Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=Abraham Lincoln]The 1992 Knicks be their best team of the Ewing era, with the superior defense. Is thou remarking that the likes of Charles Smith and Glenn Rivers be superior to Xavier McDaniel and Gerald Wilkins? Tis no contest.[/QUOTE]
Anyone who agrees, please raise your hand :oldlol:. '92 Knicks were the big underdogs for a reason, no one thought going in that they were they type of team who could make it out of the second round, or had the defense to contain Jordan. But let me get this straight:
'92 Knicks were the best Ewing era team when they won a) only 51 games, b) were ousted in the second round and c) are no where close to matching the defensive efficiency of the '93 and '94 teams. This doesn't sound like a very wise man to me :no:
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=Fatal9]First of all, this sprained wrist excuse is some sort of a joke right? Didn't bother him vs. the Suns when he averaged 40+ ppg on them? Are you saying the Suns defense was that bad (which could be true actually), that Jordan with a sprained wrist could put up those numbers on them?!
Secondly, it seems like people are actually arguing that Jordan's post 1993 years shouldn't be counted. Sorry, but according to you, wasn't he still the best player in the league back then? Seems like you want to take the good (3 rings, Finals MVPs, Scoring etc etc), and ignore the bad (getting shut down as he finally faces #1 defenses of the league in the playoffs). What's the deal with this? Those years are really what cemented Jordan as GOAT.
I love how now they have managed to turn this into a "top 5 defense" thread, when clearly I was showing his performance against the best defense in the league during the championship years. And frankly, he was horrible, how are people actually denying this?! As with all things, they've also managed to somehow involve Kobe in to a non-Kobe thread.
:oldlol: at trying to compare the '92 Knicks defense to that in '93 and '94.
The Boston performance was over 3 games and Celtics really made no real effort to stop him (they didn't need to), and plus I clearly said "during the championship years". Did burn DJ (shorter!) in that series though...but what about him being held to 41 FG% the next year? Why won't you mention that? :oldlol:
The performance against Portland was incredible. I made a thread about the 3-4 minute stretch in game 1 (back to back to back to back shots), which is my favorite Jordan moment in the finals. No one ever said he didn't play well in some series vs. good defensive teams.
:oldlol: at bringing the Cavs in to this. Their defensive statistics are on par with this year's Bobcats.
As for the Pistons defense, I have always said that Jordan rules being applied through 88-91 is a myth. They were used in '88 mostly after a monster game Jordan had in the regular season, used in the '88-'89 regular season, not used at all in the '89 series (Dick Versace, who called the games agrees), not used at all in '91. Once the triangle was instituted under Jackson, the rules were in fact useless. :oldlol: at you you masking the horrible series in '88 (27 ppg, 4.6 assists with high turnovers, don't have the FG%, but probably around 47-48%) by stretching it out to '91. Didn't have a spectacular series in '89 when the Jordan rules weren't being used either, though he had a couple of big games. Once his teammates (mainly Pippen/Grant), improved, the Pistons could not play the same defense on him anymore and as a result he played well in the '90 and '91 series.
Again, no one is saying he couldn't play well against good defensive team, he torched several of them in fact. What I was trying to do was point out that Jordan isn't what most of his fanatic groupies cook him up to be. GOAT? Yes. Invincible? No.[/QUOTE]
If it didn't bother him why was he shooting airballs then on open shots?? Your a dumb****. Just like when Kobe first injured his pinky for a strech his FG% was horrible and was shooting airballs. LOL Who was on the Knicks in 93 that wasn't on the 92 team?? The only person who left was Xmen who wasn't on the 93 team to bother Pippen. Your a pretty stupid and fake person. Where is the video of pippen guarding Magic in gm3 fatal. Remember you said you have those gms?:rolleyes: Who is saying take out his old man years?? Even through MJ shot bad in his old years who still won it in the CLUTCH? Go into Bruce thread to see his stats against the pistons from 88-91. Everyone can see through you.
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=Fatal9]Anyone who agrees, please raise your hand :oldlol:. '92 Knicks were the big underdogs for a reason, no one thought going in that they were they type of team who could make it out of the second round, or had the defense to contain Jordan. But let me get this straight:
'92 Knicks were the best Ewing era team when they won a) only 51 games, b) were ousted in the second round and c) are no where close to matching the defensive efficiency of the '93 and '94 teams. This doesn't sound like a very wise man to me :no:[/QUOTE]
Post from Loki
The '92 Knicks were virtually the same exact team as they were in 1993. They added Rolando Blackman, who was never a noted defender, and lost Gerald Wilkins, who was.
Looking at the '92 Knicks' DRtg isn't too informative. They started to peak defensively over the latter half of the season and especially the playoffs (it took time for the Riley philosophy and defensive schemes to take hold; that was his first year coaching NY). The Knicks held teams to 95.2 ppg the second half of the season and and 100.2 ppg the first half of the season; they held teams to 94.8 ppg the final 22 games of the regular season.
For reference, here's what the Knicks held the Pistons and the Bulls to in the playoffs that year: 89.2 ppg on 44.9% FG.
And here's what those teams averaged during the regular season: 104.4 ppg on 48.7% FG.
So the Knicks held their playoff opponents to 15.2 pts/3.8% FG below their season averages, which is incredible. I did the same calculations for the '08 Celtics a while back and it was something like -10.5 pts/-3.5% FG, to give you an idea of how impressive what the Knicks did was.
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=Fatal9]Anyone who agrees, please raise your hand :oldlol:. '92 Knicks were the big underdogs for a reason, no one thought going in that they were they type of team who could make it out of the second round, or had the defense to contain Jordan. But let me get this straight:
'92 Knicks were the best Ewing era team when they won a) only 51 games, b) were ousted in the second round and c) are no where close to matching the defensive efficiency of the '93 and '94 teams. This doesn't sound like a very wise man to me :no:[/QUOTE]
How much games did the 92 knicks take the superior 92 Bulls team in the playoffs?? the Xmen who shut pippen down was gone? Wilkins was a superior defender too. The 93 team couldn't even bring a hobbled MJ to a gm 7:wtf: The superior team let a 2-0 lead vanish lol. LOL
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=Duncan21formvp]Looking at the '92 Knicks' DRtg isn't too informative. They started to peak defensively over the latter half of the season and especially the playoffs (it took time for the Riley philosophy and defensive schemes to take hold; that was his first year coaching NY). The Knicks held teams to 95.2 ppg the second half of the season and and 100.2 ppg the first half of the season; they held teams to 94.8 ppg the final 22 games of the regular season.
For reference, here's what the Knicks held the Pistons and the Bulls to in the playoffs that year: 89.2 ppg on 44.9% FG.
And here's what those teams averaged during the regular season: 104.4 ppg on 48.7% FG.
So the Knicks held their playoff opponents to 15.2 pts/3.8% FG below their season averages, which is incredible. I did the same calculations for the '08 Celtics a while back and it was something like -10.5 pts/-3.5% FG, to give you an idea of how impressive what the Knicks did was.[/QUOTE]
Interesting, so we are going to pick and choose stretches to determine the strength of a team defensively. Just wondering why he doesn't mention that the '93 Knicks held teams to[B] 91.8 PPG[/B] over the last 17 games of the '93 season. At any point in the '92 season, the Knicks team did not match that. Or how about the '93 team holding teams to [B]42.5% shooting in the last 3 months of the season[/B]. In comparison, the [B]'92 Knicks held teams to 46% shooting over the last three months[/B]. The guy is manipulating stats yet again :oldlol:
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=bleedinpurpleTwo]Is it true that MJ once shot 18% in a playoff game?
AND
Pippen had to carry him thru a series against the Knicks?[/QUOTE]
In 3 of the 4 wins, Jordan had a near triple-double, a 54 point game, and an actual triple double. How exactly was he carried?
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=Fatal9]As for the Pistons defense, I have always said that Jordan rules being applied through 88-91 is a myth. They were used in '88 mostly after a monster game Jordan had in the regular season, used in the '88-'89 regular season, not used at all in the '89 series (Dick Versace, who called the games agrees), not used at all in '91. Once the triangle was instituted under Jackson, the rules were in fact useless. :oldlol: at you you masking the horrible series in '88 (27 ppg, 4.6 assists with high turnovers, don't have the FG%, but probably around 47-48%) by stretching it out to '91.[/QUOTE]
Now you're changing the rules. First it was all about FG%. Indian_Guy shut down your argument so now you want to talk about "high turnovers".
Secondly, 27 points, 9 rebounds, 5 assists, 50 fg% is horrible to you? Didn't think so.
[QUOTE=Fatal9]Didn't have a spectacular series in '89 when the Jordan rules weren't being used either, though he had a couple of big games.[/QUOTE]
In 89, he averaged 30 points, 6 rebounds, 7 assists, 48 fg% against the Pistons. That's not good enough for you?
[QUOTE=Fatal9]Once his teammates (mainly Pippen/Grant), improved, the Pistons could not play the same defense on him anymore and as a result he played well in the '90 and '91 series.[/QUOTE]
So he played better when he was surrounded by good players? :eek:
Here is a game-by-game breakdown of his stats versus the Pistons from 88-91...
[QUOTE=Da_Realist][B][U]Michael Jordan's stats against the Detroit Pistons[/U][/B]
[B]1988[/B]
Game 1 -- 29 pts, 6 assists, 11 rebounds, 10 for 22
Game 2 -- 36 pts, 1 assist, 11 rebounds, 14 for 21
Game 3 -- 24 pts, 3 assists, 7 rebounds, 8 for 20
Game 4 -- 23 pts, 5 assists, 7 rebounds, 11 for 22
Game 5 -- 25 pts, 8 assists, 8 rebounds, 10 for 22
[U][B]Series Avg -- 27.4 points, 4.6 assists, 8.8 rebounds, 49.5 fg%[/B][/U]
[B]1989[/B]
Game 1 -- 32 points, 4 assists, 11 rebounds, 10 for 29
Game 2 -- 27 points, 4 assists, 4 rebounds, 8 for 16
Game 3 -- 46 points, 5 assists, 7 rebounds, 16 for 24
Game 4 -- 23 points, 4 assists, 2 rebounds, 5 for 15
Game 5 -- 18 points, 9 assists, 5 rebounds, 4 for 8
Game 6 -- 32 points, 13 assists, 4 rebounds, 13 for 25
[U][B]Series Avg -- 29.6 points, 6.5 assists, 5.5 rebounds, 47.9 fg%[/B][/U]
[B]1990[/B]
Game 1 -- 34 points, 5 assists, 7 rebounds, 12 for 25
Game 2 -- 20 points, 7 assists, 7 rebounds, 5 for 16
Game 3 -- 47 points, 4 assists, 10 rebounds, 17 for 32
Game 4 -- 42 points, 9 assists, 4 rebounds, 13 for 25
Game 5 -- 22 points, 8 assists, 4 rebounds, 7 for 19
Game 6 -- 29 points, 2 assists, 10 rebounds, 10 for 19
Game 7 -- 31 points, 9 assists, 8 rebounds, 13 for 27
[U][B]Series Avg -- 32.1 points, 6.3 assists, 7.1 rebounds, 47.2 fg%[/B][/U]
[B]1991[/B]
Game 1 -- 22 points, 6 assists, 3 rebounds, 6 for 15
Game 2 -- 35 points, 7 assists, 3 rebounds, 10 for 20
Game 3 -- 33 points, 7 assists, 7 rebounds, 11 for 19
Game 4 -- 29 points, 8 assists, 8 rebounds, 11 for 17
[B][U]Series Avg -- 29.8 points, 7 assists, 5.3 rebounds, 53.5 fg%[/B][/U]
[B]Overall Avg --29.7 points, 6.1 assists, 6.7 rebounds, 48.9 fg%[/B][/QUOTE]
Find me someone outside of ISH that says the Bad Boys defense was overrated. Find someone that would actually confirm they think this year's Orlando Magic defense (rated #1, according to you) isn't leagues behind the 88-91 Detroit Pistons.
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=Fatal9]
Secondly, it seems like people are actually arguing that Jordan's post 1993 years shouldn't be counted. [/QUOTE]
Wrong. You are the one saying his prime years shouldn't be counted.
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=Da_Realist]Now you're changing the rules. First it was all about FG%. Indian_Guy shut down your argument so now you want to talk about "high turnovers".
Secondly, 27 points, 9 rebounds, 5 assists, 50 fg% is horrible to you? Didn't think so. [/QUOTE]
Considering he averaged nearly 10 more points in the regular season, it wasn't a great series by any means. I know you've watched the games, his turnovers seem to be a bit high and his playmaking was no where near the level it would be afterwards (reason for 4.6 assists only).
[QUOTE=Da_Realist]In 89, he averaged 30 points, 6 rebounds, 7 assists, 48 fg%. That's not good enough for you?[/QUOTE]
I said "he wasn't spectacular" though the statistics might say that because of a couple of big games. Your gamelogs just further confirm this (25 ppg, 5.3 apg, 5.5 rpg on 39.7% in the other 4 games). His lack of aggressiveness in game 4 & 5 lost them the series imo (and Pippen getting injured in game 6), though I don't think you can really blame him because it looked like the plan from the start was to keep feeding the post and use Jordan as a decoy.
Pistons are overrated in the sense that I don't think they are up there with '93/'94 Knicks, '04 Pistons and '08 Celtics, and probably a couple of the Spurs teams, most of them were all anchored by DPOY who had the type of shot blocking presence that no one on those Pistons did (if you think Salley '89 onward was the type of presence as Wallace, Duncan or KG, then you're mistaken). Some posters have this idea that the Pistons would come in and drop the Jordan rules on a player like Kobe and shut him down in any series, when that type of a defense is very easy to beat if you have decent personnalle around you (like Kobe does). Jordan was even quoted as saying this! Playing good defense against a crap team with a superstar doesn't put you on an all-time level defensively.
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=tontoz]Wrong. You are the one saying his prime years shouldn't be counted.[/QUOTE]
They love counting Kobe's '04, '00, '02 years though, which weren't even Kobe's prime, and were also when Kobe was the second option :confusedshrug:
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=Fatal9]They love counting Kobe's '04, '00, '02 years though, which weren't even Kobe's prime, and were also when Kobe was the second option :confusedshrug:[/QUOTE]
You love counting those years as his rings, so which way is it?
OK, let's erase his 3 rings Fatal says, he was too young...
:oldlol:
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
1985 Milwaukee Bucks ranked 2cnd in the NBA in defense
29.3ppg 5.8reb 8.5ast 44%fg
(High scoring game: 35pts)
1986 Boston Celtics ranked 1st in the NBA in defense
43.7ppg 6.4reb 5.7ast 51%fg
(High scoring game: 63pts & a 49pt game)
1987 Boston Celtics ranked 9th in the NBA in defense
35.7ppg 7.0reb 6.0ast 42%fg
(High scoring game: 42pts)
1988 Cleveland Cavaliers ranked 5th in the NBA in defense
45.2ppg 5.4reb 4.8ast 57%fg
(High scoring game: 55pts, 50pts, & a 44pt game)
1988 Detroit Pistons ranked 2cnd in the NBA in defense
27.4ppg 8.8reb 4.6ast 50%fg
(High scoring game: 36pts)
1989 Cleveland Cavaliers ranked 2cnd in the NBA in defense
39.8ppg 5.8reb 8.2ast 49%fg
(High scoring game: 50pts, & two 44pt games)
1989 New York Knicks ranked 10th in the NBA in defense
35.67ppg 9.5reb 8.3ast 50%fg
(High scoring game: 47pts & two 40pt games)
1989 Detroit Pistons ranked 3rd in the NBA in defense
29.67ppg 5.5reb 6.5ast 48%fg
(High scoring game: 46pts)
1990 Detroit Pistons ranked 2cnd in the NBA in defense
32.14ppg 7.1reb 6.3ast 47%fg
(High scoring game: 47pts & a 42pt game)
1991 Detroit Pistons ranked 4th in the NBA in defense
29.75ppg 5.3reb 7.0ast 54%fg
(High scoring game: 35pts)
1991 L.A. Lakers ranked 5th in the NBA in defense
31.2 points 11.4ast 6.6reb 56%fg
(High scoring game: 36pts)
1992 New York Knicks ranked 2cnd in the NBA in defense
31.28ppg 5.7reb 4.3ast 48%fg
(High scoring game: 42pts)
1992 Portland Trailblazers ranked 2cnd in the NBA in defense
35.8 ppg 4.8reb 6.5ast 53%fg
(High scoring game: 46pts)
1993 Cleveland Cavaliers ranked 6th in the NBA in defense
31.00ppg 5.0reb 5.25ast 49%fg
(High scoring game: 43pts)
1993 New York Knicks ranked 1st in the NBA in defense
32.16ppg 6.2reb 7.0ast 40%fg
(High scoring game: 54 pts)
Jordan had a sprained right wrist in the '93 Conference Finals against the Knicks, which he suffered in game 2 against the Cavs.
1993 Phoenix Suns ranked 9th in the NBA in defense
41.00ppg 8.5 reb 6.3ast 51%fg
(High scoring game: 55pts)
[U]Now, Jordan past his prime:[/U]
1995 Charlotte Hornets ranked 9th in the NBA in defense
32.25ppg 6.5reb 5.75 48%fg
(High scoring game: 48pts)
1996 Miami Heat ranked 6th in the NBA in defense
30.00ppg 3.7reb 2.7ast 52%fg
(High scoring game: 35pts)
1996 New York Knicks ranked 3rd in the NBA in defense
36.00ppg 4.8reb 4.4ast 44%fg
(High scoring game: 46pts, also had a 44pt game)
1996 Seattle Supersonics ranked 2cnd in the NBA in defense
27.3pts 5.3rebs 4.2ast 43%fg
(High scoring game: 36pts)
(Bulls ranked 1st in team defense in 1996)
1997 Atlanta Hawks ranked 3rd in the NBA in defense
26.60ppg 10.2reb 5.2ast 45%fg
(High scoring game: 34pts)
1997 Miami Heat ranked 1st in the NBA in defense
30.20ppg 8.0reb 2.6ast 37%fg
(High scoring game: 37pts)
1997 Utah Jazz ranked 9th in the NBA in defense
32.33ppg 7.0reb 6.0ast 46%fg
(High scoring game: 39pts and two 38 point games)
1998 Indiana Pacers ranked 5th in the NBA in defense
31.71ppg 5.7reb 4.1ast 47%fg
(High scoring game: 41pts)
There you have it.
[B]Bonus:[/B]
[QUOTE=bruceblitz]Forgot to post this:
[B][I][U]Players who won Defensive player of the year awards in their career, that Jordan faced in the playoffs:[/U][/I][/B]
[B]Sidney Moncrief (actually defended Jordan)[/B]
1985 Milwaukee Bucks ranked 2cnd in the NBA in defense
29.3ppg 5.8reb 8.5ast 44%fg
(High scoring game: 35pts)
[B]Dennis Rodman (defended Jordan in spots)[/B]
1988 Detroit Pistons ranked 2cnd in the NBA in defense
27.4ppg 8.8reb 4.6ast 49%fg
(High scoring game: 36pts)
1989 Detroit Pistons ranked 3rd in the NBA in defense
29.67ppg 5.5reb 6.5ast 52%fg
(High scoring game: 46pts)
1990 Detroit Pistons ranked 2cnd in the NBA in defense
32.14ppg 7.1reb 6.3ast 50%fg
(High scoring game: 47pts & a 42pt game)
1991 Detroit Pistons ranked 4th in the NBA in defense
30.00ppg 5.3reb 7.0ast 54%fg
(High scoring game: 35pts)
[B]Gary Payton (actually defended Jordan)[/B]
1996 Seattle Supersonics ranked 2cnd in the NBA in defense
27.3pts 5.3rebs 4.2ast 43%fg
(High scoring game: 36pts)
(Bulls ranked 1st in team defense in 1996)
[B]Dikembe Mutombo[/B]
1997 Atlanta Hawks ranked 3rd in the NBA in defense
26.60ppg 10.2reb 5.2ast 45%fg
(High scoring game: 34pts)
[B]Alonzo Mourning[/B]
1995 Charlotte Hornets ranked 9th in the NBA in defense
32.25ppg 6.5reb 5.75 48%fg
(High scoring game: 48pts)
1996 Miami Heat ranked 6th in the NBA in defense
30.00ppg 3.7reb 2.7ast 52%fg
(High scoring game: 35pts)
1997 Miami Heat ranked 1st in the NBA in defense
30.20ppg 8.0reb 2.6ast 37%fg
(High scoring game: 37pts)[/QUOTE]
[B][I][U]Double bonus:[/U][/I][/B]
[QUOTE=bruceblitz][B]Jordan's 50 point games and higher, against top 10 ranked defenses:[/B]
69 Cleveland OT 3/28/90 (9th ranked defense)
63 Boston 2OT (Playoffs) * 4/20/86 (1st ranked defense)
61 Detroit OT 3/4/87 (5th ranked defense)
61 Atlanta 4/16/87 (2cnd ranked defense)
59 Detroit 3/3/88 (2cnd ranked defense)
55 Cleveland (Playoffs) 5/1/88 (5th ranked defense)
55 Phoenix (Playoffs) 6/16/93 (9th ranked defense)
55 New York 3/28/95 (1st ranked defense)
54 Cleveland 11/3/89 (9th ranked defense)
54 New York (Playoffs) 5/31/93 (1st ranked defense)
53 Indiana 4/12/87 (8th ranked defense)
53 Phoenix 1/21/89 (5th ranked defense)
53 Detroit 3/7/96 (7th ranked defense)
52 Cleveland 12/17/87 (5th ranked defense)
52 Portland 2/26/88 (10th ranked defense)
52 Denver 11/26/88 (8th ranked defense)
51 New Orleans 12/29/01 (10th ranked defense)
51 New York 1/21/97 (2cnd ranked defense)
50 Milwaukee 4/13/87 (4th ranked NBA defense)
50 Cleveland (Playoffs) 4/28/88 (5th ranked NBA defense)
50 Milwaukee 2/16/89 (6th ranked NBA defense)
50 Cleveland (Playoffs) 5/5/89 (2cnd ranked NBA defense)
Jordan has 22 career 50 point games or higher against top 10 rated NBA defenses.[/QUOTE]
[B][I][U]Triple bonus:[/U][/I][/B]
[QUOTE][B]Players who won Defensive player of the year awards in their career that Jordan dropped 50 point games or higher on:[/B]
Sidney Moncrief:
50 Milwaukee 4/13/87 (4th ranked NBA defense)
Dennis Rodman:
61 Detroit OT 3/4/87 (5th ranked defense)
59 Detroit 3/3/88 (2cnd ranked defense)
Dikembe Mutombo:
50 Denver 3/24/92 (13th ranked NBA defense)[/QUOTE]
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
Fatal9 is a FRAUD. Lets see MJ's averages in the finals from his 1st 3 peat, when he was in his PRIME.
33.5ppg, 6.4rpg, 6.7apg, 50fg%, 39%3pt
MJ was already past his prime in the last 3-peat and CLEARLY had lost a step after retiring in 94'. Even past his prime he still averaged a better percantage from the field in his last 3-peat then PRIME Kobe in 5 0f Kobe's 6 finals apearances.
And can you plz take that Pippen av, you ain't folling anyone.
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=lbj23clutch]Fatal9 is a FRAUD. Lets see MJ's averages in the finals from his 1st 3 peat, when he was in his PRIME.
33.5ppg, 6.4rpg, 6.7apg, 50fg%, 39%3pt
MJ was already past his prime in the last 3-peat and CLEARLY had lost a step after retiring in 94'. Even past his prime he still averaged a better percantage from the field in his last 3-peat then PRIME Kobe in 5 0f Kobe's 6 finals apearances.
And can you plz take that Pippen av, you ain't folling anyone.[/QUOTE]
Him and roundball rock need to come out of the closet already...LOL
just saying..
Re: Jordan's statistics vs. #1 ranked defenses in playoffs
[QUOTE=catch24]Him and roundball rock need to come out of the closet already...LOL
just saying..[/QUOTE]
yea his act is getting OLD.