Tatum outplayed Giannis in 4/7 games

If you out-play someone the majority of the games (at least 4) then I would say you won the duel. So in this case, Tatum outplayed Giannis.

[B]Game 2[/B]: Tatum 29 points 65% TS and 11 BPM VS Giannis 28 points on 45% TS

Tatum clearly outplayed Giannis here as Giannis was awful

[B]Game 4: [/B]Tatum had 10 points in 4th quarter taking over and winning. 28 on 56% TS a 10% higher TS over Giannis 46% TS

[B]Game 6:[/B] Tatum had 46 points on 66% TS and hit huge clutch shots. This one also edge to Tatum

[B]Game 7:[/B] Tatum had a great passing game and set up grant Williams for a lot of his shots. Giannis had a great 1st quarter but was terrible after that with more shots then points at 25 points on 26 shots. Tatum had two less points on 12 less shots so just a way more efficient + better passing game then Giannis

[IMG]https://thumbs.gfycat.com/FearlessSoupyAntarcticgiantpetrel-size_restricted.gif[/IMG]

It's a solid case. I still think Giannis outplayed him by a huge margin in the 3 other games, so Giannis gets the nod for the series overall, considering he played without his #2 option and completely dominated Tatum defensively whenever JT tried to attack the paint. Game 6 is really close and Game 7 is a wash as Giannis got next to no help from his teammates while JT only had 6 pts on 6 shots in the 2nd half and his teammates dominated.

Tatum is getting the 2021 Booker treatment. People are all of a sudden acting like he's a top 5 guy because he's playing on the best team, when it's been a complete team effort and he hasn't had to show up in every win for them to advance the Playoffs, and hasn't been the most valuable player on the defensive side on the court. I was leaning towards JT having a top 5 case after the 1st round, but I'm not completely sold on him as the guy who could consistently carry his team. His skillset doesn't really match a top 5 guy. I feel like there's more than 5 players who could win in his place in Boston with how solid that team is overall. None of the advanced metrics point to him being a top 5 player in these POs. Horford leads the team in WS, BPM and is tied in VORP despite playing 52 less minutes. Jaylen Brown is right there statistically as well.

I think the Bucks' style of defense was almost perfect for his game, as they were willing to give up the open 3 and he feasted on those shots to his credit. Game 7 was the perfect example of why the Celtics beat the Bucks. It wasn't because JT was as good or that he outplayed Giannis when it mattered, it's just that he had far more help and could take off possessions while Giannis was the Bucks' entire offense and also had to carry their defense, and had nothing left in the tank as he was blowing layups that he made with ease in the 3 previous games and his team shot 1/14 from 3 in the 2nd half while the Celtics' role players carried the 2nd half of that game.

Both > kawhit

[QUOTE=ImKobe;14601525]It's a solid case. I still think Giannis outplayed him by a huge margin in the 3 other games, so Giannis gets the nod for the series overall, considering he played without his #2 option and completely dominated Tatum defensively whenever JT tried to attack the paint. Game 6 is really close and Game 7 is a wash as Giannis got next to no help from his teammates while JT only had 6 pts on 6 shots in the 2nd half and his teammates dominated.

Tatum is getting the 2021 Booker treatment. People are all of a sudden acting like he's a top 5 guy because he's playing on the best team, when it's been a complete team effort and he hasn't had to show up in every win for them to advance the Playoffs, and hasn't been the most valuable player on the defensive side on the court. I was leaning towards JT having a top 5 case after the 1st round, but I'm not completely sold on him as the guy who could consistently carry his team. His skillset doesn't really match a top 5 guy. I feel like there's more than 5 players who could win in his place in Boston with how solid that team is overall. None of the advanced metrics point to him being a top 5 player in these POs. Horford leads the team in WS, BPM and is tied in VORP despite playing 52 less minutes. Jaylen Brown is right there statistically as well.

I think the Bucks' style of defense was almost perfect for his game, as they were willing to give up the open 3 and he feasted on those shots to his credit. Game 7 was the perfect example of why the Celtics beat the Bucks. It wasn't because JT was as good or that he outplayed Giannis when it mattered, it's just that he had far more help and could take off possessions while Giannis was the Bucks' entire offense and also had to carry their defense, and had nothing left in the tank as he was blowing layups that he made with ease in the 3 previous games and his team shot 1/14 from 3 in the 2nd half while the Celtics' role players carried the 2nd half of that game.[/QUOTE]
Solid Post!!!

I wouldn’t call a lot of his threes open. A lot were contested

Jaylen Brown came out of the series with this to say….


[QUOTE][I]“Giannis is the best player in the world. You can see why a lot of people say that,” Celtics guard Jaylen Brown said. “He’s just relentless in his approach. He is aggressive all the time. He’s not going to be denied. And that was tough for us in the series.”[/I] [/QUOTE]



For whatever that’s worth

[QUOTE=ImKobe;14601525]It's a solid case. I still think Giannis outplayed him by a huge margin in the 3 other games, so Giannis gets the nod for the series overall, considering he played without his #2 option and completely dominated Tatum defensively whenever JT tried to attack the paint. Game 6 is really close and Game 7 is a wash as Giannis got next to no help from his teammates while JT only had 6 pts on 6 shots in the 2nd half and his teammates dominated.

Tatum is getting the 2021 Booker treatment. People are all of a sudden acting like he's a top 5 guy because he's playing on the best team, when it's been a complete team effort and he hasn't had to show up in every win for them to advance the Playoffs, and hasn't been the most valuable player on the defensive side on the court. I was leaning towards JT having a top 5 case after the 1st round, but I'm not completely sold on him as the guy who could consistently carry his team. His skillset doesn't really match a top 5 guy. I feel like there's more than 5 players who could win in his place in Boston with how solid that team is overall. None of the advanced metrics point to him being a top 5 player in these POs. Horford leads the team in WS, BPM and is tied in VORP despite playing 52 less minutes. Jaylen Brown is right there statistically as well.

I think the Bucks' style of defense was almost perfect for his game, as they were willing to give up the open 3 and he feasted on those shots to his credit. Game 7 was the perfect example of why the Celtics beat the Bucks. It wasn't because JT was as good or that he outplayed Giannis when it mattered, it's just that he had far more help and could take off possessions while Giannis was the Bucks' entire offense and also had to carry their defense, and had nothing left in the tank as he was blowing layups that he made with ease in the 3 previous games and his team shot 1/14 from 3 in the 2nd half while the Celtics' role players carried the 2nd half of that game.[/QUOTE]

if you watch 2nd half of game 7 though, tatum was playing point guard. Bucks were also cramming the paint and Tatum was finding Grant and others for wide open threes.

Tatum is playing with more of a flow and chemistry with his teammates. While Giannis just seems to be out there playing by himself. This is a credit to Tatum though as he put his role players more to use.

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855;14601773]Jaylen Brown came out of the series with this to say….






For whatever that’s worth[/QUOTE]

Tatum was drafted later and is younger, so he probably feels like a younger brother to Jaylen.

And just showing respect to Giannis and the opponent.

So i wouldn't take much from the quote in terms of comparing tatum and giannis these playoffs.

By the look of things, you would actually think Giannis is much better on defense because he's tall ripped more intimidating and has the DPOTY award. But i actually feel Tatum's defense has been much more impactful these playoffs and the entire season. So that's one thing i have working for Tatum in his favor as well. Also Tatum is obviously a way better floor spacer with his 3 point shooting. So the only major advantage i see for Giannis is rebounds.

Tatum just has bad luck in his era because he happens to be playing in the same league as prime Lebron\Kawhi\Durant. Competing with 3 GOAT SF's.

So i think that's why he was a 3rd team in this era. Tatum was clearly all defense level in 2020 but kawhi got it instead. I do think the media should and will finally wake up and give Tatum his 1st team all nba and 1st team all defense this season though.

He outplayed KD and Giannis in back to back series.

[QUOTE=WhiteKyrie;14601912]He outplayed KD and Giannis in back to back series.[/QUOTE]


Giannis was quite comfortably the best player in that series. Not even a discussion.

[QUOTE=plowking;14601915]Giannis was quite comfortably the best player in that series. Not even a discussion.[/QUOTE]
Not in those decisive games. Boston apart from some possessions here and there could’ve ended the series earlier

[QUOTE=WhiteKyrie;14601912]He outplayed KD and Giannis in back to back series.[/QUOTE]

Agreed. He humiliated Durant and then slightly outplayed Giannis.

[QUOTE=plowking;14601915]Giannis was quite comfortably the best player in that series. Not even a discussion.[/QUOTE]

Giannis averaged about 48% TS in the 4 losses, he wasn't comfortably doing shit.

[QUOTE=WhiteKyrie;14601917]Not in those decisive games. Boston apart from some possessions here and there could’ve ended the series earlier[/QUOTE]

Every game is decisive. Tatum might have outplayed Giannis by a slim margin in 4 out of 7 games but Giannis also outplayed Tatum when JT only had 10 pts on 19 shots in a 2-point loss while Giannis had to put up 42/12/8 in a very close win. If Giannis went for 10 pts on 21% shooting and got outplayed like that, there's no chance the Bucks would have even had a shot at winning the game. Some here said that Giannis was bad or not good enough in Game 7 with a 25/20/9 stat line, there's no way anyone would say that if Tatum put up those numbers. OP himself ITT said that JT outplayed Giannis with 23/6/8 7 TOs vs 25/20/9 6 TOs because of the FG%, despite Tatum being a non-factor as a scorer in the 2nd half with Grant Williams and Pritchard scoring most of the points to put the game away.

I'm not willing to go so far as to say Tatum outplayed Giannis. You can argue he did in a couple games, but like ImKobe, I saw Giannis as the best player on the floor for the series as a whole.

That said, Tatum stepped up huge when it mattered. His stock has gone up a lot this post season.

It's much easier to 'outplay' someone when you have the better team behind you, which Tatum clearly did especially with Middleton out. What do you think is the result of Tatum on the Bucks, and Giannis on the Celtics? You really think Tatum is coming out on top? As it was he needed 7 games to beat an under-manned Bucks squad.

And 'outplay' in this context is weird anyway. They're not positionally playing against each other. It's not like Hakeem murking Admiral in 95, THAT's a case where one player went directly head to head with someone over a series and outplayed their primary defender.

He outplayed KD, not Giannis. Al was the best Celtics of this series by game 5, then Tatum started taking over.

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855;14601773]Jaylen Brown came out of the series with this to say….






For whatever that’s worth[/QUOTE]

that is how the league looks at him. Durant stated once : " he will always get his"

giannis put up raw stats but wasn't efficient. kind of similar to lebron's 2015 finals. lebron had a bad back and couldn't shoot a jumper all season though. giannis has no excuse. he also choked in gm 7 with his team down 3 at the half he scores 8 points on 4-16 shooting in the 2nd half, including 2 points on 1-7 fgs in the 4th qtr.

[QUOTE=Johnny32;14602217]giannis put up raw stats but wasn't efficient. kind of similar to lebron's 2015 finals. lebron had a bad back and couldn't shoot a jumper all season though. giannis has no excuse. he also choked in gm 7 with his team down 3 at the half he scores 8 points on 4-16 shooting in the 2nd half, including 2 points on 1-7 fgs in the 4th qtr.[/QUOTE]

He really shot 4-16 in the second half?

[QUOTE=Phoenix;14602101]It's much easier to 'outplay' someone when you have the better team behind you, which Tatum clearly did especially with Middleton out. What do you think is the result of Tatum on the Bucks, and Giannis on the Celtics? You really think Tatum is coming out on top? As it was he needed 7 games to beat an under-manned Bucks squad.

And 'outplay' in this context is weird anyway. They're not positionally playing against each other. It's not like Hakeem murking Admiral in 95, THAT's a case where one player went directly head to head with someone over a series and outplayed their primary defender.[/QUOTE]
It’s not even a knock on Tatum, but swap him and Giannis and idk if the Bucks even win a game.

[QUOTE=hold this L;14602384]He really shot 4-16 in the second half?[/QUOTE]
He shot 4-17 after starting 6-9. His TS% for the series was 51.6% which is abysmal, especially for a guy who normally has a 63.3 TS%. Giannis isn’t held to LeBron standards though so everyone will say he was perfect.

Most analysts understand that Antetokuonmpo did all that he possibly could. Anyone criticizing the series he had should look at what the Celtic defense managed to do to KD. He needed Middleton really. Anyone that doesn't get how Giannis could have played well in slow of his shooting stats is going to be shocked at what the Celtic defense does to the Heat. The team record makes it harder to believe but this Celtic defense is one of the nastiest I've ever seen especially if Robert Williams stays on the floor.

[QUOTE=RRR3;14602396]He shot 4-17 after starting 6-9. His TS% for the series was 51.6% which is abysmal, especially for a guy who normally has a 63.3 TS%. Giannis isn’t held to LeBron standards though so everyone will say he was perfect.[/QUOTE]

Bingo. People only look at numbers but the efficiency is trash

[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green;14602397]Most analysts understand that Antetokuonmpo did all that he possibly could. Anyone criticizing the series he had should look at what the Celtic defense managed to do to KD. He needed Middleton really. Anyone that doesn't get how Giannis could have played well in slow of his shooting stats is going to be shocked at what the Celtic defense does to the Heat. The team record makes it harder to believe but this Celtic defense is one of the nastiest I've ever seen especially if Robert Williams stays on the floor.[/QUOTE]
Doing all you can is shooting better than 51%, especially when most of your shots are in the paint. As an example, Curry had to deal with box & 1 in 2019 when he lost next to literal G league teammates vs the best defensive team in the playoffs and had a 59% TS. Saying that, Boston's defense is seriously incredible. [U]Might[/U] be early but looks to be one of the best I've ever seen if they keep this up for two more series.

[QUOTE=hold this L;14602451]Doing all you can is shooting better than 51%, especially when most of your shots are in the paint. As an example, Curry had to deal with box & 1 in 2019 when he lost next to literal G league teammates vs the best defensive team in the playoffs and had a 59% TS. Saying that, Boston's defense is seriously incredible. [U]Might[/U] be early but looks to be one of the best I've ever seen if they keep this up for two more series.[/QUOTE]

High effort doesn't mean great shooting percentages. Celtics have two of the best players to defend him with and have the whole defense focused on him. What he needed was for his teammates to hit shots and do more in general. But you don't rebound the way he does if you aren't giving it your all.

giannis is easily the best in the world. he's too big and athletic for the league.

[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green;14602466]High effort doesn't mean great shooting percentages. Celtics have two of the best players to defend him with and have the whole defense focused on him. What he needed was for his teammates to hit shots and do more in general. But you don't rebound the way he does if you aren't giving it your all.[/QUOTE]
Ok, then he did all he tried to do unsuccessfully. He had a horrid shooting series. We're going to find out a lot about what the Celtics are going to do to stars defensively in the next 4 weeks. I don't understand how people can make excuses for a garbage tier shooting series as he did all he can. No, he got his ass locked up offensively. That shouldn't happen at the level to a superstar.

[QUOTE=hold this L;14602554]Ok, then he did all he tried to do unsuccessfully. He had a horrid shooting series. We're going to find out a lot about what the Celtics are going to do to stars defensively in the next 4 weeks. I don't understand how people can make excuses for a garbage tier shooting series as he did all he can. No, he got his ass locked up offensively. That shouldn't happen at the level to a superstar.[/QUOTE]
you must never heard of the juggernaut iverson. that shit happens, it would happen to curry if he wasnt scared to take more contested midrange shots

[QUOTE=RRR3;14602396]He shot 4-17 after starting 6-9. His TS% for the series was 51.6% which is abysmal, especially for a guy who normally has a 63.3 TS%. Giannis isn’t held to LeBron standards though so everyone will say he was perfect.[/QUOTE]

Lebron shot below 40%FG/48%TS in the 2015 Finals and they were ready to give him FMVP because of his raw averages in a losing effort in 6 games. Delusional stan lmao.

Simply put, Giannis has beaten playoff teams without much contribution from other players. He doesn't have to expect them to hit open shots. Tatum can't. Miami can put the clamps down on Tatum - see the second half of the game today. The Bucks defense against three point shooters is to let them shoot. That is conducive for Tatum's style of play. But to be honest OP you shouldn't be at this level of understanding the game.