"Kobe Bryant is not as money as we think" - Henry Abbott

[QUOTE=SwooshReturns]Anybody insinuating Bynum should be a number 1 option needs to get smacked in the face. Have you ever seen this kid try to handle a double team? Now imagine no Kobe, and he's the main option. His team would be atrocious. He can't pass to save his life. Kobe's agenda is score, score, score ... but I at least know he can handle doubles and has the ABILITY to read defenses and pass. It's just not in his nature to give it up. Is it selfish? Sure. But he's still the better more proven number 1 option.[/QUOTE]

I agree with this, as well... which is all the more reason the Lakers need a legit passing PG.

Kobe can still be the #1 option, but shots needs to be divided accordingly.

Kobe should not be averaging 24-25 shots... More like 18-20 shots.

Bynum/Gasol should have averaging 14-17 shots a game as well...

[QUOTE=Legends66NBA7]Kobe should not be averaging 24-25 shots... More like 18-20 shots.[/QUOTE]
Agreed. But in the playoffs, I want to see Kobe shooting 24 shots a game.

I don't trust Bynum or Gasol with that kind of accountability. Gasol's too soft, Bynum's too stupid and not talented enough.

Bynum is selfish too, btw. I've never even see this guy make the obvious kick out pass when doubled, re-position, and ask for the ball back to make a quicker, smarter, prepared decision.

:facepalm

Hehehe people are still writing their ass off in this thread.....I guess the fail is strong when it comes to Henry abbot. Bunch of basketball illiterates I see.

So to resume, Kobe = fail? :violin:

I actually agree. It's never a good idea for one person scoring all of the points. Yeah, they definitely need to divide up the shots evenly, preferably Kobe shooting 20 times while Pau and Drew each get 15-17 shots a game.

Pau and Drew need to be more aggressive and demand the ball more.

[QUOTE=chips93]one thing that irritates the shit out of me with abbott's arguement, is that he takes late-game execution as a given.

he makes it seem like teams could get great shots by running standard offense, if they just[I] tried[/I].

but, in reality, defense late in games step up. a lot. so simple screening and cutting, having everybody on the same page, its not as simple as just deciding to do it. it takes great execution, which is a skill that lots of teams lack.

fact is, most teams make small mistakes on defense every possession, thats why simple offenses work. somebody gets lost on a screen, somebody misses a rotation, somebody is ball watching, these things occur in regular situations and yield baskets for the offense. offenses rely on defenses making mistakes.

but in crunch time, when the defense is locked in, these mistakes are greatly reduced, so the offensive teams suffer, if they are running standard sets.

im not going to defend kobe, but this idea that all you have to do is decide to run some screens, everything works perfectly, and you get lay-ups is nice in theory, but when the other team is digging in defensively, and the pressure is on, executions suffers.

thats why teams go to isolations. you dont have to worry about execution and cohesion, because it is so simple. get him the ball, get out of his way, and we get a decent shot. as opposed to running some elaborate screening motion, where there are a lot of moving parts, where only one thing has to go wrong, and the play is ruined.

you need very smart players to run good plays at the end of games, and most teams dont have enough of these smart players to make it work, so they resort to isos.



in an ideal situation you have 5 smart guys (like say the celtics or spurs) or a great floor general (cp3) who can get everybody on the same page, then you can run real plays, and get good shots. but if you have metta world peace, or andrew bynum, you are probably going to have to resort to something [I]much[/I] simpler.[/QUOTE]

This

Kobe Bryant is easy to defend now because he goes to the same moves over and over. His days of getting to the basket are over so he just takes ISO fadeaways. Hell a 36 year old Ray Allen guards him well even. All you have to do is not bite on his fakes and put a hand in his face and that's what Allen does. Sometimes he gets hot, but I never worry about it and always wonder when people are...he's bound to go cold and start missing again....you just have to wait out his hot streak.

[QUOTE=chips93]one thing that irritates the shit out of me with abbott's arguement, is that he takes late-game execution as a given.

he makes it seem like teams could get great shots by running standard offense, if they just[I] tried[/I].

but, in reality, defense late in games step up. a lot. so simple screening and cutting, having everybody on the same page, its not as simple as just deciding to do it. it takes great execution, which is a skill that lots of teams lack.

fact is, most teams make small mistakes on defense every possession, thats why simple offenses work. somebody gets lost on a screen, somebody misses a rotation, somebody is ball watching, these things occur in regular situations and yield baskets for the offense. offenses rely on defenses making mistakes.

but in crunch time, when the defense is locked in, these mistakes are greatly reduced, so the offensive teams suffer, if they are running standard sets.

im not going to defend kobe, but this idea that all you have to do is decide to run some screens, everything works perfectly, and you get lay-ups is nice in theory, but when the other team is digging in defensively, and the pressure is on, executions suffers.

thats why teams go to isolations. you dont have to worry about execution and cohesion, because it is so simple. get him the ball, get out of his way, and we get a decent shot. as opposed to running some elaborate screening motion, where there are a lot of moving parts, where only one thing has to go wrong, and the play is ruined.

you need very smart players to run good plays at the end of games, and most teams dont have enough of these smart players to make it work, so they resort to isos.



in an ideal situation you have 5 smart guys (like say the celtics or spurs) or a great floor general (cp3) who can get everybody on the same page, then you can run real plays, and get good shots. but if you have metta world peace, or andrew bynum, you are probably going to have to resort to something [I]much[/I] simpler.[/QUOTE]

Fantastic post. Stuff like this is why I cringe at the lack of basketball IQ/bad coaching in the NBA. It takes a lot of work and smart players to be able to function like a true team in the NBA. You can't expect teams to simply turn off iso ball and turn on great team basketball. Heck, a lot of players can't even notice open guys when they're too busy trying to run a set properly.

[QUOTE=TheAesirsFinest]Fantastic post. Stuff like this is why I cringe at the lack of basketball IQ/bad coaching in the NBA. It takes a lot of work and smart players to be able to function like a true team in the NBA. You can't expect teams to simply turn off iso ball and turn on great team basketball. Heck, a lot of players can't even notice open guys when they're too busy trying to run a set properly.[/QUOTE]

Brown trying to play offense based on sets is ridiculous with this team. You don't do it in a team full of scrubs period. That's the difference between Phill's triangle and Browns traditional NBA offense. I am not saying he's wrong to choose that offense, I am just saying the pieces at his disposal will not do a good job at it period. In the triangle, freedom allows scrubs even to be a part with little IQ. For Brown's offense to work you need role players, a good PG and the Lakers lack all of the above. All things considered the transition is clearly a pain and the Lakers bench and scrubs don't help it either. Add to that Kobe being off for a game or two and you get complete meltdowns on the road. Also add the insecurity of trades for everyone in that Laker's team and you get total chaos.

It's a bad year to be a Lakers fan...... I am pretty pleased how they have performed at home and the current record. Could have been way way worse. At least Brown's defense mentality is paying off at one part of the equation. Who would have thought the Lakers starters would play such defense this day in age?

[QUOTE=chips93]one thing that irritates the shit out of me with abbott's arguement, is that he takes late-game execution as a given.

he makes it seem like teams could get great shots by running standard offense, if they just[I] tried[/I].

but, in reality, defense late in games step up. a lot. so simple screening and cutting, having everybody on the same page, its not as simple as just deciding to do it. it takes great execution, which is a skill that lots of teams lack.

fact is, most teams make small mistakes on defense every possession, thats why simple offenses work. somebody gets lost on a screen, somebody misses a rotation, somebody is ball watching, these things occur in regular situations and yield baskets for the offense. offenses rely on defenses making mistakes.

but in crunch time, when the defense is locked in, these mistakes are greatly reduced, so the offensive teams suffer, if they are running standard sets.

im not going to defend kobe, but this idea that all you have to do is decide to run some screens, everything works perfectly, and you get lay-ups is nice in theory, but when the other team is digging in defensively, and the pressure is on, executions suffers.

thats why teams go to isolations. you dont have to worry about execution and cohesion, because it is so simple. get him the ball, get out of his way, and we get a decent shot. as opposed to running some elaborate screening motion, where there are a lot of moving parts, where only one thing has to go wrong, and the play is ruined.

you need very smart players to run good plays at the end of games, and most teams dont have enough of these smart players to make it work, so they resort to isos.



in an ideal situation you have 5 smart guys (like say the celtics or spurs) or a great floor general (cp3) who can get everybody on the same page, then you can run real plays, and get good shots. but if you have metta world peace, or andrew bynum, you are probably going to have to resort to something [I]much[/I] simpler.[/QUOTE]

I disagree with a lot of your post, I think you're missing some things concerning practice time and effort. I might come back to this thread tomorrow.

[QUOTE=Smoke117]Kobe Bryant is easy to defend now because he goes to the same moves over and over. His days of getting to the basket are over so he just takes ISO fadeaways. Hell a 36 year old Ray Allen guards him well even. All you have to do is not bite on his fakes and put a hand in his face and that's what Allen does. Sometimes he gets hot, but I never worry about it and always wonder when people are...he's bound to go cold and start missing again....you just have to wait out his hot streak.[/QUOTE]
Pretty much. This has probably been the scouting report on him since 2010. Kobe hasn't been the same as an all around offensive juggernaut since the end of the 2008 season. Each season he has lost more and more ability to go to the basket. 2009 he could still do it at times, but with each progressing season he has looked slower and slower, and realied more on his jumper with each progressing season. Couple age with bad fingers to where it makes creating off the dribble difficult, and you become strictly a jump shooter. He does stagnate the offense when he goes ISO and you know all he can do is shoot difficult contested jumpers.

Coach Brown stated a day after a media interview that Kobe should be considered a MVP candidate : that Kobe should just be Kobe , and the Bynum / Gasol duo would get the cream .....

Did it really back fire ?
Fact is Kobe with the mask was playing at IMO one of his higher efficient scoring periods (aka 3-4 years ago)

* But did Brown do this purely on a mental scale for Byrant to fail as he has the last two games , ignoring his teammates and just going shooting crazy :confusedshrug:

You have to wonder : Phil Jackson must of called him out at times while he coached him , and then Kobe went into a "non-shooting mode"

Maybe this is how Brown is getting Kobe to be a 'team first player' because -
Just maybe
just maybe

Kobe is really hard to coach ....

and the only way to get through to him , is making him embarrass himself :confusedshrug:

See the OP and watching commmentaries as well as read what coach's , ex-players say ... and then you just have to wonder.

So what's new? Kobe has always been a selfish ballhog chucker. He took a lot of shots, a few of it went in by sheer luck and then he is considered 'clutch' by morons. He's happy about his 'clutch' reputation so he will keep on doing this.

[QUOTE=Jasper]Coach Brown stated a day after a media interview that Kobe should be considered a MVP candidate : that Kobe should just be Kobe , and the Bynum / Gasol duo would get the cream .....

Did it really back fire ?
Fact is Kobe with the mask was playing at IMO one of his higher efficient scoring periods (aka 3-4 years ago)

* But did Brown do this purely on a mental scale for Byrant to fail as he has the last two games , ignoring his teammates and just going shooting crazy :confusedshrug:

You have to wonder : Phil Jackson must of called him out at times while he coached him , and then Kobe went into a "non-shooting mode"

Maybe this is how Brown is getting Kobe to be a 'team first player' because -
Just maybe
just maybe

Kobe is really hard to coach ....

and the only way to get through to him , is making him embarrass himself :confusedshrug:

See the OP and watching commmentaries as well as read what coach's , ex-players say ... and then you just have to wonder.[/QUOTE]

No, Mike Brown just doesn't have the balls to actually "coach" his superstar. Phil Jackson had no problem with this.

[QUOTE=TheBigVeto]So what's new? Kobe has always been a selfish ballhog chucker. He took a lot of shots, a few of it went in by sheer luck and then he is considered 'clutch' by morons. He's happy about his 'clutch' reputation so he will keep on doing this.[/QUOTE]
lol :facepalm

[QUOTE=Jasper]Fact is Kobe with the mask was playing at IMO one of his higher efficient scoring periods (aka 3-4 years ago)[/QUOTE]
Really? So it doesn't matter that he was getting almost no assists, rebounds, steals, blocks and played very little defense? Shooting is all that matter?