Serious question, guys.
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Serious question, guys.
No, even though Oden hasn't played a game, and you have no idea how good he'll be, I wouldn't trade young for old.
[QUOTE=El Kabong]No, even though Oden hasn't played a game, and you have no idea how good he'll be, I wouldn't trade young for old.[/QUOTE]Okay. So we have our first risk taker.
No, more chances to win with Oden then Duncan. Plus you never know how good Oden will become. Duncan gets dunked on all the time by players, lets see if this happens to Oden.
[QUOTE=RoseCity07]Duncan gets dunked on all the time by players, lets see if this happens to Oden.[/QUOTE]So what?
I don't think Oden is going to be schooling guys in almost every way imaginable on offense while still being a top notch defender. It is a well known fact that defenders get dunked on because they don't get out of the way.
[QUOTE=fatboy11]So what?
I don't think Oden is going to be schooling guys in almost every way imaginable on offense while still being a top notch defender. It is a well known fact that defenders get dunked on because they don't get out of the way.[/QUOTE]
You don't know that and I don't know that. He could be the next Bill Russell. Potential > Duncan and his old age. Duncan sucks on defense in my opinion. Oden did all he did leading his team to the finals with 1 hand...!!! Rebounding with one arm most of the season.
Oden is faster, can jump higher, and is strong as hell for his age. Oden a million times over Tim Duncan.
[QUOTE=RoseCity07]You don't know that and I don't know that. He could be the next Bill Russell. Potential > Duncan and his old age. Duncan sucks on defense in my opinion. Oden did all he did leading his team to the finals with 1 hand...!!! Rebounding with one arm most of the season.
Oden is faster, can jump higher, and is strong as hell for his age. Oden a million times over Tim Duncan.[/QUOTE]Are you serious?
Tim Duncan > Bill Russell on offense
Duncan sucks on defense? Check his credentials, kid.
Look, obviously, you are like 14 and just started watching basketball like 2 years ago, but your lack knowledge cannot be tolerated by me.
Yes, you are right about Oden's potential being worth more than Tim Duncan right now. Everything else you've said is dead wrong and just really, really stupid, though.
Err on the side of youth and err on the side of size.
Duncan is better, but he will no longer be in his prime by the time Portland is ready to win.
Go wit da kid
in a couple years when duncan is as old as mutombo and oden is dominating the league...:D
[QUOTE=fatboy11]Are you serious?
Tim Duncan > Bill Russell on offense
Duncan sucks on defense? Check his credentials, kid.
Look, obviously, you are like 14 and just started watching basketball like 2 years ago, but your lack knowledge cannot be tolerated by me.
Yes, you are right about Oden's potential being worth more than Tim Duncan right now. Everything else you've said is dead wrong and just really, really stupid, though.[/QUOTE]
I'm 20 in a month been watching NBA since 95. Duncan may be better on offense but Bill Russell has 11 championships. A good defensive center is more important. You don't know how good Oden will be come next year. He is going to go through NBA conditioning and have both hands good to go. Why would the Blazers want Time Duncan when they can have to great prospects playing side by side in Aldridge and Oden?
[QUOTE=Nashformvp]in a couple years when duncan is as old as mutombo and oden is dominating the league...:D[/QUOTE]In a couple of years, Duncan will still be an All-NBA player and Oden might not even have an All-Star berth under this belt......
What the hell? TD not a good defensive player??
I like Oden, and I'm positive he'll be a HOF center, but I'm 100% sure he would be dunked on by athletic guys. All the great centers were dunked on, its not a knock.
[QUOTE=RoseCity07]I'm 20 in a month been watching NBA since 95. Duncan may be better on offense but Bill Russell has 11 championships. A good defensive center is more important. You don't know how good Oden will be come next year. He is going to go through NBA conditioning and have both hands good to go. Why would the Blazers want Time Duncan when they can have to great prospects playing side by side in Aldridge and Oden?[/QUOTE]God damnit, kid. I'm not arguing against your choice of not wanting to trade Oden. But you're too stupid to see that.
Is Tim Duncan not a good defensive center? Name one center in the NBA who plays better defense than Tim Duncan. Name one center who is better offensively.
Bill Russell wouldn't have won 11 championships if played today, either. It hurts me to even have to explain this to someone.
Do you see know how what you are saying is just plain dumb?
[QUOTE=fatboy11]In a couple of years, Duncan will still be an All-NBA player and Oden might not even have an All-Star berth under this belt......[/QUOTE]
I know, that's what makes it so difficult. You're making the assumption based on youth and potential, but potential doesn't always work out the way you plan.
If I was GM of Spurs i would trade duncan. WHY? because the spurs dynasty will last how long? 2 - 3 more years? or 10 more years with oden. The youth makes Oden > duncan.
But hey you never know the way duncan is playing and the great shape he is in he might be one of them athlets that last into the age of 40s.
are you guys serious?
YES you do are you joking? it's TIM DUNCAN. you trade anything for Tim Duncan. you trade your franchise player, your car, your soul, and your favorite pair of kicks for Tim Duncan. in an instant, no thought required, you win.
that said I wouldn't trade Bron for Duncan. Bron's too young and too good. but what the fu.ck has Greg Oden done to warrant this proposal?
Who would you trade for Oden? There are a lot of top 10 or fringe top 10 players under 25. And you don't really know if Oden will be any better than Okafor right now, if even that (just saying, he's unproven in the league).
If I'm them, I'd think hard about the possibility of Wade/Bron/Melo for him. Not saying any of those teams would offer that, but hypothetically speaking. Melo and Bron atleast are only 23 years old (Bron will be soon after the season) and top 10 talents and made terrible franchises winning teams.
None of those trades would get done, but seriously I don't think about trading an unproven pick for great players that young. And really think about the Duncan move, but I'd have to make sure I have the right players around him.
[QUOTE]If I'm them, I'd think hard about the possibility of Wade/Bron/Melo for him. Not saying any of those teams would offer that, but hypothetically speaking. Melo and Bron atleast are only 23 years old (Bron will be soon after the season) and top 10 talents and made terrible franchises winning teams.[/QUOTE]Best you can hope for is Melo because Wade and LeBron won't be offered. No way in hell.
I don't know if I would trade Oden for Melo, but a frontline of Randolph/Melo/Aldridge would score some points.
Tim duncan is someone that will retire in the next 3 -4 years Oden is someone who will retire in 10 - 15 years
3 - 4 < 10 - 15 its about how long you want spurs to be a competitor in the NBA with a dominant big man.
Few GM's would risk #1 picks, especially ones who have Oden potential. Just like Cleveland would not have traded LBJ for Jobe in '03 or Duncan for Hakeem in '97... they would like to take the risk IMO.
[QUOTE=fatboy11]Best you can hope for is Melo because Wade and LeBron won't be offered. No way in hell.
I don't know if I would trade Oden for Melo, but a frontline of Randolph/Melo/Aldridge would score some points.[/QUOTE]
Trust me. None of them would be offered.
It was a hypothetical question for if you're on the Portland side.
Oden had better numbers than Shaq and Hakeem in college. That was with one hand.
Yao Ming plays better defense around the basket than Duncan. Ben Wallace is a better shot blocker than Duncan. Duncan is probably the best on offense for a center, but not defense.
did you see Lebron try to dunk on duncan. he not only got denied he also got a change of heart =)
[QUOTE=eeeeeebro]did you see Lebron try to dunk on duncan. he not only got denied he also got a change of heart =)[/QUOTE]
1. Lebron already has dunked on Duncan.
2. I saw Kobe dunk on Duncan the last time the Lakers player the Spurs, he did it twice.
3. Dwight Howard dunked on Tim Duncan for a game winner. Duncan got owned.
Duncan has weak D.
Yes I would trade for Duncan, because the Spurs get the pick and probably fillers, so u have a lot of players to trade and make offers to other teams. With the amount of talent the Spurs have, they can get good players to complement Oden in Pop's system. The Spurs get young, they could trade Ginobili and Elson when their value is high, for some up and coming swings and bigs, keep Parker and in 2-3 years the Spurs are contenders again. The other good teams like Dallas, Phoenix, Rockets slow down. Teams like Jazz, Sonics, Golden State, Denver become contenders but the Spurs also continue their winning ways and don't fall like the other contenders of the past.
Blazers also get to have some players that can make an impact now, possibly win a championship in the next 2-3 years. They could draw free agents to play alongside Tim Duncan, and if the Blazers have a line up of Jack, Roy, Aldridge, Randolph and Duncan, they become instant contenders, and the young guys get the playoff experience that will make them strong for the future, with Duncan taking Aldridge under his wing.
There's many possibilities.
This is insane. TD for Oden? Tim is in the top 3 players in the NBA. Why would you trade TD for an unproven prospect? I even have a feeling that Oden will be just another Andrew Bynum.
Oden is the future...
Right now Duncan is better but he will retire in a couple of years...
[QUOTE=J-Roc]Oden is the future...
Right now Duncan is better but he will retire in a couple of years...[/QUOTE]
TD will have 5 more solid season.
[QUOTE=jerky10]TD will have 5 more solid season.[/QUOTE]
And maybe 2-3 more after that where he can be a great 3rd option for a title team, still rebound well, and patrol the paint.
Imo an argument can be made for not trading someone for Greg Oden, but [B]not because [/B]Oden is unproven. I mean of course we don't know how good he really is as a nba player cause he hasn't played a game yet, but can't you see what he is going to be (not potentially, but what he is destined to be)? Using this unproven argument is like saying "it's not sensible to trade Clyde Drexler for a rookie Shaq because he hasn't played a game yet whereas Clyde is on top of his game" the year Shaq was drafted. Yes, he hasn't played a game but everyone with a brain could see what impact he could bring to the game the second he was put on the court; what he could become and what he [B]already[/B] was, same cases could be made for Duncan, Lebron and Greg Oden.
One might have a case for not trading someone for Oden, but this "unproven" theory only refects their inability to see great talents, even when the whole basketball world knows it is someone you only get once in 15 years.
yey first post!
trading an experienced and tested player for a new guy whose only promise is potential is totally idiotic. Plus Duncan is considered to be the best power forward the game has ever seen! no way the spurs will do this, or even cross their minds. Even when duncan will be 35 and averages 15 and 5.. :D
Quite frankly if I'm the SPURS I'd do it.
For stupid reasons, but I'd do it. First of all they're going to have 4 rings after this season. I'd be happy with that for the next few years, plus with Oden they'd atleast be a playoff team. Maybe, if Oden is for real then they compete again in 3-5 years. That way they can certainly add some time to their time of being a top franchise.
But again that's just me saying I'd be satisfied with the 4 rings the Spurs are about to have. Im sure there are more fans and organizations that wouldn't be. And that may also have something to do with the fact that I haven't backed a team that has won a ring since the Bulls.
Oden's unproven potential for Duncan's dominance?
:no:
If I were the Spurs I'd only accept that proposal if the package includes ZBo, Oden, huge expiring contract, and 2 future 1st rnd picks (lottery protected)
[QUOTE=jerky10]Oden's unproven potential for Duncan's dominance?
:no:
If I were the Spurs I'd only accept that proposal if the package includes ZBo, Oden, huge expiring contract, and 2 future 1st rnd picks (lottery protected)[/QUOTE]
Is that a joke? I'm certain the Blazers wouldn't take Duncan for their first round pick this year, let alone the rest of what you wrote. No Zach, no picks for SA, if we decided to let SA get Oden. They don't have the value that Blazers have with Oden. Now go rob a bank with a knife.
[QUOTE=RoseCity07]Is that a joke? I'm certain the Blazers wouldn't take Duncan for their first round pick this year, let alone the rest of what you wrote. No Zach, no picks for SA, if we decided to let SA get Oden. They don't have the value that Blazers have with Oden. Now go rob a bank with a knife.[/QUOTE]
Read the thread title. It asked "Would you trade Greg Oden for Tim Duncan?"
Just answer the question by yourself instead of arguing with my point.
[B]Yes[/B] I know what I am getting with Duncan. He hasnt had major injuries and stays consistent. If he plays 4 or more years I'd do it!:cheers:
[QUOTE]Tim duncan is someone that will retire in the next 3 -4 years Oden is someone who will retire in 10 - 15 years
3 - 4 < 10 - 15 its about how long you want spurs to be a competitor in the NBA with a dominant big man.[/QUOTE]
Magic's 3-4 years with Shaq >>> The 10 years since.
Miami's 3-4 years with Shaq>>> The rest of their history.
It would be a tough trade to make but Duncan is the one guy in the NBA that gives you a legit shot at a title. I think that makes you do the deal. You never know what will happen in the future so take the now while you can.
I mean there have been much better prospects than Oden that have failed miserably or not won their team a title. Guys like Ewing, Bias and Coleman all come to mind. Hell Mutombo never won his team a title and if Oden is that good in 4 years time then Portland should be very happy.
Oden is an excellent prospect. Duncan is a great player.
If I'm the Spurs...yes, in a heartbeat.
If I'm Portland...no way.
Understand, folks, that Oden is a franchise player for the next 12 years or more (yes, even though he hasn't played a game, it easy enuf to tell he will become dominant). Duncan is an all-star for another, what, 2 years? maybe 3?
[QUOTE=WoGiTaLiA1]I mean there have been much better prospects than Oden that have failed miserably or not won their team a title. Guys like Ewing, Bias and Coleman all come to mind. .[/QUOTE]
Are you sure about that?
You can say "there have been much better prospects than Oden" then give some names like Hakeem, Shaq, D-Rob (hell even those guys are not [B]much[/B] better prospects imo); but please don't list names like Coleman, and Bias? He wasn't a 7 foot center and he died before entering the nba, Ewing has a case, but he wasn't a better prospect than Oden.
[QUOTE=WoGiTaLiA1]Hell Mutombo never won his team a title and if Oden is that good in 4 years time then Portland should be very happy.[/QUOTE]
imo Oden will be at least as good as prime Mutombo in 2 years and better thereafter.
[QUOTE]Are you sure about that?
You can say "there have been much better prospects than Oden" then give some names like Hakeem, Shaq, D-Rob (hell even those guys are not much better prospects imo); but please don't list names like Coleman, and Bias? He wasn't a 7 foot center and he died before entering the nba, Ewing has a case, but he wasn't a better prospect than Oden.[/QUOTE]
Oden is being overhyped. He is a top prospect but what has he got over someone like Okafor other than age? Okafor was better on offense and defense in college. Don't get me wrong, Oden is a better prospect but it's not that big a margin. Ewing was easily a better prospect, Ewing may be the most hyped player other than LeBron ever. Coleman was at least as good a prospect as Oden. Coleman is one of the best offensive players ever as a prospect. He didnt have the hype of Oden, but as a prospect he was better.
[QUOTE]imo Oden will be at least as good as prime Mutombo in 2 years and better thereafter.[/QUOTE]
That's a massive call there. Mutombo in his prime was a far better defender than Oden is right now. He was also much better offensively. Oden should be great but he wont be that good in 2 years. Prime Mutombo would be the best center in the league right now. I still think that Mutombo is the best comparison right now. Oden has a lot of work to do offensively, with the way that Stern is hunting defense and trying to eliminate it you have to be careful building around a guy who right now isnt going to be a good player offensively. I mean offensively Oden is worse than guys like Okafor, Kaman and Bogut were and none of them are doing very well offensively in the league.
Tim Duncan and LeBron are the two players I would trade Oden for. I wouldn't need to think about it. LeBron is the manufactured marketing toy, he is cash and he can play a bit. Duncan is the best player in the league by a vast distance and is going to give his team a shot at the title for another 3 or so years you have to believe.
Oden needs to improve a long way if he is going to be that guy. Guys like Mourning, Robinson, Ewing, Daugherty, Coleman and Mutombo who were better players coming out of college couldn't get their teams titles. Admittably the league has fallen a long way since those guys were around and a couple failed for reasons other than a lack of talent, but has the league fallen enough that Oden is going to give you a shot at the title? Especially when you cant even be certain he will be there in 5 years time?