[QUOTE=tpols;14896900]Comparing Dray and Klay to Kareem and Worthy is a ban-able offense tbh.[/QUOTE]
You are forgetting KD.
And Kareem was past his prime during the Lakers back to back titles in '87 & '88, basically a role player by '88.
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[QUOTE=tpols;14896900]Comparing Dray and Klay to Kareem and Worthy is a ban-able offense tbh.[/QUOTE]
You are forgetting KD.
And Kareem was past his prime during the Lakers back to back titles in '87 & '88, basically a role player by '88.
Curry led a 73 win team and won 2 titles without Durant. Moot point.
And like was said before Curry has already beat Luka H2H in the playoffs. And he had the same exact team back then that he has now as the 10 seed only swapping poole for Chris paul. We already saw this experiment live.
Luka wiped the Suns that had made The Finals but got gentleman swept by Curry.
People are discounting what Lukas ball dominance does to star teammates. Brunson looks like a total superstar right now in New York and Porzingis has been absolutely balling since leaving Dallas. Kyrie is the only star that's really fit with Luka ball so far. And I like Luka but that needs to be brought up.
[QUOTE=tpols;14896914]I didn't read this take til today but now I see why warriorfan was upset. This is a horrible take given Curry has had exactly one bad playoff series in his career ~ 2016 Finals which was still better than 2011 Lebron or 2004 Kobe etc. Other than that though his playoff numbers are at an absolute superstar level.
And the funny thing is we saw Curry and Luka play H2H in the playoffs and who came out on top?Curry won a ring with Andrew Wiggins as his 2nd option. Let that sink in. And Luka had Brunson whose easily a better player than Wigs. We didn't really appreciate how good that dude was til he went to New York.[/QUOTE]
Im not trying to argue against picking Curry. This is what you guys are failing to comprehend.
I’m saying that depending on what someone values, it is not “very outrageous” to take the guy who is this year’s leading scorer and second in assists, and has also proven to be a playoff lion. Curry has plenty of strengths but his playoff numbers make him look more consistent than he’s really been. Look up game threads and youll see people talking in real time about how Curry has gone cold, meanwhile his teammates claw back from a 12 point deficit, then Curry starts hitting shots again once theyre back in the lead.
He has not been the dominant player in series where the teams are closely matched that he has been in the regular season. Im not saying he was ever BAD. You guys are seeing in polarities. My literal response was that it is not “very outrageous” as someone suggested, and you guys are acting like I called Curry a scrub.
[QUOTE=tpols;14896914]I didn't read this take til today but now I see why warriorfan was upset. This is a horrible take given Curry has had exactly one bad playoff series in his career ~ 2016 Finals which was still better than 2011 Lebron or 2004 Kobe etc. Other than that though his playoff numbers are at an absolute superstar level.
And the funny thing is we saw Curry and Luka play H2H in the playoffs and who came out on top? Curry won a ring with Andrew Wiggins as his 2nd option. Let that sink in. And Luka had Brunson whose easily a better player than Wigs. We didn't really appreciate how good that dude was til he went to New York.[/QUOTE]
It's narrative driven to say stuff like that though. They were playing great defense and getting contributions from 3-8 in a way that other teams were not.
First series against Denver Wiggins was the #4 scorer at 14 ppg, Poole and Klay were significantly above him in the 20s.
Against Memphis he was again the #4 scorer in the series behind Klay and Poole.
In the next series against the Mavs he was tied for second with Klay, and Poole was very close behind them.
Deay and Looney were also giving double digits per game.
Wiggins had his best series against Boston where he was the #2 scorer but Klay was only 1 point behind him. For the totality of the playoffs Wiggins was the 4th leading scorer on the team.
Name me a "#2 option" who's actually the #4. It's all narrative, it just sounds better to prop Curry up to say Wiggins was his #2 guy. It doesn't sound quite as good when you say they had three other guys besides Steph who could routinely get you 17-20 a night. Poole had the playoffs of his lifetime. It was the last time Klay was really Klay, and the "specialists" played excellent like Dray, Loony and GP
[QUOTE=tpols;14896916]Curry led a 73 win team and won 2 titles without Durant. Moot point.[/QUOTE]
How the hell is it a moot point? He won half his titles with KD, they had the most stacked team this league has ever seen at one point.
[QUOTE=tpols;14896916]Curry led a 73 win team and won 2 titles without Durant. Moot point.
And like was said before Curry has already beat Luka H2H in the playoffs. [B]And he had the same exact team back then that he has now[/B] as the 10 seed only swapping poole for Chris paul. We already saw this experiment live.
Luka wiped the Suns that had made The Finals but got gentleman swept by Curry.
People are discounting what Lukas ball dominance does to star teammates. Brunson looks like a total superstar right now in New York and Porzingis has been absolutely balling since leaving Dallas. Kyrie is the only star that's really fit with Luka ball so far. And I like Luka but that needs to be brought up.[/QUOTE]
Stop.
[QUOTE=FultzNationRISE;14896918]Im not trying to argue against picking Curry. This is what you guys are failing to comprehend.
I’m saying that depending on what someone values, it is not “very outrageous” to take the guy who is this year’s leading scorer and second in assists, and has also proven to be a playoff lion. Curry has plenty of strengths but his playoff numbers make him look more consistent than he’s really been. Look up game threads and youll see people talking in real time about how Curry has gone cold, meanwhile his teammates claw back from a 12 point deficit, then Curry starts hitting shots again once theyre back in the lead.
He has not been the dominant player in series where the teams are closely matched that he has been in the regular season. Im not saying he was ever BAD. You guys are seeing in polarities. My literal response was that it is not “very outrageous” as someone suggested, and you guys are acting like I called Curry a scrub.[/QUOTE]
In my 1st post I said the same thing that they're extremely close. But you were going on about Curry being a bad playoff performer 1/5 or whatever which had to be addressed because it's a patented falsehood.
The warriors had Curry, Klay, Wiggins, Dray, GPII, Looney in 2022 and 2024. The only real change was swapping podz for Otto porter and Chris Paul for poole.
Klay also missed most of the 2022 season and Poole outside of a small stretch is one of the worst players in the NBA so they were arguably even weaker in 2022. The warriors have choked a ton of games this year blowing big leads though.
The main difference this year isn't Golden State, it's that the conference is absurdly stacked. Way more stacked than in 2022.
The West this year may be the greatest conference of all time.
[QUOTE=tpols;14896924]The warriors had Curry, Klay, Wiggins, Dray, GPII, Looney in 2022 and 2024. The only real change was swapping podz for Otto porter and Chris Paul for poole.
Klay also missed most of the 2022 season and Poole outside of a small stretch is one of the worst players in the NBA so they were arguably even weaker in 2022. The warriors have choked a ton of games this year blowing big leads though.
The main difference this year isn't Golden State, it's that the conference is absurdly stacked. Way more stacked than in 2022.
The West this year may be the greatest conference of all time.[/QUOTE]
I understand that a lot of the players are the same. That isn't the question. You said it was the same [I]team[/I], implying that there is no difference overall.
You think it'd be a reasonable thing to say that the 2012 Celtics, for example, had the same team as 2008 plus a better Rondo?
Like 2012 Celtics > 2008?
The 2010 Spurs had largely the same core as 2007. Would you find it reasonable to call them the exact same team?
Again..stop. It's stupid.
[QUOTE=Kblaze8855;14896676]You imagine that if you polled the people who voted him mvp they would say he was the best player in the league at the time? I don’t know that they would. It isn’t really the same question is it?[/QUOTE]
People were clamoring over Curry in 2016. It wasn't until after the Finals that people walked back their takes of Curry being the best in the NBA. But at the end of the regular season in 2016, many people, including those who voted him MVP, would've said he's the best player in the NBA.
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I understand.
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No you dont.
Actually if you look it up... the Curry Klay Dray Wiggins core combined is averaging almost the same exact production in 2024 as in 2022. And Kuminga averages 16 ppg on top of it and they have Chris Paul whose been a fantastic floor general 6th man. What you're saying doesn't add up at all. The players haven't fallen off a cliff like your other examples production wise.
Again the main difference is the western conference is absurdly stacked this year and if the warriors didn't blow a record amount of double digit leads they'd be a much higher seed.
[QUOTE=Wally450;14896928]People were clamoring over Curry in 2016. It wasn't until after the Finals that people walked back their takes of Curry being the best in the NBA. But at the end of the regular season in 2016, many people, including those who voted him MVP, would've said he's the best player in the NBA.[/QUOTE]
For sure, Curry was having a legendary season that year. It was the first year I actually saw the majority of fans rank a player ahead of LeBron throughout the year since like 2008, then the Finals happened.
[QUOTE=tpols;14896929]No you dont.
Actually if you look it up... the Curry Klay Dray Wiggins core combined is averaging almost the same exact production in 2024 as in 2022. And Kuminga averages 16 ppg on top of it and they have Chris Paul whose been a fantastic floor general 6th man. What you're saying doesn't add up at all. The players haven't fallen off a cliff like your other examples production wise.
Again the main difference is the western conference is absurdly stacked this year and if the warriors didn't blow a record amount of double digit leads they'd be a much higher seed.[/QUOTE]
Your condescension while being clueless always entertains :lol
Curry, Klay, Draymond, and Wiggins are all playing some of the worst ball either in the careers or in a decade. Just because the league has been ridiculous with the scoring numbers this year doesn't mean that they're as effective. Lebron is scoring more now than he did in 2016. I don't think anyone would claim he's been as good as he was then, no?
In 2022 the Warriors were the #1 defense in the league by Net Rating. This year they're 15th.
4th to 15th in net rating as well.
You can say the only difference is the league is better if you want. But then that makes the usual arguments of [B]"Player X won with THIS sidekick in one year, and Player Y one with a BETTER sidekick in a completely different year; therefore player X is better"[/B] that you frequently use seem dumb in retrospect.
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You can say the only difference is the league is better if you want.
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Yes the main difference is the competition. You're finally getting it.
Lebron and AD have looked amazing and won a title and they're a play in team. Warriors are fully healthy and have a great core and they're a play in team. The Kings with Fox and Sabonis who were a top seed last year are a play in team. The Durant Booker Beal Suns who were expected to be title contenders at the start of the season are a play in team.
That doesn't mean they're all "playing the worst ball of their careers'". Total nonsense. The competition level has risen is the difference.
[QUOTE=tpols;14896934]Yes the main difference is the competition. You're finally getting it.
[B]Lebron and AD have looked amazing and won a title[/B] and they're a play in team. Warriors are fully healthy and have a great core and they're a play in team. The Kings with Fox and Sabonis who were a top seed last year are a play in team. The Durant Booker Beal Suns who were expected to be title contenders at the start of the season are a play in team.
That doesn't mean they're all "playing the worst ball of their careers'". Total nonsense. The competition level has risen is the difference.[/QUOTE]
So they both are as good overall as they were in 2020?