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They try to include it in the "5 rangz" chant, but it's super embarrassing. Kobe was basically a slightly worse version of prime Pippen in 2000, while Shaq ended up HARD carrying Kobe in the finals. Even if the Kobe stans want to claim "he was injured", then that just means Shaq's carry job is even more impressive. Kobe still shot 25 shots per game in games 4-6 on 35/28 splits :oldlol:.
2011
Kobe was injured but still clutch in that series.
[QUOTE=ImKobe;15018543]Kobe was injured but still clutch in that series.[/QUOTE]
If he was injured why did he take 25 shots a game? lmao
Show your playmaking skills Kobe!
He still did far better than Lebron did in 2011.
:lebroncry:
[QUOTE=Full Court;15018550]He still did far better than Lebron did in 2011.
:lebroncry:[/QUOTE]
The funny thing is he didn't, 2011 Lebron was slightly better. 2011 Lebron was also slighly better than 2004 Kobe in the finals.
Either way, the 2000 finals is embarrassing for Kobe stans because they force themselves to "defend" Kobe's terrible play because they want to act like that 2000 ring is meaningful :lol
Just imagine Lebron or MJ trying to count a ring playing as bad as Kobe did. Shit is embarrassing.
[QUOTE=ImKobe;15018543]Kobe was injured but still clutch in that series.[/QUOTE]
Kobe did miss time, but that doesn't help your argument.
Kobe still shot chucked like a maniac games 4-6. Kobe wasn't good in game 1 nor was he good in the 8 minutes he played in game 2. Ironically the ONLY truly elite game Kobe had in the 2000 finals was game 4, after his "injury".
Shaq legit won game 2 alone which is insane.
If you want to hate on Kobe you need to find a different point of attack, if you try to go worst series route you will get raised 2011 and blown the f.uck out every time.
[QUOTE=warriorfan;15018592]If you want to hate on Kobe you need to find a different point of attack, if you try to go worst series route you will get raised 2011 and blown the f.uck out every time.[/QUOTE]
Suck My dick you f*ckng fruit cake.
[QUOTE=warriorfan;15018592]If you want to hate on Kobe you need to find a different point of attack, if you try to go worst series route you will get raised 2011 and blown the f.uck out every time.[/QUOTE]
Lebron in the 2011 finals was better than Kobe in the 2000 finals. That's what makes 2000 so embarrassing for Kobe. His teammate (peak Shaq) was literally so good/off the charts in the 2000 finals that he still won with Kobe stinking up the joint. Lebron and MJ would never win a finals like that :lol.
2011 Lebron: 17.8/7.2/6.8, 54.1 TS%, 1.5 BPM, 13.7 gamescore.
2000 Kobe: 15.6/4.6/4.2, 41.1 TS%, -.8 BPM, 9.7 gamescore. :roll:
Lebron was better in every category.
[QUOTE=StrongLurk;15018609]Lebron in the 2011 finals was better than Kobe in the 2000 finals. That's what makes 2000 so embarrassing for Kobe. His teammate (peak Shaq) was literally so good/off the charts in the 2000 finals that he still won with Kobe stinking up the joint. Lebron and MJ would never win a finals like that :lol.
2011 Lebron: 17.8/7.2/6.8, 54.1 TS%, 1.5 BPM, 13.7 gamescore.
2000 Kobe: 15.6/4.6/4.2, [B]41.1 TS%[/B], -.8 BPM, 9.7 gamescore. :roll:
Lebron was better in every category.[/QUOTE]
I'm not even sure how it's possible to shoot this bad jesus
This only makes sense if one ignored proper context.
Given their roles and expectations, LeBron had a worse series and choke. Kobe was a second option and playing with an injury to boot. I also mentioned in another thread that Kobe had a masterful Game 4 when Shaq fouled out, willing the Lakers in the 4th quarter and overtime (2011 LeBron was nowhere to be found in 4th quarters).
Above all else though, the Lakers won :lol If anything, Kobe fans "worst nightmare" is the 2004 finals.
[QUOTE=StrongLurk;15018576][B][SIZE=5]The funny thing is he didn't, 2011 Lebron was slightly better.[/SIZE][/B] 2011 Lebron was also slighly better than 2004 Kobe in the finals.
Either way, the 2000 finals is embarrassing for Kobe stans because they force themselves to "defend" Kobe's terrible play because they want to act like that 2000 ring is meaningful :lol
Just imagine Lebron or MJ trying to count a ring playing as bad as Kobe did. Shit is embarrassing.[/QUOTE]
LOL No he wasn't. Not even close. Ridiculous statements like that are what make Bronie fluffers get ridiculed. 2011 was the worst choke job of all time, and probably the most embarrassing performance for a star ever. Not even Chokemaster Harden ever had a more embarrassing finals performance.
[QUOTE=StrongLurk;15018609]Lebron in the 2011 finals was better than Kobe in the 2000 finals. That's what makes 2000 so embarrassing for Kobe. His teammate (peak Shaq) was literally so good/off the charts in the 2000 finals that he still won with Kobe stinking up the joint. Lebron and MJ would never win a finals like that :lol.
2011 Lebron: 17.8/7.2/6.8, 54.1 TS%, 1.5 BPM, 13.7 gamescore.
2000 Kobe: 15.6/4.6/4.2, 41.1 TS%, -.8 BPM, 9.7 gamescore. :roll:
Lebron was better in every category.[/QUOTE]
I don’t know man. Lost with Wade and Bosh. Got embarrassed and got beat by girls. Can never recover from that. The big bad wolfs lost to girls.
As good as he was, he was irrelevant in 2000-02. Shaq was the man, and the refs were the Lakers' second-most important player during that time.
He was still clutch, in the 1 moment when Shaq couldn't be. Shaq fouls out, and Kobe says ok. Mama there goes that man. Oh wait no, Mark Jackson was not in the booth, he was on the court. Hand down man down.
[QUOTE=Tavr;15018626]This only makes sense if one ignored proper context.
Given their roles and expectations, LeBron had a worse series and choke. Kobe was a second option and playing with an injury to boot. I also mentioned in another thread that Kobe had a masterful Game 4 when Shaq fouled out, willing the Lakers in the 4th quarter and overtime (2011 LeBron was nowhere to be found in 4th quarters).
Above all else though, the Lakers won :lol If anything, Kobe fans "worst nightmare" is the 2004 finals.[/QUOTE]
If Kobe's injury was a problem.... then he probably shouldn't have taken a combined 47fga (making only 12) in games 5 and 6, no?
Shaq fouled out with a couple minutes left in game 4 after putting up 36 and 20. Kobe made a few shots and some FT's in OT. Calling it "masterful" is a stretch.
It should at minimum put an end to all 5 rangz talk, Kobe was already clear 2nd option to a guy having literally one of the most dominant peaks ever, the Finals makes it frankly embarrassing to include this title in all-time discussions.
[QUOTE=Hey Yo;15018712][B]If Kobe's injury was a problem.... then he probably shouldn't have taken a combined 47fga (making only 12) in games 5 and 6, no? [/B][/quote]
Sure, but it definitely was an issue. Kobe essentially missed 2 full games in that finals. I don't think anybody denies Kobe's propensity to shotjack lol
[quote]Calling it "masterful" is a stretch.[/QUOTE]
As far as Game 4's concerned, a "sidekick" going more or less perfect in a Finals overtime is just that. If you prefer to call it something else, fine. But that sounds more like a personal problem than anything.
It would matter more if they had lost. Because they won it's just a footnote for haters to nitpick. Most fans won't and don't care. Brady once had a 0 TD/1 INT superbowl. Patriots won, no one cares.
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15018721]It should at minimum put an end to all 5 rangz talk, Kobe was already clear 2nd option to a guy having literally one of the most dominant peaks ever, the Finals makes it frankly embarrassing to include this title in all-time discussions.[/QUOTE]
Goat sidekick. No problem with that.
[QUOTE=StrongLurk;15018577]Kobe did miss time, but that doesn't help your argument.
Kobe still shot chucked like a maniac games 4-6. Kobe wasn't good in game 1 nor was he good in the 8 minutes he played in game 2. Ironically the ONLY truly elite game Kobe had in the 2000 finals was game 4, after his "injury".
Shaq legit won game 2 alone which is insane.[/QUOTE]
What exactly is "insane" about that? A peak Shaq (2000) on any given day might the best player ever.
If you put all the top players in their prime in a gym together, there would certainly be days where that version of Shaq is better than Kobe, LeBron, and even Jordan.
Like that version of Shaq was a monster.
People really underrate Shaq nowadays, he has a case IMO to be above Magic, Bird, Russell, Wilt, and maybe even Kareem and when he was on his game, the "most dominant ever" nickname probably isn't an overstatement.
Game 4 was also an important game in that series, that could have been 2-2 which makes it a totally different series but instead the Lakers went up 3-1 and basically closed any chance the Pacers had, they weren't going to come back from 1-3 down, certainly not against a team like that Lakers squad.
Not really because he was purposely injured by Jalen Rose (he admitted it) and was playing on one leg essentially.
Still did this to close the series and dagger Indiana.
[video=youtube_share;V9U_JtSNATo]https://youtu.be/V9U_JtSNATo?si=Dfp4t4nz1nGcw-x8[/video]
[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green;15018740]It would matter more if they had lost. Because they won it's just a footnote for haters to nitpick. Most fans won't and don't care. Brady once had a 0 TD/1 INT superbowl. Patriots won, no one cares.[/QUOTE]
I disagree 100% with this viewpoint. The outcome of the game shouldn't change how we perceive the players performance. If the Heat had won in 2011 with LeBron having the same Finals, he doesn't automatically become absolved of how dreadful his performance was, esp in crunch time.
Brady doesn't get more credit for the Pats beating the Rams despite him doing virtually nothing all game than he does torching the Eagles for 500 yards because they lost.
You can't judge individual performance by team result, it's far more nuanced than that.
.
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Kobe's 8 ppg in clutch-time is an all-time record:
[Img]https://i.makeagif.com/media/6-30-2025/UuDpkz.gif[/img]
[url]https://www.nba.com/stats/players/clutch-traditional?PORound=4&Season=1999-00&dir=A&sort=PTS[/url]
[QUOTE=3ba11;15018779].
.
Kobe's 8 ppg in clutch-time is an all-time record:
[Img]https://i.makeagif.com/media/6-30-2025/UuDpkz.gif[/img]
[url]https://www.nba.com/stats/players/clutch-traditional?PORound=4&Season=1999-00&dir=A&sort=PTS[/url][/QUOTE]
In this thread, LeBron fans want to remove Kobe's ring though. 2011 is so horrific they're forced to compare LeBron's performance to a hobbled section options. :lol A more CLUTCH and hobbled section option, rather.
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15018765]I disagree 100% with this viewpoint. The outcome of the game shouldn't change how we perceive the players performance. If the Heat had won in 2011 with LeBron having the same Finals, he doesn't automatically become absolved of how dreadful his performance was, esp in crunch time.
Brady doesn't get more credit for the Pats beating the Rams despite him doing virtually nothing all game than he does torching the Eagles for 500 yards because they lost.
You can't judge individual performance by team result, it's far more nuanced than that.[/QUOTE]
Whether you agree or not people discuss the accomplishments of greats like Brady and Kobe in terms of Championship volume. What do you think people actually think of more when they recall the first Kobe/Shaq ring, the alley-oop from Kobe to Shaq vs Portland or someone's fg %age? Regardless of how you do it there is nothing more important to sports history than winning.
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15018765].
You can't judge individual performance by team result, it's far more nuanced than that.
[/QUOTE]
A team with 3 all-stars and a goat candidate should win the title.. Period... It's bball 101 that a favored roster that fails to win [I]failed at chemistry[/I] (since the roster was favored) - this failure of chemistry falls on the biggest impactor of chemistry, which is the 1st option - the guy scoring the most points.
In basketball, some skillsets get the most out of players and having great chemistry, while some skillsets turn everyone into spot-up shooter and the bad chemistry requires "more help" (the story of lebron's career - he's simply the worst ever at chemistry)
[QUOTE=3ba11;15018779].
.
Kobe's 8 ppg in clutch-time is an all-time record:
[Img]https://i.makeagif.com/media/6-30-2025/UuDpkz.gif[/img]
[url]https://www.nba.com/stats/players/clutch-traditional?PORound=4&Season=1999-00&dir=A&sort=PTS[/url][/QUOTE]
Kobe's clutch numbers in the POs in that 3-Peat are simply insane. 2000 was his worst year IIRC because Shaq was still the 1st option in the 4th at the time, Kobe elevated in '01.
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15018765]I disagree 100% with this viewpoint. The outcome of the game shouldn't change how we perceive the players performance. If the Heat had won in 2011 with LeBron having the same Finals, he doesn't automatically become absolved of how dreadful his performance was, esp in crunch time.
Brady doesn't get more credit for the Pats beating the Rams despite him doing virtually nothing all game than he does torching the Eagles for 500 yards because they lost.
You can't judge individual performance by team result, it's far more nuanced than that.[/QUOTE]
Meanwhile, some people love to rave about 2018 lebron being a god and all due to being a true powerhouse in a team full of scrubs but still ended up being swept by the warriors in the finals. Though it may be justified, it looks a bit of a black mark but winning at least just a game there would make the series he lost look a lot more good imo.
[QUOTE=Axe;15018925]Meanwhile, some people love to rave about 2018 lebron being a god and all due to being a true powerhouse in a team full of scrubs but still ended up being swept by the warriors in the finals. Though it may be justified, it looks a bit of a black mark but winning at least just a game there would make the series he lost look [B][SIZE=5]a lot more good[/SIZE][/B] imo.[/QUOTE]
For your education, "more good" is incorrect grammar. The correct way to say it would have been "a lot better."
You're welcome. I'm here to infuse knowledge upon those of you who are lacking.
Guys, the Lebron stans do not HYPE up the 2011 finals.
The Kobe stans DO hype up the 2000 finals. THAT is the embarrassing part. With the 2004 finals, Kobe stans can simply admit Kobe was trash and lost. But the 2000 finals, they keep forcing themselves to hype up a complete dog shit performance where Shaq had the BIGGEST finals carry job in history lol.
2011 Lebron: 17.8/7.2/6.8, 54.1 TS%, 1.5 BPM, 13.7 gamescore. - No hype here from Lebron stans
2000 Kobe: 15.6/4.6/4.2, 41.1 TS%, -.8 BPM, 9.7 gamescore. - Kobe stans: "5 RaNgZ GoAt"
[QUOTE=StrongLurk;15019064][B]Guys, the Lebron stans do not HYPE up the 2011 finals.
The Kobe stans DO hype up the 2000 finals. THAT is the embarrassing part.[/B] With the 2004 finals, Kobe stans can simply admit Kobe was trash and lost. But the 2000 finals, they keep forcing themselves to hype up a complete dog shit performance where Shaq had the BIGGEST finals carry job in history lol.
2011 Lebron: 17.8/7.2/6.8, 54.1 TS%, 1.5 BPM, 13.7 gamescore. - No hype here from Lebron stans
2000 Kobe: 15.6/4.6/4.2, 41.1 TS%, -.8 BPM, 9.7 gamescore. - Kobe stans: "5 RaNgZ GoAt"[/QUOTE]
:oldlol:
[QUOTE=StrongLurk;15019064]Guys, the Lebron stans do not HYPE up the 2011 finals.
The Kobe stans DO hype up the 2000 finals. THAT is the embarrassing part. With the 2004 finals, Kobe stans can simply admit Kobe was trash and lost. But the 2000 finals, they keep forcing themselves to hype up a complete dog shit performance where Shaq had the BIGGEST finals carry job in history lol.
2011 Lebron: 17.8/7.2/6.8, 54.1 TS%, 1.5 BPM, 13.7 gamescore. - No hype here from Lebron stans
2000 Kobe: 15.6/4.6/4.2, 41.1 TS%, -.8 BPM, 9.7 gamescore. - Kobe stans: "5 RaNgZ GoAt"[/QUOTE]
Nope. Hype or not 2011 is one of the worst nightmares, if not the worst for someone self-proclaiming as goat.
Lebron stans may not hype up 2011, but they sure do have amnesia towards it.
[QUOTE=Gudo;15019071]Nope. Hype or not 2011 is one of the worst nightmares, if not the worst for someone self-proclaiming as goat.
Lebron stans may not hype up 2011, but they sure do have amnesia towards it.[/QUOTE]
Buddy, this thread is about Kobe stans. How is the 2011 finals relevant at all? We have a lot of deflectors here immediately bringing up Lebron when the entire OP/thread premise is about Kobe.
[QUOTE=Gudo;15019071]Nope. Hype or not 2011 is one of the worst nightmares, if not the worst for someone self-proclaiming as goat.
Lebron stans may not hype up 2011, but they sure do have amnesia towards it.[/QUOTE]
Kobe thought he [I]WAS[/I] Jordan before that Finals.
[QUOTE=StrongLurk;15019075]Buddy, this thread is about Kobe stans. How is the 2011 finals relevant at all? We have a lot of deflectors here immediately bringing up Lebron when the entire OP/thread premise is about Kobe.[/QUOTE]
He seems to be a disappointed cavs fan[url=https://i.ibb.co/RpQNPqx/IMG-20221122-211833.jpg].[/url]