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-   -   The secret to gaining VERTICAL (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=226570)

nathanjizzle 06-12-2011 10:33 PM

The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
You need these 3 to reach your maximum vertical. Keep in mind that too much of each three can kill your vertical you need the right amount depending on your body index.

leg strength (squats and other leg weightlifting exercises)

Plyrometrics (stretching the leg muscles, teaching jumping muscle memory, and developing your fast twitch muscles)

Upper body weight ( Benching, and other weight lifting techniques)


Im gonna start with the most important one to me because i know most people dont even consider this when there thinking vertical, UPPER BODY WEIGHT. This is pretty much the secret for vertical training. If you have the right leg strength and have completed plyometrics training and you have no upperbody weight, then your body has no weight for your legs to propell it vertically, and you have actually voided your plyometrics and leg weight training at the same time. Think about this, if your throwing a baseball vertically in the air vs a wiffle ball (one that has no holes in it). Which one could you throw further vertically? The baseball because it has the right weight to power ratio for your arm. The wiffle ball is to light and cant propell be propelled upwards as far as a baseball will. In this case your legs would be the arm and your upperbody is the object being thrown.

Look at how big nate robinsons upper body is


Look at dwight howard, he has more upperbody mass than in his legs.


Look at a frog, the best leapers in the world. If they didnt have the body weight for there legs to propel itself upward do you think it could jump as high as it does? Because of the legnth of there legs they dont need to much body weight but it is still crucial.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/88413712@N00/293941917/

But, putting to much excessive upperbody weight compared to your height will start killing your vertical. You want to find the right amount of weight to put on. Going back to the baseball example to prove why putting to much weight will kill your vertical. Throwing a baseball vs a baseball that weighs 5 pounds. Which one could you throw further into the air? Again you need to find the best upper bodyweight to leg strength ratio.


If you were to start your body from scratch, you should put on upper body weight first. Your legs will stregnthen normally because it will break down and build the right amount of muscle to carry your new upper body weight.
Once you finish putting on upperbody weight you should start your leg weight training. Again you want to gain the right stregnth and leg weight and not to much because extra muscle that is not needed will just weigh you down.
Once you finished your weight and mass training, its time to do plyometrics
This might be the hardest part of gaining vertical is plyrometrics. Plyro are exercises designed to teach your legs jumping muscle memory and developing twitch muscles. Doing plyro will teach and develop your legs to jump with your body.

BigByrd 06-13-2011 06:13 PM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
The whole of this is jibberish.

Deadpool 06-15-2011 11:30 AM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
I disagree. The most important thing you need from your upperbody as a basketball player is your core and shoulders. Having a big chest actually limits your movement and being too strong doesn't give you a comfortable feel on an outside shot.

Most basketball players do resistance based training. It's not simply weight lifting with legs. Of course they hit the gym but you're not building a football player or a body builder. Basketball requires agility,conditioning, and vertical leap.

It may seem like some players are really built but it's actually because they have an extremely low body fat percentage.

Swaggin916 06-16-2011 04:29 AM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 




Proof that upper body weight has next to nothing to do with vertical. There are certain upper body lifts that can help, but when it comes to vertical, you want to have the best strength to to weight ratio you can possibly have. 300 pound guy squatting 600 < 160 pound guy squatting 400

I get what you mean... but it's not weight, it's strength, and it only applies to certain areas that are useful for vertical (mainly your core). If all you did was Yoga and Plyos... you'd be a very gifted leaper. Probably a 1 leg leaper, but a leaper. the guys you are showing are great 2 leg leapers and that's because they have more upper body weight and have trained their body to be more strength based through squats and other weight lifting exercises (and possibly other things as well such as Nate being a football player where 2 foot jumping is pretty much the only way you are going to jump in football.)

As for your argument about upper body weight on first... I don't agree with that. If you're goal is to be a great leaper, then you aren't looking to put on much upper body weight... I mean I honestly wouldn't do a thing for upper body beside core work and olympic lifts(which is lower body but includes some upper body)... that's it... and whatever upper body weight I put on would come only from that and other lower body lifts that put on a little weight up top naturally (mostly in core, other areas of the back, and a little on arms/shoulders from gripping bars).

Most people's goals aren't solely to be a great leaper tho. Dwight is a big and having some extra weight up top (all muscle) benefits him on the block. He would jump even higher if he lost some of that upper body weight tho. He is listed as 265 and he's not even 6'10 without shoes. Kevin Durant is about as tall and get's just as high as Dwight off one leg (or damn close) and he's about 200 pounds. The real question is like I said earlier tho is... what kind of leaper do you want to be? What kind of athlete do you want to be? To do you want fly down the court and leap off 1 leg like KD and Lebron? Or do you want more power and the ability to snag boards and dunk from a standstill? That's really the real question.

MMKM 07-02-2011 10:21 PM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
This might be the dumbest post ever. Lifting weights does not make you more athletic or jump higher. The OP was very selective with his examples; Shaquille and Dwight Howard. How about guys like Vince, Michael Jordan, Julius Erving, Bill Russell, James White, Russell Westbrook, etc. Michael Wilson of the Harlem Globetrotters posted a 51.5 vertical at Memphis. He looks like a noodle. Look at volleyball players and Olympic high jumpers. How many of them look like a bodybuilder? How many great basketball players throughout history look like a bodybuilder or football player?

The secret to leaping and running fast is not weight lifting or having a big upper body. It is speed-strength, AKA how quickly your muscles can exert force, relax, and exert force again. It takes .8 sec for a muscle to reach peak force lifting a weight. When you sprint or do a reactive jump, your feet only contact the ground for .2-.4 seconds. What does this tell us? Sports are not about slow, maximal force movements. They are about ultra fast sub-maximal force movements. This is explained in detail in world renown exercise physiologist Mel Siff's book, s"Supertraining." In the future, please do not refer to weight lifting and plyometrics as a "secret," as it is the most commonly used method of athletic training on earth, despite being imperfect.

z14h 07-14-2011 06:17 AM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
This is all so confusing. Everyone is disagreeing with everyone else, so does upper body weight actually matter or not?

BrentISballin 07-14-2011 02:46 PM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
While the first part of what you are saying is true, the part about legs is not. If your upper body is large then you will need powerful legs to compensate for the weight you are trying to carry upwards. You showed pictures of the guys lower legs, most of your jumping comes from the quads, hams and butt which are covered by shorts in your pics. Smaller boned people will always have a smaller looking lower leg because the ankle is skinny .

Have you also noticed how long frog legs are compared to their overall size? This is the probably the dumbest post I've seen in a while

BrentISballin 07-14-2011 02:47 PM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by z14h
This is all so confusing. Everyone is disagreeing with everyone else, so does upper body weight actually matter or not?

WEIGHT does not matter, having upper body strength will always benefit though. If you have way to much weight up top and not enough weight down low, you will be lop sided therefore hindering your vertical.

nathanjizzle 09-25-2011 03:01 PM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 

OhNoTimNoSho 09-26-2011 04:38 PM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
Upper body weight? doesn't matter, upper body STRENGTH? matters a good amount.


One thing thats important and that is often overlooked in jumping high is a strong frame. If you have weaknesses in your body then you will not be jumping as high because the transfer of energy is being interfered with. Work out your core, back, shoulders, chest and you will see increases in vertical. Squats and deadlifts are great for increasing your vertical. Do 5 x 5 squats with max weight every other day and youll see increases in your vert in 2 weeks.

Randy 09-26-2011 09:59 PM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MMKM
This might be the dumbest post ever. Lifting weights does not make you more athletic or jump higher. The OP was very selective with his examples; Shaquille and Dwight Howard. How about guys like Vince, Michael Jordan, Julius Erving, Bill Russell, James White, Russell Westbrook, etc. Michael Wilson of the Harlem Globetrotters posted a 51.5 vertical at Memphis. He looks like a noodle. Look at volleyball players and Olympic high jumpers. How many of them look like a bodybuilder? How many great basketball players throughout history look like a bodybuilder or football player?

The secret to leaping and running fast is not weight lifting or having a big upper body. It is speed-strength, AKA how quickly your muscles can exert force, relax, and exert force again. It takes .8 sec for a muscle to reach peak force lifting a weight. When you sprint or do a reactive jump, your feet only contact the ground for .2-.4 seconds. What does this tell us? Sports are not about slow, maximal force movements. They are about ultra fast sub-maximal force movements. This is explained in detail in world renown exercise physiologist Mel Siff's book, s"Supertraining." In the future, please do not refer to weight lifting and plyometrics as a "secret," as it is the most commonly used method of athletic training on earth, despite being imperfect.


WTF are you on? Performing certain lifts and movements can absolutely make you a higher jumper and a better athlete.

Swaggin916 09-29-2011 12:39 AM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
^^^ Indeed. Lifting weights using those principles he said can help a great deal.

bobbyflay 10-01-2011 05:58 AM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
^yeah.. I gained 9 inches in vertical due to weight training(6 months). The secret is to keep on improving(to improve you have to do more so yeah makes sense)

Ass Dan 10-02-2011 09:56 AM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
huge calves

senelcoolidge 10-02-2011 02:50 PM

Re: The secret to gaining VERTICAL
 
I used to tie pork shops on my calves. I swear it worked.


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