So are people taking the Mavs seriously as top title contender yet?

[QUOTE=icemanfan]They are legit for sure Net. There can be only one though so if they do not make it to the top this time it could be a tough summer.[/QUOTE]

True there are so many good teams, that winning it all has a lot to with luck. When you play against the refs and your dumb coach it

[QUOTE=R4E] Similarly once Cuban and co. realized that Dirk was not the one to grit his teeth and growl in the post season? The Mavericks had to bring in Chandler and Butler who were not necessarily going to cower to teams like the Nuggets(who according to Cuban himself were "a bunch of thugs"). Anthony, Billups, Martin, Birdman and Ne Ne were not going to just fall in line with Cuban's notions of gentlemanly sportsmanship in pursuit of the western conference, apparently. The book is written - get very physical with Dirk N in a post season series...and let the chips fall. [/QUOTE]
How do these haters always come up with some new sh*t? Dirk averaged 34.4 points, 11.6 rebounds and 4 assists in the series against Denver and shat all over them. If the refs would have whistled the foul against Melo, they lose and the series goes to 6 agmes.

[QUOTE=creepingdeath]How do these haters always come up with some new sh*t? Dirk averaged 34.4 points, 11.6 rebounds and 4 assists in the series against Denver and shat all over them. If the refs would have whistled the foul against Melo, they lose and the series goes to 6 agmes.[/QUOTE]

Creepingdeath, just out of curiousity - are you in agreement with BarberSchool that *****[B]Dirk Nowitzki is one of the 25 best to play the game[/B], even if he doesn't do it "your way".*****

And BarberSchool is that top 25 of [B]all[/B] players in NBA & ABA history???

Can you really take these guys seriously?

[URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwfMmNXwzL0&feature=player_embedded"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwfMmNXwzL0&feature=player_embedded[/URL]

[QUOTE=R4E]Creepingdeath, just out of curiousity - are you in agreement with BarberSchool that *****[B]Dirk Nowitzki is one of the 25 best to play the game[/B], even if he doesn't do it "your way".*****
[/QUOTE]
It doesn't matter what I think about that. Why should I even bother answer someone's question who claimed that Dirk is a playoff fraud?

On a sidenote: Dirk's still in his prime years and this season might be his best yet. His resume will only get better.

as my fav espn analysts jbull n tim legler always say, this is da team too look out for in da west... glad my WIZ aint in da west

[QUOTE=creepingdeath]It doesn't matter what I think about that. Why should I even bother answer someone's question who claimed that Dirk is a playoff fraud?

On a sidenote: Dirk's still in his prime years and this season might be his best yet. His resume will only get better.[/QUOTE]

Because I am brand new here. I am just checking out what the typical poster here sees when watching the NBA game - and how atypical my perspectives are concerning the NBA game.

Everybody that has played basketball at a high level can see that Dirk N has uncommon skill...at least offensively. When I posted that Dirk is not tough or determined enough to get it done in the post season? Dirk apologists immediately hit me with Dirk's oh-so-impressive post season series statistics.

Consider this: every NBA team in the post season is going to have dominate players who have amassed impressive statistics - usually over the course of a well established NBA career. So impressive statitstics alone are never going to determine which team will win the series, the conference or the championship. So Dirk may get his(apparently) highly coveted statistics in the post season, but his teams(where Dirk is the supposed leader and best player) are typically an easy out - sometimes even a joke of an easy out. If there was a choice Dirk would be better off sacrificing his statistical marvels to consistently propel his teams farther each post season in the tournament.

Dirk is a playoff fraud because his game is limited and predictable. In other words, Dirk's game is not adaptable to give his team exactly what it needs to win down the stretch against an elite opponent. Would Dirk make the key steal to preserve the victory down the stretch when defense is what is needed to secure the series?

What makes a truly [B]elite[/B] player is the way they elevate their teams' play and make every player around them better. Dirk does his statistical thing, plays hard and the way he can in the playoffs...but an elite player? A [B]top 25[/B] of [B]all time[/B] player? Whadda sad joke

[QUOTE=kentatm]:facepalm

that is just flat out pathetic analysis

you took ONE game (that he still put up 26/9 in) to disregard his entire career. Never mind Dirk has been one of the biggest 4th quarter scorers in the NBA for 10 years now. You just flat out don't know what the hell you are talking about.[/QUOTE]

It is that Dirk was a decoy when it was time to close the Heat out.

Mavs at the Heat was a marquee game, esp as an early regular season game. Elite players come to play for the entire game when healthy for big time games. Elite players expect to make grand contributions in big time games, and particularly down the stretch of big time games. It seems Dirk was content to be a decoy...and even commented on how elated he was that Terry was taking over games in the 4th quarter recently. A true eyebrow raiser of a comment, I would say

:cheers:

No. They're usually really good in the regular season but they always blow it in the playoffs.

:applause: :applause: :applause:

[QUOTE=moaz]Why do we have to ask this question again?
Morons would mention GSW
Bigger morons : Miami
The biggest morons: Mavs chock [B]always[/B] in the playoffs.

U can write 10000 posts about Chandler/their defense this year, the morons would only see Mavs/Dirk and automatically write the same answer.

Lets w8t and see. And maybe they'll make a good trade in the winter.


BTW i don't believe they would win it all. Imo they need another piece.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=game385]No. They're usually really good in the regular season but they always blow it in the playoffs.[/QUOTE]

I think they are the 3rd best team in the west behind Lakers and Spurs. The 1234 would probably be Lakers, Mavs, Spurs and Utah. They might actually be better than San Antonio. The Mavs do have a better bench then them and thats not just Jason Terry. But Utah might come rolling thru with DWill and company. Utah has a bunch of underrated players on that team. Lakers-Mavs WCF.

[QUOTE=R4E][B]Dirk[/B] is a playoff fraud because [B]his game is limited and predictable.[/B][/QUOTE]Bolded portion is true.
Dirk's game is limited and *somewhat* predictable.
Many dominant players have been limited and predictable. Jabbar, Ewing, Bernard King, Tim Dincan, even malone after he cut off his high-top was really quite predictable......
...and guess what....
...even with moderate predictability and stylistic limitations...
...there still ain't a d@mn thing Garnett, Melo, Nene, Birdman, Duncan, McDyess, Battier, Landry, Webber, or Amare could do to stop Nowitzki in the postseason for his whole career....the only one who held dirk to less than ~23ppg in a series was his former coach, Don Nelson. think about that.....then think about how many greats have been held under 20 and knocked out in the first round more than once.....you'll find alot of players you assumed otherwise.....how many times have the other greats of Today made the NBA finals? How many others have made it to numerous Western Conference Finals? How many have gotten knocked out of the first round more than once? You'll find alot of teams you just forgot about, that you assumed did better and never "choked".

And as for the all-time ranking....Dirk's top 40 at worst right now, and when he retires maybe 4 years from now, he'll be top 25. Ask Jordan, Magic, Bird, Shaq, Kobe, Walton, Russel, Hakeem, Barkley and and Jabbar where they rank Dirk when he retires.

And watch how mad so many haters will be if the Mavericks win a title this year WITHOUT the Lakers, Spurs or Celtics suffering a major injury. Watch Stern try to set the mavs up to fail in a WCF by having Danny Crawford ref every game in the series, and the Mavs still pull it out. The kneejerk reaction haters will be scrambling for excuses to discredit the Mavericks. Pointing at luck or an opponent's weakness, never at the Mavericks wise veteran roster, diverse offensive talent, and top 5 defense. It's posters like you and other doubters and haters that have made me emotionally commit to the mavericks again, and I can't wait for the postseason. See your team there.:pimp:

[QUOTE=eppelp]Can you really take these guys seriously?

[URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwfMmNXwzL0&feature=player_embedded"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwfMmNXwzL0&feature=player_embedded[/URL][/QUOTE]

:oldlol:

Barea looks like a kid

[QUOTE=R4E]Because I am brand new here. I am just checking out what the typical poster here sees when watching the NBA game - and how atypical my perspectives are concerning the NBA game.[/QUOTE]
Dirk has been underrated here for several years, yet since a few months the respect for him seems to have grown a lot due to his MVP-calibre ball.

[QUOTE=R4E]Everybody that has played basketball at a high level can see that Dirk N has uncommon skill...at least offensively. When I posted that Dirk is not tough or determined enough to get it done in the post season? Dirk apologists immediately hit me with Dirk's oh-so-impressive post season series statistics.[/QUOTE]
Your first post in this thread was claiming that KG would throw DN halfway over the court, which is quite ridiculous considering the fact that Nowitzki regularly sh*ts on KG, especially in the playoffs. You then went on to describe is supposed softness and denied him being a closer, attributing that feat to the likes of Terry. :facepalm

[QUOTE=R4E]Consider this: every NBA team in the post season is going to have dominate players who have amassed impressive statistics - usually over the course of a well established NBA career. So impressive statitstics alone are never going to determine which team will win the series, the conference or the championship. So Dirk may get his(apparently) highly coveted statistics in the post season, but his teams(where Dirk is the supposed leader and best player) are typically an easy out - sometimes even a joke of an easy out. [B]If there was a choice Dirk would be better off sacrificing his statistical marvels to consistently propel his teams farther each post season in the tournament.[/B][/QUOTE]
The bolded part is true, indeed. If Dirk was facing the choice whether his team fares deeper into the playoffs with him only averaging only 15/5, he would do that. But if he averaged such statistics, the Mavs would drown against any opponent (at least in a series). I'm actually not quite sure what you are hinting at. Dirk's stats are not empty, if you want to imply that, thus the 50+ win seasons for a decade.

[QUOTE=R4E]Dirk is a playoff fraud because his game is limited and predictable. In other words, Dirk's game is not adaptable to give his team exactly what it needs to win down the stretch against an elite opponent. Would Dirk make the key steal to preserve the victory down the stretch when defense is what is needed to secure the series?[/QUOTE]
Well, coincidentally, in the first game versus the Heat, Dirk has had two crucial steals down the stretch. Only a tiny example. DN is not only a great scorer, and definitely not predictable (truly elite scorer cannot be predictable, that's mutually exclusive). As for his defense, it's vastly underrated. While dirk's help defense is average, his 1on1 D is actually good. People who regularly watch Mavs games know that.
[I]
Defense: Pts per 100 Poss. w/ Dirk on the court: 99.8
Defense: Pts per 100 Poss. w/ Dirk off the court: 112.5

Effective FG% Allowed w/ Dirk in the court: 45.7%
Effective FG% Allowed w/ Dirk off the court: 52.7%

Defensive Rebounding w/ Dirk on the court: 72.9%
Defensive Rebounding w/ Dirk off the court: 70.6%
[/I]
[QUOTE=R4E]What makes a truly [B]elite[/B] player is the way they elevate their teams' play and make every player around them better. Dirk does he statistical thing and plays hard and the way he can in the playoffs...[/QUOTE]
Exactly what Dirk does.

[QUOTE=R4E]
Mavs at the Heat was a marquee game, esp as an early regular season game. Elite players come to play for the entire game when healthy for big time games. Elite players expect to make grand contributions in big time games, and particularly down the stretch of big time games. It seems Dirk was content to be a decoy...and even commented on how elated he was that Terry was taking over games in the 4th quarter recently. A true eyebrow raiser of a comment, I would say
[/QUOTE]
So what are you saying? That Dirk doesn't show up in the 4th? :roll: Nice way of exposing yourself as an ignorant poster.

Dirk was third in 4th quarter points last year (only to Lebron and Kobe), he has had amazing takeovers (29 points against Utah in the 4th quarter, several rbds, stls and ass) and several gamewinners (including some to beat the buzzer). To stay with this season, only a few games ago, against Portland, he scored 12 of the last 16 points of the Mavs in the final quarter. He hit the gamewinner against the Celtics and is tied for 3rd or 5th place (don't remember correctly) for most 4th quarter points per game.

yes