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Just got done watching the game. The first half was the show. After 5:30 of play Rutgers had only 4 pts and Ace hadn't taken a shot. Then he just went off.
He scored 24 in the half and didn't even play the last 2 minutes so he scored 24 in about 12 minutes of game time.
He hit a couple of nice jump hooks. Haven't seen that much from him this season, if at all.
Nice to see him hitting his foul shots. He had the yips at the line earlier in the season. He's made 23 of his last 25 at the line.
[QUOTE=GOBB;14973556]Be honest. How many games have you watched of Ace Bailey? You talk like someone who is going off solely on stats and the highlight you saw? You are looking for any thing that supports what conclusion you drew up in your head from the stats you read online. It’s ok to say I haven’t watched this kid play a full game. And proceed to ask questions what you don’t know or are curious about to people who have. What’s hard about that? Lose the pride. You don’t know everything about everyone. No one does.[/QUOTE]
10 4
[QUOTE=GOBB;14973556]Be honest. How many games have you watched of Ace Bailey? You talk like someone who is going off solely on stats and the highlight you saw? You are looking for any thing that supports what conclusion you drew up in your head from the stats you read online. It’s ok to say I haven’t watched this kid play a full game. And proceed to ask questions what you don’t know or are curious about to people who have. What’s hard about that? Lose the pride. You don’t know everything about everyone. No one does.[/QUOTE]
Bruh, I don't try to be right at all, I'm trying to make wild conclusions from very little because it's fun if I get it right.
Ace is playing like the demon version of Dirk right now. These are big man shooter faceup buckets. The shot release point is almost unblockable, the release is pure, and the footwork into jumpers is elite.
People want to throw out Durant comps, but he had more guard in his game.
I remember when unc vs Duke were fun rivalries to watch. And then we get this…
[QUOTE=GOBB;14974001]I remember when unc vs Duke were fun rivalries to watch. And then we get this…[/QUOTE]
It still is usually great. Duke is just a wagon and UNC is having a down year. It happens.
[QUOTE=ralph_i_el;14973717]Ace is playing like the demon version of Dirk right now. These are big man shooter faceup buckets. The shot release point is almost unblockable, the release is pure, and the footwork into jumpers is elite.
People want to throw out Durant comps, but he had more guard in his game.[/QUOTE]
Michael Porter Jr with defensive upside maybe? The penetration/rim pressure game is what separates AJ Dybantsa and Ace Bailey.
[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;14974005]It still is usually great. Duke is just a wagon and UNC is having a down year. It happens.[/QUOTE]
Just expected it to be more competitive.
I haven't watched Duke in awhile. Once Flagg started hitting his jumper it was obvious he was a lock at 1. I am more interested in the other guys.
I think the rest of the top 6, not sure about the order, is:
Harper
Ace
Kasparas
Tre Johnson
Edgecomb
[QUOTE=tontoz;14974026]I haven't watched Duke in awhile. Once Flagg started hitting his jumper it was obvious he was a lock at 1. I am more interested in the other guys.
I think the rest of the top 6, not sure about the order, is:
Harper
Ace
Kasparas
Tre Johnson
Edgecomb[/QUOTE]
I’d take Edgecomb over Johnson as a prospect for sure. Johnson is probably a little better right now but I don’t know that he’ll ever be more than just a decent to good bucket-getter. Edgecomb has far more upside to me.
[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;14974034]I’d take Edgecomb over Johnson as a prospect for sure. Johnson is probably a little better right now but I don’t know that he’ll ever be more than just a decent to good bucket-getter. Edgecomb has far more upside to me.[/QUOTE]
I'm not sure about that. Tre is taller and much more skilled. He is very good at movement 3s off the catch but doesn't get that many opportunities on this team. He is mostly creating his own looks.
Put a smaller guy on him and he will post them up and score routinely.
Apparently the coaches have to monitor his practice habits to prevent him from working too hard and wearing himself out.
I haven't seen much shot creation from VJ. Hard to tell if he can't do it or is just too conservative. Definitely a freak athlete.
Haven't updated this thread in a while. Huge game tonight:
- 28 points, 8 rebounds, 7 assists, 2 steals, 3 blocks, 1 turnover
- 10/16 FG, 3/6 3PT, 5/6 FT
May have won NPOY with this performance tonight. There's one game left and he leads Basketball Reference's BPM, Bart Torvik's BPM, KenPom and EvanMiya's NPOY rankings.
If Sixers can get lucky and get a top 3 pick or win the lottery? Still don’t think whomever they take helps next season. Anyone think Flagg would make a different on a healthy (tried to type that without laughing) Sixers team? What is he going to play like a Thaddeus Young type role?
[QUOTE=tontoz;14974026]I haven't watched Duke in awhile. Once Flagg started hitting his jumper it was obvious he was a lock at 1. I am more interested in the other guys.
I think the rest of the top 6, not sure about the order, is:
Harper
Ace
Kasparas
Tre Johnson
Edgecomb[/QUOTE]I still don’t think he’ll be the Garnett type defensive presence they imagined.
He’s 6’9”, not 7’0”
Def has his J more polished, but I’m still not wowed with any specific offensive movement.
His overall ability to cover ground on both ends is impressive. Great athlete, with much better natural strength than his lanky looks indicate. But I don’t see instant superstar. I see solid player, but not a perennial all-star, unless he develops some signature offensive game.
He does have one specific move that can become a sort of “signature highlight”, but it’s not something you can use countless times a game to produce: shot fake to pivot, pivot into an open lane and lob it off the glass to yourself for a two hand monster dunk.
Flagg is leading the NCAA in some advanced stats as a freshman. He is definitely an elite prospect. Not on the same tier as Wemby/LeBron/Shaq but still elite.
Garnett was a soft jump shooter that didn't put much pressure on the rim. Flagg gets to the rim a lot.
I see Flagg more as a modern Ak47 but stronger and a better shooter.
A bigger, better shooting Jimmy Butler is a comp I've heard over on RealGM. I like it. Bigger to the tune of 2" in height, 5-7" in wingspan, and 5-7" in standing reach. And much longer strides/relatively higher center of gravity.
The other forum are complete retards, they had to change their tune quickly no Flagg though. The other forum is the basketball version of Reddit, while ISH is the basketball version of X.
[QUOTE=BarberSchool;14983898]I still don’t think he’ll be the Garnett type defensive presence they imagined.
He’s 6’9”, not 7’0”
Def has his J more polished, but I’m still not wowed with any specific offensive movement.
His overall ability to cover ground on both ends is impressive. Great athlete, with much better natural strength than his lanky looks indicate. But I don’t see instant superstar. I see solid player, but not a perennial all-star, unless he develops some signature offensive game.
He does have one specific move that can become a sort of “signature highlight”, but it’s not something you can use countless times a game to produce: shot fake to pivot, pivot into an open lane and lob it off the glass to yourself for a two hand monster dunk.[/QUOTE]
Earlier in this thread, I had a similar opinion on his offense, but that's changed for me. He's been so good facing up and using the triple threat, and pulling up in a number of different ways for jumpers. I've seen significant improvement to the touch on his J.
Flagg has a chance to really be great at scoring. Hope he finds the right folks to work out with. Like Tatum did. Would suck if he was just really good.
Big games coming up in regards to lottery odds.
Nets vs Hornets tonight
Wizards vs Raps playing twice
Jazz come to Philadelphia tomorrow night with
The Sixers on a back to back
Pels on back to back with Rockets and Memphis
Toronto are putting in their best effort to get into the play in. Brooklyn need to rest Cam Thomas because he keeps trying to win games.
[QUOTE=fourkicks44;14984899]Big games coming up in regards to lottery odds.
Nets vs Hornets tonight
Wizards vs Raps playing twice
Jazz come to Philadelphia tomorrow night with
The Sixers on a back to back
Pels on back to back with Rockets and Memphis
Toronto are putting in their best effort to get into the play in. Brooklyn need to rest Cam Thomas because he keeps trying to win games.[/QUOTE]
Yesterday the Hornets lost by one point to the Cavs :mad:
[QUOTE=fourkicks44;14984899]Big games coming up in regards to lottery odds.
Nets vs Hornets tonight
Wizards vs Raps playing twice
Jazz come to Philadelphia tomorrow night with
The Sixers on a back to back
Pels on back to back with Rockets and Memphis
Toronto are putting in their best effort to get into the play in. Brooklyn need to rest Cam Thomas because he keeps trying to win games.[/QUOTE]
With 21 wins they are 6th right now. Hope we lose the rest of the games this season.
Cooper plays in 30mins
Flagg injured and in a wheelchair.
Raps beat the Sixers last night and fall to the 5th worst record in the league meaning they are likely to keep their pick
March Madness becomes March Sadness.
This guy is way more advanced offensively than I assumed based on how people talked about him after the summer. He's clearly good NBA starter level offensively already. It's crazy to think most of his hype was based on defense.
[QUOTE=999Guy;14986690]This guy is way more advanced offensively than I assumed based on how people talked about him after the summer. He's clearly good NBA starter level offensively already. It's crazy to think most of his hype was based on defense.[/QUOTE]
He got off to a slow start with his jumper. He also was pretty turnover prone early on. Once his jumper started falling it became obvious he would be the top pick.
Just won the Oscar Robinson NPOY. He's the fourth (KD, AD, Zion) freshman to win the award. He's the youngest of them and did it in a much tougher college playing environment with NIL, the portal transfer, and super seniors due to COVID.
Still have the AP and Naismith NPOY awards to go.
[QUOTE=Im Still Ballin;14988184]Just won the Oscar Robinson NPOY. He's the fourth (KD, AD, Zion) freshman to win the award. He's the youngest of them and did it in a much tougher college playing environment with NIL, the portal transfer, and super seniors due to COVID.
Still have the AP and Naismith NPOY awards to go.[/QUOTE]
Tougher college environment? That’s a stretch.
I don't see superstar. He's not good enough with the ball in his hands and he's never going to be an off ball 3 pt assassin like Curry.
I also think his defense as it relates to the NBA level is way overrated. He's not a generational perimeter/interior defender combo at all.
#2 guy on a title team most likely. Still great to have.
[QUOTE=Carbine;14988248]I don't see superstar. He's not good enough with the ball in his hands and he's never going to be an off ball 3 pt assassin like Curry.
I also think his defense as it relates to the NBA level is way overrated. He's not a generational perimeter/interior defender combo at all.
#2 guy on a title team most likely. Still great to have.[/QUOTE]
Thats what I see at this point too. Altho Id qualify it by saying hes still years away from his prime. So he could still be due for significant improvement on where he is now. His natural combination of tools/instincts will be pretty good by NBA standards, but they dont feel historic. As Ive said all along, I see a Franz Wagner type, borderline allstar who can be a net plus on a good team. But not a perennial MVP candidate most likely.
seems like the very typical jock in high school who was a complete meat head
I think his mentality is something being overlooked quite a bit here. He's an absolute warrior and competitor of the highest level already, and the improvements he's made to his game just this year alone suggest to me that he's not done growing on offense in the slightest. He's stronger and more of a dog than Franz, albeit not as smooth. At least not yet.
I see kind of a Pippen level player. Never a true MVP guy but perhaps a top 5-10 guy in the league in his best years and potentially an enormous contributor on a team that wins titles.
[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;14988257]I think his mentality is something being overlooked quite a bit here. He's an absolute warrior and competitor of the highest level already, and the improvements he's made to his game just this year alone suggest to me that he's not done growing on offense in the slightest. He's stronger and more of a dog than Franz, albeit not as smooth. At least not yet.
I see kind of a Pippen level player. Never a true MVP guy but perhaps a top 5-10 guy in the league in his best years and potentially an enormous contributor on a team that wins titles.[/QUOTE]
Ultimate glue guy.
[QUOTE=GOBB;14988265]Ultimate glue guy.[/QUOTE]
if mentality is a factor, he's more or less a mix of Andre Iguodala and Scottie Barnes.
[QUOTE=GimmeThat;14988270]if mentality is a factor, he's more or less a mix of Andre Iguodala and Scottie Barnes.[/QUOTE]
I’ll take that on the Sixers
[QUOTE=GOBB;14988265]Ultimate glue guy.[/QUOTE]
Yeah. I'd really like to see him go to a team thats already got a few pieces. Like Portland, or one of the East play-in teams that might end up in the lotto like Miami or Atlanta. Altho lottery probability doesnt favor that clearly.
I dont know that hes a guy you stick on the Wizards or the Jazz and say "ok, now lift this thing up." Actually I think itd be really cool to see him get paired with Zion, but I dunno how much longer New Orleans stays committed to Zion and vice versa.
Tbh I wanna see Portland land him, and then see Maxey force a trade to Portland to join him. Those guys can match each other's energy, and theres some other solid pieces there.
Leave The Big Sob and Podcast P in Philly :crazysam:
Adam Morrison was not as physical as Flagg, but a much more potent scorer in his last year in college
[QUOTE=Carbine;14988248]I don't see superstar. He's not good enough with the ball in his hands and he's never going to be an off ball 3 pt assassin like Curry.
I also think his defense as it relates to the NBA level is way overrated. He's not a generational perimeter/interior defender combo at all.
#2 guy on a title team most likely. Still great to have.[/QUOTE]
Not how it works. He could bust asses on offense right now.
He’d get a decently efficient 20/5 on an NBA offense immediately.
A lot of getting better at basketball is just learning the tricks and and timing your body gives you an edge to do. There is no way he’s even learned half of his total ability to generate shots at 19.
That’s really where age shows up as valuable in the NBA. There are athletic 30 years who are as as fast or faster than 20 year olds. But it’s the learning curve of your own instincts and game. To be as good as he is at 19, means he will figure out how to utterly dominate by 23.
Look at how Wiggins improved at like 26 or some shit with Golden State. He learned how to rebound in one summer. Idiot could've learned that at 21. But didn’t have the drive to.
As long as Cooper is hard working, he will be a superstar at this rate.
Edit: The dude is actually still 18. God damn. Insane to write his ceiling off.
[QUOTE=Neal Romer;14988277]
Leave The Big Sob and Podcast P in Philly :crazysam:[/QUOTE]
:lol