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[quote=hateraid]Better as in becoming successful adults in every aspect. Also to become better people in terms of attitude.[/quote]
i view "success" differently than most folks as you can imagine. its not about the material things but the relational
one guiding principle: what kind of care does one give others?
my turn on the "hot seat" (it has actually only felt "lukewarm and not hot at all) has been a bit erratic this weekend as i havent been around much.
i leave it to "the myth" to judge whether my time is up of to extend it into monday as was mentioned earlier.
i will be on-line more tomorrow (monday)
bump.
i am around for the next hour; then back at about 9:00pm pst
:sleeping:sleeping:sleeping
What is your stance on Cheese Doodles?
Do you prefer Crunchy or Puffed? Do the Crunchy ones hurt your gums at all?
Fritos or Cheetos?
[quote=NY Comeback]What is your stance on Cheese Doodles?
Do you prefer Crunchy or Puffed? Do the Crunchy ones hurt your gums at all?[/quote]
the crunchy ones rule and worth any pain of the gums
be back later...
rainerbeachpoet.
have you posted a picture of yourself in the post a picture of yourself thread?
[quote=Mamba]rainerbeachpoet.
have you posted a picture of yourself in the post a picture of yourself thread?[/quote]
i have not-- i prefer intrigue and mystery when it comes to these kinds of things
Do you believe in transubstantiation and if yes explain how it occurs?
[quote=G-train]Do you believe in transubstantiation and if yes explain how it occurs?[/quote]
i think it is a theological construct that is based on scholastic philosophy/theology of thomas aquinas. if memory serves me well, it is about substance and accidents. the substantive "being" of a thing doesnt change while the "accidental" aspects of it can.
so the eucharist could be explained as transubstantiation in that while the "accidents" of the bread and wine can remain, the substantive reality is the change into the body and blood of Christ. primarily because of jesus' words/prayer at the last supper
it is a medieval explaination; today, things have evolved into the theological construct of the "real presence of Christ" and union/communion
Do you believe OJ really "did it"?
What was your reaction to the Trial results?
[quote=NY Comeback][/quote]
Do you believe OJ really "did it"?
[B]yes[/B]
What was your reaction to the Trial results?
[B]if one has high priced lawyers, one could get out of anything. any other black man would have been in san quentin[/B]
[QUOTE=RainierBeachPoet]i think it is a theological construct that is based on scholastic philosophy/theology of thomas aquinas. if memory serves me well, it is about substance and accidents. the substantive "being" of a thing doesnt change while the "accidental" aspects of it can.
so the eucharist could be explained as transubstantiation in that while the "accidents" of the bread and wine can remain, the substantive reality is the change into the body and blood of Christ. primarily because of jesus' words/prayer at the last supper
it is a medieval explaination; today, things have evolved into the theological construct of the "real presence of Christ" and union/communion[/QUOTE]
I'm a bit confused. The "being" is basically the "isness", right? But could you explain the "accidental" bit a little clearer?
And from what I understood: The actual bread/wine changes(loses a part of?) its "isness" during the Eucharist.
[quote=bigboi_baller]I'm a bit confused. The "being" is basically the "isness", right? But could you explain the "accidental" bit a little clearer?
And from what I understood: The actual bread/wine changes(loses a part of?) its "isness" during the Eucharist.[/quote]
the "isness" (substance) of the bread and wine is transformed into the "body and blood" of Christ; the fact that the bread and wine still have the physical qualities of bread and wine is "accidental" (or secondary)
clear as mud, no?
To me Catholiscism has taken it too literally, as Jesus frequently spoke metaphorically. eg "I am the vine", "I am the lamb". To me its is symbolism for rememberance purposes - "Do this in remembrance of me". It just seems to make more sense. My 2c - but its your hot seat so I'll shut up.
RBP, 1)Jesuit or Franciscan?
2)what came first, catholicism or eastern etc orthodoxy?
3) what do you think about the early gospels that werent codified by the council?
4) if you had to either move away from seattle or give up being a catholic, which and why?
5) What is your favorite poem? Yours or other
[quote=G-train]To me Catholiscism has taken it too literally, as Jesus frequently spoke metaphorically. eg "I am the vine", "I am the lamb". To me its is symbolism for rememberance purposes - "Do this in remembrance of me". It just seems to make more sense. My 2c - but its your hot seat so I'll shut up.[/quote]
imo, catholics can appreciate metaphor/symbol as well as other christians.
the sacramental understanding of eucharist isnt quite literal-- lest we be accused of some sort of spiritual cannibalism. the primal understanding of early christian with the words of jesus at the last supper is very important; and their desire to celebrate that "remembrance" with jesus' words "this is my body; this is my blood" echoes the sacrifice of the blood of the lamb of the jewish feast of passover
and for this reason, i believe that "real presence" and comm-union resonates with 21 c. theology better than the medieval theology
remembrance in this sense is about bringing about the past reality into the present in sacramental form. how does Christ become really present to the worshipping community? through thanksgiving (which is what eaucharist means in greek)
[QUOTE=RainierBeachPoet]the "isness" (substance) of the bread and wine is transformed into the "body and blood" of Christ; the fact that the bread and wine still have the physical qualities of bread and wine is "accidental" (or secondary)
clear as mud, no?[/QUOTE]
I think I'm starting to get what your saying:
The physical qualities of the bread/wine stay the same but the "isness" is changed. Thats the simplified version basically but I'm still left with...
So what happens to that isness? Isn't "isness" a constant ie it can't be destroyed or created?
Is the "isness" changed when I believe it is changed (ie accept it as the body of Christ) or when a priest blesses it?
[quote=boozehound]RBP, [/quote]
1)Jesuit or Franciscan?
i was educated by the jesuits!
2)what came first, catholicism or eastern etc orthodoxy?
the orthodox churches split off around the 11c (i think)
3) what do you think about the early gospels that werent codified by the council?
i have only read parts of them-- they are kind of interesting but i dont have too much more to specifically say. it would have been interesting if they were accepted/known by the early christians in that we would have a totally different undestanding of faith than we do today
4) if you had to either move away from seattle or give up being a catholic, which and why?
as much as i love seattle, i did enjoy living in los angeles; i have also lived in texas and arizona too. you can move from where you live; one cannot deny who one is
5) What is your favorite poem? Yours or other
i dont know if its my fav but its what i am thinking of now [I]you, you only, exist[/I] by ranier maria rilke:
[CENTER][FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]You, you only, exist.[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]We pass away, till at last,[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]our passing is so immense[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]that you arise: beautiful moment,[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]in all you suddenness,[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]arising in love, or enchanted[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]in the contraction of work.[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]To you I belong, however time may[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]wear me away. From you to you[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]I go commanded. In between[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]the garland is hanging in chance; but if you[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]take it up and up and up: look:[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=4]all becomes a festival![/SIZE][/FONT]
[/CENTER]
[quote=bigboi_baller]I think I'm starting to get what your saying:
The physical qualities of the bread/wine stay the same but the "isness" is changed. Thats the simplified version basically but I'm still left with...
So what happens to that isness? Isn't "isness" a constant ie it can't be destroyed or created?
Is the "isness" changed when I believe it is changed (ie accept it as the body of Christ) or when a priest blesses it?[/quote]
you got the gist of it bbb. ultimately, it remains a mystery
that is the paradox of the "isness"-- the transformation is effected by the power of jesus words and brought into the present because of the "remembrance" and the continued power of the words because of the priest acting [I]in persona christi [/I](in the person of christ) and the faith of the worshipping community.
it is a collapsing of past, present and future into the love/presence of Christ. in great part, that is the sacramental power of the eucharist
[quote=bigboi_baller]
Is the "isness" changed when I believe it is changed (ie accept it as the body of Christ) [/quote]
the sacrament exists despite my own faith. i do not control it. in a sense, when i believe it is changed is when it can more explicitly affect my life in grace and love
good night all
i leave the hot seat with this interesting explaination of the seven deadly sins explained by science:
[IMG]http://www.sciencebase.com/images/seven-deadly-sins.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE=RainierBeachPoet]the sacrament exists despite my own faith. i do not control it. in a sense, when i believe it is changed is when it can more explicitly affect my life in grace and love[/QUOTE]
Fair enough, its existence only becomes relevant when you allow it to.
Nice graphic by the way. :oldlol:
Your wisdom and knowledge continues to impress me. Jesuit education ftw! :cheers:
[quote=bigboi_baller]Fair enough,[U][B] its existence only becomes relevant when you allow it to.[/B][/U]
Nice graphic by the way. :oldlol:
Your wisdom and knowledge continues to impress me. Jesuit education ftw! :cheers:[/quote]
thanks bbb-- you will go far in life-- u.c. davis folk usually do:cheers:
it can be said differently too: it exists but only when i give myself to it does it affect me
so whos on the hot seat now?
[quote=Mamba]so whos on the hot seat now?[/quote]
my time is up
i pm'ed "the myth" so he could set up the next person
myth-- are you going to keep this thread going?
[QUOTE=RainierBeachPoet]myth-- are you going to keep this thread going?[/QUOTE]
i'd say it looks like a negative, it's been dead for days.
somebody else should take over then imo
Im in
Applenader
[QUOTE=hateraid]Applenader[/QUOTE]
I win again.
koopa king
AppleNader
phar the horse!