Atheism vs. Theism

[Micku]

Studies show most Atheists suffer from some type of mental sickness.

lol. Never heard of that.

People that believe in a deity or whatever is more happy than the people who do not believe tho.

I think that the more tech grows and the more understanding that we would have on our planet and universe, the less people will need religion and say a supernatural being created that or this. Not saying it'll go away though. As long as humans exist, I think there will always be people who will believe in the supernatural. We just need to educate people on being more science literate and knowing the basics on several fields I think.

[SilkkTheShocker]

Atheists are the same people that grew up in a broken home, picked on at school, and probably beaten by their drunken stepfather. They are just taking their anger out on God by refusing to believe in Him.

[HardwoodLegend]

Atheists are the same people that grew up in a broken home, picked on at school, and probably beaten by their drunken stepfather. They are just taking their anger out on God by refusing to believe in Him.

Not true in my case. It's a simple philosophical conclusion I've reached. What's your reasoning for not believing in gods that differ from yours?

And, as for those sample cases you bring up, why would a creator who is supposed to be the embodiment of Love itself hold their anger against them in the end? People on Earth do far more speaking on God's behalf than it does. It would be nice if it decided to be as talkative and demonstrative as it supposedly was thousands of years ago.

What's with all the hiding and secrecy?

[PistonsFan#21]

No, clearly not. First of all, most major christian religions accept evolution as compatible with their belief. second, there is no belief in science. Science is the formation of falsifiable explanations of observable (i.e. Natural) phenomenon (which is why it can be compatible with your belief in the supernatural). The whole point is that scientific explanations arent set in stone. They are subject to revision when they fail to explain the patterns in the data. which is why they have been so robust and created almost everything you use on a daily basis (F1 hybrid food plants, computers, combustion engines, modern medicine, etc.) All of these things are built upon the scientific method as an approach to understand our world.

Ok but that still doesnt change the fact that the science is saying that the world was created from the big bang and that humans evolved from bacteria. isnt that the theory? All im saying is you either believe that with no proof whatsoever or you can believe in God as the creator with also no proof. Its all about faith

[miller-time]

Ok but that still doesnt change the fact that the science is saying that the world was created from the big bang and that humans evolved from bacteria. isnt that the theory? All im saying is you either believe that with no proof whatsoever or you can believe in God as the creator with also no proof. Its all about faith

Wait are you saying that neither evolution or the big bang theory have any proof?

[PistonsFan#21]

Wait are you saying that neither evolution or the big bang theory have any proof?

yea pretty much. its all speculation and theories. The creation of universe was millions of years before the first animals and even dinosaurs. Let alone humans. Dont tell me theres a way to actually go back that far or even proofs that confirm it. As far as evolution its true to some extent. But i dont believe that humans evolved from bacteria into fishes and then into apes and finally into humans. And there is no proof of that neither.

[miller-time]

yea pretty much. its all speculation and theories. The creation of universe was millions of years before the first animals and even dinosaurs. Let alone humans. Dont tell me theres a way to actually go back that far or even proofs that confirm it. As far as evolution its true to some extent. But i dont believe that humans evolved from bacteria into fishes and then into apes and finally into humans. And there is no proof of that neither.

Every star you look at you are looking back in time (sometimes billions of years). We don't need to go back in time to see what was happening at the early stages of the universe because light and other radiation from those events is still traveling towards us.

[Legend of Josh]

My better judgment knew how fruitless these threads are.

You knew the thread, topic/subject or whatever was fruitless, yet you created the thread anyway.

A very common attribute for atheists (especially young adults, thinking they understand the entire world around them, and that the average Christian is a mindless moron) is that atheists always have God on the brain. They're highly intrigued and mentally mind-raped by "how it all started" ... "what really happens after we die" ... "is there anything else to us, or are we the complete beginning, middle and end?" - and whatever other respective questions that mankind has been asking himself since the beginning of the human conscience mind.

The average (again, especially young adult type, etc) atheist will say something along the lines of "nah man, I'm not thinking of God all the time, none of that really mentally stimulates me, God doesn't exists, so why would he be on the brain full-time" etc. Atheists almost always try and paint the picture that they're not always thinking of God, possibilities of some sort of afterlife, etc. - but that couldn't be any further from the real truth. The real truth that is in their head, all the time.

Again, you creating this thread is a dead giveaway.

1) You're constantly thinking of God, the possibility of there being a God, etc.

2) Even though you know and even acknowledge a discussion about such is a dead-end, with nothing really gained. Nothing new really learned. No new "I think I'm finally seeing the LIGHT!" or something even further solidifying your faith in no God. Yet still, you're intrigued, mind-raped by God enough to start a discussion about it.

3) You graduated from simply thinking about God, to wanting to engage in conversation with others about God, see their opinions (from both believers and non-believers alike) and maybe even argue, belittle, or deepen your non-belief because here @ ISH, the majority is atheist (LOL, again, the young I know everything type) ... and because of that religious folks (especially Christians, which is the intended target you're attempting to get into quarrels with) find themselves getting gang-raped by a bunch of pissed off atheists who get extreme pleasure in unleashing their insults and opinions on the internet. A safe place where some atheists feel in their "comfort zone" and hurl insults at Christians.

4) You think about God some more.

5) You find another outlet to get into the God debate. Whether it's friends, family members you're comfortable talking to about, other internet sources. Anything you can to get your fix because you're addicted to talking about and having open discussions about God.

6) You think about God some more.

7) Rinse and repeat 1-6



The basic and real truth is that while you claim you don't believe in God, you can't stop thinking about God. Why is that, you think?

Atheism is like the world's newest and coolest religion. It's not some fad or anything like that, but it is something that a lot of younger people are finding highly entertaining, and for some really nerdy social misfits they find likewise atheists (especially on the 'net, in fact ISH is a hotbed for these nerdy social misfits) ... and to some degree, it helps them feel "accepted" like they're a part of something. Something important. Something that is rare, uncommon and involves "free thinkers" and those of higher intelligence than these, closed-minded, moronic *believers* ... you feel like this is your calling. You feel like atheism is where you "fit in"

You're probably the type who watches YouTube videos of The Atheist Experience, and comments something to the effect of "GO MATT! GO! GET 'EM DAWG!"

[Legend of Josh]

Atheists are the same people that grew up in a broken home, picked on at school, and probably beaten by their drunken stepfather. They are just taking their anger out on God by refusing to believe in Him.

Funny, under your username it says "RETARD SLAYER" ... I think it's safe to assume who the ree ree is, no?



It's comments like this that make it even easier for atheists to "do their thang" ... but maybe there's hope. Maybe you're just trolling. I hope so.

[miller-time]

Atheism is like the world's newest and coolest religion. It's not some fad or anything like that, but it is something that a lot of younger people are finding highly entertaining, and for some really nerdy social misfits they find likewise atheists (especially on the 'net, in fact ISH is a hotbed for these nerdy social misfits) ... and to some degree, it helps them feel "accepted" like they're a part of something. Something important. Something that is rare, uncommon and involves "free thinkers" and those of higher intelligence than these, closed-minded, moronic *believers* ... you feel like this is your calling. You feel like atheism is where you "fit in"

This might be true to some degree. But you also have to acknowledge that this is the first time in recent history that atheists are actually able to come out. How many people have been atheists in the past but have had to keep it a secret? The numbers aren't just growing because it is popular, they are also growing because they simply can. Fear of being ostracized is decreasing, however that isn't true for everywhere.

[Legend of Josh]

This might be true to some degree. But you also have to acknowledge that this is the first time in recent history that atheists are actually able to come out. How many people have been atheists in the past but have had to keep it a secret? The numbers aren't just growing because it is popular, they are also growing because they simply can. Fear of being ostracized is decreasing, however that isn't true for everywhere.

I agree with you. But, it wasn't like atheists were being hunted like witches and burned at the stake either.

Also, and this is just my opinion, I feel like the poles have shifted to your very point. It's almost as if you're a believer, you're automatically labeled an idiot. Unable to think for yourself. Brainwashed. Maybe back in the day atheists were heavily mocked and ridiculed, but today, wouldn't you agree it seems almost the opposite, especially when talking about young adults, and even young teenagers.

I think even now today, and especially in the future, believers will become the outcasts. Believers will become the taboo. Believers will become the misinformed, uneducated (or at least thought to be), those of less intelligence, etc.

Are there dumb as shit believers out there? Yes, most certainly. However, I think it's a bit unfair for a typical average atheist these days (especially the younger newly enlightened type) to label any and all believers as dumbasses, etc. without really having a solid understanding of the whole God debate thing. Many atheists are very quick to pull the trigger and insult a religious person (ESPECIALLY a Christian) without any real merit behind it.

While there are many religious people who think/feel they're intellectual superior to non-believers, there are certainly WAY MORE atheists who feel they're the ones who are mentally superior, and that believers are WAY MORE mentally inferior. Like a rabbit v. turtle race comparison level. Religious people don't go around mocking atheists 24/7 365, but we know atheists do. I'm not saying ALL religious or ALL atheists, I'm just saying on average.

The part I really don't get... is why Christianity is attacked so fiercely? Why do atheists hate Jesus Christ so much? Let's suppose JC never even lived. Let's suppose there is no God, etc ... why exactly are so many atheists just THAT ragingly mad at Christ? I mean, I'm talking real hardcore insults, jokes, mockery. I've always found that interesting and enigmatic.

I think many atheists hate Jesus Christ more than say a Hitler, Stalin or even Judus haha. Why?

[RidonKs]

A very common attribute for atheists (especially young adults, thinking they understand the entire world around them, and that the average Christian is a mindless moron) is that atheists always have God on the brain

that's not a common attribute for atheists, it's a common attribute for anybody even remotely interested in the mysteries of life. and i'm not just talking about the metaphysical questions like "what started it all" and "is there life after death", though that's obviously part of it.

mostly i'm talking about the questions that arise from the inevitable shortcomings of whatever explanations we've managed to scrape together to understand our everyday human affairs, both personal and social. we certainly still don't have much of a grasp on any of it as far as i can tell. most generally, what's human nature? what's our primary psychological drive? survival instinct? love thy neighbour and cooperation? a will to power? how do we navigate the pros and cons of emotions like guilt, resentment, or the institutions of dependence and authority that are at once so helpful and yet so harmful? how the f*ck do we reconcile the fact that we live our entire lives on a core assumption that we're the center of the universe that revolves around us.... but everyone else does to? what justifies our love and our hate and our passions, or is their very nature the fact that nothing justifies them, and more than that, nothing should justify them? should we question them? why should i obey my parents? for how long should i obey my parents? is cynicism towards the political life acceptable or is a failure to participate in the great problems of the world the one unacceptable decision a human can make? is hedonism the only way out? should i deride that lazy bum on the street or consider how he got there? am i in it for myself or are we all in it together?

our social sciences have compiled an unbelievably thorough record of peoples behavioural tendencies... but that's all they are. tendencies that remain totally inapplicable at the individual level and still far too subject to a myriad of circumstance at the general level to give them any predictive weight. the hard questions persist and remain mysterious.

it's THOSE mysteries that are precisely what makes life interesting and fun and worth thinking critically about and contemplating with others. at the end of the day, experiencing all of that mumbo jumbo is what makes us human beings.

so finally, it's the limits of our understanding that make people consider god on a serious level, regardless of self identity or social affiliation, christian, jew, atheist preaching at the pulpit, satanic cult leader, buddhist monk, w/e. because the thing about god is that he/she/it is among the most multifaceted concepts humans have ever created. the fact that god is infinite by definition only underscores that fact. from the most restricted version of theism to the broadest pantheism, they all fundamentally serve the same purpose. to make sense of that which is beyond our senses and seemingly, perhaps even permanently, beyond the very tool of the rationality that even allows us to consider this shit. try to reduce all the conflicts and paradoxes and everyday dilemmas to a simplicity thats actually within the constraints of our thinking capacity.

and really, in my opinion at least, if the endgame is getting answers, it's all an effort in futility. if your endgame is enjoying the process itself, well, you're in luck. but it's all still worth thinking about, and if upon reflection of all the mysteries of life, you can't find room for at least some idea of "god", well all i can suggest is that you keep reflecting.


thats what i think anyway

more on the topic of what you guys are talking about, there is a definite shift coursing through modern society. it was only a matter of time before our secular politics would eventually come to bear on our religious convictions. organized faith in the traditional sense is unquestionably receding. and for the americans here, most of you probably, your country is among the most religious in the world so your view is a little skewed in terms of global trends.

[knickswin]

I am an atheist who has NO PROBLEM with Jesus Christ (who probably didn't even exist). The message of LOVING THY BROTHER is great. I am down with love, considerateness, and empathy. To me, they give life meaning.

HOWEVER there is no God and anyone who thinks otherwise is delusional and/or in denial.

[gigantes]

nice work, OP. fair points and an interesting topic.

i've thought about all this before and i have an answer:


everyone in the world is religious, whether they like it or not, admit to it or not.


every modern human is 'cursed' with one of the worst drawbacks in history...... i.e., a brain that self-recognises. therefore, a brain that glimpses so much more than itself.

something like that, anyway.

religion is nothing more and nothing less than an attempt to make sense of the cosmos and to give order and security to one's life. people who try to live a life without the comforting answers of religion, community, family and so forth are generally the sickest / most needy of all people in society.

that's my early run-through, in any case.
sane? or full of excrement?


EDIT: ridonks showed up?!? YES....!

[Legend of Josh]

I just have another general question I've been curious about for some time now. Why do many atheists always seem so angry.