[QUOTE=light;14165899]I would argue that LeBron right now is a better defender than Jordan was at any point in his career.[/QUOTE]
If you would argue this then you quite frankly don't know what you're talking about.
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[QUOTE=light;14165899]I would argue that LeBron right now is a better defender than Jordan was at any point in his career.[/QUOTE]
If you would argue this then you quite frankly don't know what you're talking about.
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;14166208]Jordan finishing 2nd in DPOY in '93 is such a fcking joke :oldlol:[/QUOTE]
It is funny, MJ fans will point to MJ's accolades when convenient (like MVPs or DPOY here) but whenever it is inconvenient they dismiss them as "media awards" (like Klay/Green getting more accolades than Irving/Love from 2015-2018 or MJ having 6x all-NBA teammates in 15 seasons and LeBron 5x in 17).
1-9ball, you just proved you lied. :lol
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;14166223]Only Jordan fanboys would believe Jordan was a better defender than Robinson
And you're really using the youtube comment section to back your claim :oldlol: What, you couldn't find anything on yahoo answers?[/QUOTE]
No Jerry West, Magic, Dumars and others said he was the best defender in the league and included hyperbole about "best ever defender" as well
It wasn't uncommon to hear this kind of talk and you weren't looked at weird for saying it
The guy won dpoy and was always top 5 in dpoy.. nearly won it again in 93'
So you're just young and dumb
L4/10n
Jordan was a great defender. It is amazing how one team had arguably the GOAT defenders at their position on the same team at the same time in Pippen, MJ, and Rodman. That doesn't even get to Grant, who was an elite defender for his era, just not a GOAT-level defender.
They even had the #2 defense without MJ, Grant, and Rodman in 95' (and before someone brings up scoring! They were #10 on offense).
How stacked was MJ's team? :bowdown:
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;14166223]Only Jordan fanboys would believe Jordan was a better defender than Robinson
And you're really using the youtube comment section to back your claim :oldlol: What, you couldn't find anything on yahoo answers?[/QUOTE]
Jordan wasn't but drob is a center. Almost all centers who who are good defensively have more impact than guards or even fowards. Same goes for bron btw. He dosn't have the impact defensively of the better big men in the league
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;14166234]Jordan was a great defender. It is amazing how one team had arguably the GOAT defenders at their position on the same team at the same time in Pippen, MJ, and Rodman. That doesn't even get to Grant, who was an elite defender for his era, just not a GOAT-level defender.
They even had the #2 defense without MJ, Grant, and Rodman in 95' (and before someone brings up scoring! They were #10 on offense).
How stacked was MJ's team? :bowdown:[/QUOTE]
Only MJ made the Bulls elite on both ends, and therefore championship caliber (goat dynasty-caliber actually)
And the 98' bulls were #1 on defense before pippen came back, similar to the 95' Bulls before MJ came back
That's what happens when a team is missing players on offense (95', 98'), so they step it up on defense..
indeed, players have finite amount of energy to expend both ends, so increases on one end take away from the other.. fortunately, MJ allowed teams to be great on both ends, aka the GOAT
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;14166234]Jordan was a great defender. It is amazing how one team had arguably the GOAT defenders at their position on the same team at the same time in Pippen, MJ, and Rodman. That doesn't even get to Grant, who was an elite defender for his era, just not a GOAT-level defender.
They even had the #2 defense without MJ, Grant, and Rodman in 95' (and before someone brings up scoring! They were #10 on offense).
How stacked was MJ's team? :bowdown:[/QUOTE]
bingooooooo
+1
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;14166234]Jordan was a great defender. It is amazing how one team had arguably the GOAT defenders at their position on the same team at the same time in Pippen, MJ, and Rodman. That doesn't even get to Grant, who was an elite defender for his era, just not a GOAT-level defender.
They even had the #2 defense without MJ, Grant, and Rodman in 95' (and before someone brings up scoring! They were #10 on offense).
How stacked was MJ's team? :bowdown:[/QUOTE]
His teams definitely weren't stacked. Rod was 35 and like 3 years outside of his last all star year. He was still a great defender and rebounder but he only scored 6 points a game or so. I can only imagine how much bron stans would devalue rod if he was on brons team. Mj stans do the same though and both are idiots tbh. Towards the last chip both rod and pip were shells of themselves. Rod was no longer one of the best defenders in the league and pips back hampered his play on both ends. Mj carried that 1998 team which is something bron stans like to ignore.
[QUOTE=Bronbron23;14166278]Mj carried that 1998 team which is something bron stans like to ignore.[/QUOTE]
The same reason people ignore Santa Claus: it doesn't exist.
Rodman was all-D first team in 96' and got DPOY votes. In 97' and 98' he was still elite--ask Karl Malone...
98'? Pippen wrecked the Indiana and Utah offenses from even operating normally. His back flared up in Game 5 of the 98' finals but he was FMVP front-runner before that (anyone can Google "Pippen 1998 finals MVP" and see what people were saying).
Kukoc also was good in the 98' playoffs (after having a terrible 97' playoffs due to a foot injury). He outplayed Miller in the ECF and in Game 7. When Pippen got hurt in the finals, Kukoc stepped up to average 23 PPG in the final two games. Kukoc put up 15 PPG in the series when Stockton/Hornacek [U]combined[/U] for 20 PPG.
These facts are "spun" as "MJ carried." There is a consistent theme: MJ fans have to manufacture carry jobs because he doesn't have any during those finals run, unlike LeBron. Karl Malone would have a ring if he was on the Bulls and Jordan on the Jazz.
[QUOTE=Bronbron23;14166278]His teams definitely weren't stacked. Rod was 35 and like 3 years outside of his last all star year. He was still a great defender and rebounder but he only scored 6 points a game or so. I can only imagine how much bron stans would devalue rod if he was on brons team. Mj stans do the same though and both are idiots tbh. Towards the last chip both rod and pip were shells of themselves. Rod was no longer one of the best defenders in the league and pips back hampered his play on both ends. Mj carried that 1998 team which is something bron stans like to ignore.[/QUOTE]
LeBron played with the poor man's Rodman winning a title with him in 2016. I'm happy to give him full props because he did his job well. They probably couldn't have won without him. Having Rodman would have been even better.
LeBron is an overrated defender who didn't even deserve all of the All-Defensive nods that he got.
Rod was a great defender who could still matchup against and stop (or in the case of the mammoth Shaq, slow) oversized opponents. He could bump in the post and was especially lockdown at the end of games. He would have been sufficiently versatile to go out on the wing like Dwight does and serve as a fourth perimeter defender, but it wasn't needed in the Bulls loaded system. Additionally, he still garnered league-leading defensive rebounding numbers.
If you want to talk about Rodman, make a Rodman thread instead of another LeBron thread.
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;14166290]The same reason people ignore Santa Claus: it doesn't exist.
Rodman was all-D first team in 96' and got DPOY votes. In 97' and 98' he was still elite--ask Karl Malone...
98'? Pippen wrecked the Indiana and Utah offenses from even operating normally. His back flared up in Game 5 of the 98' finals but he was FMVP front-runner before that (anyone can Google "Pippen 1998 finals MVP" and see what people were saying).
Kukoc also was good in the 98' playoffs (after having a terrible 97' playoffs due to a foot injury). He outplayed Miller in the ECF and in Game 7. When Pippen got hurt in the finals, Kukoc stepped up to average 23 PPG in the final two games. Kukoc put up 15 PPG in the series when Stockton/Hornacek [U]combined[/U] for 20 PPG.
These facts are "spun" as "MJ carried." There is a consistent theme: MJ fans have to manufacture carry jobs because he doesn't have any during those finals run, unlike LeBron. Karl Malone would have a ring if he was on the Bulls and Jordan on the Jazz.[/QUOTE]
Rodmam definitely wasn't elite in in 98. He was still a great rebounder but he had a career low in pts and didnt make a defensive team. Yeah he got like 2 votes for dpoy but he was nowhere near winning it. Mookie Blaylock had more votes lol.
And pip wasn't elite either. He also had a career low in points in the playoffs. Mj nearly scored 20 more points a game. They were both still very good but they weren't elite. Its funny how bron stans will use stats as why bron is the goat but they totally ignore it when looking at pip.
[QUOTE=72-10;14166299]LeBron is an overrated defender who didn't even deserve all of the All-Defensive nods that he got.[/QUOTE]
72-10
boiiii you are hurting off 73-9
:roll::roll::oldlol: