[url]https://amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/593239/[/url]
This is just horrible. How is this even legal?
Printable View
[url]https://amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/593239/[/url]
This is just horrible. How is this even legal?
[QUOTE=egokiller][url]https://amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/593239/[/url]
This is just horrible. How is this even legal?[/QUOTE]
There is no solution that anyone will find acceptable.
Way I see is there are two choices... you either ignore the fact that we have a border and a country and you let everyone in no matter what... or... you start shooing illegals with the intent to kill as a means of deterring the behavior.
Because they aren’t going to stop. People only understand force.
I’d be interested in the exact numbers in terms of what a tipping point would be for us but if their country is dog shit and they aren’t willing to put forth the effort to turn it around, and they keep migrating here in massive numbers, our country will eventually be dog shit also except then there won’t be anywhere to go.
nobody is holding them there
they can always leave the country which they have entered illegaly
[QUOTE=Shogon]There is no solution that anyone will find acceptable.
Way I see is there are two choices... you either ignore the fact that we have a border and a country and you let everyone in no matter what... or... you start shooing illegals with the intent to kill as a means of deterring the behavior.
Because they aren
Just make it really hard for illegal immigrants to stay in the country through the law. Any business found to use them would be fined heavily, may get shut down and the person responsible for hiring might face jail time. Anyone housing them may get citizenship revoked and deported if they are naturalized or face jail time if they are natural born American. Children of illegals do not get citizenship unless one of the biological parent is American and even that can be revoked later if found untrue. Make it impossible or really expensive to get married to an illegal. Give incentive for legit tips about illegals. e t c.
At first I thought you were talking about actual concentration camps, like the ones in China
reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKCN1S925K
[QUOTE]tortured during interrogation at the camps, living in crowded cells and being subjected to a brutal daily regimen of party indoctrination that drove some people to suicide.[/QUOTE]
Anyway, the Mexican cartels approve of your article.
[QUOTE=Shogon]There is no solution that anyone will find acceptable.
Way I see is there are two choices... you either ignore the fact that we have a border and a country and you let everyone in no matter what... or... you start shooing illegals with the intent to kill as a means of deterring the behavior.
Because they aren
Question.
Why is it so hard to let them become citizens?
What they want is an opportunity, part of that is to become citizens so why not allow them?
I mean, the issue is them not having the proper documents am I right? the whole issue is that "they're here illegally, so they're criminals" well why not allow them to become citizens like they did ages ago. When Italians, Germans, Polish, English, Irish, etc came here they just well... came. They arrived in Ellis Island gave an oath, were tested for illnesses and that was basically it.
So if the issue is them coming over without documentation instead of incarcerating them why not process them instead?
Have them go become citizens while they're there. Make them earn their citizenship by having them work for their citizenship status while they're there.
Most of them don't have the resources to obtain proper documentation, nor do they have the finances to do so. Instead of treating them like criminals and animals (criminals at least have more rights) make use of them. Have them work for their citizenship. There's a number of jobs that they can do while in the camps that can be beneficial for the US. Once their debt is paid, they'll receive their worker's permit, citizenship, or whatever documentation card they need to work and pay their taxes.
It aint that hard if racist goggles are removed.
To be honest they have no right to complain about living conditions. It
[QUOTE=bladefd]>>>let everyone in
or
>>>kill them all Rambo-style
Talk about 2 extremes[/QUOTE]
Ok, so suggest an alternative that doesn't entail indefinite detention or repeated catch and release with pinky promises from them not to do it again.
And then once you do that and fail to offer a solution, realize that I'm right.
Then, realize that you're stupid.
You're stupid.
Stupid.
[QUOTE=warriorfan]To be honest they have no right to complain about living conditions. It’s better than the alternative of one to the dome. They knew the rules, they knew what was at stake and they lost. Sorry. Not about to use our taxpayer money to put up all these refugees in a 5 star hotel. Send them back or kill them ASAP. Don’t have the time and money for this nonsense.[/QUOTE]
:applause:
Except they're almost never refugees. They're almost always just people wanting a better life and not willing to come here the legal way.
Refugees are people that are displaced by war and would probably rather be at home but can't go back home because they will be killed by the government or get caught in the cross fire of a war zone. The vast majority of these people just want to come here because they don't want to put the effort in or lack the understanding of how to do it at home. They're not refugees.
Don't go into the "containment camp" :confusedshrug:
[QUOTE=Shogon]:applause:
Except they're almost never refugees. They're almost always just people wanting a better life and not willing to come here the legal way.
Refugees are people that are displaced by war and would probably rather be at home but can't go back home because they will be killed by the government or get caught in the cross fire of a war zone. The vast majority of these people just want to come here because they don't want to put the effort in or lack the understanding of how to do it at home. They're not refugees.[/QUOTE]
Agreed. I misused the word and there is an important distinction from immigrants and refugees.
[QUOTE=Trollsmasher]nobody is holding them there
they can always leave the country which they have entered illegaly[/QUOTE]
A lot of the detainees who have experienced exceptionally poor conditions are actually children who have been separated from their parents. They can't simply decide to leave the country. There have been reported instances where pre-teens and young teenagers, brought over by their parents, have had to take care of babies that were separated from other parents at the border and placed in detention.
Especially shocking is that children detained by the US government have no right to court-appointed representation in immigration proceedings, so we've actually seen children and toddlers as young as 3 [URL="https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/defendants-diapers-immigrant-toddlers-appear-court-alone-n887356"]appear in court alone[/URL] to advocate for themselves.
[QUOTE]Jack H. Weil, a longtime immigration judge who is responsible for training other judges, made the assertion in sworn testimony in a deposition in federal court in Seattle. His comments highlighted the plight of thousands of juveniles who are forced to defend themselves each year in immigration court amid a surge of children from Central America who cross the southwestern U.S. border.
“I’ve taught immigration law literally to 3-year-olds and 4-year-olds,” Weil said. “It takes a lot of time. It takes a lot of patience. They get it. It’s not the most efficient, but it can be done.”
He repeated his claim twice in the deposition, also saying, “I’ve told you I have trained 3-year-olds and 4-year-olds in immigration law,” according to a transcript. “You can do a fair hearing. It’s going to take you a lot of time.”
Legal and child-psychology experts ridiculed Weil’s assertions, noting that key milestones for 3- and 4-year-olds include cooperating with other children, saying simple sentences and building towers of blocks.
“I nearly fell off my chair when I read that deposition,” said Laurence Steinberg, a psychology professor at Temple University who is a witness for the plaintiffs in the Seattle case. “Three- and 4-year-olds do not yet have logical reasoning abilities. It’s preposterous, frankly, to think they could be taught enough about immigration law to be able to represent themselves in court.”[/QUOTE]
This is not a new thing. This happened under the Obama and Bush administrations as well... but not in the volume that we are seeing now.
[QUOTE=iamgine]Any business found to use them would be fined heavily, may get shut down and the person responsible for hiring might face jail time. [/QUOTE]
I don't think the current occupant of the White House would sign a bill like that for pretty obvious reasons. :confusedshrug:
[QUOTE=iamgine]Just make it really hard for illegal immigrants to stay in the country through the law. Any business found to use them would be fined heavily, may get shut down and the person responsible for hiring might face jail time. Anyone housing them may get citizenship revoked and deported if they are naturalized or face jail time if they are natural born American. Children of illegals do not get citizenship unless one of the biological parent is American and even that can be revoked later if found untrue. Make it impossible or really expensive to get married to an illegal. Give incentive for legit tips about illegals. e t c.[/QUOTE]
[B]Why should it be '[I][U]impossible[/U][/I]' for them to become documented? [/B]
But to another of your points.... this entire immigration argument is a sham, always has been, always will. It's a political tool (wedge issue) meant to raise money and separate voters.
The same people that are championing deportation are the same ones hiring them under the table.
FACT is we NEED undocumented workers.
They pump more into the economy than some racists twats here realize. They contribute BILLIONS into the economy at a minimum aside from other contributions they make such as job creation (many communities are self sustained so they create their own opportunities).
But f*ck it, let's throw away all rational discussions out the window and go with good ol racist myths used to brainwash and manipulate voters.
[QUOTE=andgar923]
[B]FACT is we NEED undocumented workers.
[/B]They pump more into the economy than some racists twats here realize. They contribute BILLIONS into the economy at a minimum aside from other contributions they make such as job creation (many communities are self sustained so they create their own opportunities).
But f*ck it, let's throw away all rational discussions out the window and go with good ol racist myths used to brainwash and manipulate voters.[/QUOTE]
Fact Check: NOPE
[url]https://www.irli.org/single-post/2017/09/27/New-FAIR-Study-Illegal-Immigration-Costs-116-billion-Annually[/url]
Illegal immigration costs $116 billion annually
[QUOTE]At the state and local level, education ($44.4 billion) was by far the largest expense, followed by general public services ($18.5 billion) and medical ($12.1 billion).[/QUOTE]
English as a second language significantly impacts our government schools in CA.
[url]https://youtu.be/kJ51KsITM_E?t=160[/url]
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_fKcQlkmZI[/url]
In the Democrat debates, the candidates speak lots of Spanish, followed by
[QUOTE=Cleverness]Fact Check: NOPE
[url]https://www.irli.org/single-post/2017/09/27/New-FAIR-Study-Illegal-Immigration-Costs-116-billion-Annually[/url]
Illegal immigration costs $116 billion annually
English as a second language significantly impacts our government schools in CA.
[url]https://youtu.be/kJ51KsITM_E?t=160[/url]
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_fKcQlkmZI[/url]
In the Democrat debates, the candidates speak lots of Spanish, followed by
[QUOTE=andgar923]LOLLLLLLL
Ben Shapiro :oldlol:
Dailycaller :roll:
F*ck outta here with your racist posts.[/QUOTE]
You just ignored the costs and called my posts racist. Try thinking about the costs of illegal immigration... it's not actually racist to do that.
So which part of my post was racist? Fact checking your false claim?
[IMG]https://i.postimg.cc/8Chpc8gT/trump-immigration-2.jpg[/IMG]
Do you find that quote racist?
[QUOTE=Cleverness]You just ignored the costs and called my posts racist. Try thinking about the costs of illegal immigration... it's not actually racist to do that.
So which part of my post was racist? Fact checking your false claim?
[IMG]https://i.postimg.cc/8Chpc8gT/trump-immigration-2.jpg[/IMG]
Do you find that quote racist?[/QUOTE]
Because it comes from a racist site using fake stats that have been debunked in order to push an agenda.
Try doing some REAL research and using non biased sources next time.
[QUOTE=andgar923][B]Why should it be '[I][U]impossible[/U][/I]' for them to become documented? [/B]
But to another of your points.... this entire immigration argument is a sham, always has been, always will. It's a political tool (wedge issue) meant to raise money and separate voters.
The same people that are championing deportation are the same ones hiring them under the table.
FACT is we NEED undocumented workers.
They pump more into the economy than some racists twats here realize. They contribute BILLIONS into the economy at a minimum aside from other contributions they make such as job creation (many communities are self sustained so they create their own opportunities).
But f*ck it, let's throw away all rational discussions out the window and go with good ol racist myths used to brainwash and manipulate voters.[/QUOTE]
what does illegal immigrants having some positives have to do with anything? I mean, I'd love to have someone trim my garden for cheap. I'd be glad to hire people for $1 under the table. That doesn't mean I agree with it in the macro sense. Are there really people who are unable separating this?
And no, we don't "need" illegal immigrants. :facepalm
[QUOTE=andgar923]Because it comes from a racist site using fake stats that have been debunked in order to push an agenda.
Try doing some REAL research and using non biased sources next time.[/QUOTE]
Let's not be too harsh... let's help him think this through.
[B]Cleverness,[/B] are there any ways in which undocumented immigrants benefit the US economy? If so, please state them.
[QUOTE=andgar923]Question.
Why is it so hard to let them become citizens?
What they want is an opportunity, part of that is to become citizens so why not allow them?
I mean, the issue is them not having the proper documents am I right? the whole issue is that "they're here illegally, so they're criminals" well why not allow them to become citizens like they did ages ago. When Italians, Germans, Polish, English, Irish, etc came here they just well... came. They arrived in Ellis Island gave an oath, were tested for illnesses and that was basically it.
So if the issue is them coming over without documentation instead of incarcerating them why not process them instead?
Have them go become citizens while they're there. Make them earn their citizenship by having them work for their citizenship status while they're there.
Most of them don't have the resources to obtain proper documentation, nor do they have the finances to do so. Instead of treating them like criminals and animals (criminals at least have more rights) make use of them. Have them work for their citizenship. There's a number of jobs that they can do while in the camps that can be beneficial for the US. Once their debt is paid, they'll receive their worker's permit, citizenship, or whatever documentation card they need to work and pay their taxes.
It aint that hard if racist goggles are removed.[/QUOTE]
why should literally anyone ever be given citizenship of any country?:biggums:
why should any sane peoples dillute their own political power by cheaply giving it out like a candy?
being for giving out citizenship is the perfect example of voting against your own interests - you are literally making yourself less powerful with each one you give out
if a guest worker's usefulness is predicated on his entitlement to eventual citizenship, then his presence is clearly not desirable
Classical Athens had it right - [url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metic[/url]
[QUOTE=andgar923][B]Why should it be '[I][U]impossible[/U][/I]' for them to become documented? [/B]
But to another of your points.... this entire immigration argument is a sham, always has been, always will. It's a political tool (wedge issue) meant to raise money and separate voters.
The same people that are championing deportation are the same ones hiring them under the table.
FACT is we NEED undocumented workers.
They pump more into the economy than some racists twats here realize. They contribute BILLIONS into the economy at a minimum aside from other contributions they make such as job creation (many communities are self sustained so they create their own opportunities).
But f*ck it, let's throw away all rational discussions out the window and go with good ol racist myths used to brainwash and manipulate voters.[/QUOTE]
How did you get into Canada?
How does Canada get by without millions of undocumented workers?
Does Canada value culture of its country when testing immigrants to become citizens?
Would Canada just allow people to become citizens like you are promoting? If not, why are you living in a racist country?
[QUOTE=Hawker]How did you get into Canada?
How does Canada get by without millions of undocumented workers?
Does Canada value culture of its country when testing immigrants to become citizens?
Would Canada just allow people to become citizens like you are promoting? If not, why are you living in a racist country?[/QUOTE]
Good question. Why does Canada not take in millions of illegal immigrants? Per the Left, it would provide a net positive on their economy and make their skin colors more diverse.
[QUOTE=MaxFly]Let's not be too harsh... let's help him think this through.
[B]Cleverness,[/B] are there any ways in which undocumented immigrants benefit the US economy? If so, please state them.[/QUOTE]
Let me make it easy for you:
The cons of illegal immigration outweigh the pros. Agree or disagree?
"FACT is we NEED undocumented workers."
I disagreed with this statement and backed it up with a logical study.
Do you agree or disagree with "the fact is we NEED undocumented workers?"
according to the Truman show, artificial salt (sea) water
[QUOTE=egokiller][url]https://amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/593239/[/url]
This is just horrible. How is this even legal?[/QUOTE]
Trump did it right ---- :bowdown: