[QUOTE=Overdrive;15030989]So over multiple threads we found the two things Kobe was great at already:
Intent to play defense and missing beautiful shots.[/QUOTE]
:roll: :roll: :roll:
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[QUOTE=Overdrive;15030989]So over multiple threads we found the two things Kobe was great at already:
Intent to play defense and missing beautiful shots.[/QUOTE]
:roll: :roll: :roll:
[QUOTE=RRR3;15030986]Phil was saying Kobe was overrated on defense back in 2004 lol. He wrote about it in his book.[/QUOTE]
His biggest problem to me was his constant ball watching on defense, lots of times he would just focus on the offensive player who had the ball, even though he wasn't assigned to him. This led to many defensive breakdowns.
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers;15030998]His biggest problem to me was his constant ball watching on defense, lots of times he would just focus on the offensive player who had the ball, even though he wasn't assigned to him. This led to many defensive breakdowns.[/QUOTE]
How would you rate Kobe just speaking offense wise
[QUOTE=RRR3;15030999]How would you rate Kobe just speaking offense wise[/QUOTE]
As a straight up scorer, at his peak he was one of the best to ever do it. He scored 36% of the Lakers points during the '06 season. To put that into perspective, Wilt scored 40% of his team's points the year he averaged 50 PPG. And also keep in mind Wilt played 7.5 more MPG than Kobe did, which means Kobe's scoring season in '06 might actually be more impressive.
When he was on, he was very eye-pleasing to watch. He would hit a bunch of difficult shots that no player at the time could hit, I think that is one of the reasons why he was so popular, but that confidence he had would backfire because he would also take and miss those shots difficult shots lots of times. His overall offense when taking into account passing, decision making, & efficiency is where he falls below the other all-time great offensive players. He had skill in terms of ways he could score, but didn't have the offensive versatility of a Jokic or LeBron or even Bird.
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers;15031004]As a straight up scorer, at his peak he was one of the best to ever do it. He scored 36% of the Lakers points during the '06 season. To put that into perspective, Wilt scored 40% of his team's points the year he averaged 50 PPG. And also keep in mind Wilt played 7.5 more MPG than Kobe did, which means Kobe's scoring season in '06 might actually be more impressive.
When he was on, he was very eye-pleasing to watch. He would hit a bunch of difficult shots that no player at the time could hit, I think that is one of the reasons why he was so popular, but that confidence he had would backfire because he would also take and miss those shots difficult shots lots of times. His overall offense when taking into account passing, decision making, & efficiency is where he falls below the other all-time great offensive players. He had skill in terms of ways he could score, but didn't have the offensive versatility of a Jokic or LeBron or even Bird.[/QUOTE]
Guy said "even Bird" like Bird isn't unquestionably better than Yolk. :oldlol:
Bird is actually one of the few people who gives Kobe a run for his money in terms of 1 on 1 play. I would still probably give the edge to Kobe due to his athleticism but it's a worthwhile debate. I don't get mad when someone puts Bird #2 behind Jordan.
But Bird and Yolk isn't even a debate. Yolk is to Bird what Kobe is to Jordan. In fact the gap between Jordan and Kobe is probably smaller because Yolk can't score from anywhere from the court like Larry can.
[QUOTE=Baller234;15031010]Guy said "even Bird" like Bird isn't unquestionably better than Yolk. :oldlol:
Bird is actually one of the few people who gives Kobe a run for his money in terms of 1 on 1 play. I would still probably give the edge to Kobe due to his athleticism but it's a worthwhile debate. I don't get mad when someone puts Bird #2 behind Jordan.
But Bird and Yolk isn't even a debate. Yolk is to Bird what Kobe is to Jordan. In fact the gap between Jordan and Kobe is probably smaller because Yolk can't score from anywhere from the court like Larry can.[/QUOTE]
Jokic and Bird is debatable peak wise. Kobe is about half as good as Jordan. You are delusional.
[QUOTE=RRR3;15031011]Jokic and Bird is debatable peak wise. Kobe is about half as good as Jordan. You are delusional.[/QUOTE]
Hmm, I dunno guys.
Pat Riley, Dirk Nowitzki, Vince Carter, Steve Nash, T-Mac, Mark Jackson, Allen Iverson, Jason Kidd, Kevin Durant, Steve Nash, Grant Hill, Bonzi Wells, Chauncey Billups, Jamal Crawford, Ron Artest and Andre Iguodala...
or [B]3tard[/B].
Whose basketball knowledge reigns supreme.
[QUOTE=Baller234;15031016]Hmm, I dunno guys.
Pat Riley, Dirk Nowitzki, Vince Carter, Steve Nash, T-Mac, Mark Jackson, Allen Iverson, Jason Kidd, Kevin Durant, Steve Nash, Grant Hill, Bonzi Wells, Chauncey Billups, Jamal Crawford, Ron Artest and Andre Iguodala...
or [B]3tard[/B].
Whose basketball knowledge reigns supreme.[/QUOTE]
Why are Kobe’s stats so inferior to Jordan’s? It’s not even close. Surely if he was close he would be in the ballpark. Literally all you have is opinions from people who are objectively wrong based on the facts. Kobe was nowhere near MJ you’re on crack if you think he was.
[QUOTE=RRR3;15031017]Why are Kobe’s stats so inferior to Jordan’s? It’s not even close. Surely if he was close he would be in the ballpark.[/QUOTE]
Don't take it up with me, take it up with Pat Riley.
He must be a total schmuk that knows nothing about basketball.
[QUOTE=Baller234;15031018]Don't take it up with me, take it up with Pat Riley.
He must be a total schmuk that knows nothing about basketball.[/QUOTE]
Poor poor POOR baby brained bawler. He can’t make his own arguments has to rely on quotes from others.
Let’s hear it. Let’s hear one argument from YOU. I bet you can’t do it because there’s no actual evidence supporting Kobe being that level of player.
[QUOTE=RRR3;15031020]Poor poor POOR baby brained bawler. He can’t make his own arguments has to rely on quotes from others.
Let’s hear it. Let’s hear one argument from YOU. I bet you can’t do it because there’s no actual evidence supporting Kobe being that level of player.[/QUOTE]
Why do you care about my opinion? I've made case countless times for Kobe this last week. You've read all my posts. It's clear you don't value my opinion.
You don't even value Pat Riley's, why would you value mine? :oldlol:
3tard you are missing your calling. You have a knack for seeing the game in a way others cannot, not even the all time greats. You would be extremely valuable as a scout or an assistant coach. You're letting your talent and intelligence go to waste.
[QUOTE=Baller234;15031022]Why do you care about my opinion? I've made case countless times for Kobe this last week. You've read all my posts. It's clear you don't value my opinion.
You don't even value Pat Riley's, why would you value mine? :oldlol:
3tard you are missing your calling. You have a knack for seeing the game in a way others cannot, not even the all time greats. You would be extremely valuable as a scout or an assistant coach. You're letting your talent and intelligence go to waste.[/QUOTE]
Your “case” for Kobe was a video clip of ONE shot he made :lol And then a bunch of opinions. I want facts. Why can’t you give me facts?
[QUOTE=RRR3;15031011]Jokic and Bird is debatable peak wise. Kobe is about half as good as Jordan. You are delusional.[/QUOTE]
You can only grade them relative to their era or it won’t be fair, the modern player will always be better. That being said, Bird never had a 5 year stretch where he was the consensus bitw like Jokic. Since the 80’s, only MJ, Lebron and Jokic has done that- their peak isn’t very debatable. Bird has also had many, many times more playoff failures than Jokic as well, we sweep it under the rug because players weren’t put under a microscope back then.
[QUOTE=j3lademaster;15031025]You can only grade them relative to their era or it won’t be fair, the modern player will always be better. That being said, Bird never had a 5 year stretch where he was the consensus bitw like Jokic. Since the 80’s, only MJ, Lebron and Jokic has done that- their peak isn’t very debatable. Bird has also had many, many times more playoff failures than Jokic as well, we sweep it under the rug because players weren’t put under a microscope back then.[/QUOTE]
Prepare for a bawler meltdown.
[QUOTE=j3lademaster;15031025]You can only grade them relative to their era or it won’t be fair, the modern player will always be better. That being said, Bird never had a 5 year stretch where he was the consensus bitw like Jokic. Since the 80’s, only MJ, Lebron and Jokic has done that- their peak isn’t very debatable. Bird has also had many, many times more playoff failures than Jokic as well, we sweep it under the rug because players weren’t put under a microscope back then.[/QUOTE]
I've always said Bird had several pedestrian playoff performances for an ATG/top 10 player throughout his career. He's lucky he didn't play in the social media era where that shit would be far more documented and distributed amongst fans.