Breakup of Jordan's Bulls: Why did Jerry Krause destroy the Bulls?

[Clippersfan86]

Don't forget.... 98-99 was a lockout. I do believe the Bulls had a good chance at another championship.

True would of been even easier for the Bulls to win a 4th in a row. In this video it says that the Bulls had literally 10 contracts coming off the books after the final championship and it would of been impossible to keep it together. Reinsdorf could of at least kept together the main guys?

It seems like Pippen was as big of a problem as Krause. Immature and money hungry? I guess he blew up on a team bus demanding a trade. He wanted to make a name for himself outside of Jordan. I guess he wanted a bigger contract. Krause sat him down and told him to wait to sign a contract extension until the new cap is set and Pippen said I don't care I want the long term security now. Within a couple seasons after new caps were set.. Pippen was the 5th highest paid player on the Bulls and demanded a trade because he felt he was worth more.

Now it's also saying Phil Jackson orchestrated the collapse of the Bulls dynasty by motivating his players to turn on the Bulls FO. The players were saying he constantly motivated them by using Jerry Krause because they all had a common hatred for him.

[Gotterdammerung]

Krause retired in 2003, citing obesity, and is now a scout for the Chicago White Sox. Which was his old position in the 70's. The more things change...

Yes, he was convinced that the Bulls' success was due to his superior organizational skills, not the players or the coach.

At the same time, it would have been hard to re-sign everyone without detonating the salary cap.

[Clippersfan86]

Man this is such an interesting story. So much drama... so many egos. Now on part 2... it's showing the flip side. How Jordan was responsible for the breakup. I guess he was constantly demonizing and personally attacking Krause. Pippen said that Jordan would randomly insult Krause on the team bus. Call him fatass etc.

So the number 1 reason Krause isn't to blame according to this ESPN Classic special is Michael Jordan. His hatred for Krause and ego are supposedly equally as responsible for the destruction of the Bulls dynasty.

I should of titled this "Who destroyed the Bulls dynasty?"

[Sarcastic]

Don't forget.... 98-99 was a lockout. I do believe the Bulls had a good chance at another championship.

This. I think the Bulls would have beaten the Spurs if they were given the chance to do so. By 2000 however, the Lakers were ready to win. Then again they probably wouldn't have had Phil Jackson as their coach, so who knows.

[dee-rose]

It was ugly behind the scenes, but it was actually a perfect finish. Jordan was showing signs of being human, and after Pippens back went out, I really don't think we would have won another one. Alot of it had to do with Pippen's problems with Krause but Phil Jackson was the real mastermind behind the players tension with the Krause and the rest of management. He could have easily just taken managements side, but it became a battle of egos and Phil often used the managements mistreatment of the team as a way to unite and motivate them. Krause was a douchey egomaniac who believed it was more about the organization then the players, and in some cases (spurs) it is, but in this case it wasn't. It sort of became an MJ/Phil vs. Krause battle, and in the end Krause wanted to prove he could build a contender without MJ. He obviously failed. At the end of the day, it all worked out and MJ ended up having a fairytale of a career. Everytime I hear PJ say "what a finish" after MJ's last shot, it's a reminder that the end was inevitable, because Phil wanted out, not Pippen.

As for all the Pippen demanding a trade stuff, all of that happened after Krause tried to trade him and when it almost happened, MJ told Krause that he'd retire again if Pippen was traded. Honestly, if Phil would have stayed, MJ wouldn't have retired, and they might have another ring to their name... or they might have been knocked out by a team led by a rookie.

[chicity89]

Honestly what personnel moves did Krause make that stood out? I always thought Krause was overrated, none of his draft picks really panned out (although they were at the end of the round) and besides dealing Perdue for Rodman I don't remember him making any other big trades.

The only thing that I think was notable was when he traded Oakley for Bill Cartwright. The Bulls needed a center to put them over the top and that definitely helped. However, I'm not saying I supported how Krause felt or what he did was something of genius. I will always resent him for breaking up the team that I grew up watching night in and night out. The thing I'm saying is that he felt like he deserved more credit and didn't get it, wrong or not. At the end of the day the players are the ones who went out there and busted their asses and brought this city almost a decade of excellence. Jerry Krause wasn't the one on the floor.

[Rose]

So in general do you feel the entire FO should be blamed rather than the pawn Krause? I just found this video all of you should check out if you have 21 minutes (2 parts youtube). It's called "Did Jerry Krause break up the Chicago Bulls dynasty?". It's a Sportscenter special.

It investigates all the details and hears all sides of the story from players, coaches, opposing players and coaches, other GM's opinions of Krause and the dynasty etc. Seems like a ton of people are saying Krause had a nasty ego. Brilliant mind to build the team.. but also went mad because he wanted more recognition.

Part 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHK9w...eature=related


Part 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyjOb...eature=related

Edit: Bulls owner Jerry Reinsdorf speaks in the videos too. It's super interesting and worth watching.

Just watched. Disagree with #1. Jordan was open that if Phil stayed, he stays. I think they should flip 1 and 2.

[Clippersfan86]

It was ugly behind the scenes, but it was actually a perfect finish. Jordan was showing signs of being human, and after Pippens back went out, I really don't think we would have won another one. Alot of it had to do with Pippen's problems with Krause but Phil Jackson was the real mastermind behind the players tension with the Krause and the rest of management. He could have easily just taken managements side, but it became a battle of egos and Phil often used the managements mistreatment of the team as a way to unite and motivate them. Krause was a douchey egomaniac who believed it was more about the organization then the players, and in some cases (spurs) it is, but in this case it wasn't. It sort of became an MJ/Phil vs. Krause battle, and in the end Krause wanted to prove he could build a contender without MJ. He obviously failed. At the end of the day, it all worked out and MJ ended up having a fairytale of a career. Everytime I hear PJ say "what a finish" after MJ's last shot, it's a reminder that the end was inevitable, because Phil wanted out, not Pippen.

Sounds like it was a very complex situation. Lots of issues. Is it any surprise Phil had a similar situation with Kobe and Shaq? Pitting their egos against each other? He sure likes to manipulate.

[Clippersfan86]

Just watched. Disagree with #1. Jordan was open that if Phil stayed, he stays. I think they should flip 1 and 2.

Part 1? Or number 1 of part two?

[dee-rose]

Sounds like it was a very complex situation. Lots of issues. Is it any surprise Phil had a similar situation with Kobe and Shaq? Pitting their egos against each other? He sure likes to manipulate.

Yup. Phil truly is a mastermind. The whole organization, including the players became puppets under him imo, I won't complain tho, it all worked out.

[Rose]

True but they would've at least contended. You don't trade in contending team for a title and arguably the greatest draw in Sports history for a lottery team led by Toni Kukoc and Elton Brand.

Well I don't think think they would have really contended either. Phil was tired of coaching which is why he took that break, and later the Lakers break. I think personally, Phil was gone regardless, but they could have found another coach and then who knows from that perspective.

But Jordan was becoming more human, and Pippen was a different player, that was Rodman's last notable season if I'm not mistaken, so they'd needed to have re-tooled.

[Rose]

Part 1? Or number 1 of part two?

Number one of part two. Should have clarified.

[Clippersfan86]

Yup. Phil truly is a mastermind. The whole organization, including the players became puppets under him imo, I won't complain tho, it all worked out.

Same with the Lakers haha. He made it work for 3 rings with Kobe and Shaq and 2 after. Btw... is it normal to almost feel pity for the Bulls opponents? I can't help but think how sucky it is that Gary Payton's Sonics and Malone and Stockton's Jazz just got very very unlucky in losing 2 times a piece to the Bulls in the finals. Had they played in any other era... they would have rings. Michael Jordan and the Bulls were heartbreakers lol.

Edit: Sorry Jazz twice.. Sonics once.

[Clippersfan86]

Number one of part two. Should have clarified.

NP assumed you meant that. Phil repeated the mind games of causing ego clashes for the Lakers too lol. Remember like in his books he would bash his players while they still played for him even to motivate etc? He sure likes controlling the minds of his players.

[Rose]

Same with the Lakers haha. He made it work for 3 rings with Kobe and Shaq and 2 after. Btw... is it normal to almost feel pity for the Bulls opponents? I can't help but think how sucky it is that Gary Payton's Sonics and Malone and Stockton's Jazz just got very very unlucky in losing 2 times a piece to the Bulls in the finals. Had they played in any other era... they would have rings. Michael Jordan and the Bulls were heartbreakers lol.

I still think the Sonics could have won if Glove had played on Jordan for more time than besides the first two games. He flustered the hell out of him, when he was on him.