Printable View
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing;15012942]Exactly. Not one Conservative that I know of in the public eye or not has ever said that they weren't for legal immigration. That was an asinine thing to even imply. The Left, or those that sympathize with the Left are just vastly uninformed.[/QUOTE]
Stop acting like you've never heard of Stephen Miller.
[QUOTE=rawimpact;15012923]In two posts you went from many conservatives dont want legal immigration to conservatives want legal immigration to decrease
Do you realize how different these two things are? Conservatives want controlled immigration. Immigration should not always be helping hand from American taxpayers. There are people coming to the USA not because they need the USA, but because the USA needs them. Those are the ones that need to prioritized if we want to make the American dream viable.[/QUOTE]
Not really. I clearly said "many if not most". You're getting hung up on the wording, but the premise still remains. Who is more likely to speak against immigration, who ended the refugee program (except for whites), who wanted to scrap DACA (inhumane), etc? As for decreased immigration, it's all anti-immigrant. Here's a Gallup article:
[QUOTE]Currently, [B]73% of Republicans, matching the prior high from 1995, want immigration decreased[/B], while 10% want it increased, meaning their net preference for more immigration is -63. By contrast, 40% of Democrats want it increased, while just 18% want it decreased -- a +22 net preference score. Independents still tilt negative, with 27% wanting it increased and 39% increased, or -12.[/QUOTE]
You can call this whatever you like. It's all anti-immigrant. And a significant number of conservatives simply don't like black and brown people.
[QUOTE=rawimpact;15012928]It's true... though. Weight is really a huge problem with the culture. Universities and work places have glass limits on each race to encourage diversity. Dems absolutely love this... but if we apply the same logic to immigration policies... nope. 59 or so south african refugees were allowed and they cry injustice.[/QUOTE]
Because it's clearly anti-black/brown and pro-white. What part of scrapping the entire refugee program [I]except[/I] for whites is unclear? Furthermore, that's the first set of Afrikaaners. There will be more. And again, I'm all for bringing them (despite not knowing the full scope of the situation), but I'm all for bringing South Sudanese too.
[QUOTE=tpols;15012930]Even legal immigration isn't really a right though. You don't just get to... choose to be a citizen anywhere you want.
I can't just apply for citizenship in Japan or UAE or something. Countries are allowed to say no to immigration and keep what they have. Especially when they're floating in a major financial deficit and barely afloat as is.[/QUOTE]
Who said it is a right? What people are saying is, fix the system. 88% of legal immigrants are non-Europeans, a significant shift to once upon a time when it was mostly Europeans. It took 2 months then, it takes 10 years now. See the difference?
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing;15012942]Exactly. Not one Conservative that I know of in the public eye or not has ever said that they weren't for legal immigration. That was an asinine thing to even imply. The Left, or those that sympathize with the Left are just vastly uninformed.[/QUOTE]
Don't you regularly talk smack about Latinos, Muslims, and blacks? Coulda sworn I've seen you take aim at POC on this forum, so you saying all of this now is pretty meaningless. If it wasn't you, then I apologize.
According to the Gallup poll, 73% of Republicans want immigration decreased. Want more data, here's an article on views on immigrants and refugees...
[URL="https://globalaffairs.org/research/public-opinion-survey/republican-concerns-over-immigration-hit-all-time-high"]https://globalaffairs.org/research/public-opinion-survey/republican-concerns-over-immigration-hit-all-time-high[/URL]
[QUOTE]Key Findings
- Eight in 10 Republicans (83%) say large numbers of immigrants and refugees coming into the United States is a critical threat to the country, a record high in Chicago Council Surveys since the Council first asked the question in 1998.
- While a majority of Americans (61%) believe immigrants from other cultures have a mainly positive impact on American society, a majority of Republicans (61%) believe their impact is mainly negative.
- A majority of Americans (65%) oppose the mass detention of undocumented immigrants in camps while a majority of Republicans (57%) support such a policy.
- The majority of Americans (62%) favor a path to citizenship for unauthorized immigrants working in the United States, either with (24%) or without (38%) a fine or waiting period.
- A plurality of Republicans (44%) say “illegal” immigrants working in the United States should be required to leave their jobs and the country while 41 percent favor providing them a path to US citizenship.
- Half of Republicans (50%) say legal immigration into the United States should be decreased.[/QUOTE]
It's actually worse than I thought, lol.
Taking high quality immigrants just damages other countries. America is like the Lakers and all the other countries are the small market teams who get screwed when their best leaves for LA.
[QUOTE=HoopsNY;15013048]Because it's clearly anti-black/brown and pro-white. What part of scrapping the entire refugee program [I]except[/I] for whites is unclear? Furthermore, that's the first set of Afrikaaners. There will be more. And again, I'm all for bringing them (despite not knowing the full scope of the situation), but I'm all for bringing South Sudanese too.[/QUOTE]
So it's based on color and not race or country of origin? Are we doing pigment analysis with each applicant or what? Do the Guidos from mexico get denied refugee status?
There is a huge statistical difference between many and majority. 'Many' is up for interpretation. Does this mean five of your friends? Whereas the majority of conservatives has statistical relevance.
[QUOTE=Baller234;15012967]The right wing social media influencers you are referring to aren't shitting on Mexico because they're racist. They're doing so because the "peaceful protestors" are waving the flag of Mexico while setting the U.S. flag on fire. These people are asking for a fight. If you can criticize our country and our culture then we can criticize yours.[/QUOTE]
Cool story. Showing a few cases of flag burning isn't hatred of America, it's anger and hostility towards government and its policies. Why do you think it happened rampantly during the 1960s? There was this war called the Vietnam war that Americans didn't agree with.
Then the government tried to ban flag burning during the 80s. Flag burnings increased. Why? Because it was protected free speech and guess what happened, the SCOTUS ruled that it is in fact protected free speech.
Am I in favor of that? No. But you citing one or a few cases of this during a protest is meaningless when Mexicans are Americans and many of them are indigenous to the US long before the US even became the US. Not to mention, there's 38 million of them for crying out loud.
[QUOTE]And I'm sorry but it's not racist to criticize multiculturalism either. There are legitimate arguments against it that have nothing to do with prejudice or race. I'm not saying immigrants have to leave their identities behind when they come here but I also think they have an obligation to assimilate.[/QUOTE]
Case in point. This is why people are angry. Name an immigrant group that doesn't assimilate within 2-3 generations. I'll wait.
It's just unbelievable how you think these racist talking points are in fact ok. Multiculturalism has been the backbone of our country since its inception.
We've been a diverse nation for hundreds of years, and every time new populations arrive, bigots sell the idea to voters like yourself that "they're not assimilating" or that "they're a threat!" It happened with the Chinese, the Japanese, the Irish, the Italians, and now with Mexicans, South and Central Americans, Arabs, Indians, etc.
[QUOTE]Trump suspended the refugee program because too many people were gaming the system pretending to be facing persecution when in reality they're here for the economic benfits. I understand he made an exception for the whites coming from South Africa but those people ARE actually being persecuted. These are well off people financially. They're not looking to come here for any other reason. Plus the Trump administration said they're admitting about 1,000 people, not [B]hundreds[/B] of thousands.[/QUOTE]
Yea, and people in South Sudan ARE being persecuted. People in Burma ARE being persecuted. People in a lot of other places ARE being persecuted.
Interesting how you find moral justifications for whites but everyone else can take a hike.
[QUOTE]I mean do you honestly think that Trump is looking to beef up the white population by letting in [B]1,000 [/B] white people from South Africa? That's gonna make a dent and restore white dominance?[/QUOTE]
Trump is just a figurehead. I'm more concerned with the voting block. The sentiment is there. Ignoring it is crazy.
[QUOTE=rawimpact;15013054]So it's based on color and not race or country of origin? Are we doing pigment analysis with each applicant or what? Do the Guidos from mexico get denied refugee status?
There is a huge statistical difference between many and majority. 'Many' is up for interpretation. Does this mean five of your friends? Whereas the majority of conservatives has statistical relevance.[/QUOTE]
Bro, if you want a deep dive into my word choice then go ahead. I've made my point. Take an issue with the talking heads and the statistics, as well as the voter block, not me.
[QUOTE=warriorfan;15013051]Taking high quality immigrants just damages other countries. America is like the Lakers and all the other countries are the small market teams who get screwed when their best leaves for LA.[/QUOTE]
That is the way it should be. Sure we can take on refugees as well, but if we have the opportunity to take in talented and bright individuals -- they need to be prioritized.
[QUOTE=HoopsNY;15013056]Bro, if you want a deep dive into my word choice then go ahead. I've made my point. Take an issue with the talking heads and the statistics, as well as the voter block, not me.[/QUOTE]
Because your word choice has significance which is why i asked for a poll citation. How do you not see a difference between the word many vs majority? You can call it what you want... but until you provide a reference proving majority of conservatives are against immigration... it's completely false. You are trying to paint conservatives a certain way by making fallacious presumptions. Just because one wants better control does not mean they want to abolish.
[QUOTE=rawimpact;15013057]That is the way it should be. Sure we can take on refugees as well, but if we have the opportunity to take in talented and bright individuals -- they need to be prioritized.[/QUOTE]
You can't have your cake and eat it too. High functioning, wealthy, and otherwise intellectual individuals likely won't leave their homeland (unless there's like civil war or something). They have good standing in society and have the means for a good life.
The US is a capitalist system. We need a lot of low skilled labor to keep the engine running. Immigrants will often fill those jobs simply because Americans won't.
I'm sure you're an educated and probably doing well enough for yourself. Are you going to drive a taxi, change the bedsheets at the Hampton Inn, pick fruit, or clean a train stop?
It's immigrants who do the majority of these jobs as well as produce jobs because some of them sell land and property in their home countries to open up gas stations, restaurants, delis, local restaurants in their ethnic enclaves, etc.
This has been the rubric forever and it's not going to change because some Americans like you and tpols think a bunch of upper-middle class scientists will mass migrate and fill those jobs.
[QUOTE=rawimpact;15013058]Because your word choice has significance which is why i asked for a poll citation. How do you not see a difference between the word many vs majority? You can call it what you want... but until you provide a reference proving majority of conservatives are against immigration... it's completely false. You are trying to paint conservatives a certain way by making fallacious presumptions. Just because one wants better control does not mean they want to abolish.[/QUOTE]
I showed statistics that showed the majority of Republicans believe immigration and refugees to be a threat. What part of anti-DACA, close the refugee program but allow whites, 8/10 Republicans saying immigrants and refugees are a threat, or 73% of Republicans wanting decreased immigration does not drive home the point?
[QUOTE=HoopsNY;15013049]Who said it is a right? What people are saying is, fix the system. 88% of legal immigrants are non-Europeans, a significant shift to once upon a time when it was mostly Europeans. It took 2 months then, it takes 10 years now. See the difference?[/QUOTE]
USA wasn't running like a 40 trillion dollar government deficit back then bro. And there were way less people back then so a population increase wasn't a big deal. Now it is. I don't think you realize how broken the house of cards is that the USA government is currently operating as.
[QUOTE=TheMan;15013046]Stop acting like you've never heard of Stephen Miller.[/QUOTE]
Show me where Stephen Miller has said he's against legal immigration. Remember, I'm the Conservative here. I know my side.