tough luck, and it does happen. What [I]doesn't[/I] happen is Derek Fisher dropping 30 and 10 or the other team shooting 67% from the field in the first half despite how well I play defensively.

[quote]Crazy mistakes of AI( or...realI) happen.

But let it happen in a video game and the game is "broken".[/quote]

See above.

[quote]People will bitch because they are prone to complaining. We all are. But that doesnt mean Ray Allen actually makes all his open jumpers..... [/quote]

But he makes the majority of them.


[quote]You call the game broken. No game has ever been...right. 2k9 and 10 sure as hell were not. no game I can score 40 off jump hooks with pointguards is...unbroken. No game I can drop 55 with Ben Gordon easily 2 out of 5 games is...unbroken. And it just gets worse going back. so what we are left with is the fact that...

If 2k11 is broken...every basketball game in history was broken. its never been done right. Not even close. Calling a basketball game broken is tantamount to saying...it not actually basketball.[/quote]

Each game has had it's issues. I've never seen a PG drop 40 off of jumphooks (you'll have to make a video for me, I'd actually love to see it). But we're not talking about 2K9, or 2K10. Looking back [B]now[/B], problems are easy to identify because of what gaming technology is capable of. I harp a lot on 2K11, but it is a decent game. The problem is that it is capable of being a [I]much[/I] better game than it currently is, and the technology to fix its issues is available [I]now[/I], not 4 years into the future.

[quote]If you look hard(and if you are pointing out jump ball problems you are looking hard) every basketball game was, is, and will be broken...because its a video game.[/quote]

I noticed the jump ball issue because Dwight Howard was getting beat at every jump ball on Superstar/Simulation difficulty. I didn't go out of my way to scrutinize the sheer ridiculousness of it.

[quote]Its a complaint that will never go away because basketball cant be played with buttons.[/QUOTE]

Not sure I can say anything other than 2K doesn't agree with you.

I play 2k11 all the time and... strangely I've never experienced any of these problems. What I did notice though is the same people tend to always have the same problems, which I think might be because those people are doing things that they aren't aware of and its affecting the game, and they think its the game doing it.

I'm thinking it's just going to be a situation of a couple of folks with forever dissenting opinions here. I happen to be on KBlaze's side of things but I definitely see Fiasco's side regarding a couple of issues (though not [i]all[/i] issues).

I still think it's just going to be an outlook thing. I look at NBA 2K11 and see all the crazy adjustments, additions, graphical upgrades, etc. and I say "My god, this the best basketball game I've ever played. There's no way I'd even be able to go back to NBA 2K10 now because this so far surpasses it." I acknowledge the imperfections (the silly physics-altering blocked shots at the rim, the ball "disappearing" into the stands when it's blocked out of play) and I know it's important to make note of those things and suggest improvements, but I just don't know if there's any way I can be upset with 2K video game producers with the progress being made year-to-year.

As a lifelong basketball video gamer (beginning with [i]Magic Johnson's Fast Break[/i]), I have a hard time seeing 2K11 as something that could possibly be some kind of horrible production. Of course it's not perfect, but I just could never justify any sort of "if 2K doesn't get their stuff together, they're not getting my money next year" stance. I love basketball videogaming, and I don't think anyone else has ever done it better at this point. There's no way I could pass this up.

[QUOTE=Rake2204]I'm thinking it's just going to be a situation of a couple of folks with forever dissenting opinions here. I happen to be on KBlaze's side of things but I definitely see Fiasco's side regarding a couple of issues (though not [i]all[/i] issues).

I still think it's just going to be an outlook thing. I look at NBA 2K11 and see all the crazy adjustments, additions, graphical upgrades, etc. and I say "My god, this the best basketball game I've ever played. There's no way I'd even be able to go back to NBA 2K10 now because this so far surpasses it." I acknowledge the imperfections (the silly physics-altering blocked shots at the rim, the ball "disappearing" into the stands when it's blocked out of play) and I know it's important to make note of those things and suggest improvements, but I just don't know if there's any way I can be upset with 2K video game producers with the progress being made year-to-year.

As a lifelong basketball video gamer (beginning with [i]Magic Johnson's Fast Break[/i]), I have a hard time seeing 2K11 as something that could possibly be some kind of horrible production. Of course it's not perfect, but I just could never justify any sort of "if 2K doesn't get their stuff together, they're not getting my money next year" stance.[B] I love basketball videogaming, and I don't think anyone else has ever done it better at this point. There's no way I could pass this up[/B].[/QUOTE]

:cheers:

Imma get the Bird cover :rockon:

Fiasco, Kblaze.

2k is the best game out there (only videogame I still play) and I don't wanna sound like a b*tch complaining about a game.. but I kinda feel what Fiasco is saying somewhat.

Multiplayer (offline) is great fun, but I like to play association/franchise vs CPU, been doing that for more than 10 years in videogames now (no life, lol).
two major issues with 2k11 (for me) were:
1. No good balance between roleplayers/scrubs/stars for CPU/player
2. Shot stick timing

1.
I can't stand the fact that, even with (what's supposed to be) realistic sliders and good defense on my behalf (if I may say so), I had Jermaine O'Neal killing me with midrange fadeaways of post-ups. He torched me for 30 and 16 a few days ago (on a fantasy team). Ridiculous shots all around, just unstoppable :lol I won though.

These things happen to often IMO when you play on superstar/HOF.
More so than with previous 2k games or even Live games (waayy back though). Role players go for 30 too often. Also, I like the fact that they have tendencies for players, but some guys shoot too much now. Kevin Durant for instance shoots like 30/40 shots a game every time you play him, which scks somehwat.. but ok I can live with it. However, when JO does it :facepalm

The other way around though, this doesnt work. User controlled roleplayers have great games sometimes, but most are just worthless when playing on higher levels, forcing you to rely on your starters too much. That might just be me though.


2.
Shot stick timing is somewhat of an issue sometimes. There have been complaints on different forums/websites that some players have shots that are to difficult to master.
Nowitzki for instance has a difficult release. If you don't feel it for a game, you'll miss a lot (a lot) of open jumpers. Some people boss with him though. I think they'll fix that a bit though (they read 2k forums/complaints too I presume).


Also, I feel that a player like Larry Bird loses his value because his intangibles, court vision, handling, shooting are nullified by his weaknesses - he's slow, bad elevation, shot that is tough to master. He was a monster on 2k5 (bit oldschool, but let me make my point..). He was not the fastest in those games, but he could finish from everywhere, strong around the hoop, didn't dribble into defenders as much to come to an awkward halt.. Easier to use than now.
Bird can catch fire and be great to play with, but he's not as easy to use as JR Smith, or players like him.. Guys that are fast, can finish up close and can bomb from long range (Shannon Brown, JR Smith, Jason Richardson), are too good in these games (Both on CPU, or when you play with them) They need to balance that out a bit.. somehow. I felt like they had that right in older versions but kinda let it slip at some point.


Overall, games have gotten more realistic and Kblaze had a point..The above issues mightve been there in the old days, but just didnt stand out because games were less realistic.
Still, NBA Live 2000 and NBA 2K3 produced the best, most realistic box scores of any games I've played. I can be somewhat of a statgeek sometimes, so I liked that :D

Still, 2k11 was better than 2k10/2k9 and I cant wait for 2k12 :bowdown:

[QUOTE=Dave3]They need to bring back the all decade team just so I can use players like Shaq, Tmac, AI, and Kobe in their primes again.

Edit: oh, and definitely do something about myplayer mode. On rookie the other team shoots 32% FG. On all star or w/e the next level up is, my team also shoots 32% FG. Why are NBA teams struggling to break 35% FG? My rebounding stats are inflated like crazy.[/QUOTE]
That's why they need to let us use sliders in My Player. My Player feels so different from the other modes, and many of it's problems can be fixed with the right sliders.

I used to drop 60 regularly with Samuel Dalembert on 2K9 on HOF difficulty.

A lot of people's passing gripes comes from them throwing horrible passes.

Those are all fake. This is the real one:

[IMG]http://s3.amazonaws.com/imgly_production/1545014/large.jpg[/IMG]

[QUOTE=Dasher]I used to drop 60 regularly with Samuel Dalembert on 2K9 on HOF difficulty.

A lot of people's passing gripes comes from them throwing horrible passes.[/QUOTE]
I agree. If you don't use the pass feature where you pick using one of the buttons(Y, X, B, or A on the xbox), you're going to turn the ball over like its your job. The regular passing feature is horrid. It never goes to the right guy.

I find lots of people don't fake a pass before doing a pass either, I know I dont :oldlol: Thats something that has to be done in basketball a lot, especially if you're playing a more on-edge defender.

People that complain about the same things are either stuck up on them, or making the same mistakes.

Or its something like My Player that just isn't DONE yet. Or its something like realism that isn't quite there yet.

There are some flaws in 2k11. I can't play My Player. You cannot justify someone starting out as a 45 and making it onto an NBA team. I'd rather start at atleast 55 with less skill points.

Association trading is horrible. Its getting better. But if you do the thing where you put players on the block and get offers from all the teams, 28 of the 30 are trying to rip you off or get the better end of it. Not to mention, the CPU constantly denies trades. Some players say they're "going to test the free agency market" when their team is 10-0 on the season so far.

I mean these are things that will be fixed, and things that won't stop me from buying 2k12, 2k13, 2k14, 2k15, 2k16, so on and so forth. Well, unless some new basketball giant comes along and surpasses them. Which could happen.

[QUOTE=Fiasco]- There is consistency in real life. There is none in this game. At the end of the day, yes, the odds of the ball going in are 50%. But how often does Ray Allen miss that open 3? Barely. He's a knockdown shooter. You expect more from him than you would from Blake Griffin. Leaving Blake Griffin open behind the arc in real life... worth the risk. Leaving Ray Allen open is plain stupid. But that doesn't translate at all in this game. Every shot behind the arc is 30/70, even for players who are [B]known[/B] to be threats from deep.

- We all complain, there's no argument there. I do it a ton. I'll be the first to admit I have the foulest mouth when I botch a shot/play. And if it happens because I messed it up.. cool, whatever. But when you have a game that's hard coded to intentionally throw you off, no matter what your shot rating is, then that's an issue. The developers even said during the patch that they "wanted to fix three point shooting".... when the issue never even existed.

- There were definitely points about his inconsistent jumper earlier this year (James'). Before the first roster update, Wade & LeBron could not be guarded at all because there was not a shot they couldn't hit, defense present or not. But as the year progressed and ratings/tendencies started to line up, I think LeBron going 8/9 isn't as much of a surprise to people as it was earlier thanks to his recent playoff run.

- I had to laugh at your Boozer comment because it's sadly true. But try playing a game where all your teammates channel Boozer's legendary defense and you'll catch my drift (Superstar/Simulation is perfect for this).



My problem isn't Kobe going off for 60, or Wilt dropping 100. That's tough luck, and it does happen. What [I]doesn't[/I] happen is Derek Fisher dropping 30 and 10 or the other team shooting 67% from the field in the first half despite how well I play defensively.



See above.



But he makes the majority of them.




Each game has had it's issues. I've never seen a PG drop 40 off of jumphooks (you'll have to make a video for me, I'd actually love to see it). But we're not talking about 2K9, or 2K10. Looking back [B]now[/B], problems are easy to identify because of what gaming technology is capable of. I harp a lot on 2K11, but it is a decent game. The problem is that it is capable of being a [I]much[/I] better game than it currently is, and the technology to fix its issues is available [I]now[/I], not 4 years into the future.



I noticed the jump ball issue because Dwight Howard was getting beat at every jump ball on Superstar/Simulation difficulty. I didn't go out of my way to scrutinize the sheer ridiculousness of it.



Not sure I can say anything other than 2K doesn't agree with you.[/QUOTE]
You need a good set of sliders.