Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
[QUOTE=HoopsNY;14178090]Yea but the question is if you put DeRozan on the 1993-94 Bulls, how high is their ceiling? My guess is higher than where they finished, but I still think Hakeem wins the chip.[/QUOTE]
I'll kind of play devil's advocate here and say they don't even get better. Derozan only helps in scoring and he's isn't efficient. I don't see how he improves them significantly.
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
[QUOTE=light;14178265]But MJ could barely win a series without Pippen. Pip was responsible for too many things that Jordan didn't do. And Pip EMPHASIZED teamwork and selflessness. That's why the Bulls were better with Pippen at the helm versus Jordan who struggled with trusting his teammates. It's why a solo Jordan team was relatively easy to defend - you always knew what the Bulls offense was going to do.[/QUOTE]
so how's Pip's "great" leadership helped his career in '94? Houston? Portland?
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
[QUOTE=Vino24;13972290]I think DeRozan would fair pretty well with Jeff Hornacek being his toughest comp.[/QUOTE]
+1
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
[QUOTE=3ball;14178114]Pippen averaged 21 on 40% in the 94' ECSF as 1st option - would he get that next to derozan?.. would they have good chemistry or would pippen turn into complete garbage like he did next to Hakeem/Barkley in 99' (who are obviously much better than derozan)
Here's the reality... Hakeem's Rockets were trash in 94' because Ewing almost beat them with 18 on 35%... so MJ replacing pippen easily wins the chip that year... Otoh, the 95' Rockets were for real with Drexler and had the toughest ring ever based on opponent SRS.. they swept shaq's magic just like the 96' Bulls[/QUOTE]
Hakeem's Rockets were trash? You do realize Ewing's bad performance was because of Hakeem's defense, right? Offensive output is largely because of the opposition's defense.
Team's don't go out there shooting wide open jumpers that result in 35% shooting. Get real.
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
[QUOTE=light;14178265]But MJ could barely win a series without Pippen. Pip was responsible for too many things that Jordan didn't do. And Pip EMPHASIZED teamwork and selflessness. That's why the Bulls were better with Pippen at the helm versus Jordan who struggled with trusting his teammates. It's why a solo Jordan team was relatively easy to defend - you always knew what the Bulls offense was going to do.[/QUOTE]
You're letting your hatred for MJ cloud your judgement. Jordan did everything that Pippen did. And to say he barely won a series without Pippen reduces MJ's contribution in a series like the '88 series against Cleveland. Rookie Pippen wasn't the reason why Chicago won, MJ was.
To say a solo MJ team was relatively "easy" to defend is also disingenuous. Relative to whom? A Jordan-less Bulls? Chicago was [B]7th[/B] offensively in 1993 with an injured Pippen. In 1994, they had a healthy, peak Pippen, peak Grant, and peak Armstrong, and finished [B]14th[/B] offensively.
The '88 team finished [B]9th[/B] offensively. Is that due to Pippen? Keep in mind, the '88 team didn't play with the triangle, nor had Phil Jackson as the head coach.
Pippen '88: 21 Mpg, 8 PPG, 2 Assists, 49% TS%, 2 TOs, and 0.2 ORBs
So is Chicago's "relative" success, offensively, due to Pippen here?
In addition, I love that they were better with Pippen at the helm (healthy/peak Pippen, peak Grant, peak Armstrong) but complete disregard for MJ leading the team to a [B]26-12 record (56 team win pace)[/B] in 1998 [I]without[/I] Pippen for nearly half the season.
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
There are some who argue that the 94 Bulls WITH MJ would lose to the Rockets, so I fail to see how they'd win with DeRozan. The non-troll deduction is DeRozan would boost them past the Knicks and probably the Pacers then lose to the Rockets.
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
I'm not high on DeRozan at all, I think he's one of the most overrated shooting guards this past decade. I think he will actually make the Bulls worse
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
[QUOTE=HoopsNY;14178416]Hakeem's Rockets were trash? You do realize Ewing's bad performance was because of Hakeem's defense, right? Offensive output is largely because of the opposition's defense.
Team's don't go out there shooting wide open jumpers that result in 35% shooting. Get real.[/QUOTE]
But the rockets barely won in 7 games despite Ewing playing like garbage.. so a better 1st option performance easily wins.. and we all know Starks played well except cratered in game 7
Again, they only became viable when Drexler arrived
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
[QUOTE=3ball;14178577]But the rockets barely won in 7 games despite Ewing playing like garbage.. so a better 1st option performance easily wins.. and we all know Starks played well except cratered in game 7
Again, they only became viable when Drexler arrived[/QUOTE]
That speaks more to the Knicks' team defense than the Rockets as an offense. You big up the Knicks in other posts, now all of a sudden the Rockets got taken to 7 games because they're trash? The irony.
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
[QUOTE=HoopsNY;14178449]You're letting your hatred for MJ cloud your judgement. Jordan did everything that Pippen did. And to say he barely won a series without Pippen reduces MJ's contribution in a series like the '88 series against Cleveland. Rookie Pippen wasn't the reason why Chicago won, MJ was.
To say a solo MJ team was relatively "easy" to defend is also disingenuous. Relative to whom? A Jordan-less Bulls? Chicago was [B]7th[/B] offensively in 1993 with an injured Pippen. In 1994, they had a healthy, peak Pippen, peak Grant, and peak Armstrong, and finished [B]14th[/B] offensively.
The '88 team finished [B]9th[/B] offensively. Is that due to Pippen? Keep in mind, the '88 team didn't play with the triangle, nor had Phil Jackson as the head coach.
Pippen '88: 21 Mpg, 8 PPG, 2 Assists, 49% TS%, 2 TOs, and 0.2 ORBs
So is Chicago's "relative" success, offensively, due to Pippen here?
In addition, I love that they were better with Pippen at the helm (healthy/peak Pippen, peak Grant, peak Armstrong) but complete disregard for MJ leading the team to a [B]26-12 record (56 team win pace)[/B] in 1998 [I]without[/I] Pippen for nearly half the season.[/QUOTE]
Made an error here. Chicago was actually [B]2nd[/B] in offense in 1993, which only furthers my point.
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
[QUOTE=FromDowntown;13972430]Think of his 90s competiton too:
•plumbers, mechanics, baggers, etc.
Think of his teammate:
•GOAT #2 option SP (Stimulus Pippen)[/QUOTE]
Yikes
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
[QUOTE=LeCroix;13996135]possible since they did 55 with Pete Myers[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock;13996214]Yup--Pete Myers who is a career 5/2/2 player (in the Bulls' defense, who else could they have signed in October, which is when MJ decided to bail?). :roll: DeRozen is 20/4/4 for his career and 27/5/4 in his peak year.[/QUOTE]
interesting
Pippen is an animal
any number 2 will do
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
He's an upgrade for sure.
Re: Put Demar Derozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
[QUOTE=HoopsNY;14178449]You're letting your hatred for MJ cloud your judgement. Jordan did everything that Pippen did. And to say he barely won a series without Pippen reduces MJ's contribution in a series like the '88 series against Cleveland. Rookie Pippen wasn't the reason why Chicago won, MJ was.
To say a solo MJ team was relatively "easy" to defend is also disingenuous. Relative to whom? A Jordan-less Bulls? Chicago was [B]7th[/B] offensively in 1993 with an injured Pippen. In 1994, they had a healthy, peak Pippen, peak Grant, and peak Armstrong, and finished [B]14th[/B] offensively.
The '88 team finished [B]9th[/B] offensively. Is that due to Pippen? Keep in mind, the '88 team didn't play with the triangle, nor had Phil Jackson as the head coach.
Pippen '88: 21 Mpg, 8 PPG, 2 Assists, 49% TS%, 2 TOs, and 0.2 ORBs
So is Chicago's "relative" success, offensively, due to Pippen here?
In addition, I love that they were better with Pippen at the helm (healthy/peak Pippen, peak Grant, peak Armstrong) but complete disregard for MJ leading the team to a [B]26-12 record (56 team win pace)[/B] in 1998 [I]without[/I] Pippen for nearly half the season.[/QUOTE]
Why bother? These people are allergic to 2 things. Making good threads and good insight
Re: Put DeMar DeRozan with the 1993-94 Chicago Bulls?
If Derozan = MJ, then that makes Kawhi the GOD of basketball. Did what Derozan couldn't in just one year lol