Kobe Bryant is now officially a top 10 player of all time!

[monkeypox]

I think it's unfair to say Kobe's only got one championship. He was more than an Robert Horry on those three chips. People credit Garnet with a ring even though he didn't win finals mvp, so I don't know why people competely discredit Kobe's three other rings. And for those that live by the stats I beleive he lead in win shares for one of the three. Being an elite player on four championships is pretty damn good.

[Sir Charles]

How many league MVPs did Pip win? How many Finals MVP? How many scoring titles? How many titles as the #1? Has he ever been to the Finals as the #1?

How many times has Bryant ben the Most Dominant Defender in the Game (DRT) ?

WHen Jordan Left ...Pippen was among the Most Dominant Defender in the Game ....Finished as Top 4 Player in the League (Top 4 PER) with NO Top 10 PER Player in the League : PAU GASOL (Today`s Kevin McHale) a Top 10 Best Player the Last 9 Years!!!

Not to Mention Imagine How Hard that is to Be

Among the Most Dominant Defenders in the Game (Like Howard is now, 2nd Lebron) but Also THEE GAME CREATOR for His Team while the the Leading Scorer for His team, Leading Assiter for His Team, Leading Stealer for His Team and 3rd in Rebounds for his Team with 9.4 per game?

More Respect for Scottie Pippen = Greatest Perimeter Defender of All Time, One of the Greatest Game Creators of All time from the PF Position

Pippen in his Prime was around Kobe`s level and quite possibly better in everything except the 1 on 1 Game, Scoring and Shooting.

More Respect 12 year old!

[D-Rose]

I think it's unfair to say Kobe's only got one championship. He was more than an Robert Horry on those three chips. People credit Garnet with a ring even though he didn't win finals mvp, so I don't know why people competely discredit Kobe's three other rings. And for those that live by the stats I beleive he lead in win shares for one of the three. Being an elite player on four championships is pretty damn good.

I think Kobe said it right in the Press conference that people just discredited his role altogether as a star on that team.

I love how he said it's a great feeling to prove all the haters wrong.

[D-Rose]

How many times has Bryant ben the Most Dominant Defender in the Game (DRT) ?

WHen Jordan Left ...Pippen was among the Most Dominant Defender in the Game ....Finished as Top 4 Player in the League (Top 4 PER) with NO Top 10 PER Player in the League : PAU GASOL (Today`s Kevin McHale) a Top 10 Best Player the Last 9 Years!!!

Not to Mention Imagine How Hard that is to Be

Among the Most Dominant Defenders in the Game (Like Howard is now, 2nd Lebron) but Also THEE GAME CREATOR for His Team while the the Leading Scorer for His team, Leading Assiter for His Team, Leading Stealer for His Team and 3rd in Rebounds for his Team with 9.4 per game?

More Respect for Scottie Pippen = Greatest Perimeter Defender of All Time, One of the Greatest Game Creators of All time from the PF Position

Pippen in his Prime was around Kobe`s level and quite possibly better in everything except the 1 on 1 Game, Scoring and Shooting.

More Respect 12 year old!

My post did seem a bit snobby and fanboyish but I was only saying what the difference was between Kobe and Pippen. I didn't mean to underrate Pippen in any way.

Can you please give your Top 10 or Top 20 all time list ? I'm interested how much of your list is dependent on EFF, PER, other stats.

[Sir Charles]

I think it's unfair to say Kobe's only got one championship. He was more than an Robert Horry on those three chips. People credit Garnet with a ring even though he didn't win finals mvp, so I don't know why people competely discredit Kobe's three other rings. And for those that live by the stats I beleive he lead in win shares for one of the three. Being an elite player on four championships is pretty damn good.

He didn`t win because of the media crap that destroy`s the reality of the game and the respect for Pierce whom had been the leader for the last decade for the Celtics: when one arrives he can`t just take away the ground of a player that has been around more. Its called respect dummy!

*Look at the Celtics now...can hardly get passed the 1st Round with out Garnett!!! from Champions to that!...thats how Impactful his Game is.

And yes Garnett was THEE REAL FINALS MVP for the Champions of 2008

That goes for Real NBA Fans Not Kiddos Who Listen to What the Media Tells Them and Repeates it Like a Recorder

[D-Rose]

He didn`t win because of the media crap that destroy`s the reality of the game and the respect for Pierce whom had been the leader for the last decade for the Celtics: when one arrives he can`t just take away the ground of a player that has been around more. Its called respect dummy!

*Look at the Celtics now...can hardly get passed the 1st Round with out Garnett!!! from Champions to that!...thats how Impactful his Game is.

And yes Garnett was THEE REAL FINALS MVP for the Champions of 2008

That goes for Real NBA Fans Not Kiddos Who Listen to What the Media Tells Them and Repeates it Like a Recorder

Take away Pierce and it's the same amount of success. Without Pierce there's no clutch go-to guy that can create.

[monkeypox]

He didn`t win because of the media crap that destroy`s the reality of the game and the respect for Pierce whom had been the leader for the last decade for the Celtics: when one arrives he can`t just take away the ground of a player that has been around more. Its called respect dummy!

*Look at the Celtics now...can hardly get passed the 1st Round with out Garnett!!! from Champions to that!...thats how Impactful his Game is.

And yes Garnett was THEE REAL FINALS MVP for the Champions of 2008

That goes for Real NBA Fans Not Kiddos Who Listen to What the Media Tells Them and Repeates it Like a Recorder

I agree that Garnett deserves full credit for that ring, just tell that to the people that think "no finals mvp = you are robert horry."

[Dbrog]

I have Kobe 9th all-time right now, Pippen 18th. If Kobe wins next season he overtakes Hakeem and would have a case over Bird/Russell/Shaq. If he can get to 6 he leaves these guys behind and has a case over Magic. I think only Jordan, Kareem, and Wilt are beyond Kobe's reach.

@ Kobe being ranked higher than Duncan currently.

[wg1man]

Yea definetely agree Kobe Bryant is officially one of the top ten players of all time! Congratulations Kobe Bryant and the Los Angeles Lakers, they deseerved it!

[stephanieg]

Huh?

[Big#50]

Yeah, how does that effect my point?

What I am saying is that Kobe got to play with the Greatest Center in 20 years. People wondered if he can win without Shaq, and it took him 7 years to do it.

That's only Ring #1 as a Leader. Why do we dismiss guys like Pippen and Worthy, who have just as many Rings as Kobe? Because they are not Leaders. Kobe finally has one as a Leader. That does not make you Top 10.

Agreed.

[Laker4Lyfe]

[D-Rose]

Agreed.

Honestly I guess you guys don't see the big picture. It's not only getting a title as a #1 and Finals MVP that put Kobe in this position. It is a combination of other accomplishments that can arguably put him in the Top 10.

This was all Kobe was missing, he already had everything else (11 time All-Star, All-NBA, All-Defensive, MVP, Scoring titles, ASG MVP, youngest to 20K, etc etc).

[Sir Charles]

My post did seem a bit snobby and fanboyish but I was only saying what the difference was between Kobe and Pippen. I didn't mean to underrate Pippen in any way.

Can you please give your Top 10 or Top 20 all time list ? I'm interested how much of your list is dependent on EFF, PER, other stats.

Its dependant alot on reality which is shown in "Broken Down Stats" through EFF, PER and Statistical + / -

-They Tell the Real Story...that the Hype-Media-Votings-Likes Don`t Wan`t to Look At...

*But lets Remember...Those would be more exact if they where measured by the Level of Teamate One Is Sorrounded by In Your Prime and Those Teamates Prime...so then there would be an even more exacpt mesaure of Efficiency, Production, Impact and Domination but those have not yet been made...

*Also that should be measured for players Primes (usually ages 22-32) because if player plays passed 32-34 then his EFF, PER (including Play-Off PER, even more important than season) and Statistical +/- declines greatly and especially at 35,36,37,38 etc..

*There are few exceptions that have played at a superior level passed 32-34 (Jabbar, Jordan, Malone, Kobe most likely..etc)

In No Order i can make a Sure Top 16 For Their Primes

Centers

****Wilt Chamberlain (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)
****Kareem A Jabbar (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)
****Shaq (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)
****David Robinson (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)

Center-Forwards

****Hakeem Olajuwon (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)
****Tim Duncan (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)

Powerforwards

****Charles Barkley (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)
****Karl Malone (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)
****Bob Petit (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)

Shooting Guards or Combo Guards

****Michael Jordan (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)

Point Guards

****Magic Johnson (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)

For These Last 5...If You Take Their Primes ages 22-32 then they would also appear in the (Top 20 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/-)

Smallforwards

***Julius Erving
***Larry Bird
***Elgin Baylor

Shooting Guards or Combo Guards

***Jerry West
***Oscar Robertson

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*****Wilt and Jabbar would definetly be the Greatest Players If you talk about prime ages 22-32...Jordan close....or maybe right there if you consider level of teamates

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****Only Players to be In The Top 10 All Time In EFF, PER and Statistical +/- are Michael Jordan and Charles Barkely as of now and if you include that off The Level of Their Teamates them 2 and Prime Hakeem Olajuwon and David Robinson would probably be THEE 4 MOST PRODUCTIVE PLAYERS of All Time...Probably The Best All Court Players of All Time (soon Lebron): Those That Have the Best Mixture of IMPACT, DOMINANCE and EFFICIENCY together...

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***Kevin Garnett is One Most Likely to Join That Group of Top 17-20 Players in 3-5 years

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**Kobe will establish himself as a Top 20-25 in the next 5 years or so aswell as ....

Wade 20-25 in the next 5-8 years

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**** Lebron James is the Only Plauer Right Now, other than Shaq and Duncan to have a Chance to be in the Top 5-10-15 GOATs


For Detail: http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/sho...=123375&page=8

[Laker4Lyfe]

Lil Dez: "Sir Charles Barkley don't have no rings................. not one"