For the good of the NBA, shouldn't some of these teams stop tanking?

First, I'll acknowledge my biases so that we can hopefully not have them as the focus of the discussion. I am a Celtics fan. And I hate tanking. The two stances are not mutually exclusive as I don't have to like everything Ainge does. I do understand why the team was constructed the way it was this season and even agree that getting a higher draft pick will make the team better long term. I just don't like tanking in general because I think it cheapens the game. An ideal league has every team doing everything they can to win it all every season. But that's not how things work, and by trading the leadership and not pushing Rondo to come back early it's pretty evident that was Ainge's plan. Jeff Green is not supposed to be the caliber of player around whom you can build a division winner.

We all want our entitlements but no one wants to pay taxes, you know?

TL;DR. Now let's get to the point. With the Celtics as the focus because that's the tank I'm riding in.

Fortunately (?) for Ainge there are still 55+ games for Brooklyn or NY to turn their seasons around but it's hard to believe in either team at the moment. It may have happened in my lifetime but I cannot think of a division winner that had a losing record, and we're on pace to see that in the Atlantic with the Celtics sitting ugly at 11-14. Again: they traded the leadership. The coach was dealt for a pick and the vet leaders were dealt for draft picks and players the Nets didn't want. And it didn't work. Ainge has created a bad team that is not bad enough. If the majority of the EC continues to win at the same pace Ainge will have to somehow make the Celtics not just worse but much worse to have a shot at one of the NCAA's 4-6 players that are being hyped as future superstars (Parker, Wiggins, Randle, Smart, Embiid, whoever).

Question: How do you do that?

Without ordering Coach Stevens to intentionally lose, how do you mess up the roster even further for the sake of the future? The best healthy player is career 13.8 ppg Jeff Green, this season averaging 16.9 as of the writing of this topic. The whole roster is roleplayers except for Rajon Rondo, who will in theory make the team better when he returns. That's right, horror of horrors the Celtics could end the season with 40 wins. I'm sure the Pacers would deal Danny Granger a first and filler for Rondo and Green but isn't that just too blatant? Or, for those of you that disregard the need for a team to maintain some semblance of competitiveness, doesn't selling tickets/making money matter?

Stepping outside of the Cs, we have 12 losing teams in the EC. Of those 12, there are four teams I feel certain were designed to lose: Orlando, Toronto (currently conducting an absolute fire sale for Canadian native Wiggins), Philly and Boston. Utah is also tanking out West, but that's only one team in that conference. In a normal season, whow many teams tank, 1 or two? Not sure, but when you already had 6 or 7 teams in the East that were going to be bad on account of them being bad, that's going to be an awful lot of bad basketball.

Are you going to pay $200 for a couple good seats for you and your girl to watch Orlando play the Raptors? If you live in Miami and get to see 82 games of LeBron why bother shelling out $199 for all of these games with bad teams? If you live in Washington how much do you even care what happens in the regular season when you know your team has no chance? 99.999997% of bball fans predict a Pacer/Heat ECF (there are something like 30 Hawk fans, 4 of whom are really dumb).

Right now the NBA badly needs more competition, especially in the Eastern Conference. The Rose injury wasn't just a blow to the Bulls, it was a blow to the entire NBA as it robbed us all of a team that could at least compete with Miami and the Pacers, even if they wouldn't have won. The way the standings are now neither the Pacers nor the Heat wouldn't even have an entertaining series until the ECF. It is not good for the NBA to have an entire conference that is not worth paying attention to, and this is compounded by the fact people like me on the east coast have to stay up until 1am to watch good basketball.

It is extremely unlikely that any of the tanking teams reverse course and make some deals to compete in the present. It is extremely unlikely that Ainge or any other GM even reads this post. We'll have to live with what is going to be a bad season. I am aware that my whining solves nothing. I just wanted to vent. So to anyone that read this whole post: Thank you.

Parting thoughts: Darko, Bargnani, Bennett, Brown.

Well, I'm glad you got that out, but Utah isn't necessarily tanking.

The funniest part is that NY and BK aren't even trying to tank. They don't even have any picks. Might end up being the worst division ever when its all said and done if neither of them turns it around. Has there ever been a division where not one team broke .500?

I honestly don't see many moves after possibly shipping Lowry, even though every starter we have should be on the move.

As for more competition in the East... better wait for next or couple seasons in the future.

[QUOTE=mrpibb]Well, I'm glad you got that out, but Utah isn't necessarily tanking.[/QUOTE]
The team is not trying to lose games... I don't think that ever really happens where players intentionally lose games to get some star on their team with them. The management in Utah however, has clearly set this team up this year to lose a lot of games. That is tanking. Utah is tanking. It's fine, because almost every single franchise has done it at least once except for Utah.

[QUOTE=mrpibb]Well, I'm glad you got that out, but Utah isn't necessarily tanking.[/QUOTE]
Who's their best player, Hayward? I could be wrong but I figure something like that only happens if you're intentionally losing.

[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green]Who's their best player, Hayward? I could be wrong but I figure something like that only happens if you're intentionally losing.[/QUOTE]

The idea is to see what the Jazz have in their young players. People have been clamoring for Favors and Kanter to start. That's basically what happened.

Who were the best free agents this summer? Howard? That would be pretty silly already having Favors and Kanter. So the front office delayed the year it will have salary cap space until next year, which is supposedly really good.

[QUOTE]The team is not trying to lose games... I don't think that ever really happens where players intentionally lose games to get some star on their team with them. The management in Utah however, has clearly set this team up this year to lose a lot of games. That is tanking. Utah is tanking. It's fine, because almost every single franchise has done it at least once except for Utah.[/QUOTE]

Young teams lose, but what team could they have crafted that would make the playoffs? Are any good players being held back from playing?

We wanted to find out how the young guys would play. This year was the year to do it. If we win, awesome. If we lose, awesome.

But it's not tanking, which is deliberate.

The Nets have clearly turned it around and are on track to reach .500 before the All Star break. Also, I think that if the Knicks get Tyson back and maybe make a trade, then they could potentially get back to the .500 mark by the end of the season.

[QUOTE=mrpibb]The idea is to see what the Jazz have in their young players. People have been clamoring for Favors and Kanter to start. That's basically what happened.

Who were the best free agents this summer? Howard? That would be pretty silly already having Favors and Kanter. So the front office delayed the year it will have salary cap space until next year, which is supposedly really good.



Young teams lose, but what team could they have crafted that would make the playoffs? Are any good players being held back from playing?

We wanted to find out how the young guys would play. This year was the year to do it. If we win, awesome. If we lose, awesome.

But it's not tanking, which is deliberate.[/QUOTE]
It's semantics really... Tanking our [I]rebuilding[/I]. In many ways they are the same. Rebuilding is when the management designs the team in a way that they know will not win many games. Maybe it just feels like tanking because Utah has never really had a true rebuilding year since the first few years after they were moved to Utah. But relative to what we have seen other teams do in the past.... no Utah isn't "tanking". It is a smart move by management.

[QUOTE=joshwake]It's semantics really... Tanking our [I]rebuilding[/I]. In many ways they are the same. Rebuilding is when the management designs the team in a way that they know will not win many games. Maybe it just feels like tanking because Utah has never really had a true rebuilding year since the first few years after they were moved to Utah. But relative to what we have seen other teams do in the past.... no Utah isn't "tanking". It is a smart move by management.[/QUOTE]

:cheers:

[QUOTE=mrpibb]The idea is to see what the Jazz have in their young players. People have been clamoring for Favors and Kanter to start. That's basically what happened.

Who were the best free agents this summer? Howard? That would be pretty silly already having Favors and Kanter. So the front office delayed the year it will have salary cap space until next year, which is supposedly really good.[/QUOTE]
Did they go after Monta Ellis? Did they try to trade Big Al before he was a free agent, or sign and trade him over the offseason? Did they make any moves to improve? If all you do in the offseason is lose a guy that was arguably your best player and start some guys that some fans thought were being held back are you really trying to improve? And if you are not trying to improve, what are you really doing?

I'm not saying you have no point as it can be hard to obtain good players and I am aware of the inherent disadvantage Utah has in attracting free agents. But did they even try?

[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green]Did they go after Monta Ellis? Did they try to trade Big Al before he was a free agent, or sign and trade him over the offseason? Did they make any moves to improve? If all you do in the offseason is lose a guy that was arguably your best player and start some guys that some fans thought were being held back are you really trying to improve? And if you are not trying to improve, what are you really doing?

I'm not saying you have no point as it can be hard to obtain good players and I am aware of the inherent disadvantage Utah has in attracting free agents. But did they even try?[/QUOTE]

Who actually believed Monta Ellis would be part of a championship roster? Why would we sign Al or Millsap when we're trying to get Favors and Kanter playing time? Why would we sign good players at the expense of signing great players next year?

What you're suggesting makes sense, but it also mortgages the future. This is what you're asking for. Every league needs to have bad teams. When it's intentional it's glaring, but this is not intentional. It was going to happen.

We missed the playoffs last year, so we're trying something else. We didn't like what we saw, so we're trying something else.

but even if the tanking teams stop tanking they still suck no?

on the realz doe i can't believe big baby, aaron afflalo, rondo, gerald wallace all havent' been dealt

relegation. end of tanking.

[QUOTE=HylianNightmare]but even if the tanking teams stop tanking they still suck no?

on the realz doe i can't believe big baby, aaron afflalo, rondo, gerald wallace all havent' been dealt[/QUOTE]

Nobody wants Gerald Wallace's contract. Big Baby and Rondo are coming off of injuries.

They should get all they can for Afflalo right now.