Margaret Thatcher RIP

[senelcoolidge]

Well GB has become a lazy, leecher, socialistic, slack nation. Of course they won't like Thatcher.

[rufuspaul]

Well GB has become a lazy, leecher, socialistic, slack nation. Of course they won't like Thatcher.

You notice no one's answered my question as to how she won such lopsided elections. I was certain there'd be posts about how the evil conservatives manipulated the electorate.

[KevinNYC]

Weren't the Labour governments that Thatcher and Reagan hated also anti-communist?

Jimmy Carter who supported majority rule in South Africa wasn't anti-communist?

Support for free markets would imply also being anti-communist don't you think?

Lots of big differences there. The reason I'm anti-communist is not primarily their economic policies, it's their repressive and dictatorial nature and suppression of basic freedoms like speech. My point was that they supported governments who oppressed their people as long as those governments were anti-Soviet. They did care about their opinion on monetary policy. This embrace of dictators weakened the idea that being anti-communist = being pro freedom.

[LJJ]

Promote economic reform and free market and small government >>> Cash out the value created by previous governments by selling off accumulated state property >>> Use this incidental profit to reinforce the "success" of your reforms


Easy, cheap, parasitical way towards short term success.

[rufuspaul]

Weren't the Labour governments that Thatcher and Reagan hated also anti-communist?

Jimmy Carter who supported majority rule in South Africa wasn't anti-communist?



Lots of big differences there. The reason I'm anti-communist is not primarily their economic policies, it's their repressive and dictatorial nature and suppression of basic freedoms like speech. My point was that they supported governments who oppressed their people as long as those governments were anti-Soviet. They did care about their opinion on monetary policy. This embrace of dictators weakened the idea that being anti-communist = being pro freedom.

And how were they different from other administrations in that aspect? In case you forgot there was this thing called the Cold War going on at the time. Not getting annihilated by the Russians took priority. Dealing with the ugly underbellies of countries that could help in that regard was going to have to wait. The same sorts of things go on today (see Pakistan).

And if you think Jimmy Carter and the Labour party were actually on the way to winning the Cold War I've got land in Florida I'd like to sell you.

[rufuspaul]

Easy, cheap, parasitical way towards short term success.

That's a great term to describe British labor unions in the late 70s.

[kentatm]

And if you think Jimmy Carter and the Labour party were actually on the way to winning the Cold War I've got land in Florida I'd like to sell you.

they were but not really through anything they were doing.

the USSR Communist regime was going to come apart at the seems due to many internal issues that the US and UK had zero control over.

Thatcher and Reagan did jack squat to end the Cold War. They just happened to be in power when the USSR was collapsing.

[KevinNYC]

they were but not really through anything they were doing.

the USSR Communist regime was going to come apart at the seems due to many internal issues that the US and UK had zero control over.

Thatcher and Reagan did jack squat to end the Cold War. They just happened to be in power when the USSR was collapsing.

Both Thatcher and Reagan recognized the opportunity that was Gorbachev who, of course, was the most important figure in the end of the Cold War. Don't know about Thatcher's domestic politics, but there many idiots/ideologues in the GOP and second levels of Reagan's cabinet who thought Reagan had gone soft by talking to Gorbachev and were against any negotiations at all. Go back and read the speeches Gingrich was giving at the time and you realize what a missed opportunity the 80's would have been if someone like him was in power. Luckily for us, the top levels of the Reagan cabinet had folks like George Schultz who saw the tremendous promise of Gorbachev. Unfortunately for us, a lot of those second rank Reaganites who thought Reagan "won the cold war" wound up in senior positions in the Bush II cabinet.


So I think Jack Squat is overrated. Reagan ignored the nutty wing of his party.

[KevinNYC]

And how were they different from other administrations in that aspect? In case you forgot there was this thing called the Cold War going on at the time. Not getting annihilated by the Russians took priority.

They were different in the exact way I mentioned. Carter supported majority rule in South Africa. Reagan didn't. Reagan helped block sanctions against SA. So Carter was in favor of change in South Africa while still doing cold war stuff like arming the mujaheddin.


Also in what way did South Africa affect us getting annihilated by the Russians? Pro or Con?
Seems a logical leap too far, my friend.

[KevinNYC]

You notice no one's answered my question as to how she won such lopsided elections. I was certain there'd be posts about how the evil conservatives manipulated the electorate.

If I was being glib, I would say some combination of the oil shock of the 1970's, the Sex Pistols, the Falklands war, the cheap oil (Saudi and North Sea) and lower inflation of the of the 1980's.

I could go into each of the above, but the Falklands war is the most obvious. She was deeply unpopular during her first term because unemployment was high and Britain was in a recession in 1981 and 1982. (Similar to the early years of Reagan's first term.) The Falklands War changed that. Her popularity soared after that. The economy picked up in 1983 too. She actually got less votes in 1983 than 1979 I believe, but Labor did even worse because a third party picked up a bunch of votes. Thatcher got 44% of the vote and won handily.

[pinhead]

Well GB has become a lazy, leecher, socialistic, slack nation. Of course they won't like Thatcher.

A lot of that is down to Thatcher, Jackass.

[pinhead]

LOLZ

http://www.news.com.au/entertainment...-1226617048476

[PickernRoller]

The blood on her hands just filled my house. There is a lot of info on her that just by googling her name, watching mainstream media or reading history books you simply won't get.

Not a dig on her but then again the truth is the truth - just sealed in a coffin as most of the world wants it to be. I guess ok for sensationalism.

[UK-NJ]

I keep seeing the question posed: 'why did she win elections?'

Probably because the south (largest concentration of people in the country) didn't feel or see the effects of what she was doing first hand. She cut the north adrift & expected everyone to fend for themselves. I would genuinely recommend any of her foreign supporters talk to people who actually lived through her reign & the impact she had on the north of the country. People seem happy to close their eyes to the negative impact she had on the PEOPLE & only prefer to look back in statistics & economics. It's blind.

There's a reason that she's so strongly reviled by half the country. It isn't just people complaining for the sake of it. They lived through it. It just galls me to see Americans talking about the positives of Thatcherism whilst completely disregarding the poverty she placed on the north. If you still feel as strongly in support of her after doing a little research on the people who were hardest hit by her regime then I don't know what to tell you.

[pinhead]

I keep seeing the question posed: 'why did she win elections?'

Probably because the south (largest concentration of people in the country) didn't feel or see the effects of what she was doing first hand. She cut the north adrift & expected everyone to fend for themselves. I would genuinely recommend any of her foreign supporters talk to people who actually lived through her reign & the impact she had on the north of the country. People seem happy to close their eyes to the negative impact she had on the PEOPLE & only prefer to look back in statistics & economics. It's blind.

There's a reason that she's so strongly reviled by half the country. It isn't just people complaining for the sake of it. They lived through it. It just galls me to see Americans talking about the positives of Thatcherism whilst completely disregarding the poverty she placed on the north. If you still feel as strongly in support of her after doing a little research on the people who were hardest hit by her regime then I don't know what to tell you.

What American jackasses know about foreign affairs you can write on the back of a postage stamp