Lebron shot 35 percent in the 2007 Finals?!!!

Ha ha ha ha ha. I didn't even know Lebron shot that low! I couldn't believe it. Here is the video exposing Lebron's days in Cleveland.

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsaPiKUUqN8&t=1s[/url]

And they also mentioned that Cleveland had some of the top rated defenses and rebounding stats in the league. So to say Lebron had no help is total BS. Maybe he didn't have Wade/Bosh type help, but he had a dam good team. And I can understand that maybe the Spurs had a better team, but him and his boys got swept.

That's the thing. How can this guy get so much hype? Not to hate on him and say he's a bad player or anything like that. But the hype doesn't add up. He shot 35 percent on 22 points? And had 23 turnovers? I mean how many championships would Lebron have if HE only played with one all star in his career? Why are we not interested in the truth? Why do we act like Lebron had no help in Cleveland? SGA did just fine with all that defensive help.

So when we talk about all the bad Finals Lebron had like against Dallas, this Spurs series HAS to go down as another failure. It's not that he lost. It's that he got swept and shot 35 percent with 23 turnovers as a forward. Duncan owned him ha ha. How can you respect this guy, claiming he had no help when he only shot 35 percent as the teams leader?

And then in 2015, Lebron got all this credit for winning 2 games in the Finals while shooting under 40 percent as well. In 2021 Lebron had Westbrook and Davis on his team while having veteran role players Dwight Howard, Carmelo Anthony and Rondo. Couldn't even win the championship. I mean they couldn't make the playoffs. Actually, I mean they couldn't even make the PLAY IN. And the blamed it all on Russell Westbrook!

And 2007 wasn't even close to his WORST choke job. Did you know that 2011 is the worst choke job in the history of the sport?

I have personally documented no less than [B][SIZE=4]45 [/SIZE][/B]choke jobs from Lebron, just in the post season.

:lebronamazed:

Bron stans will try to dismiss this as LeBron being young and his first Finals appearance so it doesn’t really count…

Then turn around and celebrate Lebron’s 2012 collusion fueled lock-out chip, vs the young and low bball iq core of okc (KD, Westbrook, Harden all age 22 or 23 in their first finals appearance)

I feel like this version of Lebron 2018-present is so much better than his early prime. Nowadays he almost never bombs out. Even in loss, he'll still produce very well. Hes smarter, bigger, can shoot better, and is more in control. Back in the day he was prone to major crashouts. 2007, 2008, 2010, 2011, almost 2013, etc.

Oh wow, really?!

[QUOTE=warriorfan;15021009]Bron stans will try to dismiss this as LeBron being young and his first Finals appearance so it doesn’t really count…

Then turn around and celebrate Lebron’s 2012 collusion fueled lock-out chip, vs the young and low bball iq core of okc (KD, Westbrook, Harden all age 22 or 23 in their first finals appearance)[/QUOTE]


Ha ha ha! Bro, I didn't even really watch that series. But i assumed that Lebron scored like 28 a game and shot close to 50 percent. I just believed everyone that he was too young. Then I heard someone say on youtube that he shot 35 percent. I didn't believe it was true. And only 22 points a game WOW and averaging 6 turnovers a game!! This was Lebron in his ATHLETIC prime.

So now that I have all the facts, I have to ding him for this. Then his next finals he lost against Dallas while playing with Wade and Bosh? That really is bad. I can't believe it was this bad though. 35 percent DAM.

His 2nd option was injured and he had weakness in.his game at 22. And the routine "did you see the team he got there with? " they had no business in the finals, he got them there with a legendary performance.

[QUOTE=warriorfan;15021009]Bron stans will try to dismiss this as LeBron being young and his first Finals appearance so it doesn’t really count…

Then turn around and celebrate Lebron’s 2012 collusion fueled lock-out chip, vs the young and low bball iq core of okc (KD, Westbrook, Harden all age 22 or 23 in their first finals appearance)[/QUOTE]

:applause:

Great point about OKC especially. What's funny is those same fanboys will jump on Kobe for his 2000 finals (injured and literally missed multiple games), despite him ALSO being "young" and the same age as LeBron in 2007. Song and verse about his fg% and that ring being ultimately irrelevant. :lol Their goalpost moving and hypocrisy never ends.

[QUOTE=sdot_thadon;15021070]His 2nd option was injured and he had weakness in.his game at 22. And the routine "did you see the team he got there with? " [B]they had no business in the finals, he got them there with a legendary performance[/B].[/QUOTE]

This.


.

[QUOTE=sdot_thadon;15021070]His 2nd option was injured and he had weakness in.his game at 22. And the routine "did you see the team he got there with? " they had no business in the finals, he got them there with a legendary performance.[/QUOTE]



Always always always always always.... some kind of excuse.

[QUOTE=sdot_thadon;15021070]His 2nd option was injured and he had weakness in.his game at 22. And the routine "did you see the team he got there with? " they had no business in the finals, he got them there with a legendary performance.[/QUOTE]

And 2011?

[QUOTE=sdot_thadon;15021070]His 2nd option was injured and he had weakness in.his game at 22. And the routine "did you see the team he got there with? " they had no business in the finals, he got them there with a legendary performance.[/QUOTE]

Which has nothing at all to do with the FACT that

THE MAN SHOT [B][SIZE=5]35%[/SIZE][/B] IN THE FINALS!!!!


[img]https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fmedia1.tenor.com%2Fm%2FH8akeoCjEZsAAAAC%2Fincredulous-cormier.gif&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=3840bff57106b8ed18468fd0e3be74a1fd417174b8d60f48ea73fdaae2a0197c[/img]

[QUOTE=Full Court;15021167]Which has nothing at all to do with the FACT that

THE MAN SHOT [B][SIZE=5]35%[/SIZE][/B] IN THE FINALS!!!!


[img]https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fmedia1.tenor.com%2Fm%2FH8akeoCjEZsAAAAC%2Fincredulous-cormier.gif&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=3840bff57106b8ed18468fd0e3be74a1fd417174b8d60f48ea73fdaae2a0197c[/img][/QUOTE]



True. Plus 6 turnovers per game!!! :applause: Lebron shot 35 percent, 20 percent from 3, and had 6 turnovers per game! All he had to do was play a normal game and his team could have won the Finals.

[QUOTE=Walk on Water;15021211]True. Plus 6 turnovers per game!!! :applause: Lebron shot 35 percent, 20 percent from 3, and had 6 turnovers per game! All he had to do was play a normal game and his team could have won the Finals.[/QUOTE]

Dang it, Lebron. All you had to do was not choke. That's it. Just that one thing. Just not freaking choke.

:crazysam:

[QUOTE=Full Court;15021167]Which has nothing at all to do with the FACT that

THE MAN SHOT [B][SIZE=5]35%[/SIZE][/B] IN THE FINALS!!!!


[img]https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fmedia1.tenor.com%2Fm%2FH8akeoCjEZsAAAAC%2Fincredulous-cormier.gif&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=3840bff57106b8ed18468fd0e3be74a1fd417174b8d60f48ea73fdaae2a0197c[/img][/QUOTE]

It has everything to do with it. Larry Hughes isnt some all time legend but he [B]was[/B] Lebron's 2nd option. Find me a team that won a title without ots 2nd option. Find me a team that was able to win with the 2nd option at 13ppg in the finals. You have to go all the way back to Dream's 94 Rockets and fun fact another team that had such weak support from the 2nd option was none other than MJs stiffest competition the 98 Jazz, Hornacek poured in a whopping 10ppg as the 2nd option. Who's supposed to win like that?

[QUOTE=beasted;15021135]And 2011?[/QUOTE]
Ive never seen anyone argue 2011 wasn't a bad series from LeBron. I just dont think he had a bad series for the same reasons Lebron haters do. I will say this however: if Wade and Bosh were such a cheat code to titles....then why couldn't they win that chip with Lebron having an off series? Meanwhile Lebron led them to 2 chips.with both having injuries on top of off series. Make it make sense.

Lebron was trash in 07 finals.

If he played well but still lost, then he'd have some leeway.

But he was ULTRA dog doodoo. Lebron is my guy but I can't stand the way people mythologize the 07 run. It was a pre-prime Lebron who played well before the finals and had a legendary game 5 against the Pistons...but the comp was objectively poor and he completely shit the bed in the finals. There is no defending that level of poor play, under any circumstance, if you are supposed to be a top 5 player in the league and healthy at the time too.

[QUOTE=sdot_thadon;15021277]It has everything to do with it. Larry Hughes isnt some all time legend but he [B]was[/B] Lebron's 2nd option. Find me a team that won a title without ots 2nd option. Find me a team that was able to win with the 2nd option at 13ppg in the finals. You have to go all the way back to Dream's 94 Rockets and fun fact another team that had such weak support from the 2nd option was none other than MJs stiffest competition the 98 Jazz, Hornacek poured in a whopping 10ppg as the 2nd option. Who's supposed to win like that?[/quote]

Not speaking for that poster, but I don't think mentioning LeBron's production and putrid efficiency is equivalent to "winning the finals". LeBron gets credit for his series against Detroit (Larry Hughes was a complete no show in that series), so he should still get flack for his poor finals play. Kobe at the same age got dragged (and still does) for being "carried by Shaq" in 2000, but Kobe was also legitimately hurt and actually missed games in those finals. I'm just saying...can we be consistent? :confusedshrug:

Regarding your 2011 question. By a superstar standard, how do you overcome LeBron's massive and unanticipated dropoff? You cannot be [I]arguably[/I] your teams best player and have complete no shows in 4th quarters, especially in games decided by a few points. I'm not going to question Wade or Bosh here, I don't even think actual Miami Heat fans do.

[QUOTE=StrongLurk;15021278]Lebron was trash in 07 finals.

If he played well but still lost, then he'd have some leeway.

But he was ULTRA dog doodoo. Lebron is my guy but I can't stand the way people mythologize the 07 run. It was a pre-prime Lebron who played well before the finals and had a legendary game 5 against the Pistons...but the comp was objectively poor and he completely shit the bed in the finals. There is no defending that level of poor play, under any circumstance, if you are supposed to be a top 5 player in the league and healthy at the time too.[/QUOTE]

Great objectivity :applause:

Lebron is the only player in history to shoot 35% with 6 TO's per game in a series - it's the worst chucking and turnovers that the game has ever seen.. Then he repeated this in 2008 with 35% and 5 TO's against the Celtics, which caused loss in a winnable, 7-game series.. Meanwhile, 22-year old Kobe and Amare dominated the Spurs with goat stats in 02' and 05', respectively..

Young Lebron simply couldn't shoot and wasn't aware that it was legal to turn his back to the basket (no post game whatsoever).. And old Lebron is too slow.. i.e. ball-domination is bad enough, but slow ball-domination is even worse.. Slow ball-domination can't wear out a defense, so his teams face fresh opponents and therefore have max defensive requirements at all times..

So it matters little that Lebron is more controlled, aka slower - the faster ball-dominator is better.. And it's still ball-dominance, so he still can't score off screens to facilitate a real halfcourt offense.. Even his attempt at "off-ball" and more assisted buckets alongside Luka was [I]massively negative[/I] and it was described by the T'Wolves coach as "looking to go downhill upon the catch", aka still ball-dominant.. It got exposed in the playoffs by the young T'Wolves, who then got demolished by OKC.

Not according to bbref. It says he shot 2007% in the 35 finals.

[QUOTE=Tavr;15021284]Not speaking for that poster, but I don't think mentioning LeBron's production and putrid efficiency is equivalent to "winning the finals". LeBron gets credit for his series against Detroit (Larry Hughes was a complete no show in that series), so he should still get flack for his poor finals play. Kobe at the same age got dragged (and still does) for being "carried by Shaq" in 2000, but Kobe was also legitimately hurt and actually missed games in those finals. I'm just saying...can we be consistent? :confusedshrug:

Regarding your 2011 question. By a superstar standard, how do you overcome LeBron's massive and unanticipated dropoff? You cannot be [I]arguably[/I] your teams best player and have complete no shows in 4th quarters, especially in games decided by a few points. I'm not going to question Wade or Bosh here, I don't even think actual Miami Heat fans do.[/QUOTE]

Here's the thing I dont disagree that he was bad in 2007. Im just adding perspective, my personal opinion is Pop watched that game 5 vs Detroit and said screw that, not happening to us. He bet on Lebrons streaky shooting not holding up and it worked. They showed him several players whenever he got the ball, sometimes a wall. Those guys didn't have to worry about anyone else because there wasn't another threat on the floor. Thats all im saying. If he had anyone that could take a bit of attention his life woulda been easier that finals. Who knows maybe Hughes would have slowed Parker some and made the series even closer and more winnable.

And about Kobe....im not one to trash his 2000 finals. My only gripe is when people use that title as if he wasn't the sidekick there. And I didn't fault Bosh or Wade for any shortcomings in Miamis run, it is what it is. These things only get pointed out in the face of the heat being a voltron team for 4 years that failed.

[QUOTE=sdot_thadon;15021292]Here's the thing I dont disagree that he was bad in 2007. Im just adding perspective, my personal opinion is Pop watched that game 5 vs Detroit and said screw that, not happening to us. He bet on Lebrons streaky shooting not holding up and it worked. They showed him several players whenever he got the ball, sometimes a wall. Those guys didn't have to worry about anyone else because there wasn't another threat on the floor. Thats all im saying. If he had anyone that could take a bit of attention his life woulda been easier that finals. Who knows maybe Hughes would have slowed Parker some and made the series even closer and more winnable.[/quote]

Yeah that's fair, and I more or less agree with your analysis. I'm just trying to figure out if we (not you in particular but generally speaking) hold these players to the same standard. Like most people, I'm of the opinion LeBron had weaknesses in his game and absolutely should have played better in that finals. Do the Cavs win the series if he does? Highly doubtful. The point is though we can only judge an individual based on his performance.

[quote]And about Kobe....im not one to trash his 2000 finals. My only gripe is when people use that title as if he wasn't the sidekick there. And I didn't fault Bosh or Wade for any shortcomings in Miamis run, it is what it is. These things only get pointed out in the face of the heat being a voltron team for 4 years that failed.[/QUOTE]

Don't know many people who think Shaq and Kobe were 1A/B in 2000. Kobe was quite clearly #2 during that run. From 2001 and on though I get why Kobe fans debate the "carried by Shaq" and "sidekick" stuff. With that Miami superteam, I actually thought Wade could have played better in 2014. His fans claim he was playing hurt, but to me he just simply had a poor finals. No shame in that either. Many greats have underperformed on that stage.

.
[B]Thread Cliffs [/B]


The Spurs exposed that a 22 on 35% player won the weakest East ever.

And Lebron can't handle max defensive attention, aka carrying the scoring load - he never beat a top 5 SRS team with weak scoring and efficiency from a sidekick (never carried weak help over top teams)

[QUOTE=3ba11;15021951].
[B]Thread Cliffs [/B]


The Spurs exposed that a 22 on 35% player won the weakest East ever.

And Lebron can't handle max defensive attention, aka carrying the scoring load - he never beat a top 5 SRS team with weak scoring and efficiency from a sidekick (never carried weak help over top teams)[/QUOTE]


Stats at 22 years old vs Duncan's Spurs


[Indent]01' Kobe vs Spurs........ 33 on 53%
05' Amare vs Spurs...... 37 on 55%
07' Lebron vs Spurs...... 22 on 35%[/indent]


^^^ one of them doesn't belong

Lebron also shot 35% in the 08' ECSF

Also, the Cavs lost 3 fourth quarter leads in the 07' Finals, so 30 on 45% from lebron easily wins

[QUOTE=3ba11;15021962]Stats at 22 years old vs Duncan's Spurs


[Indent]01' Kobe vs Spurs........ 33 on 53%
05' Amare vs Spurs...... 37 on 55%
07' Lebron vs Spurs...... 22 on 35%[/indent]


^^^ one of them doesn't belong

Lebron also shot 35% in the 08' ECSF

Also, the Cavs lost 3 fourth quarter leads in the 07' Finals, so 30 on 45% from lebron easily wins[/QUOTE]

Young prime Lebron had an extremely exploitable weakness as he had beginner level confidence in his jumper. Kobe otoh his bread and butter was the jumper and fundamentals and then he just sprinkled elite athleticism on top of it dunking in Robinson and Duncan's grills. No weaknesses to exploit.