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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
In one of my high school games two days ago, one of our players made a 3 and got fouled literally 2 seconds after, so we thought it was an and1. But, they said it was after the shot. So the other team in bounded the ball and our second best player fouled him at half court and he picked up his fourth. When our coach looked at the score board he saw the other team had 7 fouls (the last one from the foul after the made 3) and complained to the refs that he should have shot a bonus free throw after the 3. So after 10 minutes of discussion, he got to shot the bonus and our player didnt get his 4th.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green]Whether or not the game should have been close enough for the call to matter is an issue for the Cs to deal with internally in terms of coaching up the players a little better and addressing weaknesses. The refs still have a responsibility to make that situation right.[/QUOTE]
From what I read, the league office said it was the right thing to do. So apparently it was made right. Just not to your satisfaction.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
Whenever refs make a mistake (and this was probably just an honest mistake) and uncover it after some damage has been done, they're bound to reslove it in some way that noone likes. In the case of this Cs game, the refs probably figured that they were either going to have Rivers yelling at them all night for scoring the basket or both Rivers and McMillan yelling at them, Rivers figuring that all their anti-Celt calls were bad and McMillan upset at them for taking away a scored basket, which may or may not be permissible by the rules. They chose to only have to deal with screaming from one instead of two.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=reppy]From what I read, the league office said it was the right thing to do. So apparently it was made right. Just not to your satisfaction.[/QUOTE]
Well, I'd say that they then followed the procedure correctly post-screw-up, but they didn't make things "right." It was still two points that the Blazers ought not have had. Oh well though, it's just one game.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
Now if you want to blame them for missing the 6 six players on the court, then yeah, I'm with you there. That's pretty bad. But y'know, refs miss a ton of obvious stuff. If any player was called for every bit of contact, every dirty movie, then the entire league would foul out in 10 minutes.
And I imagine the rule will be modified or changed soon to take this type of situation into account.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
I'm saying that, given the info you provided (I didn't know that the league said they acted correctly) they did the best they could under the circumstance. But that isn't the same thing as making it "right."
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=gts]took awhile but here's the rule...
[quote]Section III
d. It is the responsibility of each team to have the proper number of players on the court
when play begins. Failure to do so will result in a technical foul being assessed and charged
to the team.
EXCEPTION: If the violation occurs on (1) a free throw attempt which is to be followed
by another free throw attempt, or (2) a free throw attempt that is not going to remain
in play, (3) throw-in before the ball is released, or (4) jump ball before the ball is released.
[/quote]
[url]http://www.nba.com/media/2008-09-NBARuleBook.pdf[/url]
page 40[/QUOTE]
Did you guys even read that post? That post should end all discussion on this thread.
/Fin
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
Coming from someone who has refereed games before, the hardest stuff to spot is the unusual, no matter how obvious. You are conditioned to look for specific things so much that you have to filter out everything else. You've got 3 refs, and they are supposed to watch 10 guys for hip checks, hand slaps, illegal screens, travelling, double dribble, 3 in the key(both ways), and a few other things, as well. You think they count the number of players on the floor for every possession?
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green] It was still two points that the Blazers ought not have had. [/QUOTE]
But that happens ALL THE TIME. A shot counts when his foot was on the line. Someone blocks a shot but it should have been goaltending. A missed foul. A shot counts as a 3 that shouldn't. On and on and on...... Mistakes are part of the game. Refs made a mistake in not catching it. It happens.
It's just that this mistake was a doozy and comical. But still an honest mistake by refs, which partly got corrected with the technical foul.
I didn't watch the game, but I bet there was "make up call" immediately after that. Probably some phantom foul called on the Blazers. Happens all the time......
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
I saw no make-up call. Whatever though.
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Re: The NBA of 2009: 6 on 5!
[QUOTE=pete's montreux]Here's the scenario:
Boston @ Portland, end of the second quarter, 10.1 seconds left on the clock. Portland is passing the ball inbounds with six players in the game. Oden gets the ball and passes to Outlaw for the jam to end the half. The entire Celtics team and staff are going insane.
The referee's say it was their mistake, they allow the basket, and Boston shoots a technical free throw.
Let me say that again, they allowed the basket.
Refs call the league office, their response is that it's a technicality and the bucket is good, and there's nothing they can do about it.
What's to stop a team for having 6 guys on the floor at any given time to score a three? All the other team gets is a technical free throw.
Absurd. I don't even want to watch the NBA anymore.[/QUOTE]
don't watch it then, celtics suck anyways
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Re: The NBA of 2009: 6 on 5!
[QUOTE=pete's montreux]Here's the scenario:
Boston @ Portland, end of the second quarter, 10.1 seconds left on the clock. Portland is passing the ball inbounds with six players in the game. Oden gets the ball and passes to Outlaw for the jam to end the half. The entire Celtics team and staff are going insane.
The referee's say it was their mistake, they allow the basket, and Boston shoots a technical free throw.
Let me say that again, they allowed the basket.
Refs call the league office, their response is that it's a technicality and the bucket is good, and there's nothing they can do about it.
What's to stop a team for having 6 guys on the floor at any given time to score a three? All the other team gets is a technical free throw.
Absurd. I don't even want to watch the NBA anymore.[/QUOTE]
oh noes!!1 and nothing ever happened to KG when he pushed a ref . so what?
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Re: The NBA of 2009: 6 on 5!
[QUOTE= pete's montreux]The referee's say it was their mistake, they allow the basket, and Boston shoots a technical free throw.
Let me say that again, they allowed the basket.[/QUOTE]
how often are points taken away on technical fouls?
trying to go back and i can't remember points being taken away on a tech...
anyone?
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
LOL I can picture it right now:
Mike D'Antoni realizes he can use this to his advantage.
He spreads the floor with 5 shooters all around the perimeter.
Jerome James sits under the basket with the camera people
All of a sudden, Jerome James puts down his popcorn, gets up and catches a pass from Duhon and scores.
Opponents inbound ball.
plus 1 for the knicks!
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=PK3434]LOL I can picture it right now:
[/QUOTE]
How fast do you think Stern would fine the Knicks?
C'mon, it was an honest mistake by Blazers and refs. If teams tried this purposely, the organization would be fined or worse.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green]I'm saying that, given the info you provided (I didn't know that the league said they acted correctly) they did the best they could under the circumstance. But that isn't the same thing as making it "right."[/QUOTE]
Really? That's the tack your gonna take?
How about "making right" the [b]four[/b] steps by Pierce that magically turned into a foul?
How about "making right" the Tony Allen foul that occurred almost two seconds and 18 feet from the shot, yet was still a shooting foul?
How about "making right" the stiff arm push from Rondo that allowed him to put up a three on Blake late in the game?
How about "making right" the flagrant 1 that should have been called on Eddie House as it's league policy to call any excessive contact at the neck or higher a flagrant?
How about "making right" the travelling call on Jerryd Bayless as he crossed over Ray Allen, despite the fact that he took one step before dribbling, not three?
How about "making right" the obvious technical during Sergio Rodrigez's foul shots as Paul Pierce stood out of place, directly in front of Sergio, stopping the play to talk trash?
You know, as long as we're holding the refs to the standard of "making it right"...
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=JordanL]Really? That's the tack your gonna take?
How about "making right" the [b]four[/b] steps by Pierce that magically turned into a foul?
How about "making right" the Tony Allen foul that occurred almost two seconds and 18 feet from the shot, yet was still a shooting foul?
How about "making right" the stiff arm push from Rondo that allowed him to put up a three on Blake late in the game?
How about "making right" the flagrant 1 that should have been called on Eddie House as it's league policy to call any excessive contact at the neck or higher a flagrant?
How about "making right" the travelling call on Jerryd Bayless as he crossed over Ray Allen, despite the fact that he took one step before dribbling, not three?
How about "making right" the obvious technical during Sergio Rodrigez's foul shots as Paul Pierce stood out of place, directly in front of Sergio, stopping the play to talk trash?
You know, as long as we're holding the refs to the standard of "making it right"...[/QUOTE]
some errors are inarguably more egregious than others. First rule of basketball: 5 v 5. even a hothead like you understand this deep inside.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=bagelred]How fast do you think Stern would fine the Knicks?
C'mon, it was an honest mistake by Blazers and refs. If teams tried this purposely, the organization would be fined or worse.[/QUOTE]
i know..i was just joking around.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
Someone mentioned that this whole fiasco was a morale breaker for the Celtics which lead to the loss and that couldn't be more true... but, that doesn't mean its a valid excuse. Garnett lets this type of thing get into his head way too much, even though taking things too seriously often works to his advantage. It simply didn't last night.
When you have as much influence over younger players like Garnett does you have to lead by example. I'm not going to lie, though... this whole thing is pretty funny.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=nosurrender]some errors are inarguably more egregious than others. First rule of basketball: 5 v 5. even a hothead like you understand this deep inside.[/QUOTE]
More egregious? No. Do they make the officials look like bigger idiots? Yes.
But all of those calls I listed above have as much of a point impact as the 6v5 situation, and the [b]point impact[/b] is what directly affects the game. The Rondo pushoff for example is a potential six point swing.
I haven't been complaining about the refs, I was reacting to the ridiculous insinuation by RMWG that certain errors should be corrected based on a karma type arrangement instead of the letter of the rules, especially when you start with a low-impact rule such as the whining, sniviling complaint that he levied.
You guys were a trash team two season ago, yet you already forgot how to lose... suck it up and move on. Christ, you guys act like Portland was sitting behind the scorers table, cackling as they added points by pressing a button. Get over yourselves.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
"Morale Breaker?" It pissed the Cs off but didn't break the team's spirit, Garnett, Pierce, etc. were still playing hard and focused. They just lost. What really killed the team was getting beat on the boards, which was happening both before and after 6 on 5.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=JordanL]More egregious? No. Do they make the officials look like bigger idiots? Yes.
But all of those calls I listed above have as much of a point impact as the 6v5 situation, and the [b]point impact[/b] is what directly affects the game. The Rondo pushoff for example is a potential six point swing.
I haven't been complaining about the refs, I was reacting to the ridiculous insinuation by RMWG that certain errors should be corrected based on a karma type arrangement instead of the letter of the rules, especially when you start with a low-impact rule such as the whining, sniviling complaint that he levied.
You guys were a trash team two season ago, yet you already forgot how to lose... suck it up and move on. Christ, you guys act like Portland was sitting behind the scorers table, cackling as they added points by pressing a button. Get over yourselves.[/QUOTE]
this isn't about point impact. this is about the very foundation of the fuc*ing game.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=JordanL]More egregious? No. Do they make the officials look like bigger idiots? Yes.
But all of those calls I listed above have as much of a point impact as the 6v5 situation, and the [b]point impact[/b] is what directly affects the game. The Rondo pushoff for example is a potential six point swing.
I haven't been complaining about the refs, I was reacting to the ridiculous insinuation by RMWG that certain errors should be corrected based on a karma type arrangement instead of the letter of the rules, especially when you start with a low-impact rule such as the whining, sniviling complaint that he levied.
You guys were a trash team two season ago, yet you already forgot how to lose... suck it up and move on. Christ, you guys act like Portland was sitting behind the scorers table, cackling as they added points by pressing a button. Get over yourselves.[/QUOTE]
I mention a simple fact and you get upset. A bit touchy, it seems. I'm not even making a big deal over it. Whatever though.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green]I saw no make-up call. Whatever though.[/QUOTE]
Thats because you were wearing green colored glasses. The entire 2nd half the Blazers got raped on calls. Actually, the entire game was called terribly both ways.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[quote=JordanL]Really? That's the tack your gonna take?
How about "making right" the [B]four[/B] steps by Pierce that magically turned into a foul?
How about "making right" the Tony Allen foul that occurred almost two seconds and 18 feet from the shot, yet was still a shooting foul?
How about "making right" the stiff arm push from Rondo that allowed him to put up a three on Blake late in the game?
How about "making right" the flagrant 1 that should have been called on Eddie House as it's league policy to call any excessive contact at the neck or higher a flagrant?
How about "making right" the travelling call on Jerryd Bayless as he crossed over Ray Allen, despite the fact that he took one step before dribbling, not three?
How about "making right" the obvious technical during Sergio Rodrigez's foul shots as Paul Pierce stood out of place, directly in front of Sergio, stopping the play to talk trash?
You know, as long as we're holding the refs to the standard of "making it right"...[/quote]
All of those are judgment calls. The 6 v 5 is a procedural call. Big difference.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=Myth]Thats because you were wearing green colored glasses. The entire 2nd half the Blazers got raped on calls. Actually, the entire game was called terribly both ways.[/QUOTE]
Ah. Ok. Whatever.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green]"Morale Breaker?" It pissed the Cs off but didn't break the team's spirit, Garnett, Pierce, etc. were still playing hard and focused. They just lost. What really killed the team was getting beat on the boards, which was happening both before and after 6 on 5.[/QUOTE]
Don't get me wrong. I was for the Celtics in that game, but you can't argue that debating a call like that and eventually having the outcome work in the other teams favor doesn't have some psychological effect. Throw that into the mix with a crowd chanting "Boston Sucks" and you're likely to get frustrated when things aren't going your way. Garnett, more than a lot of players, has difficulty letting things slide off his back and that isn't a criticism. In my opinion it was one of his most admirable traits when he was with the TWolves.
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=pete's montreux]All of those are judgment calls. The 6 v 5 is a procedural call. Big difference.[/QUOTE]
No, whether or not Pierce takes four steps is a factual matter. Whether or not Bayless took three steps is a factual matter. Whether or not Tony Allen was in the act of shooting is a factual matter.
[quote]I mention a simple fact and you get upset. A bit touchy, it seems. I'm not even making a big deal over it. Whatever though.[/quote]
Oh, how clever. ****ing rich. Yeah, all that's been posted by Boston fans for the last 12 hours is how a two point swing cost them a five point game because as Doc said "it got inside their heads". And I'm the one that's a bit touchy.
I'm not touchy, I'm fed up with the bull**** arrogance that Boston fans are posting here, as if they're Garrnett himself. As if they take the winning shot from the 200 level. As if they don't get the most bull**** favorable referreeing I've seen since I've been following the NBA (18 years). I'm fed up with the self-centered idiocracy of Boston fans.
(And in this way I guess not that much of it has to do with you RMWG.)
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
[QUOTE=JordanL]No, whether or not Pierce takes four steps is a factual matter. Whether or not Bayless took three steps is a factual matter. Whether or not Tony Allen was in the act of shooting is a factual matter.
Oh, how clever. ****ing rich. Yeah, all that's been posted by Boston fans for the last 12 hours is how a two point swing cost them a five point game because as Doc said "it got inside their heads". And I'm the one that's a bit touchy.
I'm not touchy, I'm fed up with the bull**** arrogance that Boston fans are posting here, as if they're Garrnett himself. As if they take the winning shot from the 200 level. As if they don't get the most bull**** favorable referreeing I've seen since I've been following the NBA (18 years). I'm fed up with the self-centered idiocracy of Boston fans.
(And in this way I guess not that much of it has to do with you RMWG.)[/QUOTE]
wait so you think that those "factual" judgement call errors are nearly as bad as allowing 6 v 5 basketball about which KG and the whole godd*mn bench was shouting well before the basket went in?
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
i saw the highlight on espn.. i tell you if i were KG or something, i would have gotten a technical straight up... if you look at it, you question what kind of technicality is that they have 6 players but the basket still count?? that conversation shouldnt get passed that... what is that a loop hole?
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
I just saw the replay on ESPN and the ONLY question I have to the league is this :
Will the league review to see how many ref's were on the floor that can't count to 5 ?
If the league is handing out fines , I would really like to hear what they do to the ref's that were officiating the game that night.
As soon as I saw the replay it was quite obvious 6 white jersey's were on the floor. :wtf:
My vote for Rook of year - Oden
[url]http://sports.espn.go.com/broadband/video/videopage?videoId=3801570&categoryId=2459788[/url]
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
If you walk around in the sidelines, sneak under the basket and get an alley-oop, then get called for tech, will they still do the same thing? since you got the dunk 1st b4 being called for the tech
And yeah the nba is getting uglier and uglier. Superstar calls is ruining it. Lebron gets it, kobe gets it, wade gets it, paul gets it and many others. But Boston has the big 3 that gets it and even Rondo is starting to get the "respect" of the refs. Which gives a single game a ton of ugly calls.
Why do it so much. They are superstars and already good on their own, Magnigying and making them look even good on paper just makes them look bad for unbias casual fans
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
Wait was this perfectly done on purpose by McMillan?
Also.. if this happened last last quarter at the Garden you get chaos.
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Re: The NBA of 2009: 6 on 5!
[QUOTE=Sekman]don't watch it then, celtics suck anyways[/QUOTE]
:violin:
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
Boston Sucks, Boston Sucks, Boston Sucks, Boston Sucks, Boston Sucks,
Yah Portland Fans rule
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Re: Blazers score basket against Celtics using six players on the court
sh*t happens all the time... it's not as if this will affect the C's seeding. relax
this reminds me of the game where lebron held on to the rim for 3-4 secs after a dunk. anyone else would have been hit with a T