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-   -   Boxing Discussion Thread (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=225058)

raiderfan19 06-02-2011 03:43 AM

Boxing Discussion Thread
 
We have repeatedly stated in several of the event specific threads that we should make an all purpose boxing thread. I haven't seen one and I also haven't seen any discussion about Khan/Judah which is at least important enough to deserve mention relative to some of the other fights weve mentioned. Khan is imo one of several people competing for 3rd in the p4p rankings behind Pac and Martinez(I don't rank Floyd because I consider him retired until he at least schedules another fight but he would be in the top 2 if ranked) Zab isn't quite what he once was or could have been but he is still a talented veteran fighter with the skills to be dangerous to anyone. I see Khan taking this by UD in a pretty exciting fight. What does everyone else think? Also obviously any other boxing discussion is welcome.

SCREWstonRockets 06-02-2011 04:38 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
I really like the Amir vs Zab fight. Much better matchup than Amir vs Bradley. They had a nice little twitter beef going on in which I have to say that Amir won that round :lol.

You know what, I might have to put BHop at the top of the p4p list. Although, I think these list are nothing more than mental *********ion for fans. Just give me good matchups anytime over these imaginary list.

Froch vs OG Johnson could be a nice little war. It's fight to watch this weekend. I'm going for Mr Johnson to win this one and the whole thing.

JCC Jr is also fighting in which should be his biggest test as he goes for his first major title. Interesting stat I read, JCC Sr. was 43-0 when he went for his first major title and JCC Jr is going in this fight with a record of 42-0-1. :pimp:

Andre Berto also accused Ortiz of juicing in their fight and then back pedaled faster than MJ dancing on the moon. "He's juicing" seems to be the new excuses these days. Add that to the list that includes, "I was weighted drained. I over trained. I came into the fight with an injury."

kentatm 06-02-2011 04:41 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
about damn time a thread like this was made.

there is no reason for individual matches to get their own threads when we could stick everything here where it would be easy to find and reference.

RedBlackAttack 06-02-2011 04:55 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
I'm in agreement with you guys and am psyched about the Zab-Khan bout. I think it offers a REALLY interesting matchup. I like that Khan is stepping in against a bigger man (although the fight is at light welter) and against a heavy hitter.

Zab has real WELTERWEIGHT power... Let alone at 140.

His southpaw style may also be an issue for Khan.

There are a lot of unknowns in this fight.

Dasher 06-02-2011 05:05 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
I fully expect Zab to win. I have been on a roll picking fights lately, even picking Celestino Caballero to lose when his opponent, who turned out to be Jason Litzau, was still listed as TBD.

A topic I would like to discuss is HBO losing it's grip on the boxing world means for the industry.

DonDadda59 06-02-2011 06:15 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
wouldn't be at all surprised if zab beat khan. Very dangerous fight for him, so he gets props for stepping up, especially since he could've coasted after the bradley breakdown.

And hbo's vice grip is being loosened by cbs/showtime and there's been talk that the heads of hbo sports will be fired soon.

lefthook00 06-03-2011 02:59 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
I'm excited for Khan vs. Zab. Khan's height/length might give Zab problems. Zab is still very very fast though, and can change everything with one punch.

I would love to see Bradley vs. Zab too.

IcanzIIravor 06-03-2011 05:44 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DonDadda59
wouldn't be at all surprised if zab beat khan. Very dangerous fight for him, so he gets props for stepping up, especially since he could've coasted after the bradley breakdown.

And hbo's vice grip is being loosened by cbs/showtime and there's been talk that the heads of hbo sports will be fired soon.


I agree on this. It's nice to see a fighter not coasting and immediately going after a dangerous fight. Khan should get a lot of respect from fans for not taking an easier paycheck.

magic chiongson 06-03-2011 10:44 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
zab, khan, bradley.. any fight involving 2 out of the three should be a good one. heck i'd even add maidana to the list. super middle, junior welter, & bantamweight is where the action is at these days

DonDadda59 06-05-2011 02:13 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Chavez Jr = garbage, but we already knew that. He's a big boy though, weighed in at 180 in the ring and was facing a light hitting 165 lber, so he was just eating his punches like skittles.

Froch-Johnson was a war between 2 guys with steel in their face and chests. Froch's inside game looks a bit weak though, so he might have some trouble against Ward. Should be a great finale, glad that at least 2 of the original Super 6ers are fighting for the prize.

Kessler looked razor sharp in his return and had that over hand right added. Word is he wants Bute next, I'd go with Mikkel in that one.

Mikey Garcia is the most polished/complete young up-and-comer. Great all around skills, got some speed and pop, and shows nice ring intelligence. He'll be a problem for anyone in his division.

Possibly big news coming on the heels of a report that Mayweather turned down $65 million to fight Pacquiao in Singapore:

Pacquiao offered $65M to fight Alvarez in Mexico

MANILA—Mexican billionaire Carlos Slim has offered $65 million to Filipino boxing superstar Manny Pacquiao to fight in Mexico next year with one of Mexico’s up-and-coming fighters.

This was revealed yesterday by Ilocos Sur Gov. Luis “Chavit” Singson, a long-time confidante of Pacquiao, who said that negotiations with Slim, the world’s wealthiest man, have already started and that Pacquiao was interested in the guaranteed money.

Singson’s report came after Top Rank’s Bob Arum revealed that American boxer Floyd Mayweather Jr. had turned down a $65 million offer from a Singaporean group to fight Pacquiao.

In a phone interview, Singson said that Slim had told him about his desire to host one of Pacquiao’s fights as a favor to his countrymen who have been looking to see Pacquiao fight on their soil.

The $65 million offer to Pacquiao was guaranteed by Slim, who would pick the Mexican opponent for the world’s best pound-for-pound boxer.

He said Slim is looking at WBC light middleweight champion Saul “Canelo” Alvarez as likely opponent for Pacquiao.

The unbeaten Alvarez is just 21 and holds an awesome 36-0-1 record with 26 knockouts.

Since 1995, Pacquiao has figured in more than a dozen fights with Mexican or Mexican and Mexican-Americans such as Oscar De La Hoya, Erik Morales, Marco Antonio Barrera and Juan Manuel Marquez but he has never fought in Mexico.

He added that unlike Mayweather, Pacquiao would not turn down $65 million especially since he still has to find his match in the ring.
“I think Manny is still at his peak,” said Singson.

http://sports.inquirer.net/4365/mexi...ight-in-mexico

Lebron23 06-05-2011 09:14 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Why did Floyd Mayweather turned down the $65 Million dollar purse from Pacquiao?

Pacquiao vs. Alvarez is going to be a good fight. Alvarez loves to trade punches with his opponents, and this is going to be a very entertaining fight.

Tarik One 06-06-2011 11:50 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
One thing that concerns me about Floyd is his age. He 's certainly not getting any younger. Just how long can he maintain his speed and reflexes?

I know that he practically lives in the gym and stays in tremendous shape, but father time inevitably catches up with you.

SCREWstonRockets 06-06-2011 01:22 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
I wouldn't exactly call JCC Jr, garbage. Hes getting better and he is only 25. Nothing close to his dad but he definitely has a knack of working the body running in his blood. It was an entertaining fight, better than expected. He's game. The kid comes to fight as he finished it strong. with that said, there was no way Zbik was going to win a close decision.

SCREWstonRockets 06-06-2011 01:28 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lebron23
Why did Floyd Mayweather turned down the $65 Million dollar purse from Pacquiao?

Pacquiao vs. Alvarez is going to be a good fight. Alvarez loves to trade punches with his opponents, and this is going to be a very entertaining fight.


Honestly, I'm sure Bob Arum would turn down that offer as well. I mean, it's in Singapore. You have to think about how it'll transfer over to the PPV buy rates. If the fight starts at night over there, we're talking about a early morning showing in the States. This fight will happen, but only in America.

raiderfan19 06-06-2011 06:06 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Pac would absolutely MURDER Alvarez. Putting a slow 154 lber against one of the fastest offensive guys in the world? If Manny didnt want it to, that fight doesn't get out of the first round. Id be seriously concerned for Canelo's safety. I can't imagine Canelo taking that fight for less than 10 mil though and i cant see him getting that.

Reef 06-06-2011 06:09 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
If Manny does fight Alvarez, then he should also fight Sergio at 154. I personally think 147 should be his limit since he walks around at 150.

DonDadda59 06-06-2011 08:16 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Reef
If Manny does fight Alvarez, then he should also fight Sergio at 154. I personally think 147 should be his limit since he walks around at 150.


If someone offers him $65 million to fight both the Klitschkos on the same night, I'm sure Manny would take it. That's an absurd amount of money for 36 minutes of work. :oldlol:

And Canelo is Mr. 150 lb catchweight, weight wouldn't be a problem. It'd be crazy to see this fight at the Azteca or Omnilife Stadium :eek:

kentatm 06-10-2011 04:30 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
usman ahmed aka uzzy entrance

SCREWstonRockets 06-11-2011 11:15 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kentatm

:lol Seen this kid before. He has heart. But it's probably best that you don't learn how to box just from watching Prince Naseem Hamed tapes.

Dizzle-2k7 06-11-2011 07:42 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Why is Money so scared of Pac? :roll:

raiderfan19 06-11-2011 09:24 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dizzle-2k7
Why is Money so scared of Pac? :roll:

Hes not.

Im actually pretty happy with both guys right now. Jmm is the first non tailor made opponent for manny since ...jmm. Ortiz is the best non manny/floyd ww right now so they are fighting the best non each other fights they can.

I also think that they are both great tune ups. Jmm is a counter puncher with slick boxing skills and fast hands. Ortiz is lefty with power in both hands and speed.

Obviously floyd and manny would be huge steps up from jmm and ortiz but they are both good fights and the right style of fights to lead to the super fight.

raiderfan19 06-12-2011 12:57 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Also i will add this, its entirely possible floyd and manny will both have utterly dominating wins which will make it look like these were easy fights. If that is the case, it doesnt detract at all from the fact that both took what were at the time as tough a fight as the two all time greats could take at this point(other than fighting each other) and they are both just that good

SCREWstonRockets 06-14-2011 09:35 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jaydacris
Sergio Martinez is fighting Darren Barker October 1st

Why is Sergio Martinez not a bigger star? He has all the star qualities, the look, exciting fighting style, KO power. It's a shame he has yet to have one PPV fight. And were talking about a Top 5 fighter in the world.

These promoters need to get off their asses and stop letting HBO promote their fighters. Sergio should be fighting more than once or twice per year. No reason why he shouldn't have a bigger name and bigger following. Bob Arum gets a lot of negativity but he and even GBP would know how to promote Sergio and make him a star.

Its not even just Sergio. But guys like Paul Williams and Berto, both Americans with fan freindly styles, who get HBO fights all the time but still relatively unknown to everyone besides diehards. To top it off, these promoters come out of no where to cash out and expect Top Rank or GBP to give their fighters, their biggest paydays ever. If the promoters would actually do their job and build up their fighter's name, they wouldn't have problems getting big money fights with top dogs like TR and GBP.

Tarik One 06-14-2011 03:36 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Sergio is still relatively new in the spotlight and sort of caught everyone by surprise. He wasn't groomed like Berto and Pavlik.

RedBlackAttack 06-14-2011 04:28 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SCREWstonRockets
Why is Sergio Martinez not a bigger star? He has all the star qualities, the look, exciting fighting style, KO power. It's a shame he has yet to have one PPV fight. And were talking about a Top 5 fighter in the world.

These promoters need to get off their asses and stop letting HBO promote their fighters. Sergio should be fighting more than once or twice per year. No reason why he shouldn't have a bigger name and bigger following. Bob Arum gets a lot of negativity but he and even GBP would know how to promote Sergio and make him a star.

Its not even just Sergio. But guys like Paul Williams and Berto, both Americans with fan freindly styles, who get HBO fights all the time but still relatively unknown to everyone besides diehards. To top it off, these promoters come out of no where to cash out and expect Top Rank or GBP to give their fighters, their biggest paydays ever. If the promoters would actually do their job and build up their fighter's name, they wouldn't have problems getting big money fights with top dogs like TR and GBP.

I made a similar point about Andre Ward about a month ago...

He has all of the tangible things that general sports fans usually look for in their 'golden boy' fighters -- aside from style -- and yet he is almost completely unknown outside of hardcore boxing circles...

Gold Medalist - check
World Champion - check
Undefeated - check
American - check
Likeable - check

...throw in the fact that he has beaten (dominated) top tier talent recently and it is mind-boggling that he isn't more well known. Usually, the Gold Medal alone will make a fighter who turns professional one of the stars of the sport. He hasn't just gone pro, he has dominated some of the best in the world... And no one seems to care.

I realize that he doesn't have the tailor-made style for a huge draw, but there have been plenty of defensive-minded Olympic champions that became huge names.

I'm pretty much at a total loss as to the lack of promotion that Ward gets. Sergio Martinez is a certified star in comparison to Ward. The question is, do we blame Dan Goossen or is it just that the public hasn't embraced him for whatever reason? I feel like his accomplishments should be out there a little more than they currently are.

RedBlackAttack 06-14-2011 04:53 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DonD13
I like him a lot but the people don't care too much about amateur careers, his fights are not THAT exciting and as a person he might be too nice, too boring. People like controversial figures.
But I think when he wins the super 6, he might become well known because he is an undefeated american.
It's not the same story because Martinez had 51 fights and is coming to the end of his career while Ward still has time to get that fame and big money.

Well... Martinez wasn't much of a name -- even in hardcore boxing circles -- until he lost that majority decision to Paul Williams, which was just four fights ago for him. He was a really, really late bloomer and he didn't get his professional career started until his mid-20s.

Maybe that is why the general public is late catching on?

Americans may not care about amateur boxing, but they do care greatly about the Olympics. The list of American Gold Medalists is one of the most prestigious in all of sports. For some reason, Ward didn't get that bump.

lefthook00 06-14-2011 05:00 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Martinez started late, I don't know why he's not a bigger star. He is also fighting out of Oxnard, CA, there are some good camps there. If he would have beaten Margarito and Cotto, I think he would be more popular now, like how Margarito is.

As for Ward, he is not a KO artist. He is not on HBO. He is not a crazy sh*t talker. He hasn't had a crazy memorable fight. Same reason why Dawson isn't bigger, but replace "not on HBO" with "weaker competition" for Dawson.

lefthook00 06-17-2011 04:28 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjEl_FgAw5g

Haye Klitschko "FACE OFF" with Max Kellerman!!!!!!!!

IcanzIIravor 06-17-2011 07:32 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DonD13
ASCII checkbox questions. Fill it out.

-----------------

Floyd Mayweather vs. Manny Pacquiao 2012, who would win?
[ x] Money
[ ] Manny

Who will win on July 2?
[ ] Wladimir Klitschko (points)
[x ] Wladimir Klitschko (stoppage)
[ ] David Haye (points)
[ ] David Haye (stoppage)

Victor Ortiz vs. Floyd Mayweather
[x ] Mayweather (points)
[ ] Mayweather (stoppage)
[ ] Vicious Vic (points)
[ ] Vicious Vic (stoppage)

Andre Ward vs. Carl Froch, who will win?
[ ] Froch (points)
[ ] Froch (stoppage)
[x ] Ward (points)
[ ] Ward (stoppage)

Amir Kahn vs. Zab Judah
[ ] Kahn (points)
[ ] Kahn (stoppage)
[ ] Zab (points)
[x ] Zab (stoppage)

Saul Alvarez vs. Ryan Rhodes, who will win?
[ ] Alvarez (points)
[x ] Alvarez (stoppage)
[ ] Rhodes (points)
[ ] Rhodes (stoppage)

Vitali Klitschko vs. Tomasz Adamek, who will win?
[ ] Dr. Ironfist (points)
[x ] Dr. Ironfist (stoppage)
[ ] Adamek (points)
[ ] Adamek (stoppage)

Manny Pacquiao vs. Juan Manuel Marquez, who will win?
[x ] Pacman (points)
[ ] Pacman (stoppage)
[ ] Dinamita (points)
[ ] Dinamita (stoppage)

Sergio Martinez vs. TBA, who will win?
[x ] Martinez all the way
[ ] TBA
[ ] lolwut

-----------------


:pimp:

Lebron23 06-20-2011 10:37 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
I am very impressed with the Performance of Alvarez and Bronner in the last weekend. They are finally starting to showcase their boxing skills againts top 10 rank opponents in their respective Divisions.

Tarik One 06-20-2011 12:10 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
I've seen Alvarez maybe 5 or more times now and he is definitely getting better each time he fights.


Shame Rhodes couldn't hang in there, thought he gave it his all, I don't remember him trying to hold on once. Shame he couldn't get more punches off.


You can't forget just how young that kid is, people will go on about his record, but he is moving up levels quickly now and fighting people at least with enough heart to make him work.


I don't want to jump on the band wagon, but this kid is gonna be great.

SCREWstonRockets 06-21-2011 12:22 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RedBlackAttack
I made a similar point about Andre Ward about a month ago...

He has all of the tangible things that general sports fans usually look for in their 'golden boy' fighters -- aside from style -- and yet he is almost completely unknown outside of hardcore boxing circles...

Gold Medalist - check
World Champion - check
Undefeated - check
American - check
Likeable - check

...throw in the fact that he has beaten (dominated) top tier talent recently and it is mind-boggling that he isn't more well known. Usually, the Gold Medal alone will make a fighter who turns professional one of the stars of the sport. He hasn't just gone pro, he has dominated some of the best in the world... And no one seems to care.

I realize that he doesn't have the tailor-made style for a huge draw, but there have been plenty of defensive-minded Olympic champions that became huge names.

I'm pretty much at a total loss as to the lack of promotion that Ward gets. Sergio Martinez is a certified star in comparison to Ward. The question is, do we blame Dan Goossen or is it just that the public hasn't embraced him for whatever reason? I feel like his accomplishments should be out there a little more than they currently are.

I disagree to a certain extent about Ward. I don't think he's entertaining enough to be a star. He doesn't have a fan friendly style. It seems as if he just wants to do just enough to win. We haven't seen him take chances. His fights aren't exactly crowd pleasing and his last fight against Abe was a snooze fest. Besides boxing purist, he isn't wowing many out there. He isn't the type of fighter that we will see in many Fight of the Year matches.

To become a star in boxing, I believe you have to bring some sort of entertainment to the ring. Some drama, something compelling in his matches. So far, Ward doesn't bring much of that. Sure, he has great resume, but that can only get you so far. When you lack excitement in the ring, it'll have to come from elsewhere. Unfortunately, his down to earth, soft spoken personality works against him in this area.

At the end of the day, boxing is an entertainment business. If you're not entertaining the masses, then you're ceiling isn't very high. To be fair, I don't think we've seen him in the ring with somebody that can push him to the limits and force him to take chances and do more than just get the W.

dwight20-20 06-21-2011 12:35 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
I'm going to box my friend this summer. I am stronger and 10 inches taller but he might have speed on me. Neither of us have ever boxed before. Advice?

AirTupac 06-25-2011 07:29 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Felix :bowdown:

Great comeback. Like a champ.

IcanzIIravor 06-25-2011 07:45 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DonD13
Good luck!
Specially with Zab lol
nah, I'm not counting him out but I don't think he can handle Kahn's speed, size, reach, workrate...

Common guys fill out your cards!!

at the end of the year the winner gets a e-high-five or something


Ha ha, I don't know why exactly, but I've always been a bit of a fan of Zab. Guy has so much talent it is sad he has been a mental midget when it comes to his super fights.

Reef 06-25-2011 08:40 PM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Alexander vs. Matthyse tonight. Solid fight. Matthyse is dangerous. If Devon can hang with him, it should put him right back in the mix.

Reef 06-26-2011 12:27 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Spoiler Alert:









Wow, what a bullshit decision again for Alexander. Some judge had it 96-93 for Devon..wtf. He should have 3 losses on his record now.

DonDadda59 06-26-2011 01:28 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Matthysse gets jobbed again :mad:

He has wins over Judah and Alexander in my book and is still undefeated. Devon got some old fashioned home cooking tonight.

And the WBC needs to stop with that silver, sapphire, cubic zirconia belt bullshit. Now we have to watch that dude who KO'ed a terrible Ray Austin get beaten like a drum in Germany against one of the Klits :facepalm

raiderfan19 06-26-2011 07:43 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
When mentioning good to great fighters that aren't nearly as big a star as they should be, doesn't Bernard Hopkins have to take the cake? Hes absolutely an all time great(Id probably have him top 25), is doing amazing and unprecedented things for his age, is probably the 2nd most dominant middleweight champ ever(or was), and yet hes never actually been a star other than to huge boxing fans.

raiderfan19 06-26-2011 07:43 AM

Re: All Purpose Boxing Discussion Thread
 
Oh and Im really tired of Devon Alexander


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