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- Curry
- Jokic
- SGA
Pretend that you are a GM and your goal is to win a championship [B]this season[/B]. Assume you were guaranteed that all three of them would remain perfectly healthy for the remainder of the year.
You're simply judging them on how good they are RIGHT NOW and whether or not they put you in a position to win.
What is the order you would draft those guys.
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Isn't Curry hurt? Even if he wasnt Jokic is like twice as good as old Curry and SGA.
There's nothing in OP speaking to roster construction, but given equal talent I think Jokic is quite comfortably the best floor raiser/most likely to field a competitive team with average talent around him. Surround him with the talent SGA currently has and/or what Steph was working with during the Warriors peak, and I'd argue it's lights out for the league.
Jokic
SGA
Curry
Curry obv not being in their tier/the worst of the 3.
Jokic
Curry
SGA
Since we have no idea what the rest of the team looks like, Joker first because he is the most talented player in the league at the moment. Curry second, because basically he is a system almost by himself. The defensive attention and gameplanning necessary opens things up for the other players. SGA last because he can probably score the best in the league right now, but, I'm not sure he's making guys around him better or opening things up for teammates as much as the other two based solely on the defensive attention. He also needs the ball to be most effective.
Jokic
SGA
Curry
SGA is a better scorer than Jokic, and he's better on the defensive end.
[QUOTE=Phoenix;15045176]There's nothing in OP speaking to roster construction, but given equal talent I think Jokic is quite comfortably the best floor raiser/most likely to field a competitive team with average talent around him. [B]Surround him with the talent SGA currently has[/B] and/or what Steph was working with during the Warriors peak, and I'd argue it's lights out for the league.[/QUOTE]
SGA is currently missing his 2nd best player and his team is 19-1.
[QUOTE=beasted;15045191]Since we have no idea what the rest of the team looks like, Joker first because he is the most talented player in the league at the moment. Curry second, because basically he is a system almost by himself. The defensive attention and gameplanning necessary opens things up for the other players.[B] SGA last because he can probably score the best in the league right now, but, I'm not sure he's making guys around him better or opening things up for teammates as much as the other two based solely on the defensive attention. He also needs the ball to be most effective.[/B][/QUOTE]
But when he has the ball he's insanely effective, and he's effective from everywhere on the floor.
I'm not making a definitive case for SGA or anything like that, I think it's a debate, but how long are we going to ignore the fact that this man is dominating? OKC is not some stacked team. They just have a guy who can close and is an automatic bucket.
[QUOTE=Baller234;15045209]SGA is currently missing his 2nd best player and his team is 19-1.
But when he has the ball he's insanely effective, and he's effective from everywhere on the floor.
I'm not making a definitive case for SGA or anything like that, I think it's a debate, but how long are we going to ignore the fact that this man is dominating? [B]OKC is not some stacked team.[/B] They just have a guy who can close and is an automatic bucket.[/QUOTE]
They are absolutely a stacked team :lol By far the most talented/deepest team in the league.
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15045211]They are absolutely a stacked team :lol By far the most talented/deepest team in the league.[/QUOTE]
A STACKED team??
What happens if you remove SGA? Then what? How good are they?
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15045211]They are absolutely a stacked team :lol By far the most talented/deepest team in the league.[/QUOTE]
You are acting it's the 2015 hawks with 4 all stars lol
SGA
Jokic
Curry
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15045211]They are absolutely a stacked team :lol By far the most talented/deepest team in the league.[/QUOTE]
You are acting it's the 2015 hawks with 4 all stars lol
SGA
Jokic
Curry
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15045211]They are absolutely a stacked team :lol By far the most talented/deepest team in the league.[/QUOTE]
Lakers are more stacked than OKC.
I don't know what's worse.
Calling OKC a "stacked" team or suggesting that Curry isn't on the same tier as Yolk and SGA.
When Curry is healthy he looks as good as he's ever been. I'm almost convinced he's on something he's been that good. It's like he's stronger and quicker now somehow.
Shai
Curry
Jokic
[QUOTE=Baller234;15045209]SGA is currently missing his 2nd best player and his team is 19-1.
.[/QUOTE]
I'm not sure if that says more about SGA or Jalens Williams impact on the W/L record. They're still very obviously a well-oiled unit in spite of his absence, which isn't a knock on SGAs greatness. But I dont think he matches Joker as a floor-raiser if all else is equal( like talent). We can theorize about which team is better off if you swapped them, but I would still take Joker. You may feel differently.
[QUOTE=Phoenix;15045234]I'm not sure if that says more about SGA or Jalens Williams impact on the W/L record. They're still very obviously a well-oiled unit in spite of his absence, which isn't a knock on SGAs greatness. But I dont think he matches Joker as a floor-raiser if all else is equal( like talent).[/QUOTE]
This is the OKC roster without SGA and Williams:
Chet Holmgren
Ajay Mitchell
Aaron Wiggins
Isaiah Joe
Isaiah Hartenstein
Cason Wallace
Luguentz Dort
Jaylin Williams
Alex Caruso
Branden Carlson
Ousmane Dieng
Chris Youngblood
Kenrich Williams
Brooks Barnhizer
Tell me, how good do you think this team would be?
[QUOTE=Baller234;15045236]This is the OKC roster without SGA and Williams:
Chet Holmgren
Ajay Mitchell
Aaron Wiggins
Isaiah Joe
Isaiah Hartenstein
Cason Wallace
Luguentz Dort
Jaylin Williams
Alex Caruso
Branden Carlson
Ousmane Dieng
Chris Youngblood
Kenrich Williams
Brooks Barnhizer
Tell me, how good do you think this team would be?[/QUOTE]
Frisky 39 win team.
[QUOTE=Baller234;15045232]I don't know what's worse.
Calling OKC a "stacked" team or suggesting that Curry isn't on the same tier as Yolk and SGA.
When Curry is healthy he looks as good as he's ever been. I'm almost convinced he's on something he's been that good. It's like he's stronger and quicker now somehow.[/QUOTE]
Stacked is such a subjective term, you can make it out to mean anything you want. But how anyone could argue OKC doesn't possess an incredible amount of cohesive talent and depth is beyond me.
And I'm genuinely puzzled by the Curry claim. How does anyone believe he's even remotely comparable to SGA or esp Jokic right now? That's fvcking wild to me :lol
[QUOTE=Baller234;15045236]This is the OKC roster without SGA and Williams:
Chet Holmgren
Ajay Mitchell
Aaron Wiggins
Isaiah Joe
Isaiah Hartenstein
Cason Wallace
Luguentz Dort
Jaylin Williams
Alex Caruso
Branden Carlson
Ousmane Dieng
Chris Youngblood
Kenrich Williams
Brooks Barnhizer
Tell me, how good do you think this team would be?[/QUOTE]
You should post the Nuggets roster minus Joker and Murray and ponder that same question. I agree with ShawkFactory, not sure if they'd win 39 but can't see them under 35-36 wins. I'm not sure if you're arguing that the Nuggets with SGA are better and/or OKC with Joker is worse, but you seem to prefer SGA and that's your prerogative. I'm not spending my evening arguing your preference nor defending mine.
[QUOTE=k0kakw0rld;15045215]You are acting it's the 2015 hawks with 4 all stars lol
SGA
Jokic
Curry[/QUOTE]
Theyre def more stacked than the Korver Horford Hawks :oldlol:
Best defensive team with or without shai. If lakers can win games with little d im sure okc would do ok without shai
[QUOTE=Phoenix;15045246][B]You should post the Nuggets roster minus Joker and Murray and ponder that same question[/B]. I agree with ShawkFactory, not sure if they'd win 39 but can't see them under 35-36 wins. I'm not sure if you're arguing that the Nuggets with SGA are better and/or OKC with Joker is worse, but you seem to prefer SGA and that's your prerogative. I'm not spending my evening arguing your preference nor defending mine.[/QUOTE]
Why would I do that? The whole point of the exercise was to highlight that SGA is currently dominating without his 2nd best player.
I'm not even sure I have a preference. I'm torn myself. It's why I created the thread. I think if push comes to shove you have to give the edge to Joker because he does so much more for his team, but let's be honest he DOES have help. He has shooters, he has utility guys and he also has a go-to sidekick in Murray. And yet they're STILL not as good as OKC who's missing their 2nd best player.
Again maybe I could dismiss it if OKC was some STACKED team but they really aren't, not when Williams is missing. They're good and they're well coached but they're not STACKED with talent. Clearly the difference maker is SGA.
Btw I'm not a fan of SGA so this isn't me being biased. I think he carries all the time and I hate the way he foul baits. I also don't like how he carries himself off the court with his effeminate ways. I respect his talent. That's where it ends.
[QUOTE=Baller234;15045257]Why would I do that? The whole point of the exercise was to highlight that SGA is currently dominating without his 2nd best player.
.[/QUOTE]
Yes, and my counter to that was to say I'm not sure where the line blurs between SGAs floor-raising ability and whether Williams has much of a material impact on the W/L column. I said I would take Joker if the talent was on par, and that's because I believe his playmaking talents would have more of a rising tide effect on teams with comparable talents. I think he does that on a historic level, so if you're asking me to choose then I gave my answer. The problem is often that choosing one carries the perception of slighting the other person, and its not a knock on SGA.
Which led you to ask what would the Thunder look like if you remove SGA and Williams. It would, at least for me, stand to reason that the same conditions be levied on the Nuggets because I brought up the idea of floor-raising, just seemed like a natural extension of that thought experiment but maybe that's just me. For the record I'm not arguing that the team outside SGA/Willams are historically talented and really they don't have to be. I think they're well-coached and have a great system in place to be competitive and then SGA puts them over the top. Really the fact that OKC flew out the gate and has a better record than Denver with the context of Williams being out is impressive, but I also judge these things ultimately in the playoffs should they meet. The Thunder are a young team boosted by a championship run and maybe there is some internal goal of challenging the Warriors 2016 season. I dont know, but the regular season is a marathon, not a sprint. It's only validated beyond bragging points if they go back to back, I assume they'd take that over 74+ wins.
[QUOTE=Baller234;15045209]SGA is currently missing his 2nd best player and his team is 19-1.
But when he has the ball he's insanely effective, and he's effective from everywhere on the floor.
I'm not making a definitive case for SGA or anything like that, I think it's a debate, but how long are we going to ignore the fact that this man is dominating? OKC is not some stacked team. They just have a guy who can close and is an automatic bucket.[/QUOTE]
Without knowing who else is on the team, the safe pick is Curry. What if the other teammates also need the ball to be effective? With Curry doesn't matter.
[QUOTE=Baller234;15045232]I don't know what's worse.
Calling OKC a "stacked" team or suggesting that Curry isn't on the same tier as Yolk and SGA.
When Curry is healthy he looks as good as he's ever been. I'm almost convinced he's on something he's been that good. It's like he's stronger and quicker now somehow.[/QUOTE]
He’s obviously stronger but he’s not quicker. At the same time it’s not like he got slow. He has better balance and is able to finish through contact better. Steph has always put a lot of work in for his entire career. That plus good genetics and a bit of luck not suffering really catastrophic injuries.
An interesting stat I saw during a game a few weeks ago was something how in nba history the guard with the most ppg past age 35 was Wade with 18 ppg. Curry has been shattering that for awhile now.
(I’m guessing they are listing MJ as a SF when he came back for his Wizards run)
So easy
1. Jokic
2. SGA
3. Curry
1. Jokic
2&3 would be a toss up, depending on what other players I have to build a roster with. If I have a giant heavy big who loves contact, sets huge wide immovable screens, and is an enforcer, I’ll take curry. If I don’t have that big, I’ll take Shai.