Lebron's time of possession in 2015 Finals was 50% higher than RS leader

[url]http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/possessions/?Season=2014-15&SeasonType=Playoffs&sort=TIME_OF_POSS&dir=1&PORound=4[/url]

Lebron's time of possession (the amount of time he possesses the ball each game) was a whopping 12.0 minutes per game in the Finals - that's 50% higher than the regular season leader, John Wall's 8.2 minutes.

Overall, for the 2014-2015 regular season and playoffs, Lebron's time of possession was higher than any non-pg in the league - he and Harden were the only non-pg's with equal or higher time of possession than point guards.

Since today's spaced-out, screen-roll setup allows more ball-domination and higher time of possession to accumulate stats, wings from prior eras like MJ and Dr. J would have higher stats today.

It's almost like he slowed down the tempo of the game to not allow gsw to play to their strengths

Why the fucc would time of possession matter when it comes to "accumulation of stats". The number of possessions is what matters.

LeBron James finished the 2015 NBA Finals with averages of 35.8 points, 13.3 rebounds, and 8.8 assists per game.

LeBron James is the first player in NBA Finals history to lead both teams in points, assists and rebounds for the entire series.

Without James on the floor, Cleveland’s field goal percentage dropped for 40% to 17%, and it’s offensive efficiency fell from 97.3 to 50.9.

According to Tom Haberstroh of ESPN, James accounted for 38.3% of Cleveland's points in the Finals, the second-highest percentage of team points in Finals history. He is edged only by Michael Jordan scoring 38.4% of the Bulls' points in the 1993 Finals, which Chicago won.

He was responsible for an average of 57.7 points per game on points he either scored or assisted on; which in turn, accounted for 62% of the Cavaliers’s points in the NBA Finals.

According to ESPN Stats & Information, by pulling the Elo Ratings for each team to make the NBA Finals before the series began, and taking into account a team’s home-court advantage, it was able to project each team’s chances of winning prior to the Finals. What was discovered was that James’ teams had the lowest expected winning percentage — 37% — out of any of the other players on this list. If you consider that James still managed to win two titles with those odds stacked against him, the four losses don’t seem so terrible. And if we look at the 2015 Finals by itself, we’ll realize that James did was pretty much unprecedented.

“If we look at a multi-year Statistical Plus/Minus talent projection for every NBA Finals team, this Cavs team ranks as the ninth-least talented NBA finalist since 1985. (By contrast, Cleveland’s opponents, the mighty Golden State Warriors, rank as the 14th-most talented.) Remove James, and things get even more dire; his supporting cast ranks as the third-worst team carried by its best player to the NBA Finals since 1985.”

If you were to take James’s talent rating (6.6) and replace it with that of the league-average player (0.0), the Cavaliers’s talent rating would dwindle to -0.1. So what the King ended up doing was carrying one of the three-worst supporting casts in NBA history to within two games of a championship. Of course, what we forgot to mention was that FiveThirtyEight also determined that these Golden State Warriors finished the year with the second-highest peak Elo Rating (1822) in NBA history and third-highest Composite Elo Rating of all time (1796), making them one of the best basketball teams ever. And what James did against them remarkable.

When LeBron was NOT on the floor, JR Smith, Matthew Dellavedova, James Jones and Iman Shumpert DID NOT MAKE A SHOT in the NBA Finals

Without LeBron James on the floor this series.
JR Smith 0/9 FG
Delly 0/7 FG
J. Jones 0/3 FG
Shumpert 0/2 FG
Total 0/21 FG


[IMG]http://giant.gfycat.com/FlimsySpitefulButterfly.gif[/IMG]

^^^^ lebrons reaction when Kevin Love signed with the cavs

I think that post killed 3ball. If he survived, he's frantically looking through his Word documents for something with enough paragraphs that can buy him time to regroup.

What about Curry, bro? Why'd you stop praising him this season? He's playing his best ball yet.

[QUOTE=GIF REACTION]

Without James on the floor, Cleveland’s field goal percentage dropped for 40% to 17%, and it’s offensive efficiency fell from 97.3 to 50.9.

[/quote]
All great players have this effect.. When a great player goes to the bench, his team's performance will suffer - this is nothing new.. It's not an argument for Lebron anymore than it is for Nash, Kevin Johnson, MJ, Magic or Stockton.


[quote=GIF REACTION]

According to Tom Haberstroh of ESPN, James accounted for 38.3% of Cleveland's points in the Finals, the second-highest percentage of team points in Finals history. He is edged only by Michael Jordan scoring 38.4% of the Bulls' points in the 1993 Finals, which Chicago won.

[/QUOTE]
He needed 50% more time of possession achieve his stats than the RS leader in time of possession.

AND he only shot 39% despite only being double-teamed 3 times per game (18 times in the entire series)..

How come Lebron shot so poorly despite getting secluded 1-on-1 over and over??... High volume - Lebron's efficiency is poor at the additional midrange and isolations required of high volume shooting, so he can't shoot well at high volume.. Otoh, as Haberstroh said, Jordan WON his Finals, because he shot well at high volume - he shot 51% on 33 fga.


[quote=GIF REACTION]

What was discovered was that James’ teams had the lowest expected winning percentage — 37% — out of any of the other players on this list.

[/QUOTE]
According to the 538 list, MJ's 1991 and 1993 casts rank far below Lebron's 2012 and 2013 casts, which proves that MJ won with less.. MJ was capable of winning with less, as the 538 lists prove.

And when you compare Jordan's [COLOR="Navy"][I]per 100 stats[/I][/COLOR] to other wings (playoffs stats shown below), it's clear that he did exactly what the other wings did, but just MORE OF IT.. His efficiency was the same as other wings, but he simply produced far more at that efficiency:

[SIZE="1"]JORDAN:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 43.3 pts.. 2.2 oreb.. 6.1 dreb.. 7.4 ast.. 4.0 tov.. 2.7 stl.. 1.1 blk.. [COLOR="green"]32.5 fga.. 118 ORtg.. 56.8 ts[/COLOR]
LEBRON:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 36.5 pts.. 2.0 oreb.. 9.3 dreb.. 8.6 ast.. 4.5 tov.. 2.2 stl.. 1.2 blk.. 26.8 fga.. 114 ORtg.. 56.5 ts
DURANT:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 35.8 pts.. 1.2 oreb.. 9.1 dreb.. 4.8 ast.. 4.1 tov.. 1.4 stl.. 1.5 blk.. 25.8 fga.. 114 ORtg.. 58.3 ts
KOBE:[COLOR="White"].....[/COLOR] 34.7 pts.. 1.4 oreb.. 5.5 dreb.. 6.4 ast.. 4.0 tov.. 1.9 stl.. 0.9 blk.. 27.7 fga.. 110 ORtg.. 54.1 ts
WADE:[COLOR="White"]....[/COLOR] 32.2 pts.. 2.0 oreb.. 5.4 dreb.. 7.1 ast.. 4.8 tov.. 2.3 stl.. 1.4 blk.. 24.5 fga.. 108 ORtg.. 55.4 ts[/size]

Lebron is an all time great nba player. Anyone posting anything to counter this, should never be taken seriously.

And I hate watching lebron and hope he retires to I never have to watch his horrible boring awful basketball! As you can tell I'm doing my best to say nice things about how much I hate watching him play!

[QUOTE=FKAri]

Why the fucc would time of possession matter when it comes to "accumulation of stats". The number of possessions is what matters.

[/QUOTE]
Why would time of possession matter?... Lebron needed 50% more time of possession achieve his stats than the RS leader in time of possession..

If you don't think that's remarkable, then you're ridiculously biased... Read that again - 50%... more... time of posssession... than the RS leader.

And of course, he only shot 39% despite only being double-teamed 3 times per game (18 times in the entire series)..

[QUOTE=3ball]All great players have this effect.. When a great player goes to the bench, his team's performance will suffer - this is nothing new.. It's not an argument for Lebron anymore than it is for Nash, Kevin Johnson, MJ, Magic or Stockton.



He needed 50% more time of possession achieve his stats than the RS leader in time of possession.

AND he only shot 39% despite only being double-teamed 3 times per game (18 times in the entire series)..

How come Lebron shot so poorly despite getting secluded 1-on-1 over and over??... High volume - Lebron's efficiency is poor at the additional midrange and isolations required of high volume shooting, so he can't shoot well at high volume.. Otoh, as Haberstroh said, Jordan WON his Finals, because he shot well at high volume - he shot 51% on 33 fga.



According to the 538 list, MJ's 1991 and 1993 casts rank far below Lebron's 2012 and 2013 casts, which proves that MJ won with less.. MJ was capable of winning with less, as the 538 lists prove.

[/QUOTE]

So you agree Lebron is an all time great and one of the best ever to play?

What was the point of this topic then? We all agree. Lebron was amazing in the finals last year.

FYI removed all your stuff with weird colors and font and stuff. I assumed that was stuff you didn't mean to post since it looked bad.

Lebron increased his teams offensive rating by an NBA finals record +46.4

Legendary impact

[QUOTE=3ball]Why would time of possession matter?... Lebron needed 50% more time of possession achieve his stats than the RS leader in time of possession..

If you don't think that's remarkable, then you're ridiculously biased... Read that again - 50%... more... time of posssession... than the RS leader.

And of course, he only shot 39% despite only being double-teamed 3 times per game (18 times in the entire series)..[/QUOTE]

You know I can't tell. Is more time good or bad? I'm struggling with what you're going for. Do you think Triston Thompson should have the ball? WIth Irving out there's no doubt Lebron is the top scorer and point guard for the cavs. So....what is the point? How can I be baised if I don't even know if this is favorable or unfavorable?

Seriously post your thought process on these weird posts. Mind you once you do, I'm likely to laugh at you and not keep posting because you never seem to have a point that isn't comical.

[QUOTE=dhsilv]Lebron is an all time great nba player. Anyone posting anything to counter this, should never be taken seriously.

And I hate watching lebron and hope he retires to I never have to watch his horrible boring awful basketball! As you can tell I'm doing my best to say nice things about how much I hate watching him play![/QUOTE]
Lebron is an all-time great, but so is Barkley and Malone and Pete Maravich.

For once, accept the statistical facts - Lebron takes more time to score than any non-pg in today's gamee... and for him to achieve his Finals stats, he needed a whopping FIFTY PERCENT MORE time of possession than the regular season leader..

Of course, he only shot 39% despite being double-teamed only 3 times per game (18 times in the entire series)..

Btw, when you compare Jordan's [COLOR="Navy"][I]per 100 stats[/I][/COLOR] to other wings (playoffs stats shown below), it's clear that he did exactly what the other wings did, but just MORE OF IT.. His efficiency was the same as other wings, but he simply produced far more at that efficiency:

[SIZE="1"]JORDAN:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 43.3 pts.. 2.2 oreb.. 6.1 dreb.. 7.4 ast.. 4.0 tov.. 2.7 stl.. 1.1 blk.. [COLOR="green"]32.5 fga.. 118 ORtg.. 56.8 ts[/COLOR]
LEBRON:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 36.5 pts.. 2.0 oreb.. 9.3 dreb.. 8.6 ast.. 4.5 tov.. 2.2 stl.. 1.2 blk.. 26.8 fga.. 114 ORtg.. 56.5 ts
DURANT:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 35.8 pts.. 1.2 oreb.. 9.1 dreb.. 4.8 ast.. 4.1 tov.. 1.4 stl.. 1.5 blk.. 25.8 fga.. 114 ORtg.. 58.3 ts
KOBE:[COLOR="White"].....[/COLOR] 34.7 pts.. 1.4 oreb.. 5.5 dreb.. 6.4 ast.. 4.0 tov.. 1.9 stl.. 0.9 blk.. 27.7 fga.. 110 ORtg.. 54.1 ts
WADE:[COLOR="White"]....[/COLOR] 32.2 pts.. 2.0 oreb.. 5.4 dreb.. 7.1 ast.. 4.8 tov.. 2.3 stl.. 1.4 blk.. 24.5 fga.. 108 ORtg.. 55.4 ts[/size]

[QUOTE=GIF REACTION]Lebron increased his teams offensive rating by an NBA finals record +46.4

Legendary impact[/QUOTE]

Had his shots fallen, is it possible he could have by himself beaten a top 15 team all time? How crazy is that?

Now honestly I think the warrior were jsut screwing around and were shocked the cavs even had a chance.

[B]Respond to my earlier post about Curry.[/B]




[QUOTE=3ball]All great players have this effect.. When a great player goes to the bench, his team's performance will suffer - this is nothing new.. It's not an argument for Lebron anymore than it is for Nash, Kevin Johnson, MJ, Magic or Stockton.
[/QUOTE]

Show me the numbers for MJ and Dr J

[QUOTE=3ball]


He needed 50% more time of possession achieve his stats than the RS leader in time of possession.

AND he only shot 39% despite only being double-teamed 3 times per game (18 times in the entire series)..

How come Lebron shot so poorly despite getting secluded 1-on-1 over and over??... High volume - Lebron's efficiency is poor at the additional midrange and isolations required of high volume shooting, so he can't shoot well at high volume.

[/QUOTE]

Because literally no one else on that team was scoring. His usage was so high throughout the playoffs that he had no more legs for his jumper. Also, Lebron's not an all-time great iso scorer. It might be his greatest weakness. Yet he still put up 30 something across the whole series.

Let's use YOUR OWN suggested sources to destroy you:
[url]http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/lebron-james-may-go-down-as-the-greatest-loser-ever/[/url]

[QUOTE=3ball]

According to the 538 list, MJ's 1991 and 1993 casts rank far below Lebron's 2012 and 2013 casts, which proves that MJ won with less.. MJ was capable of winning with less, as the 538 lists prove.[/QUOTE]

EDIT - my bad I thought you were referring to 2015.


[img]https://espnfivethirtyeight.files.wordpress.com/2015/05/paine-datalab-lebron-cast-2.png[/img]


That's by 538 btw.
Right here:
[url]http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/where-this-years-cavs-rank-among-lebrons-nba-finals-supporting-casts/[/url]



Bye bye 3ball. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

[QUOTE=GIF REACTION]Lebron increased his teams offensive rating by an NBA finals record +46.4

Legendary impact[/QUOTE]
This is so rare because you never get a team with such a weak supporting cast make the NBA finals

Let alone sweep a 60 win team

It takes a GOAT tier player to do these things

[QUOTE=3ball]Lebron is an all-time great, but so is Barkley and Malone and Pete Maravich.

For once, accept the statistical facts - Lebron takes more time to score than any non-pg in today's gamee... and for him to achieve his Finals stats, he needed a whopping FIFTY PERCENT MORE time of possession than the regular season leader..

And of course, he only shot 39% despite only being double-teamed 3 times per game (18 times in the entire series)..

[/QUOTE]

Maravichi is kinda pusing it on all time great. But again what's your point?

Lebron IS the point guard for the cavs or at least was in the finals. He was also the offensive scorer. He's a pass first player....which we all know.

[QUOTE=GIF REACTION]

Lebron increased his teams offensive rating by an [B][COLOR="Red"]NBA finals record[/COLOR][/B] +46.4

[/QUOTE]
horseshit... We don't have stats for past greats..

The reality is that Lebron's teammates shot better than he did in the Finals - they shot 43.3% eFG to his 43.2%.

Lebron's Finals stats were not great - his FG% and defense ruined it...

MJ's impact was greater when he averaged 41/9/6/51 in 1993 Finals [COLOR="Blue"][I]with GOAT defense[/I][/COLOR].......... or his 33/7/11/56 in 1991 Finals, with GOAT defense.

[SIZE="7"][B]Lebron increased his teams offensive rating by an [COLOR="Red"]NBA finals record +46.4[/COLOR][/B][/SIZE]

Legendary impact

[QUOTE=FKAri]

That's by 538 btw.
Right here:
[url]http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/where-this-years-cavs-rank-among-lebrons-nba-finals-supporting-casts/[/url]

Bye bye 3ball. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.[/QUOTE]
[B][COLOR="Red"]Get some glasses... Seriously - you're literally misreading the stats.
[/COLOR][/B]
[COLOR="Blue"][B]According to the 538 list, MJ's 1991 and 1993 casts rank far below Lebron's 2012 and 2013 casts, which proves that MJ won with less..

There is no way to refute this - if you put your faith in 538, the list says MJ won with less.[/B][/COLOR]
.

[QUOTE=3ball]horseshit... We don't have stats for past greats..

The reality is that Lebron's teammates shot better than he did in the Finals - they shot 43.3% eFG to his 43.2%.

Lebron's Finals stats were not great - his FG% and defense ruined it...

MJ's impact was greater when he averaged 41/9/6/51 in 1993 Finals [COLOR="Blue"][I]with GOAT defense[/I][/COLOR].......... or his 33/7/11/56 in 1991 Finals, with GOAT defense.[/QUOTE]

So now you're just saying stuff without any clue what you're talking about? If you don't have any evidence shut up. God, stop insulting MJ. MJ was the GOAT! He shouldn't have slime like you insulting his legacy!

3ball schooling these youngsters as usual.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/ByQSoLU.gif[/IMG]

[QUOTE=3ball]How dumb are you?
According to the 538 list, MJ's 1991 and 1993 casts rank far below Lebron's 2012 and 2013 casts, which proves that MJ won with less..

There is no way to refute this - if you put your faith in 538, the list says MJ won with less - you dumb ****[/quote]

Bro MJ is better than lebron. I don't care how many times you try and claim otherwise. STOP POSTING THIS CRAP.

MJ> Lebron

Stop trying to sell people on lebron being better than MJ. Christ, you just won't stop!

[QUOTE=GIF REACTION][SIZE="7"][B]Lebron increased his teams offensive rating by an [COLOR="Red"]NBA finals record +46.4[/COLOR][/B][/SIZE]

Legendary impact[/QUOTE]
This is by far the largest offensive rating increase by a superstar simply because supporting casts this weak never make the NBA finals... You need a very special type of player to be able to do this

[QUOTE=GIF REACTION]

[SIZE="2"][B]Lebron increased his teams offensive rating by an [COLOR="Red"]NBA finals record +46.4[/COLOR][/B][/SIZE]

[/QUOTE]
This isn't true - we don't have data for MJ's Finals where he played much better than Lebron on both ends... nor do we have stats for Magic, or Stockton, or anyone else.

Here's what we do know: Lebron played horrible defense and shot 39% despite not getting double-teamed, while having 50% higher time of possession than anyone had all year.
.

[QUOTE=GIF REACTION]This is by far the largest offensive rating increase by a superstar simply because supporting casts this weak never make the NBA finals... You need a very special type of player to be able to do this[/QUOTE]

Eastern conference where their biggest obstacle was the phucking Hawks.

STFU.

[QUOTE=3ball]This isn't true - we don't have data for MJ's Finals where he played much better than Lebron on both ends, or Magic, or Stockton, or anyone else.

Here's what we do know: Lebron shot 39% despite not getting double-teamed or having 50% higher time of possession than anyone had all year.[/QUOTE]
Incorrect

We do have the data

Jordan doesn't come close because he had a significantly stronger supporting cast, which minimizes his impact on the team offensive rating

[QUOTE=3ball]This isn't true - we don't have data for MJ's Finals where he played much better than Lebron on both ends, or Magic, or Stockton, or anyone else.

Here's what we do know: Lebron shot 39% despite not getting double-teamed or having 50% higher time of possession than anyone had all year.[/QUOTE]

So like I keep saying. MJ likely was more valuable but just because i can't prove it doesn't mean MJ wasn't the goat. seriously....

As many of you may already know I am a big time Pacers fan but I am a fan of the Cavaliers as well. LeBron did have an uphill battle vs the Warriors and MVP Steph Curry and put up guady numbers, however it was at the sacrifice of ball sharing and an equal opportunity offense. LeBron put up a lot of points but his efficiency was way off, this plus the sheer amount of time he was dominating the ball lead to a non winning style of basketball and ended up hurting us overal. If LeBron mixed in more off ball game with less ball domination he could of gotten our 3 point shooters much more involved. This would of helped spread the floor for LeBron to start working inside again. Instead LeBrons ball dominating, playground style basketball allowed Golden State to gameplan accordingly and take the series.

[QUOTE=3ball][B][COLOR="Red"]Get some glasses... Seriously - you're literally misreading the stats.
[/COLOR][/B]
[COLOR="Blue"][B]According to the 538 list, MJ's 1991 and 1993 casts rank far below Lebron's 2012 and 2013 casts, which proves that MJ won with less..

There is no way to refute this - if you put your faith in 538, the list says MJ won with less.[/B][/COLOR]
.[/QUOTE]

You're right I misread what you wrote and edited the post. I thought you were referring to 2015.

I don't understand what you're trying to say in this thread. You think Dr J would have taken the Cavs further than Lebron?

[QUOTE=Monta Ellis MVP]As many of you may already know I am a big time Pacers fan but I am a fan of the Cavaliers as well. LeBron did have an uphill battle vs the Warriors and MVP Steph Curry and put up guady numbers, [B][COLOR="Red"]however it was at the sacrifice of ball sharing and an equal opportunity offense.[/COLOR][/B] LeBron put up a lot of points but his efficiency was way off, this plus the sheer amount of time he was dominating the ball lead to a non winning style of basketball and ended up hurting us overal. If LeBron mixed in more off ball game with less ball domination he could of gotten our 3 point shooters much more involved. This would of helped spread the floor for LeBron to start working inside again. Instead LeBrons ball dominating, playground style basketball allowed Golden State to gameplan accordingly and take the series.[/QUOTE]
Spot on

[QUOTE=3ball]Only if Dr. J was capable of good efficiency in the same spots Lebron had and at 33 FGA shot volume.

It's remarkable that Lebron fans and the media think it's impossible to shoot better than 39%...

especially while holding the ball 50% longer than anyone has all year and playing secluded 1-on-1 with no double-teaming... It's ridiculous.[/QUOTE]

So Cavs win with any iso scorer better than Bron?

Cavs win with Paul Pierce? Carmelo? Bernard King? Adrian Dantley? Connie Hawkins?

[QUOTE=FKAri]

I don't understand what you're trying to say in this thread

[/QUOTE]
[I]I'm saying Lebron's 2015 Finals wasn't all-time great because:[/I]


1) he held the ball 50% longer than anyone else did all year (this is amazing - 50 frieking percent more than the RS leader - lebron had LITERALLY all day to make his move)

2) he wasn't double-teamed

3) he employed a stat-friendly, playground style, so his stats lack integrity compared to those accumulated using an equitable, team approach (the only approach that has EVER won championships)

4) despite 1-3 above (50% longer time of possession, no double-teaming, stat-friendly style) - he only shot 39%

5) his defense was poor (again)

i agree. Thats why 2/6 is the best that he could do despite doing what others has never done-colluding.

[QUOTE=3ball][I]I'm saying Lebron's 2015 Finals wasn't all-time great because:[/I]


1) he held the ball 50% longer than anyone else did all year (this is amazing - 50 frieking percent more than the RS leader - lebron had LITERALLY all day to make his move)

2) he wasn't double-teamed

3) he employed a stat-friendly, playground style, so his stats lack integrity compared to those accumulated using an equitable, team approach (the only approach that has EVER won championships)

4) despite 1-3 above (50% longer time of possession, no double-teaming, stat-friendly style) - he only shot 39%

5) his defense was poor (again)[/QUOTE]

So all those guys I listed earlier would've won in Lebron's place, right?

Also, how come if I post something that goes against what you say, it's "media" being wrong.

If the stats are neutral or in your favor, they are real?

I already linked this and you didn't respond:
[url]http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/lebron-james-may-go-down-as-the-greatest-loser-ever/[/url]

You just go in circles man. There is no point in debating.

[QUOTE=FKAri]So Cavs win with any iso scorer better than Bron?

Cavs win with Paul Pierce? Carmelo? Bernard King? Adrian Dantley? Connie Hawkins?[/QUOTE]
No, only the very best can shoot well at high volume while still contributing in other areas (like defense).

MJ, Shaq, Hakeem, Wilt, Bird, Kareem, and more - these guys would've won with that Cavs team, assuming they shot better than Lebron's 39%.

[I]Do you think it's impossible or something to shoot better than 39%?... Do you think the Cavs still lose if Lebron shoots 45 or 50%?.. The way you guys defend Lebron's 2015 Finals, it's like you think these things.[/I]

[QUOTE=FKAri]

I already linked this and you didn't respond:
[url]http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/lebron-james-may-go-down-as-the-greatest-loser-ever/[/url]

[/QUOTE]
Lebron shot 39%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

His totals equaled MJ's, except he shot 12 percentage points worse!!!!!!!!!.. He also employed a playground, stat-padding style, while MJ achieved his stats within winning, team concept.

Why ignore this?

Again, do you think it's impossible to shoot better than 39%?... Do you think the Cavs still lose if Lebron shoots 45 or 50%?.. The way you guys defend Lebron's 2015 Finals, it's like you think these things.
.

great leaders trust their teammates. And thats what lebron and lebron fans dont get. Theres a reason why russell, duncan, magic are the greatest winners coz they trust their teammates to do their roles. Meanwhile bran wouldnt, not because he doesnt trust them but because playing off ball means sacrificing stats, which is actually worse than not trusting them. The guy is selfish. Just like oscar robertson was considered cancer. These 3, bran, wilt, oscar, are the greatest losers of all time which also happens to be the greatest statpadder. Coincidence? Nah..

[QUOTE=3ball]No, only the very best can shoot well at high volume while still contributing in other areas (like defense).

MJ, Shaq, Hakeem, Wilt, Bird, Kareem, and more - these guys would've won with that Cavs team, assuming they shot better than Lebron's 39%.

[I]Do you think it's impossible or something to shoot better than 39%?... Do you think the Cavs still lose if Lebron shoots 45 or 50%?.. The way you guys defend Lebron's 2015 Finals, it's like you think these things.[/I][/QUOTE]

No center wins in place of Bron. The team wouldn't be able to bring the ball up the court. Guard play would be a disaster when Dellavadova is your best player.

Bird, MJ, maybe Kobe give them similar chances as they had with Bron. Sure they'd get doubled more and fouled more as well. But the outcome of the game wouldn't change much.

[QUOTE=3ball]Lebron shot 39%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

His totals equaled MJ's, except he shot 12 percentage points worse!!!!!!!!!.. He also employed a playground, stat-padding style, while MJ achieved his stats within winning, team concept.

Why ignore this?

Again, do you think it's impossible to shoot better than 39%?... Do you think the Cavs still lose if Lebron shoots 45 or 50%?.. The way you guys defend Lebron's 2015 Finals, it's like you think these things.
.[/QUOTE]

Team concept goes out the window when you lose 2 out of your top 3 players on an already top heavy team. Why are you cherry picking evidence?

[QUOTE=FKAri]

Bird, MJ, maybe Kobe give them similar chances as they had with Bron. Sure they'd get doubled more and fouled more as well. [B]But the outcome of the game wouldn't change much.[/B]

[/QUOTE]
[I]Do you think the Cavs still lose if Lebron shoots 45%+, or are you saying MJ couldn't have shot 45%?[/I]
.