Wilt Chamberlain would average "25 and 15, EASY"

[CavaliersFTW]

With today's dearth of quality centers? Those numbers are at the extreme low-end. I wouldn't go any lower than 18 rpg....scoring-wise, the game has shifted more to the perimeter but Wilt is definitely capable of 30 in this era. Who's going to stop him inside? Wilt would make even Dwight Howard look small, and Dwight's considered a monster by today's standards.

^--- Seriously. Dwight Howard is actually shorter than Bill Russell, and instead of facing him 8+ times a year plus Thurmond/Reed/Jabbar etc it'd be Dwight + Bynum like 3 times a year each. Wilt would be victimizing the leagues Glen "big baby" Davis', and Joel Anthony's like it was criminal

90 percent of the leagues centers right now are no better than the roleplayer bigs Wilt faced in the earliest part of the 60's.... IE, his 37-50ppg era... only thing that's different is pace. Sh*t would be painful to watch if it was your team he was playing against.

[Bigsmoke]

So players like the 6-9 Howard and Love would be outrebounding a near 7-2, 300 lb, 7-8 wingspan, highjump champion, Chamberlain, then?

basically.

Shaq and David Robinson couldnt rebounds like Dwight and Love could either. Shaq is the stongest to ever play the game at 7'1 and Robinson was 7'1 with the 35 vertical jump as a guard.

[ILLsmak]

hahahaha

-Smak

[millwad]

He's right bout the shot blocking number, no way in hell Wilt blocks 3bpg in his prime even in the modern NBA. Wilt's shot blocking volume is incredible, he blocked at a rate of about 7bpg in 1972. No matter how you do the math for pace, fg%, shots taken etc it isn't going to be less than 4bpg today and that was past his prime Wilt. His timing and reach combo is far beyond anyone in the league today. 9-7, and timed well enough to catch shots in mid-air or swat a Kareem skyhook?

Source?

I personally think that he'd with ease would average the most blocks in the modern era but no where close to what he was doing back in his own era.

Regarding his other stats, his 22.9 rebound average would be lower, no doubt. First of all, less competition from the guard and forward position and less athletic players (not including the center position) and way worse FG% and more shot attempts really made Wilt's rebounding stats look unreal. Even a guy like Elgin Baylor had two seasons where he averaged more than 18 rebounds per game.

I think a career average of 15 rebounds per game seems like a pretty logical number. He wouldn't play 46 minutes per game, I'd guess he'd average 40 minutes per game which still is extreme for a center. His average would go down to 19.9 rebounds if he'd average 40 minutes per game and in the modern era he'd have more competition from more athletic guards, less available rebounds due way better FG% and a slower pace.

And before you mention Kevin Love or any other statpadder, realize that Wilt would do it all on the court, passing, shotblocking, rebounding, scoring and defending. Love barely plays any defense which gives him way more room to focus on rebounds.

And regarding his scoring, per 40 minutes he'd average around 26 points per game and considering that the modern era is played at a slower pace with defensive schemes and more double teams and Wilt not being able to have anything alike his 50 points season I think his point per game average over his career would be like 23-24 points per game.

And his assists would be lower as well, he played in an era where they played at a higher pace with more possessions every game. Wilt's 40 minute per game average would give him a 3.8 assist per game average and with less possessions every game I think he'd average a 3.3 asists per game over his career. Also consider that he wouldn't be able to have two seasons where would average more than 7.8 assists per game which also drags his career average down.

So in the regular season over his WHOLE career I guess he'd average 23-24 points per game, 15 rebounds, 3.5-4 blocks and 3.3 assists per game.

In the playoffs based on a 40 minute (he averaged 47 min per game) per game average he'd average; 19 points per game, 21 rebounds and 3.5 assists.

His rebounding would obviously not be as high as 21 rebounds per game, I think 16 rebounds per game would be realistic. His scoring in his prime would be higher obviously but based on his career average he'd average 19 points per game in the playoffs and I would let it be like that and his 3.5 assists per game sounds logical too.

Obviously Wilt and some of the old school players have inflated stats, especially when it comes to rebounding and minutes per game and Wilt looks way more human with a 40 minute per game average both in the regular season and the playoffs. A player like Jordan averaged 38 minutes per game, Kobe averages 36.5 minutes per game and the elite today play way less minutes and so would Wilt do as well.

What do you guys think about this post?

[fpliii]

I don't know what he'd put up, but I believe there's a rebounding ceiling in today's game. I'm not sure where the wall is, but I can't see anybody in league history averaging much more than 17 rebounds in standard minutes if they're dropped into the league today.

[jongib369]

Source?

I personally think that he'd with ease would average the most blocks in the modern era but no where close to what he was doing back in his own era.

Regarding his other stats, his 22.9 rebound average would be lower, no doubt. First of all, less competition from the guard and forward position and less athletic players (not including the center position) and way worse FG% and more shot attempts really made Wilt's rebounding stats look unreal. Even a guy like Elgin Baylor had two seasons where he averaged more than 18 rebounds per game.

I think a career average of 15 rebounds per game seems like a pretty logical number. He wouldn't play 46 minutes per game, I'd guess he'd average 40 minutes per game which still is extreme for a center. His average would go down to 19.9 rebounds if he'd average 40 minutes per game and in the modern era he'd have more competition from more athletic guards, less available rebounds due way better FG% and a slower pace.

And before you mention Kevin Love or any other statpadder, realize that Wilt would do it all on the court, passing, shotblocking, rebounding, scoring and defending. Love barely plays any defense which gives him way more room to focus on rebounds.

And regarding his scoring, per 40 minutes he'd average around 26 points per game and considering that the modern era is played at a slower pace with defensive schemes and more double teams and Wilt not being able to have anything alike his 50 points season I think his point per game average over his career would be like 23-24 points per game.

And his assists would be lower as well, he played in an era where they played at a higher pace with more possessions every game. Wilt's 40 minute per game average would give him a 3.8 assist per game average and with less possessions every game I think he'd average a 3.3 asists per game over his career. Also consider that he wouldn't be able to have two seasons where would average more than 7.8 assists per game which also drags his career average down.

So in the regular season over his WHOLE career I guess he'd average 23-24 points per game, 15 rebounds, 3.5-4 blocks and 3.3 assists per game.

In the playoffs based on a 40 minute (he averaged 47 min per game) per game average he'd average; 19 points per game, 21 rebounds and 3.5 assists.

His rebounding would obviously not be as high as 21 rebounds per game, I think 16 rebounds per game would be realistic. His scoring in his prime would be higher obviously but based on his career average he'd average 19 points per game in the playoffs and I would let it be like that and his 3.5 assists per game sounds logical too.

Obviously Wilt and some of the old school players have inflated stats, especially when it comes to rebounding and minutes per game and Wilt looks way more human with a 40 minute per game average both in the regular season and the playoffs. A player like Jordan averaged 38 minutes per game, Kobe averages 36.5 minutes per game and the elite today play way less minutes and so would Wilt do as well.

What do you guys think about this post?

I like it for the reason that your not saying he would be a scrub like a lot of ignorant ISH posters...you at least go into depth about your opinion which is great. While we don't agree 100% on what he would average I'd say what my opinion is and what you say and in between would be a good guesstimate. What do you think his points would be at his peak if he was the number 1 scoring option? IMO being a more dangerous scoring threat than Shaq would open up a lot of assists for him...So Ill slightly raise his assists to 4 to possibly 5...IMO if Gasol can get 4.6 it's 'within reason. Idk if you've seen this video before but its a highlight of Lakers VS Bulls with some GREAT assist's by dip

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuuMMu2z6Bs


and I would also see between Kevin Love and Dennis Rodman RPG.. depending on what his role is and how often he's going for blocks losing his position for rebounds

[Pointguard]

Source?

I personally think that he'd with ease would average the most blocks in the modern era but no where close to what he was doing back in his own era.

Regarding his other stats, his 22.9 rebound average would be lower, no doubt. First of all, less competition from the guard and forward position and less athletic players (not including the center position) and way worse FG% and more shot attempts really made Wilt's rebounding stats look unreal. Even a guy like Elgin Baylor had two seasons where he averaged more than 18 rebounds per game.

I think a career average of 15 rebounds per game seems like a pretty logical number. He wouldn't play 46 minutes per game, I'd guess he'd average 40 minutes per game which still is extreme for a center. His average would go down to 19.9 rebounds if he'd average 40 minutes per game and in the modern era he'd have more competition from more athletic guards, less available rebounds due way better FG% and a slower pace.

Its not crazy to say that Barkley and Rodman were the best rebounders in the modern era and Rodman averaged more than 18. Barkley is 6'4, Rodman 6'6. and Baylor 6'5. They were definitely better rebounders than Shaq and Yao who were giants in height and girth. Barkley was active in all aspects of the game as well. Wilt and Russell went after rebounds unlike any other centers in the history of the sport. They liked to rebound and did it great their whole careers. Unlike Kareem who hated it.

And before you mention Kevin Love or any other statpadder, realize that Wilt would do it all on the court, passing, shotblocking, rebounding, scoring and defending. Love barely plays any defense which gives him way more room to focus on rebounds.

Wilt could easily cheat on every center in the game now and just claim the same seven foot radius around the rim. Dwight cheats like crazy and he's at 14.5 rebs. You never hear DH is the best rebounder ever.

And regarding his scoring, per 40 minutes he'd average around 26 points per game and considering that the modern era is played at a slower pace with defensive schemes and more double teams and Wilt not being able to have anything alike his 50 points season I think his point per game average over his career would be like 23-24 points per game.

Wilt is a natural scorer. They are very rare. Few players can hit the 30 ppg mark at all. The ones that can break that barrier three or more times are on one hand. Those who can do it more than 5 times its only Chamberlain and Jordan. Its a threshold that only the elite can get too no matter what time in history. To average 40ppg over seven years means you got great skill. He averaged 35ppg over 24 straight playoff games with defenses just going "gung ho" on him and against teams that are highly ranked all time for defense. So he's in Lebron and Jordan scoring ability there. We can say it was easier for Wilt to score but to do it at unfathomable highs that Jordan could not come close to, don't happen to a guy unless he was very skilled and had great know how on how to score. The most prolific Kareem played against Chamberlain and he was a lot closer to averaging 20ppg for 7 years than 40.

So to say Wilt would average what Dwight Howard averaged, when he wasn't skilled or polished at all, and what Wilt averaged on a bouncy Kareem when Wilt didn't care to shoot anymore (well less than half the attempts he was shooting in his prime) is a bit of a stretch. 19ppg is way too low for a guy that demonstrated way too many feats that have lasted 50 years. He has more of scorer's mentality than DH (23ppg), way more dominance, way more skill, way more determination and way more will power. DH is not a natural scorer, nor much of a learned one. Wilt also had a better touch around the rim.

While I do think the zone and speed of perimeter players would slow him down some. The lack of defensive players, plethora of fast creative point guards and great shooters should also be in the formula in favor of Wilt. Wilt with a running, creative point guard would get a lot of easier baskets as well. Amare was a lot like DH when he averaged 26ppg. He basically got his points off of speed. Wilt would have all the same advantages as DH, Shaq and Amare collectively in today's game - only against worse competition today - tho I do think Wilt was more skilled and had a better shooting touch. There is no way the conversations starts below 29ppg, a good 10 points away from what you have.

[Helix]

Wilt would average whatever he wanted to average in any era.

Unless you actually saw the guy play and have lived long enough to fully understand the evolution of athletes, training, nutrition, etc, it would be very difficult to understand just what a freak he was.

He's the best big man that ever lived, and he'd have been the best in any era he played.

That is the correct answer.

[millwad]

Its not crazy to say that Barkley and Rodman were the best rebounders in the modern era and Rodman averaged more than 18. Barkley is 6'4, Rodman 6'6. and Baylor 6'5. They were definitely better rebounders than Shaq and Yao who were giants in height and girth. Barkley was active in all aspects of the game as well. Wilt and Russell went after rebounds unlike any other centers in the history of the sport. They liked to rebound and did it great their whole careers. Unlike Kareem who hated it.

How is that relevant to what I wrote?
And I find it ridiculous that in a try to hype up Chamberlain you midgetize Barkley. Since when was Barkley 6'4? Come on, soon people will call him 6'0..

I guess Barkley in this pic used high heels;



And Rodman had no offense and he was a PF, all he did was to rebound and defend, when he liked to. And Barkley who was TALLER than 6'4 never came close to some of the rebounding numbers Baylor had, are you going to claim that rebounds weren't inflated back then? And what has Kareem to do with this? Seriously..

Wilt could easily cheat on every center in the game now and just claim the same seven foot radius around the rim. Dwight cheats like crazy and he's at 14.5 rebs. You never hear DH is the best rebounder ever.

What the hell, I was talking career average and I did it based on the fact that rebounding numbers were inflated compared to modern era due worse FG%, less athletic guards and faster pace.

And I was talking about career average, not prime. And Dwight's highest rebound per game average in a season is 14.5, his career average is 13 rebounds per game and that will go down when he gets older.

Wilt is a natural scorer. They are very rare. Few players can hit the 30 ppg mark at all. The ones that can break that barrier three or more times are on one hand. Those who can do it more than 5 times its only Chamberlain and Jordan. Its a threshold that only the elite can get too no matter what time in history. To average 40ppg over seven years means you got great skill. He averaged 35ppg over 24 straight playoff games with defenses just going "gung ho" on him and against teams that are highly ranked all time for defense. So he's in Lebron and Jordan scoring ability there. We can say it was easier for Wilt to score but to do it at unfathomable highs that Jordan could not come close to, don't happen to a guy unless he was very skilled and had great know how on how to score. The most prolific Kareem played against Chamberlain and he was a lot closer to averaging 20ppg for 7 years than 40.

Irrelevant.
I never said that he wasn't a natural scorer but you don't seem to understand that first of all, Wilt's minute per game average would go down and I'm even generous when I gave him a career average of 40 minutes per game when I tried to translate his number to the modern era. No players and especially no centers play 40 minutes per game as an average during their whole careers in the modern era. So I gave him 40 minutes anyway and his average based on 40 minute play would be 26 points and due defensive schemes, more double teams and slower pace I only took away 2-3 points as a career average. How is that unfair?

So to say Wilt would average what Dwight Howard averaged, when he wasn't skilled or polished at all, and what Wilt averaged on a bouncy Kareem when Wilt didn't care to shoot anymore (well less than half the attempts he was shooting in his prime) is a bit of a stretch. 19ppg is way too low for a guy that demonstrated way too many feats that have lasted 50 years. He has more of scorer's mentality than DH (23ppg), way more dominance, way more skill, way more determination and way more will power. DH is not a natural scorer, nor much of a learned one. Wilt also had a better touch around the rim.

Wilt in his own era had a career average of 22.5 points per game in the playoffs and that was over 47 minutes per game, something he never would have played in the modern era. I gave him a 40 minute average of playing time instead based on his OWN stats from his OWN era and based on that he'd AVERAGE 19 points. So you think that defensive schemes, more double teams, slower pace and a more guard owned ball game would do Wilt much greater based on scoring?

While I do think the zone and speed of perimeter players would slow him down some. The lack of defensive players, plethora of fast creative point guards and great shooters should also be in the formula in favor of Wilt. Wilt with a running, creative point guard would get a lot of easier baskets as well. Amare was a lot like DH when he averaged 26ppg. He basically got his points off of speed. Wilt would have all the same advantages as DH, Shaq and Amare collectively in today's game - only against worse competition today - tho I do think Wilt was more skilled and had a better shooting touch. There is no way the conversations starts below 29ppg, a good 10 points away from what you have.

Wilt did NOT have a better shooting touch than Amare, stop dreaming. And I wrote that I believe he'd average higher than 19 per game in the playoffs in his scoring prime but you got to realize that Wilt's career average in the playoffs when it came to scoring is not as impressive as you're trying to claim it was.

Per 36 minutes he had a lower career scoring average in the playoffs than Olajuwon, Shaq, Kareem, Tim Duncan, Patrick Ewing, Moses Malone, Willis Reed.. His regular season average is by far greater than all those guys, even on a 36 minute per game judgement.

With a 40 minute per game average he averaged about 19 points per game during his playoff career. What makes you believe that slower pace, more double teams, defensive schemes and playing in an era with way less touches for centers would make him so much greater on offense in the playoffs compared to what he was in his own era?

And yeah, so you basically think that he'd average 29 points per game (at least), probably a couple of rebounds higher than 15. It's real life basketball, it's not some video game and I don't understand why you think that this era would make him look even greater when it comes to stats? Please explain.

[jlauber]

Baylor's best season translates to about 13 rpg in today's NBA...which is just below the 6-5 Barkley's best season. The 6-8 Jerry Lucas' best season translates to about 14 rpg in today's NBA, which is just slightly less than the 6-9 (or shorter) Kevin Love's best season of 15 rpg.

Take Wilt's 27 rpg season, and it translates to about 18 rpg in today's NBA. Let him play against clowns in 75% of his game, tell him to cut back his shot blocks to 5+ instead of 10, and his rebounding numbers would go UP.

The bottom line...if Kevin Love can grab 15.2 rpg, in 35.8 mpg, in an NBA that averaged 41.4 rpg per team...a Wilt, who was just crushing his peers, and EASILY playing 43-44 mpg (hell, the man has the SEVEN highest MPG seasons in NBA history, and players like Lebron and Iverson were around 43 mpg within the last ten years)...Chamberlain would come close to 20 rpg.

As for scoring...I get a kick out of those that use his CAREER playoff scoring mark of 22.5 ppg as some kind of gauge on his scoring. The man had FOUR 50+ point playoffs games. He had FOUR playoff series of 37 ppg, 37 ppg, 39 ppg and 39 ppg. He had THREE playoff series, just against Russell of between 30-34 ppg (and another two at 28-29 ppg.) He had FOUR post-seasons of 33.2 ppg, 34.7 ppg, 35.0 ppg, and 37.0 ppg. And, think about this... his 34.7 ppg playoff run came on .543 shooting, in a POST-SEASON NBA that only averaged 105.8 ppg on .420 shooting.

And the REALITY was, Chamberlain cut back his shooting by design (and poor designs in some cases...see the 1969 post-season.) How great a scorer was a "pre-injured" Wilt. In his 11th season, at age 33, he was LEADING the NBA in scoring at 32.2 ppg, on get this... .579 (as well as averaging 20.2 rpg),,,when he shredded his knee.

Of course, those that use SMALL sample playoff series, will point out Kareem's 35 ppg post-season in '77, in 11 playoff games. Well, Chamberlain was averaging 32 ppg in his first nine straight games in that '70 season. Interesting, too, that he poured in 38 against the reigning MVP, Wes Unseld, as well as 42 against the very talented Bob Rule, and get this...he dumped 43 on Connie Dierking in one of those nine games (this, only a year after shelling him for 60 points in a game.) Why is 43 point game interesting? Kareem faced Dierking multiple times in his career, and his high game against him was 41 points. Oh, and Chamberlain outscored Kareem, 25-23, and outshot him, 9-14 to 9-21, in their one H2H that season, as well.

That from a Chamberlain who was past his peak "scoring" seasons.

BTW, Wilt averaged 50.4 ppg in an NBA that averaged 118.8 ppg. Doing simple math, that translates to 41 ppg in this PAST season (the NBA averaged 96.3 ppg in a season of a condensed scheduling.)

[PistolPete44]

Ban the LosBulls Mods

[millwad]

Ban the LosBulls Mods

You're the one who should get banned, do you always PM stuff like this to people when you don't agree with them?

I hope cancer gets your mom mang

I mean wilt chamberlain is ****ing dead and you hate him with a passion?
Dude helped shaped NBA mang
You deserved cancer, not some innocent old men / smokers

I sure gave you a reply you deserved, but you sir, you're a pathetic human being and being that angry and wishing that someone's mother should get cancer because they don't agree with you when it comes to basketball, that's beyond pathetic and makes you a worthless and shitty person.

Your mother must be ashamed of the fact that her son is such a worthless individual.

[Deuce Bigalow]

You're the one who should get banned, do you always PM stuff like this to people when you don't agree with them?



I sure gave you a reply you deserved, but you sir, you're a pathetic human being and being that angry and wishing that someone's mother should get cancer because they don't agree with you when it comes to basketball, that's beyond pathetic and makes you a worthless and shitty person.

Your mother must be ashamed of the fact that her son is such a worthless individual.

Here's the PMs he sent me

YOU ARE PATHETIC

Stress is not a good thing for elders, so take it easy. No need to be mad.

YOU NEED TO DIE MAN I HATE READING YOUR POSTS AND U ARE A BIASED KOBRICK STAN
AOPISEHFOAUISDFHOUAFUAEHGOUHEGO UKJOBROICK STANS I HOPE KOBE FANS DIE
PIOJOPERJIO$ITJ)358972984739283479287(*#$&(*#&$(*# &$(*)#$&(

Stop being mad. It's not healthy for your age.

Get ****ED I DONT WANT TO SEE UR NAME AGAIN ****ING KID I FIUUK U ****

Calm down and take your pills senior

you should stop making enemies here too...

Then he's like I wont bother you again

[-23-]

Baylor's best season translates to about 13 rpg in today's NBA...which is just below the 6-5 Barkley's best season. The 6-8 Jerry Lucas' best season translates to about 14 rpg in today's NBA, which is just slightly less than the 6-9 (or shorter) Kevin Love's best season of 15 rpg.

Take Wilt's 27 rpg season, and it translates to about 18 rpg in today's NBA. Let him play against clowns in 75% of his game, tell him to cut back his shot blocks to 5+ instead of 10, and his rebounding numbers would go UP.

The bottom line...if Kevin Love can grab 15.2 rpg, in 35.8 mpg, in an NBA that averaged 41.4 rpg per team...a Wilt, who was just crushing his peers, and EASILY playing 43-44 mpg (hell, the man has the SEVEN highest MPG seasons in NBA history, and players like Lebron and Iverson were around 43 mpg within the last ten years)...Chamberlain would come close to 20 rpg.

As for scoring...I get a kick out of those that use his CAREER playoff scoring mark of 22.5 ppg as some kind of gauge on his scoring. The man had FOUR 50+ point playoffs games. He had FOUR playoff series of 37 ppg, 37 ppg, 39 ppg and 39 ppg. He had THREE playoff series, just against Russell of between 30-34 ppg (and another two at 28-29 ppg.) He had FOUR post-seasons of 33.2 ppg, 34.7 ppg, 35.0 ppg, and 37.0 ppg. And, think about this... his 34.7 ppg playoff run came on .543 shooting, in a POST-SEASON NBA that only averaged 105.8 ppg on .420 shooting.

And the REALITY was, Chamberlain cut back his shooting by design (and poor designs in some cases...see the 1969 post-season.) How great a scorer was a "pre-injured" Wilt. In his 11th season, at age 33, he was LEADING the NBA in scoring at 32.2 ppg, on get this... .579 (as well as averaging 20.2 rpg),,,when he shredded his knee.

Of course, those that use SMALL sample playoff series, will point out Kareem's 35 ppg post-season in '77, in 11 playoff games. Well, Chamberlain was averaging 32 ppg in his first nine straight games in that '70 season. Interesting, too, that he poured in 38 against the reigning MVP, Wes Unseld, as well as 42 against the very talented Bob Rule, and get this...he dumped 43 on Connie Dierking in one of those nine games (this, only a year after shelling him for 60 points in a game.) Why is 43 point game interesting? Kareem faced Dierking multiple times in his career, and his high game against him was 41 points. Oh, and Chamberlain outscored Kareem, 25-23, and outshot him, 9-14 to 9-21, in their one H2H that season, as well.

That from a Chamberlain who was past his peak "scoring" seasons.

BTW, Wilt averaged 50.4 ppg in an NBA that averaged 118.8 ppg. Doing simple math, that translates to 41 ppg in this PAST season (the NBA averaged 96.3 ppg in a season of a condensed scheduling.)

No coach would let a player play 44+ mpg in todays league. What's so hard to understand?

[millwad]

Here's the PMs he sent me




Then he's like I wont bother you again

Something is really wrong with him, what a worthless and sad human being. Telling people that they should die or that their mother's should get cancer because they don't agree with him when it comes to a bouncing ball.

Probably some really lonely and depressed guy without any real life what so ever, protecting a basketball player and getting that butthurt just because someone doesn't agree with him..