Shaq vs. Bird

[oolalaa]

Bird was a jerk and he and McHale despised each other.

That's a pretty big exaggeration on both points....

[ILLsmak]

Post-season Shaq was a FAR greater player.

And a PEAK regular season Shaq was much more dominant.

Shaq is better than Bird when it comes to getting wins. All of the fluff aside, you gotta take the dude who controls the paint and I don't think anyone else has the way Shaq did. People were physically afraid of Shaq, opposing front lines would quit.

Now, if you said game tied going down the stretch gimme Bird, but 82 games gimme the guy who dominates the paint and makes almost 60% of his shots, collapsing the D.

People here are funny because they underrate Shaq. They value stats and awards and for some reason Shaq didn't go as hard on the awards as other players did. Maybe cuz he was usually skipping half the season. But anyone who says Shaq wasn't a huge defensive impact player is a dummy.

-Smak

[Hands of Iron]

Actually, the '84 Lakers were one bad pass, and one missed FT away from SWEEPING Boston. Even Larry Bird admitted that they should have.

And, had Magic been completely healthy for the '81 post-season, and LA gets #2 of what would have been a 3-peat. The '80 and '82 Lakers easily handled Philly in the Finals (and even won a clinching game six on the road without Kareem in '80), while the '81 Celtics had to come back from a 3-1 series deficit against the Sixers, and in those three straight wins, they won by the narrowest of margins.

And if you are going to credit Bird with a "hypothetical" ring over Magic in '86, then I will give Magic a hypothetical ring over Bird in '88 (and any year after that, had Boston even been able to get to the Finals in '89, 90, and '91.

So even IF I were to give you '86, Magic SHOULD have beaten him in 81 and '84, dominated him in '85 and '87, and WOULD have pasted him in '88, '89, 90, and '91.

Or basically, Magic with a 9-1 edge over Bird.

No, I'm actually talking about 1986 and the merit of the Houston Rockets as the Celtics NBA Finals opponent that season. It's not a hypothetical win so much as it is a prediction considering that was the best team the Celtics put on the court during the decade. Wasn't even really the point of the post either though.

I don't know what all that other drivel is for or why you even posted it. Oh, that's right! You don't like Larry Bird. I couldn't give a shit less. One bad pass and one missed free throw, huh? That's why they play the games, bud. And yes, we already know the 1980s Lakers had a lot more talent than the Celtics. Magic had a Top 5 player of all-time making huge contributions through 1985 for three of their championships. McHale and Parish made one All-NBA (1) Team, combined. For their careers.

[Harison]

Bird was a jerk and he and McHale despised each other.

Not really, but they had clashes. Reason is simple, Bird was die-hard intense player, while McHale was laid-back "its just a game".

Still they respected each other and had no problems co-existing, until the very end - when injured roster couldnt win anymore, and Bird was increasingly bitter, especially considering Bird was on constant pain management - few hours before every game at the hospital. THEN yes - you could say the locker room atmosphere wasnt good, but team was done anyway.

[KevinNYC]

Bird was a jerk and he and McHale despised each other.

Are distorting things because you have an agenda or do you just not know the real relationship between the two players.

McHale isn't into the heavy psychoanalysis thing, but he's pretty sure that diversity helped the whole. He believes he knows why the Celtics had a good mixture.

"It was because we were all different personalities," McHale said. "If everybody had been like me or been like Larry or been like Robert (Parish), it never would have worked. You know what I mean? We all drove each other crazy, and that was good. We had a good group of guys. We always had a lot of guys on our team that had a lot of character and were fun to be around. I think that was a big part of it. I don't know if success breeds chemistry or chemistry breeds success, but whatever happened, we had a lot of it.

"Larry Bird improved everybody. He was the best player on our team. He drove everybody. He could do so many things, it was fun playing with him.

[Freedom Kid7]

Is it really that fair to compare a center to a small forward?
Regardless I'm taking Bird for both situations. Bird's best winning season is equivalent of Shaq's best, if not better (Bird was a king and had to go through tough competition. 2000 Shaq did not have to worry about any incredibly tough teams or better centers). Plus, Bird would cause far less drama and has better intangibles than Shaq is. Shaq might be more athletic and arguably dominance, but Bird had all the intangibles Shaq didn't, and that changes a whole lot of things. Plus, Shaq might only give you a couple of years with a team. Bird will stay with you until his back breaks.

EDIT: Jlaubber, I sware it seems you really detest Bird, Hakeem and KAJ to an extent. Why?

[DatAsh]

And shot blocking, defense, and playoff performer/Finals performer in his prime/peak. He also 3peated to titles with less help than Bird got.

[DatAsh]

I'd probably rate Bird higher all-time, and would build around him over Shaq as well despite O'Neal's iilustrious peak. I'd really only take Hakeem Olajuwon and possibly Jordan over Larry Bird to build a team around.

No Wilt or Russell?

[DatAsh]

What? Peak Bird's defense was better than peak Shaq's...

Let's not get carried away now

[Legends66NBA7]

What in the post was laughable ?

And shot blocking, defense, and playoff performer/Finals performer in his prime/peak. He also 3peated to titles with less help than Bird got.

Especially the first two. Bird's better than Shaq in shot blocking and defense ?

[KOBE143]

Bird easily.. No Kobe no 3peat for Shaq..

[DatAsh]

What in the post was laughable ?



Especially the first two. Bird's better than Shaq in shot blocking and defense ?

Guess that came out wrong

I don't disagree with any of it, I just enjoyed the sarcastic nature of the post itself. In hindsight I see how that could be taken the wrong way though.

[Legends66NBA7]

Guess that came out wrong

I don't disagree with any of it, I just enjoyed the sarcastic nature of the post itself. In hindsight I see how that could be taken the wrong way though.

Ohhh.....

Damn, I feel like a dick now.

Damn internet and mixed messages.... and yes, that was in a sense sarcastic but yes a serious post too.

[Legends66NBA7]

Bird was a jerk and he and McHale despised each other.

Yes, Bird could be a dick too, but he wasn't breaking the Celtics dynasty apart. The core still remained the same, but got old faster.

Shaq had problems with Kobe and managment too. Even burned bridges with the Magic, Lakers, and Heat franchises.

[TheBigVeto]

EDIT: Jlaubber, I sware it seems you really detest Bird, Hakeem and KAJ to an extent. Why?

That clown is a Wilt/Magic/Kobe slurper.