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-   -   Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse) (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=112397)

brwnman 12-09-2008 11:10 AM

Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
Me and my friend were just kicking around ideas, and actually got to something that might make semi-sense.

AP + Joey G + (1st if needed to sweeten the deal)

for

Shane Battier + Luther Head

Yes, Joey is playing well and AP is an expirer as well, and that is exactly why you look to trade them. From our side, it's pretty clear why we need Shane and as for Head, we don't really need him, but to make contracts match. Head expires after this year as well.

For Houston, it's sort of sketchy but actually makes sense for them. Shane Battier still has 2 years remaining on his contract and while he's a good spot starter whenever they have injuries, they actually add to their depth at the wings. Head is not playing at all for them and Joey gives them another guy with size along with AP who could do those spot-start duties when injuries happen. Another plus point is the fact that AP expires, Joey expires and if needed, there's also a first round pick for Houston.

Jason Kapono + Andrea Bargnani + Will Solmon

for

Richard Jefferson + Malik Allen

Milwaukee is going nowhere and their roster needs a shake up. Obviously this is a 3 for 2 trade and we'll need to add a minimum third string PG to make our roster reach 13. That's besides the point. This trade completes our starting lineup and would help us compete with the best of 'em when it comes playoff time. Milwaukee does this trade to simply get Andrea Bargnani, a big with big upside and has been playing decent D, so he will get minutes under Skiles. Also, Richard Jefferson has been below average to average for Milwaukee and recently got benched along with most of the starting lineup against the Lakers for some subpar D and even offense. With Toronto, he'll share with people the number 2 scorer spot with 2 other guys and our starting lineup would be able to compete with the best of 'em.


Pros:
C: J. O'Neal
PF: C. Bosh
SF: R. Jefferson
SG: S. Battier
PG: J. Calderon

need I say more?

Okay fine, I will. Size in the starting unit. I think this will be one of the our strengths as most of our guys will be above average when it comes to size on D and will disrupt the passing lanes a lot. We also get a slasher we've always coveted and a lockdown defender in Battier.

Another pro out of this is that we get Head, and he can actually share the duties at point with Roko whenever either one of them is off.

Cons:

Depth - Big issue here. If O'Neal or Bosh go down, we'd be majorly f*cked! But if we are to think like that and not take some risks, we might be left to mediocrity for the next couple of years. This may force us to go small at times with Moon at PF, but gotta take our chances.

Bench in general - If Roko and Head are out there together, that leaves our bench really short.

Size (froncourt): On the bench we'll have Malik Allen and Kris Humphries; we'd be thin. I think if Jawai could come back that would solve a lot of our issues or we may have to go in the FA bin and pick up a big to play spot minutes here and there.

So what do ya think, ish?

Fair enough? Or trades balancing one way or the other...

RapsFan 12-09-2008 11:13 AM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
Not bad trades.

RJ didn't get benced though really. He had serious foul trouble and by the time the 4th came, it was a blow out so the starters were 'benched', which happens in most blow outs. Skiles has praised RJ a lot, so I am not sure they would be looking to move him. Redd actually might be the guy the prefer to move.

Also, Battier is in no way a SG. He's be play off the pine as a 30 min per guy backing up at the 3 and 4....which is fine. Still a SG issue. Malik and Hump off the pine is great for backup bigs IMO. Head with them actually gives us a very solid bench.

Sekman 12-09-2008 11:36 AM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
hard to imagine both trades actually happening..

especially the RJ one, when they gave up Yi for some toughness, don't know if they wanna bring Bargs (similar to Yi) back

Redd can make threes like Kapono..

brwnman 12-09-2008 11:40 AM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RapsFan
Not bad trades.

RJ didn't get benced though really. He had serious foul trouble and by the time the 4th came, it was a blow out so the starters were 'benched', which happens in most blow outs. Skiles has praised RJ a lot, so I am not sure they would be looking to move him. Redd actually might be the guy the prefer to move.

Also, Battier is in no way a SG. He's be play off the pine as a 30 min per guy backing up at the 3 and 4....which is fine. Still a SG issue. Malik and Hump off the pine is great for backup bigs IMO. Head with them actually gives us a very solid bench.


With Battier, I'm not sure if he's not a SG. I think SG/SF doesn't have to do much when you have guys that can rotate and guard both positions. Ofcourse you have guys that are subjected to one position on the floor because of size/stiffness (ala Joey Graham). But if you can guard like Battier can, I don't think position matters much; they become interchangeable. Also, on offense, all battier gotta do it spot up and shoot. RJ will do the cutting/slashing and penetrating.

Yes, RJ was in foul trouble, but when you're losing big and have to come back, coaches leave your best players in. But Skiles gave up on the game in the 3rd Q :wtf: I'll be honest and say that I haven't watched Milwaukee much and I thought about Redd, but his price is too hefty for the Raps to be able to match and Jefferson helps more than Redd in our situation to me...

Valliant13 12-09-2008 11:48 AM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by brwnman
Me and my friend were just kicking around ideas, and actually got to something that might make semi-sense.

AP + Joey G + (1st if needed to sweeten the deal)

for

Shane Battier + Luther Head


Jason Kapono + Andrea Bargnani + Will Solmon

for

Richard Jefferson + Malik Allen


Fair enough? Or trades balancing one way or the other...


I would love the Battier+ Head one, but doubt the Rockets see enough value in parker- graham to pull the trigger even with a first added. It's not ridiculous by any means, but with their injury issues I can't see them sacraficing depth for a fairly moderate return. Still, if they actually have Artest in their long term plans...it's not out of the question with a pick(or picks) added.

The second one I like, and see as more likely, but I worry about the depth hit. I wouldn't be outraged if it happened...but I would far prefer someone like Gerald Wallace with that package.

Valliant13 12-09-2008 11:50 AM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by brwnman
I'll be honest and say that I haven't watched Milwaukee much and I thought about Redd, but his price is too hefty for the Raps to be able to match and Jefferson helps more than Redd in our situation to me...



I have no interest in Redd. He's badly overpaid, and only hurt the Raps already poor defense. If we are moving Bargs we need athleticism and D on the wing.

Chamberlain 12-09-2008 12:08 PM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
Redd hurt the Raptor's defence? I'm not going to try to make a case for him as being one of the best one-on-one defenders in the league, but the reason he fell into the second round of the draft was because of his lack of offensive potential. He was drafted on the sole basis that he was a solid defender, and while he may not be a superb NBA defender, he can definetly hold his own.

bonez26 12-09-2008 12:46 PM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
Two pretty good trades IMO although it would leave us a little thin up fron but we could sign a min FA to fill the hole. Also instead of Head (think he's too small for our lineup) I would ask for Von Wafer instead. Atheletic...plays hard and a pure scorer slasher to be included instead of head.

bada bing 12-09-2008 02:07 PM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcours
 
i like both those trades. These two give us a very strong startling lineup and really boost the raptors. I doubt this can happen but they are very good trades.....

Sekman 12-09-2008 02:20 PM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
sort of long and not worth reading ><

gimme back my 5 minutes!

:oldlol:

jrcp3 12-09-2008 05:13 PM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
The bucks just traded for Richard Jefferson ...... he's going to be there corner stone of the team since Redd will leave soon .... NO WAY that is happening as for Houston they wouldn't trade that because there GOING FOR A CHAMPIONSHIP this year and they need ever player they can get, Battier is a top league dender and there is no way they are letting him go for that price ...... at least not this year since they are in the hunt for the championship .......

jrcp3 12-09-2008 05:18 PM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
It's not really a individual defense that is wrong with us, if that was the case JOSE HAS TO GO! He get beat EVERY TIME ....... it's really more of a " TEAM CONCEPT that they all have to buy into and play TEAM DEFENSE well ..... 1 player isn't going to make a big difference .......

Houston has 3 Top 5 Defenders in the league and there struggling

Battier ( Top defender )
Artest ( Best in the league? )
Yao Ming ( 7'5 Blocks and no one will come in the lane )
Rafer ( Good defense, considering he plays hard and steals )
Scola ( Just watch him play )
Chuck Hayes .....

and there not even the best team in the league with all that .......

It's all about TEAM defense and some part individual 1 player isn't going to solve nothing, if anything Jose needs to step his defense up the most it all starts with the PG, you put pressure on the PG it's going to make everything alot harder, but jose doesn't so all the PG's have there way .....

brwnman 12-09-2008 05:47 PM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
Artest is overrated defensively.

Battier just came back from injury (and occasionally gets lit up).

But Houston is struggling as a whole team because they have a tough schedule and their offensive guns aren't producing at all. They are shooting horribly from the perimeter...

Toni 12-09-2008 06:30 PM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
i dont mind your trades.. although depth will be a problem for us.. what i believe is that if you have a really strong starting lineup your bench will usually become more improved over time.. kinda like with the celtics.. veterans will always want to play with a championship contending starting lineup like cassell and pj brown.. and im sure we can sign young d-leaguers that can get the job done.. if we add one or two quality pieces at SG & SF and bolster a lineup that already includes superstar Bosh and fringe allstars (being generous) O'Neal & Jose.. we may be able to do something special this year, its still early.. if we can get a battier/butler/jefferson type player even for a bargs package will be pretty huge for us.. good trades though i actually like how we get something valuable in return unlike some of the other trades i see posted..

new noise 12-10-2008 06:23 AM

Re: Yes... ANOTHER trade proposal (2 of 'em - sort of long, but worth reading ofcourse)
 
I suppose if we can turn Parker & Graham into a solid starter, Battier wouldn't be the worst possible option. Probably about the best kind of scenario we can hope for at this point.


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