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-   -   The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!! (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=270204)

lilbeastnani 07-05-2012 10:33 PM

The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 

What a moron of a general manager!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sport...rticle4393527/

Quote:

Colangelo’s backup plan – swapping a lottery-protected first-rounder and forward Gary Forbes to the Houston Rockets for point guard Kyle Lowry – won’t sell jerseys or drive up television ratings or bring people back to the Air Canada Centre. Oh, the diehards will buy in, but for the majority of fans in Toronto and across the country, the Raptors will remain something that Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment uses to pay the bills between Maple Leafs games.

Landing Nash wasn’t a shortcut to an NBA title, but it was a shortcut to relevancy. The Raptors’ theme song will be Landry Fields Forever and nobody will be listening.

his wasn’t LeBron James and The Decision, but the ramifications for the Raptors will cut just as deep. At least Nash didn’t hire Jim Gray to be his lapdog. My guess is Gray was probably busy.

Grey Dawn 07-05-2012 11:25 PM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
In terms of signing Nash, what else do you want him to do, his contract offer was $11 million more than what Nash accepted with LA for the same number of years. :confusedshrug:

Sekman 07-06-2012 12:19 AM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
why you want to fire BC ?? you're lil beastnani only because this guy brought him here.. you should thank him

lilbeastnani 07-06-2012 01:03 AM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
It has little to do with the Nash thing. We should've never been at the point where a 38 year old Steve Nash is supposed to be our saving grace. Let alone going "all in" for him. Why would I thank a guy who does throughout his tenure in Toronto has shown time and time again that he doesn't know how to construct a winning roster. Give me a break.

Zan Tabak 07-06-2012 07:27 AM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
I keep hearing 'fire bc', and I'm all for it. But who's on the radar to replace him?

Good gm's are by no means a dime a dozen...

AC Earl 07-06-2012 10:21 AM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
Another reason?

According to sources, one team considering making an offer to Brandon Rush is the Toronto Raptors, who had hoped to sign Nash. The Raptors had allocated significant money to Nash and now will look elsewhere – and perhaps toward Rush.


http://www.csnbayarea.com/basketball...66&feedID=5986

Chamberlain 07-06-2012 10:58 AM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Grey Dawn
In terms of signing Nash, what else do you want him to do, his contract offer was $11 million more than what Nash accepted with LA for the same number of years. :confusedshrug:


I think its all the moves he made up to this point in preparing to sign Nash, and then having it blown back in his face.

RaininThrees 07-06-2012 01:20 PM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
On Colangelo:

Quote:

There was no way Bryan Colangelo was going to upgrade his team’s talent without taking on a significant risk. The Toronto Raptors have not built up enough high-end talent or accumulated enough assets with value to make moves without opening themselves up to real danger down the road.

At the same time, it was not fair to expect Colangelo to sit on his hands, watch the Raptors miss the playoffs again and continue to hope for luck in the draft lottery. If Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment had patience for that, and believed Colangelo was the man to execute such a plan, they would have given him something more than a two-year contract with a team option for a third year 14 months ago. Ownership wanted Colangelo to deliver something tangible quickly. That is the prerogative of those in control. If you do not like Colangelo’s win-now mindset, take it up with MLSE.

If Colangelo had to make a move, then, the one he made featured appropriate risk.

Children and championships played heavily in Steve Nash’s move to L.A.
In the wake of missing out on Steve Nash on Wednesday, the Raptors agreed to acquire point guard Kyle Lowry from Houston on Thursday. In exchange, the Raptors will give up a future first-round pick — more on that in a bit — and guard Gary Forbes, a bit part if there ever was one. The deal is unlikely to become official until July 11, the end of the league’s moratorium on player movement.

Lowry will not be a licence for MLSE to print money, as the acquisition of Nash would have been. However, he has far more upside than Nash in that he is just 26 and is being paid less than US$12-million over the next two seasons. It would have required almost 50% more annually, plus another season to obtain Nash, although the Raptors would have been able to keep the draft pick. Depending on ensuing moves, the Raptors could have significant financial flexibility starting next season.

Nash would have been a stopgap, albeit an attractive one for reasons impacting profitability and relevance. Lowry could be a long-term solution. Lowry had a very nice year last season, averaging 14.3 points and 6.6 assists per game. Before the all-star break, he averaged 15.6 points and 7.6 assists per game, making him a borderline all-star. His advanced statistics suggest he is one of the 10 to 12 best point guards in the league. However, he missed 15 games in March and April because of a bacterial infection and eventually lost his starting spot to Goran Dragic. Dragic signed with Phoenix on late Wednesday to replace Nash there.

In the off-season, Lowry lashed out at Houston coach Kevin McHale for the handling of the situation.

“I honestly think it would be tough,” Lowry told The Houston Chronicle when asked if he could play for McHale again in the upcoming season. “Things have to be addressed. The situation would have to be addressed.

“If things aren’t addressed coaching-wise, I guess I have to be moved.”

In the Raptors, Lowry will find an admirer of his talents. He has a fan in Alvin Williams, the Raptors’ director of player development. The two share a hometown (Philadelphia) and an alma mater (Villanova).

His biggest fan will be head coach Dwane Casey, who adores Lowry for his tough-mindedness and strong defence. Colangelo is putting a lot of faith in Casey — both Lowry and Landry Fields, whom the Raptors will sign to an offer sheet on July 11, are favourites of the coach. If Casey turned the Raptors into a middle-of-the-pack defensive team last year, he will expected to turn them into a near-elite defensive team this year.

With Lowry’s relatively small contract, the Raptors will also retain the rights of Jose Calderon, who would have been waived via the amnesty clause in the event of Nash’s signing. The Raptors will dangle him in trade discussions, perhaps with an extraneous shooting guard and power forward, in hopes of acquiring a talented swingman. If not, Lowry and Dragic played together in Houston, so there is no reason why Calderon and Lowry could not in Toronto, unless Lowry objects to that. (It was not immediately clear whether the Raptors would rescind qualifying offers to restricted free agents Jerryd Bayless and Sonny Weems.)

Giving up the draft pick is a legitimate risk; it should not be minimized. As explained by the Chronicle — this could not be confirmed, although it is believed to be close to accurate — the pick will go to the Rockets next year if it falls between fourth and 14th. If that condition is not met, the pick is pushed back and the conditions change slightly. The Rockets get the pick if the Raptors finish between third and 14th in the two years after that or between second and 14th in the two years after that. If the Raptors never meet those conditions, the Raptors will have to give up the pick six years from now whether they are picking first overall or are out of the lottery. The Rockets are banking on the Raptors being bad sooner rather than later. Colangelo, who has given away conditional first-round picks in the past, is banking on his team being good and paying the tab years from now.

It is a significant gamble. Lowry is very good, but not a superstar, not even an all-star. If you do not like that approach, once again, your issue lies with MLSE. Colangelo was never going to accept the status quo, not with his job on the line. He is betting on a 26-year-old point guard and a 55-year-old coach to form a perfect union. With that combination, plus Jonas Valanciunas, there is the germ of a really exciting team developing. Given the nature of the last two seasons, that matters more than it might seem.

Email: ekoreen@nationalpost.com |Twitter: ekoreen

bokes15 07-06-2012 05:01 PM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Zan Tabak
I keep hearing 'fire bc', and I'm all for it. But who's on the radar to replace him?

Good gm's are by no means a dime a dozen...

I don't care who we replace him with, the point is he needs to be replaced ASAP. I rarely say this but I agree with beastnani here. If our best reason for keeping him is that we don't know who we're gonna replace him with, then get rid of him. Finding a GM or a coach is not like finding a superstar basketball player. You throw enough money out there, and they will come running. The guy is paid handsomely at 5 mill/year which is well above the average for the position. And if your response to that would be "well why would we want to pay 5 mill for another guy who is unproven." And there would be a simple answer to that. We don't. If we find a guy who is as established as BC was pre Toronto we pay him accordingly. If we don't (as has been suggested by many others on this forum) we try and coup a young GM who has worked under an established vet and pay him less but give him the chance to prove himself. Worst case scenario either way new guy, new ideas, new game plan. It couldn't get or be any worse.

bokes15 07-06-2012 05:16 PM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
FYI though BC's contract is up this year, hence the reason he wanted to "accelerate the process." Accelerate the process is code for "SAVE MY ASS." Good luck convincing MLSE that they need to keep him on board any longer to rebuild the franchise that he has actually made WORSE since he got here. He lost his chance at Nash, which was essentially his get out of jail free card. Fans would've packed the ACC just to see him, revenue would've gone up, we'd have made the playoffs, money in their pockets everyone's happy, BC gets another deal. Now in addition to sucking, our attendance will remain low and our future bleak (aside from Val). So i'm happy it fell through because I see BC being gone in the near future.

Toni 07-06-2012 06:10 PM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
I'm just not comfortable with Stefanski taking over if Colangelo gets canned. Which will probably be what happens. I wish we would've picked up Kevin Pritchard before he went to the Pacers. I like the way he builds teams.

Zan Tabak 07-06-2012 06:34 PM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bokes15
I don't care who we replace him with, the point is he needs to be replaced ASAP. I rarely say this but I agree with beastnani here. If our best reason for keeping him is that we don't know who we're gonna replace him with, then get rid of him. Finding a GM or a coach is not like finding a superstar basketball player. You throw enough money out there, and they will come running. The guy is paid handsomely at 5 mill/year which is well above the average for the position. And if your response to that would be "well why would we want to pay 5 mill for another guy who is unproven." And there would be a simple answer to that. We don't. If we find a guy who is as established as BC was pre Toronto we pay him accordingly. If we don't (as has been suggested by many others on this forum) we try and coup a young GM who has worked under an established vet and pay him less but give him the chance to prove himself. Worst case scenario either way new guy, new ideas, new game plan. It couldn't get or be any worse.



Hear what your saying and good points all around. I just don't want to end up with another one of these guys ...



Zero swag......

bokes15 07-06-2012 09:46 PM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
Everyone talks about how bad Babcock was, and yes he was bad but the situation BC came into was far more adventageous than his. VC was disgruntled because of previous moves that were made by Glen Grunwald and was unhappy with the Babcock signing prior to any moves being made due to the fact that he wanted Dr. J as the GM and wasn't consulted. So the situation he stepped into was one where his all-star/superstar player made it known up front that he wasn't all in and in fact wanted out, ala Dwight Howard. So he ultimately succomed to the pressure.

BC on the other hand stepped into a situation where Babcock had provided the capspace by trading Carter, we lucked into a #1 draft pick, he had a happy all-star. From there, he was in the drivers seat. A chance to build and mold us into a true contender with all the tools he needed to do it. And he failed, I feel moreso than any GM we've had in our history, but yet he's given by far the biggest rope due to the prestige of the Colangelo name.

keantona 07-06-2012 10:40 PM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Zan Tabak
I keep hearing 'fire bc', and I'm all for it. But who's on the radar to replace him?

Good gm's are by no means a dime a dozen...


An average GM would be a huge upgrade on the fool we have now.

I find the 'we couldn't find anyone better' argument for keeping Colangelo ridiculous. He's been an abject failure. I'd take virtually every other GM or assistant GM who has worked in the NBA in the last ten years over Colangelo after what he's done to the franchise (I say 'virtually' largely because of Isiah Thomas). And there must be dozens of iconic ex-NBA stars and hundreds of bright sports scientists who could do the job: it's just a matter of firing Colangelo and starting a thorough search and interview process.

bada bing 07-07-2012 01:38 PM

Re: The O-F-F-I-C-I-A-L FIRE BC THREAD!!!!
 
This is why bad teams remain bad regardless of the opportunities handed down to them. A team that has great management and long term outlook always tends to be successful in the long run. The Raptors just do not have good management. We keep making mistakes after mistakes mainly because we do not have a good outlook towards the future. I am not sure if ownership does not allow the GM's/President enough liberty to make decisions or what?

This team is just a mess all around. I am glad I have been busy and not in the mix of WTF is happening around in the NBA and especially with the Raptors these days.

My main question is why was BC investing soo much in Steve Nash? We sholud have never ever been in the run to sign Steve Nash. I love Nash and consider him a HOFmer. The guy is awesome BUT he does not and should not fit into the plan the raptors should be having right now. If I am looking at it in terms of teh Toronto Raptors, I am in a rebuilding mode. I do not need an aging 38 y/o pg towards the end of his career. What will nash give us besides sell Jerseys for a year? In my view, it was a horrendous and extremely miscalculated decision by BC to go after Steve Nash. This alone would have been a good reason to fire the guy.

And now if I am Steve Nash. Why would i sign with the raptors? I have accomplished everything I need to and have the money. I need to win a championship by being a pivotal part of a team. If I feel I have two more years left in me, I am going to a contending team with established stars that will help me win a championship. No way in hell am I coming to a team like the raptors just because they belong to a city in my country. (BTW, Nash' family is in the US and I believe he is from western canada....not toronto...). Besides, Nash has played for the Canadian team and done enough. He should not be asked to prove his loyalty by joining such a lousy team.

whatever....just after reading all of the threads here, i am further convinced that BC needs to go now. This guy has no vision and is going to ruin everything for us. I am seriously comparing the guy to Isiah Thomas with the knicks now. Just a royal mess. Absolute mess.

I look forward to us competing next year though. I feel V. is going to be good and we may do a little better and compete for the 8th spot next year. Only because we will be surprising everyone.


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