Did Shohei Ohtani just have the greatest individual game in sports history?

[QUOTE=AlternativeAcc.;15038216]It's not a stretch at all

In 1996 he had 40/40 and led the leave in walks and WAR by a huge margin. Finished 5th. With today's voting that's a unanimous MVP.[/QUOTE]

Bonds is my goat so I’m not going to give you push back on it. I watched him and he was really like that.

[QUOTE=GOBB;15038226]Now post the greatest players YOU have ever seen.[/QUOTE]

1. Ohtani

2. The rest.

I saw Bonds during the early-mid 00's. Since I live in the bay area I got to watch a shit ton of his regular season games. It was amazing to watch, the hype around him was crazy, but steroids give him an asterisk.

[QUOTE=1987_Lakers;15038228]1. Ohtani

2. The rest.

I saw Bonds during the early-mid 00's. Since I live in the bay area I got to watch a shit ton of his regular season games. It was amazing to watch, the hype around him was crazy, but steroids give him an asterisk.[/QUOTE]


Cool. I’m curious about “the rest”. No agenda, or motive on my end either.

[QUOTE=GOBB;15038231]Cool. I’m curious about “the rest”. No agenda, or motive on my end either.[/QUOTE]

Pujols and Trout immediately come to mind. Ichrio was a menace too, just didn't have HR power. A-Rod was a monster too, but gets points taken off because of steroids.

More perspective on Babe Ruth as a pitcher.

Walter Johnson is usually the choice for GOAT pitcher, he played in Ruth's era.

Ruth actually had a lower ERA as a pitcher than Johnson did in two years. This was prime Johnson too.

1916
Ruth - 1.75 ERA (Would have won Cy Young award if that was a thing back then)
Johnson - 1.90 ERA

1917
Ruth - 2.01 ERA
Johnson - 2.21 ERA

[QUOTE=1987_Lakers;15038228]1. Ohtani

2. The rest.

I saw Bonds during the early-mid 00's. Since I live in the bay area I got to watch a shit ton of his regular season games. It was amazing to watch, the hype around him was crazy, but steroids give him an asterisk.[/QUOTE]

So you never saw pre steroid bonds.

Checks out because you don’t know anything about it apparently lol.

Coming from someone who followed him when he was on the Pirates that thought I was being pranked when I heard he’s coming to the Giants…He was the best player in the league before he even came to San Francisco.

[QUOTE=warriorfan;15038245]So you never saw pre steroid bonds.

Checks out because you don’t know anything about it apparently lol.

Coming from someone who followed him when he was on the Pirates that thought I was being pranked when I heard he’s coming to the Giants…He was the best player in the league before he even came to San Francisco.[/QUOTE]

That would make you like 45. I don't believe you are that old. If so, you have to be the most immature middle aged man I have encountered. :oldlol:

I didn't see pre steroids Bonds but know how highly regarded he was. He peaked as a hitter when he was on steroids though, that isn't even a debate.

Only thing Bonds was better at during the 90's was fielding and stealing bases, but even as a defensive fielder during the 90's he didn't really blow you away, people always shitted on his weak arm.

Mays had the total package. Pre steroids Bonds as a hitter was basically Mays level, Bonds was probably slightly better, but Mays as a defensive fielder was superior, some have him as the best defensive center fielder ever.

Yea Bonds was the better hitter in the league for a decade almost before the steroids. Smart player who ran the bases well too and was excellent defensively, albeit in left field so not as important.

GOAT talks are tough because the roid years really play into it. Without 2000-2004 he’s still a first ballot guy and top 15 or something like that.

Really hard to compare him to Ruth or Ted Williams. Or Mays. Or Mantle even, who doesn’t get talked about enough. He had some injuries that stifled a few of his prime years but at his best he was absolutely as good as Mays. Better hitter for sure. Not the same force athletically of course but his dominance at the plate made up for it.

I feel Pedro Martinez gets kinda forgotten as the years progress.

Didn't have the longevity to be the GOAT pitcher, but in his prime (late 90's - early 00's) he was probably the best to ever do it or at least top 3 ever.

His ERA+ numbers in his prime which is ERA comparing it to league average is the best ever. To have a 2.20 ERA in a 7 year span at the peak of the steroid era is pretty crazy.

[QUOTE=1987_Lakers;15038295]I feel Pedro Martinez gets kinda forgotten as the years progress.

Didn't have the longevity to be the GOAT pitcher, but in his prime (late 90's - early 00's) he was probably the best to ever do it or at least top 3 ever.

His ERA+ numbers in his prime which is ERA comparing it to league average is the best ever. To have a 2.20 ERA in a 7 year span at the peak of the steroid era is pretty crazy.[/QUOTE]

Nahhh. Him, Maddux, Clemens, and Unit are timeless. 4 of the probably 8-10 best ever all pitching at the same time was cool.

[video=youtube;RN1nUnCr1QM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RN1nUnCr1QM[/video]

My goodness

Of all the greatest pitchers in that era I think Clemens actually gets forgotten the most. The later steroid aspect certainly doesn't help but he was such a dawg.

7 Cy's. Only 5 instances in MLB history of 20 K's in a game and he has 2 of them.

You always hear about Maddux (76 pitch complete game shutout), Pedro (4 pitch dominance), and Johnson (struck everyone out) and rightfully so but he doesn't get mentioned much.

[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;15038293]Yea Bonds was the better hitter in the league for a decade almost before the steroids. Smart player who ran the bases well too and was excellent defensively, albeit in left field so not as important.

GOAT talks are tough because the roid years really play into it. Without 2000-2004 he’s still a first ballot guy and top 15 or something like that.

Really hard to compare him to Ruth or Ted Williams. Or Mays. [B]Or Mantle even, who doesn’t get talked about enough. He had some injuries that stifled a few of his prime years but at his best he was absolutely as good as Mays.[/B] Better hitter for sure. Not the same force athletically of course but his dominance at the plate made up for it.[/QUOTE]

[video=youtube;wj8iMqKeBKk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wj8iMqKeBKk&t[/video]

Hey Barry.... [I]don't fukk with me![/I]

[url]https://x.com/nut_history/status/1608614942395232256?s=19[/url]

[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;15038299]Of all the greatest pitchers in that era I think Clemens actually gets forgotten the most. The later steroid aspect certainly doesn't help but he was such a dawg.

7 Cy's. Only 5 instances in MLB history of 20 K's in a game and he has 2 of them.

You always hear about Maddux (76 pitch complete game shutout), Pedro (4 pitch dominance), and Johnson (struck everyone out) and rightfully so but he doesn't get mentioned much.[/QUOTE]
Really, I feel like Maddux doesn't get talked about at all.

I'm not going to say he's necessarily underrated or anything, but since we're on the topic of pitchers from that era, I think it's insane Schilling never made the HOF. He and Johnson were arguably the greatest pitching duo ever in '01, they annihilated everyone in their path including the dynasty Yankees. That's not even mentioning his iconic run with the Sox in '04.