Nikola Jokic only winning 1 NBA championship just like Giannis

If they lost in this series. I don't see them winning another NBA championship

Im not sure, Lou.

The Nuggets are have a pretty young team still. Everyone but KCP are 28 or younger.

They could still win another NBA champions chip after a down year, like the 2022 Golden State Warriors.

The Nuggets are having a very bad series but I dont think losing this year closes their window.

Nikola Jokic with healthy uric acid and Rajons Rondo on the 2008 Celtic. How many champions?

2 finals appearances with 3 MVP's is really not a good look for the award.

[QUOTE=FultzNationRISE;14907801]Im not sure, Lou.

The Nuggets are have a pretty young team still. Everyone but KCP are 28 or younger.

They could still win another NBA champions chip after a down year, like the 2022 Golden State Warriors.

The Nuggets are having a very bad series but I dont think losing this year closes their window.[/QUOTE]

Jokic just turned 29 but your point holds otherwise, there's no reason yet to think they're a one hit wonder. If anything we may be getting to a point where there's a new champion every year or you see less back to backs. We haven't had a repeat champ since 2018. There's also nothing to say they couldn't come back this series but it does appear to be a bad matchup for them.

It's very difficult to win rings - good health, peaking at the right time, calls going your way, luck, etc - regardless of stellar individual play. That's why it's hard to crack the top 10 - no matter what the gaudy stats and accompanying (fan) gushing occurs - you've got to have the individual numbers (dominance), win rings and do it for a long time. Jokic is young - he'll have many more chances if he WANTS to continue playing.

And I wouldn't say a 0-2 hole is totally insurmountable but home games? :-( Each game is separate.

Depends on if Jokic even cares to play more, he might just retire.

I've always felt this Nuggets team was overrated. Murray has had some great runs, but he is a flawed star with bad handles. He's not even at a Tony Parker level imo.

If we compare Jokic to Duncan, then Duncan had Manu, Parker and a ton of defensive help his entire career. He also always had another 7 footer to help take the heat off.

Denver are poorly constructed.

Jokic should leave.

[QUOTE=90sgoat;14907864]Depends on if Jokic even cares to play more, he might just retire.

I've always felt this Nuggets team was overrated. Murray has had some great runs, but he is a flawed star with bad handles. He's not even at a Tony Parker level imo.

If we compare Jokic to Duncan, then Duncan had Manu, Parker and a ton of defensive help his entire career. He also always had another 7 footer to help take the heat off.

Denver are poorly constructed.

Jokic should leave.[/QUOTE]

Spurs always played a really bad big however. Nuggets 5th guy is kcp someone who’ll never be a liability out there

[QUOTE=NBAGOAT;14907868][B]Spurs always played a really bad big however.[/B] Nuggets 5th guy is kcp someone who’ll never be a liability out there[/QUOTE]

D-Rob and LMA were pretty good, but I get your point.

Rasho, Nazr, Splitter, Dedmon etc were not great, but they were big and strong and they played defense, which allowed Duncan to rest.

Other than that, Spurs just constructed their rosters better. Manu and Parker were just on a different level to MPJ and Murray. I mean, Manu to MPJ? It's a no comparison. Parker and Murray are about same level, but Parker is a much better ball handler.

Jokic didn’t sell enough jerseys, but did generate billions in pre-season bets for Denver to win it all …. so they fixing the WCSF against him and that’s that :roll:

Last night were the Worst officiated games we’ve seen in the playoffs since Kings vs Lakers. Far far far worse than letting Bogut set 30 illegal screens per game.

[QUOTE=90sgoat;14907864]Denver are poorly constructed.[/QUOTE]
I don’t think they’re poorly constructed, but their current opponent was built to stifle exactly what they do. Tim Connelly built both teams, off two sides of the same coin.

Add to that mix, all-time bad officiating allowing full license to foul, and we have a recipe for frustrating disaster.

Thank you for your contribution.

Who knows. And coming back from down two games to win a series isn’t rare enough to even be surprised if it happens but one thing is pretty clear. He certainly isn’t unbeatable. It feels like an obvious thing to say, but you go read a lot of topics over the last year, people are legitimately looking at his skill set and style of play talking about how there’s nothing to be done and he can’t be beat. Like his skill level is too much to contend with.

I just always thought it was odd because we already spent years watching him be beat and like everyone else he was sure to be beat for most of his career. Everybody is gonna mostly get beaten. Everyone. If you aren’t Bill Russell and sculpted from a block of pure victory you’re gonna lose waaaaaaaay more than you win.

He’s unquestionably an all time great. But he isn’t so perfect approach wise he’s sure to win. He might have a Duncan career. He might have a Moses Malone. He’s great. Greater than usual great. But he’s gonna get beat like…almost all the time.

If he wins 4 he’s gonna not win 12-15 times.

Hes not some unbeatable god spilling victory from his pores. And I could show you quite a few people acting like he was. Overreaction is normal of course so we don’t need to go all into who said what.

Thats sports. But it’s realistic to expect him to lose an awful lot.

[QUOTE=NBAGOAT;14907868]Spurs always played a really bad big however. Nuggets 5th guy is kcp someone who’ll never be a liability out there[/QUOTE]

Denver literally has 0 bigs outside jokic.

Plus that's not even true. Duncan started his whole career playing with David Robinson who especially in 1999 when they first won was like top 5 in advanced metrics in the whole NBA.

Jokic has been overrated because he’s white.

He had a good run last year. That’s it.

[QUOTE=Norcaliblunt;14907922]Jokic has been overrated because he’s white.

He had a good run last year. That’s it.[/QUOTE]

Not even close.

Nuggets have been overrated because they found a way to win in a very soft league using big brain Jokic.

Nuggets are not as good a team this year so even if rules were the same, they'd still struggle.

Where does KAT, Gobert or Embiid go with this Nuggs team?

[QUOTE=Norcaliblunt;14907922]Jokic has been overrated because he’s white.

He had a good run last year. That’s it.[/QUOTE]

He won MVP the two years before last year, but had no chance in the playoffs because they were riddled with key injuries.

He was also smashing all sorts of records and being shown on graphics that said “Only Wilt has done this” constantly. And this includes myriad playoff performances, not just regular season.

Going strictly by the evidence, THESE threads from the last couple days are the overreaction threads. Two games and suddenly his status has changed? It’s very prisoner of the moment.

Also, you in particular, Norcaliblunt, have no intelligence whatsoever and should never speak. About anything.

That said… somethin is definitely up with the Joker. He was passive and somewhat casual for large stretches of the LAL series too. Theres no reason they should have trailed every game. He really hasnt come out assertive, he picks it up later on but they still needed two game winners that involve a lot of luck.

Obviously Minny is better than Los Angeles and give them credit, but he’s making unforced errors and missing shots he usually doesnt. This is not “Joker at his best, but he just cant do anything with Minny.” Weve seen him drop 47 on Toody.

Something is up with him, and the people who cant see it and think this two game sample size is suddenly “the real reality” as opposed to the last four years are shall we say… lacking the gift of perspective.

There are always overreactions in both directions.

Prisoners of the moment, with poor memories and poor predictive intelligence for the future, will always be victims of laughable recency bias.

Jokic may very well be the best passing big ever.
But his weaknesses are physical.
He was never the type to simply physically dominate a man his own size or a taller longer defender. Or never the type to physically dominate the paint defensively.

His dominance was like a chess player, with his rotation players being the many pieces, and his ability to read the game at a PG’s level, gave him a huge advantage when those pieces were healthy, and when the opposition wasn’t much bigger and much longer than his squad.

Yes, Minny do play him well in that they are quick to double him aggressively in the post and they do it with another big or lanky wing and he seems to struggle making good passes from that.

[QUOTE=90sgoat;14907927]Not even close.

Nuggets have been overrated because they found a way to win in a very soft league using big brain Jokic.

Nuggets are not as good a team this year so even if rules were the same, they'd still struggle.[/QUOTE]Rules changed big time, right at the time that injuries started to hit them.

But that doesn’t excuse the ridiculous officiatihg in BOTH games LAST NIGHT. Knicks and Minny got a huge boost from a painfully obvious lopsided whistle (or in minny’s case, a lack of whistle). The entire worldwide fanbase is now questioning the validity and integrity of the league.

There is a huge lack of consistency, clarity, and trust. Silver has a big problem on his hands, ALREADY.

[QUOTE=BarberSchool;14908023]Rules changed big time, right at the time that injuries started to hit them.

But that doesn’t excuse the ridiculous officiatihg in BOTH games LAST NIGHT. Knicks and Minny got a huge boost from a painfully obvious lopsided whistle (or in minny’s case, a lack of whistle). The entire worldwide fanbase is now questioning the validity and integrity of the league.

There is a huge lack of consistency, clarity, and trust. Silver has a big problem on his hands, ALREADY.[/QUOTE]The Pacers game seemed pretty well-officiated outside of the last few seconds. I mean, that's a big deal, but what you're generally suggesting is taking a lot of credit away from the Knicks.

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855;14907901]Who knows. And coming back from down two games to win a series isn’t rare enough to even be surprised if it happens but one thing is pretty clear. He certainly isn’t unbeatable. It feels like an obvious thing to say, but you go read a lot of topics over the last year, people are legitimately looking at his skill set and style of play talking about how there’s nothing to be done and he can’t be beat. Like his skill level is too much to contend with.

I just always thought it was odd because we already spent years watching him be beat and like everyone else he was sure to be beat for most of his career. Everybody is gonna mostly get beaten. Everyone. If you aren’t Bill Russell and sculpted from a block of pure victory you’re gonna lose waaaaaaaay more than you win.

He’s unquestionably an all time great. But he isn’t so perfect approach wise he’s sure to win. He might have a Duncan career. He might have a Moses Malone. He’s great. Greater than usual great. But he’s gonna get beat like…almost all the time.

If he wins 4 he’s gonna not win 12-15 times.

Hes not some unbeatable god spilling victory from his pores. And I could show you quite a few people acting like he was. Overreaction is normal of course so we don’t need to go all into who said what.

Thats sports. But it’s realistic to expect him to lose an awful lot.[/QUOTE]

i like bill russell the player

i like him even more as a person

that is all

[QUOTE=j3lademaster;14908041]The Pacers game seemed pretty well-officiated outside of the last few seconds. I mean, that's a big deal, but what you're generally suggesting is taking a lot of credit away from the Knicks.[/QUOTE]But we all gotta admit, Refs got so many things wrong in the last minutes of Knicks/Pacers, and all they were wrong about went in the Knicks favor.

[QUOTE=90sgoat;14907870]D-Rob and LMA were pretty good, but I get your point.

Rasho, Nazr, Splitter, Dedmon etc were not great, but they were big and strong and they played defense, which allowed Duncan to rest.

Other than that, Spurs just constructed their rosters better. Manu and Parker were just on a different level to MPJ and Murray. I mean, Manu to MPJ? It's a no comparison. Parker and Murray are about same level, but Parker is a much better ball handler.[/QUOTE]

Oh I agree spurs are better. However don’t forgot spurs also didn’t have a 4th guy like Gordon who was in the all star convo last year and still really good this year. It’s not manu vs mpj. It’s manu and old Michael Finley vs mpj and Gordon. More worth discussing.

There are 2 teams better 1-5 than denver in wolves and Celtics. However neither team has a mvp candidate so it’s not a good look on paper to lose to one of those teams when you have a good team around you yourself(yes ik ant might become top 5 with this playoff run but we’ll see). If lebron, curry, kd did that they get a lot of criticism. They get criticism whenever they lose with a good team even if other team has a superstar too. Duncan and spurs were stacked but also battling a mvp guy in nash and his own big 3 with Marion/stat

[QUOTE=tpols;14907910]Denver literally has 0 bigs outside jokic.

Plus that's not even true. Duncan started his whole career playing with David Robinson who especially in 1999 when they first won was like top 5 in advanced metrics in the whole NBA.[/QUOTE]

I meant on the team with prime Duncan/manu/Parker since that’s op brought up. Drob is a great robin but that spurs was also all role players outside those 2. Denver is paying 4 guys big salaries to be impactful.

[QUOTE=BarberSchool;14907887]Jokic didn’t sell enough jerseys, but did generate billions in pre-season bets for Denver to win it all …. so they fixing the WCSF against him and that’s that :roll:

Last night were the Worst officiated games we’ve seen in the playoffs since Kings vs Lakers. Far far far worse than letting Bogut set 30 illegal screens per game.[/QUOTE]

Malone literally screaming into the face of a ref and Murray throwing shit onto the court. Rigged though! :facepalm

[QUOTE=BarberSchool;14907887]Jokic didn’t sell enough jerseys, but did generate billions in pre-season bets for Denver to win it all …. so they fixing the WCSF against him and that’s that :roll:

Last night were the Worst officiated games we’ve seen in the playoffs since Kings vs Lakers. Far far far worse than letting Bogut set 30 illegal screens per game.[/QUOTE]

Drapemond sets the same illegal screens to this day. And nah, the officiating wasn’t bad at all last night or one sided. They swallowed the whistle on both. Jokic is constantly hacking people with his elbows to free up space and it’s never called. Porter Jr travels literally all the time

[QUOTE=SATAN;14908091]Malone literally screaming into the face of a ref and Murray throwing shit onto the court. Rigged though! :facepalm[/QUOTE]
Barberdrool with another braindead take :lol