:eek: !!! Tank nation, let's do this...
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:eek: !!! Tank nation, let's do this...
3 players being heavily discussed are Hayes, Patterson and Vasquez...
It's done. Gay, Acy and Gray for Greivis Vazquez, Chuck Hayes, John Salmons, and Patrick Patterson.
[QUOTE=Chamberlain]It's done. Gay, Acy and Gray for Greivis Vazquez, Chuck Hayes, John Salmons, and Patrick Patterson.[/QUOTE]
:banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:
Only contract that we're obligated to pay beyond this year is Hayes at around 6 million. Getting Patterson and Vasquez is a positive return as they don't make very much and should have value (both have qualifying offer beyond this year). Salmons has a 7 million team option that will be declined.
Only problem is that it is conveivable we actually win more games this year. We also will get to see Chuck Hayes play major minutes. Guy is right up Casey's alley.
Now that this is done, I'd like to see follow-up moves dealing Amir and Lowry too. Derozan should be available as well.
- Hayes and Salmons are totally irrelevant to the Raptors long-term future if this is the start of a rebuild. Salmons shouldn't even be on the active roster. Hayes will hopefully be traded elsewhere this year.
- I'd like to see Patterson play because, well, why not? See if there is anything to him. Gotta trade Amir to open up minutes first though.
- Vasquez is a solid rotation player in the NBA. Not ideal as a starter if you want to be a great team but not bad to have on the team if he's cheap.
Excellent deal. Long time coming and good riddance, let cousins beat the **** out of that cucker.
As for trading amir and derozan we should get actual value for them otherwise I wouldn't move them for the sake of it. You don't just bleed talent for nothing especially if they won't win you games.
[QUOTE=RapsFan]Only problem is that it is conveivable we actually win more games this year. We also will get to see Chuck Hayes play major minutes. Guy is right up Casey's alley.[/QUOTE]
Not likely Salmons and Hayes are scrubs. Hays can rebound, but can't do much otherwise. Vasquez is alright and Patterson has been terrible this year.
I want the rest of the starters gone too.
You smell that? Its a real tank. :applause:
New York Knicks, here we come! :oldlol:
Yeah Rudy might have actually lost us more games, but then we would have been stuck with him next year too
[QUOTE=Grey Dawn]New York Knicks, here we come! :oldlol:
Yeah Rudy might have actually lost us more games, but then we would have been stuck with him next year too[/QUOTE]
Still have casey. Its amazing how much the ball movement has improved, even derozan is passing.
[QUOTE=Himan12]You smell that? Its a real tank. :applause:[/QUOTE]
Amir, DeMar, and Kyle all helped their trade value tonight.
The truth is, you can only justify having a 19M player on your roster if either A. you're a playoff team or B. that player is someone who is so damn good that you can build your entire team around them. Rudy clearly is neither of those so it was a good move to let him go. We have a guy who has actually outplayed him all year and is taking in half the salary. Now DD's contract doesn't look so bad anymore.
Good start, but I still don't think they are much worse than they were before the trade. Definitely more has to be done.
[QUOTE=Grey Dawn]
Yeah Rudy might have actually lost us more games, but then we would have been stuck with him next year too[/QUOTE]
+1
[QUOTE=Zan Tabak]Good start, but I still don't think they are much worse than they were before the trade. Definitely more has to be done.[/QUOTE]
I would agree.
In fact you could actually make a reasonable arguement to say that with less overlap in Derozan/Gay ISO Offence plus the addition of a true "distributing back up point guard known for pick and roll"... that the team as of today is as good or even better and more balanced !
We lost talent in Gay despite what his perfromance here was; but we picked up depth a PG and depth in the forecourt which argueably makes us deeper and better.
I reserve my judegment. [B]This may NOT be a tank move at all.[/B]
Just saying
ESPN calls it out although they seem to predict that Wiggens is the true target.
[url]http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/662/raps-kings-likely-not-done-dealing[/url]
Thing about Klow is the only teams that really really need his services would appear to be NY Knicks and Brooklyn.
I guess a 3 way trade would be required @ 6.2 Mill...
Vasq can run the point frankly...
There is also nothing to say that MU cannot parley : This years pick, plus two next year (Raps and Knicks) into top 3 this off season for Wiggens.
It's a money move, but it could have the reverse impact of a tank. Addition by subtraction, unless our scoring is just so inept moving forward. I totally agree the guys we got arent's special but they are servicable.
If the Raptors don't draft a long-term option at PG in this upcoming draft, I wouldn't be surprised to see Vasquez re-signed to a short and relatively affordable deal. I think he's a good "stop-gap" option to go forward with during rebuilding years until you find a better long-term option via draft or trade.
I'd be shocked if Lowry and Amir aren't trade sometime soon. I'm hoping the Raptors are shopping Derozan as well but wouldn't be surprised if he stays. I'm not worried about this move affective the tank. You don't get players like Hayes, Vasquez and Patterson to make a push for the playoffs. All of these guys are going to be in play for other trades this year.
[QUOTE=Jballer]I would agree.
In fact you could actually make a reasonable arguement to say that with less overlap in Derozan/Gay ISO Offence plus the addition of a true "distributing back up point guard known for pick and roll"... that the team as of today is as good or even better and more balanced !
We lost talent in Gay despite what his perfromance here was; but we picked up depth a PG and depth in the forecourt which argueably makes us deeper and better.
I reserve my judegment. [B]This may NOT be a tank move at all.[/B]
Just saying[/QUOTE]
I would tend to agree with this post, im not convinced the quote unquote tank is a done deal.
Our main weakness was our bench scoring, and now we have a deep bench. We lost our best isolation scorer, but Demar isnt a big drop off from Rudy in that dept.
In the weak Atlantic, we could still be a playoff team....4th seed actually, not a good thing.
If not for the Denver Meltdown, we would have just completed a .500 West Coast Rd trip.
Judging by all the East teams just as bad as us, A tanking season isnt a guarantee that we get Wiggins. It might give us 15% chance at landing him. He is the only player worth tanking for....
[B]My worst fear is we achieve more of the same last 5 years. Bad enough to miss the playoffs, good enough to not get a good lottery pick.[/B]
[QUOTE]Judging by all the East teams just as bad as us, A tanking season isnt a guarantee that we get Wiggins. It might give us 15% chance at landing him. He is the only player worth tanking for....[/QUOTE]
No he's not. In fact, as of right now, I'd rather have Parker than Wiggins. That may change though.
I'd be thrilled if the Raptors got any of the top 3. I'd be really happy if the Raptors had a chance to draft someone like Smart, Embiid or even Exum (although I know next to nothing about his game other than what I've read).
It's not just about Wiggins.
[QUOTE=Qwyjibo]
If the Raptors don't draft a long-term option at PG in this upcoming draft, I wouldn't be surprised to see Vasquez re-signed to a short and relatively affordable deal.
I'd be shocked if Lowry (snip and Amir ??) aren't trade sometime soon. I'm hoping the Raptors are shopping Derozan as well but wouldn't be surprised if he stays.
I'm not worried about this move affective the tank. You don't get players like Hayes, Vasquez and Patterson to make a push for the playoffs. [/QUOTE]
Q I follow you right up to the last point. I agree to disagree on 3 :cheers:
1) I would not be surprised at all to see Vasquez play here next season and after that. Better backup PG than what[B] ESPN[/B] calls our Pupu platter at the one.
2) I actually totally agree about Lowry. Not sure on Amir although he is expriring in 2014 15 as I recall and therefore a very good asset "next year". Like you I assume Demar is here to stay.
3) These guys may be scrubs but where the Raps are, where the rest of the conference is, where the new rotation can actually improve the team O ....
I will hold my judgement.
If we move Klow/Amir/Landry and get talent back this very well could be a push for the playoffs in the east. [COLOR="Purple"]This kind of depth team with cap room is exactly what MU had in Denver.[/COLOR] It allows you all kinds of options.
Right now I would be willing to bet that we will see a move - perhaps a 3 way move to get Klow to one of the NY teams and we get a player and a pick back... further it will be a player to make a push for the playoffs
[B]Zach Lowe at ESPN[/B]
[U]Here’s the thing: This deal, by itself, may well make the 2013-14 Raptors better[/U]. And that’s why we should expect the Raptors to begin (or continue) gauging the market for both DeMar DeRozan and Kyle Lowry as we approach December 15, after which most free agents who signed over the summer are trade-eligible again. Dwane Casey, the team’s head coach, may also be in trouble, depending on Ujiri’s timetable with the position, per several league sources.
...
DeRozan has shot better this season without Gay on the floor, per NBA.com. The Raptors’ starting lineup, torrid to finish last season, has scored just 98.9 points per 100 possessions this season — about equivalent to Orlando’s offense, ranked 24th in the league. [U]The Raps turned into world-beaters when Casey separated the two wing gunners:[/U] 104.2 points per 100 possessions when DeRozan played without Gay, and 112.7 when Gay went solo. (This did not happen last season.) DeRozan has improved incrementally in almost every one of his pro seasons, and he has much wider appeal around the league than Gay.
[url]http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/85058/a-new-king-what-the-rudy-gay-trade-means-for-toronto-and-sacramento[/url]
If this is the start of a "re-tool" and not a "rebuild" then I basically lose all faith in this franchise. This team still need that one high-end talent to build around.
Once Lowry is gone, ill be ready to call this a rebuild.
Although I still think that this Raptors team without Gay has a 50/50 chance of making the playoffs in the
East...
Liked Rudy. on the plus side my buddy got a very[URL="http://traveltorontonow.blogspot.ca/2014/01/cheap-rudy-gay-toronto-raptors-swingman.html"] cheap Gay jersey [/URL]for 30. Swingman one.
[QUOTE=jdtoronto]Liked Rudy. on the plus side my buddy got a very[URL="http://traveltorontonow.blogspot.ca/2014/01/cheap-rudy-gay-toronto-raptors-swingman.html"] cheap Gay jersey [/URL]for 30. Swingman one.[/QUOTE]
Something about wearing a jersey that has 'Gay' written on the back just doesn't do it for me. :D
Not that there is anything wrong with that.
btw nice spam :cheers: