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Name me something other than 3pt shooting that Kobe bests Jordan
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All MJ all day
:roll:
stats, what a pesky thing:lol
/thread
[IMG]http://kicksaddict.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/kobe-in-mj-jersey.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3342/4555131653_d2ec158101.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE=Shade8780][IMG]http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3342/4555131653_d2ec158101.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
Just giving AlphaWolf the rope, y'all, doing a great job hanging himself:lol
[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]and Bill Russell has everything over MJ except Ballhogging, FMVP (named after him) Championships, defensive GOAT, MVP's etc.....so why don't many people consider Russell better?...or even top 3?
Just because MJ won more biased media awards don't make him better....(Look at the above example)
again...Phil Jackson said Kobe is the best allaround player....
nuff said.
next[/QUOTE]
Where's the source of the quote of Phil saying that? I'm not saying you're wrong, but I've heard Kobe fans claim Phil quotes like this all the time and then they cite the actual source and he's saying something different.
[QUOTE=guy]Where's the source of the quote of Phil saying that? I'm not saying you're wrong, but I've heard Kobe fans claim Phil quotes like this all the time and then they cite the actual source and he's saying something different.[/QUOTE]
He said it, it was a radio interview if I'm not mistaken.
But even Kobe fans know that this is nothing but one of Phil's infamous mind games. I seriously doubt that they actually believe this to be a sincere comment.
Jordan 2 (Comeback) Jordan is the best player I've ever seen. (I saw his first 3 championship, but I was like 9 to 12 years old).
[QUOTE=andgar923]He said it, it was a radio interview if I'm not mistaken.
But even Kobe fans know that this is nothing but one of Phil's infamous mind games. I seriously doubt that they actually believe this to be a sincere comment.[/QUOTE]
Only KB fans believe it, the rest of the NBA world knows MJ> Kobe and it's not even close.
[QUOTE=andgar923]He said it, it was a radio interview if I'm not mistaken.
But even Kobe fans know that this is nothing but one of Phil's infamous mind games. I seriously doubt that they actually believe this to be a sincere comment.[/QUOTE]
Phil always says Jordan is better in an indirect way when asked, until one day in 2010 he flat out said Jordan is the greatest of all time. Mistake I made was not saving the youtube video. It would be too hard to find it.
[QUOTE=TheMan]Just giving AlphaWolf the rope, y'all, doing a great job hanging himself:lol[/QUOTE]
you gave nothing but stats...wich are marginal at best...then when that failed you just used "well the whole world says it...so it's true"
I agree as does NBA.com..."MJ by acclamation is the GOAT"....in other words...the majority says it....not by stats...or championships(he's not even close)...but by majority vote.
now since the world says MJ = GOAT...then what does the world think of Kobe?....I bet it's easily top 3 alltime right now world wide vote.
top 3 = not stupid for saying maybe the GOAT.
[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]you gave nothing but stats...wich are marginal at best...then when that failed you just used "well the whole world says it...so it's true"
I agree as does NBA.com..."MJ by acclamation is the GOAT"....in other words...the majority says it....not by stats...or championships(he's not even close)...but by majority vote.
now since the world says MJ = GOAT...then what does the world think of Kobe?....I bet it's easily top 3 alltime right now world wide vote.
top 3 = not stupid for saying maybe the GOAT.[/QUOTE]
:facepalm
tough decision, i'd go with MJ since they won 3 instead of 2 chips
Kobe is comparable to MJ in some aspects, more noticeable his offensive skill set. But even then, he's still just an MJ 'lite' version, not even MJ 2.0, just MJ lite.
Which looking at the great scheme of things isn't bad at all, but he's not better than MJ nor on par with him.
Having 'similarities' doesn't equate to being equal or better.
MJ is at the top of a 50 high pyramid, Kobe is at the 40th level at best.
Just gotta love it how the bandwagon mentality is pathetically used on ALL Laker/Kobe fans, like we're a bunch of mindless sheep like Lebron fans. We already know Kobe isn't Jordan, that's not even debatable. What makes you haters look utterly ridiculous is that you LOVE to say Kobe isn't close to Jordan. But then turn right around and want to try and bring up Lebron when he has absolutely nothing in common with Jordan. If you can't compare Kobe to Jordan, then you can't try and do it with Lebron either. Trying to do so just makes you look hilariously delusional. Then you wonder why you get the responses you normally get from not only Laker/Kobe fans, but NBA fans in general.
[QUOTE=LakersReign]Just gotta love it how the bandwagon mentality is pathetically used on ALL Laker/Kobe fans, like we're a bunch of mindless sheep like Lebron fans. [B][SIZE="3"][COLOR="Red"]We already know Kobe isn't Jordan, that's not even debatable.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B] What makes you haters look utterly ridiculous is that you LOVE to say Kobe isn't close to Jordan. But then turn right around and want to try and bring up Lebron when he has absolutely nothing in common with Jordan. If you can't compare Kobe to Jordan, then you can't try and do it with Lebron either. Trying to do so just makes you look hilariously delusional. Then you wonder why you get the responses you normally get from not only Laker/Kobe fans, but NBA fans in general.[/QUOTE]
Coulv'e fooled me.
So you're saying that all of these Kobe fans are just trolling?
Cause I know some of them in person.
Btw..... MJ fans are nowhere near as hated as Kobe fans...not close. It's overwhelmingly Kobe fans exclusively that hate MJ fans.
[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24][B]stats say Kevin Love>Hakeem..what's your point?
[/B]
I'm going off of watching both players whole careers and agreeing with Coach Phil...
get off of stats N@tz[/QUOTE]
Not gonna argue with the idiocy of AlphaWolf, as I've already destroyed him before, as there is not a single person on this board (with the exception of a few extremely biased Kobe fans) that will ever agree with him, but I just had to point out the exceptional idiocy of this comment. :oldlol:
AlphaWolf proving, once again, that he's ISH's funniest troll. :oldlol:
Subsequent.
[QUOTE=andgar923]Coulv'e fooled me.
So you're saying that all of these Kobe fans are just trolling?
Cause I know some of them in person.
Btw..... MJ fans are nowhere near as hated as Kobe fans...not close. It's overwhelmingly Kobe fans exclusively that hate MJ fans.[/QUOTE]
That's only cuz you want to try to apply a bandwagoners mentality to all Laker/Kobe fans that CLEARLY does not exist. Not my fault or my problem. And trying to hold ALL Laker/Kobe fans accountable for the actions and thoughts of a few. While having nothing to say to fake Heat fans who still want to try and compare Lebron to Jordan, only strengthens my point.
[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]you gave nothing but stats...wich are marginal at best...then when that failed you just used "well the whole world says it...so it's true"
I agree as does NBA.com..."MJ by acclamation is the GOAT"....in other words...the majority says it....not by stats...or championships(he's not even close)...but by majority vote.
now since the world says MJ = GOAT...then what does the world think of Kobe?....I bet it's easily top 3 alltime right now world wide vote.
top 3 = not stupid for saying maybe the GOAT.[/QUOTE]
I suggest you go check every GOAT list you can find on the net and on Youtube...i guarantee you won't find Kobe top 3 all-time anywhere, HOMER....:hammerhead:
[QUOTE=TheMan]An over the hill MJ:facepalm
why does LBJ shit all over Kobe? He over the hill?[/QUOTE]
You know Kobetards are whipped when they feel it necessary to prop Kobe up over a 40-year old Jordan who physically couldn't defend himself....:facepalm
[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]Kobe merked MJ at 18 - 19 years old too....:confusedshrug:
Lebron?....why would you bring a 2nd tier player into this convo?...
that's like asking why Drexler or Richmond beat Jordan on a few regular season games.....and besides....Kobe barely played the first 3 - 4 games vs Lebron.:confusedshrug:
again...keep this between top players who won.[/QUOTE]
Kobe "merked" MJ ?? You mean the whole 6 points he scored on Jordan in the 1998 game in Chicago? :hammerhead:
[QUOTE=bwink23]You know Kobetards are whipped when they feel it necessary to prop Kobe up over a 40-year old Jordan who physically couldn't defend himself....:facepalm[/QUOTE]
What's really funny is, not only was Jordan not even guarding Kobe that game, but Kobe was rocking Jordan's kicks in tribute during that game as well :oldlol:
It's [I]gotta[/I] be the shoes...
[B]"Give your Old Man a hand boy!! It's the least you can do after all I done taught ya".[/B]
[IMG]http://www.kicksandchicks.com/nike-shoes/08/08/04/images/air-jordan-viii-8-retro-kobe-bryant-player-exclusives_1.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://www.sneakerfiles.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/airjordanviiikobepemain.jpg[/IMG]
Any Jordan > Kobe today.... except maybe the Wizards one
To quote AlphaWolf, stats don't matter, Kevin Love is greater than Hakeem because he says so:lol
[QUOTE=bwink23]You know Kobetards are whipped when they feel it necessary to prop Kobe up over a 40-year old Jordan who physically couldn't defend himself....:facepalm[/QUOTE]
That's like me saying I'm better than Jerry West because I'm in my 30s and I'm sure I can beat a 70 year old ass West:facepalm
MJ is was a better athlete. Straight up fact. Mj, even in 2nd 3peat era, was more of a no nonsense player than Kobe. Kobe strings more moves together on individual plays and has more range. MJ was a really quick striker, a little different than Kobe.
[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0Jjl9_ZDY4[/url]
One of the best highlights I've seen. He is just too clean, it's too easy. Look at how fast MJ still was, especially on those plays where he is driving. Just a supreme athlete. Possibly GOAT athlete.
[QUOTE=lefthook00]MJ is was a better athlete. Straight up fact. Mj, even in 2nd 3peat era, was more of a no nonsense player than Kobe. Kobe strings more moves together on individual plays and has more range. MJ was a really quick striker, a little different than Kobe.
[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0Jjl9_ZDY4[/url]
One of the best highlights I've seen. He is just too clean, it's too easy. Look at how fast MJ still was, especially on those plays where he is driving. Just a supreme athlete. Possibly GOAT athlete.[/QUOTE]
One overlooked aspect, but highly critical was mj's faster decision making and reaction capabilities. Combine that with mj's superior peripheral vision and higher IQ and it became a nightmare trying to stop him, more so than kobe. So even in mj's later years when his athleticism had faded, he was causing tons of problems to his defenders, yes even in his wizard years.
[QUOTE=andgar923]One overlooked aspect, but highly critical was mj's faster decision making and reaction capabilities. Combine that with mj's superior peripheral vision and higher IQ and it became a nightmare trying to stop him, more so than kobe. So even in mj's later years when his athleticism had faded, he was causing tons of problems to his defenders, yes even [B]in his wizard years[/B].[/QUOTE]
He was an MVP runner before injury.
[IMG]http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/502/wizardjordan.png[/IMG]
[QUOTE=rodman91]He was an MVP runner before injury.
[IMG]http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/502/wizardjordan.png[/IMG][/QUOTE]
Not to get into a whole debate over who was better Wiz MJ or any Kobe version, but my post was meant to illustrate my point. We saw that even an unathletic MJ (for his standards) he could still give defense nightmares due to his higher IQ, faster reading and reacting time. He simply made it harder for the defense to adjust, more so than Kobe ever has.
[QUOTE=rodman91]He was an MVP runner before injury.
[IMG]http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/502/wizardjordan.png[/IMG][/QUOTE]
Jordan's biggest issues as a Wizard was he physically couldn't perform well every night. Much of that from injury and age. When you body isn't right, your shots not right....
If you eliminate all these absurdly horrible Jordan games...he was 23.9ppg on 47%FG in 75% of the games he played in.
NOT BAD considering he was playing during an era where 43-44% FG was average.
[QUOTE=rodman91]He was an MVP runner before injury.
[IMG]http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/502/wizardjordan.png[/IMG][/QUOTE]
We can also consider the fact the Jordan has SEVERAL first quarters where he went off for 18-24 points...
It makes sense that he couldn't sustain it due to physical limitations...
[QUOTE=bwink23]We can also consider the fact the Jordan has SEVERAL first quarters where he went off for 18-24 points...
It makes sense that he couldn't sustain it due to physical limitations...[/QUOTE]
What most don't understand is that MJ's efficiency wasn't low because he couldn't play, it was low because his body couldn't maintain it.
He was carrying a ton of load, he was supposed to come off the bench and play limited minutes. But as injuries and bad play piled on, he was forced to carry the entire team on both ends. He'd play great the first half, but had his efficiency drop during the second. And if one looks it up, EVERY player has a drop off in the second half, and the stats actually show that players normally have good 1st and 3rd quarters, but their stats/efficiency drop in the 2nd and 4th. And to add to this, his performance in back to back games was poor... again, due to his body not being able to handle the pressure. But in games in which he had a few days rest, he was playing like one of the best 5 players in the league and an MVP candidate.
I laugh at the notion that he couldn't play or that this generation would kill MJ.
Not really a Kobe fan, but he may be better than 96-98 Jordan in his prime. Anyway, i can understand the argument from Jordan because they are close in this argument anyway.
[QUOTE=pauk]Any Jordan > Kobe today.... except [B]maybe[/B] the Wizards one[/QUOTE]
:facepalm
[QUOTE=andgar923]One overlooked aspect, but highly critical was mj's faster decision making and reaction capabilities. Combine that with mj's superior peripheral vision and higher IQ and it became a nightmare trying to stop him, more so than kobe. So even in mj's later years when his athleticism had faded, he was causing tons of problems to his defenders, yes even in his wizard years.[/QUOTE]
Yup, and that's what's missing in Lebron and Kobe's game which causes them to shit the bed against the better defenses in the playoffs/finals. Both guys don't make quick decisions when they get the ball, there's a lot of dribbling and standing around and that gives defenses the chance to double, trap them, etc. Jordan on the other hand never let the D pigeonhole him. Like in the video Lefthook posted, MJ was always one step ahead. Whenever they would throw a double at him, he'd always put himself in a position where he could beat it or more likely avoid it. If they throw a double at him in the low post, he'd spin baseline to avoid the help. If he saw the double coming while he was at the top of the key, he'd pull a dribble move to avoid it before it was set (Dwade is great at this particular aspect, Bron and Kobe are terrible at reading help D).
Lebron usually makes up for his lack of quick decision making and play reading ability with his ridiculous court vision, so he can always find the open man. Kobe on the other hand usually decides to just chuck regardless of how ill-conceived it is, but he has gotten a lot better in the last 4 years or so in that regard. But neither guy even comes remotely close to Jordan.
jordan played in a less defense, more running and man to man vs addition of zone era. Easier to react.
[QUOTE=eliteballer]jordan played in a less defense, more running and man to man vs addition of zone era. Easier to react.[/QUOTE]
Tim Grover said Jordan is physically and mentally the best he's ever seen...and he's trained Jordan, Kobe and Lebron...:facepalm
[QUOTE=eliteballer]jordan played in a less defense, more running and man to man vs addition of zone era. Easier to react.[/QUOTE]
KB42PAH's gospel still lives :oldlol:
Absolute horseshit what you typed above. Most teams in the league don't even bother with zone (DAL and MIN in the past 10 years being the few notable exceptions who employ zone every once in a while). And that's not even considering the league making it virtually impossible to effectively guard perimeter players with the elimination of hand checking and any sort of physical play.