How where you taught to shoot?

[Jyap9675]

Main reason why shooters have their right foot facing to the side (so called open stance) is because it allows them to align their shooting shoulder directly to the basket.

I still prefer stephen curry's shot, it takes less energy since you're using your legs and consistent/reliable. Only downside is that you gotta rely on screens, creating space or increasing your range to get your shot off. Or in most pick-up games "defense" doesn't really exist so you can just keep shooting

Ray allen's jump shot is also good in a way because you can just easily just get your shot off by just purely out-jumping your opponent. Only downside is that it could be harder since you gotta work on balance of your shot and takes more energy.

[OmniStrife]

Learned from watching pros shoot.
esp. Nash cause he's relatively small and is very efficient.

[9512]

I taught myself. No 1 was around. I didn't join a team until a year later after I started playing. Then the coach never taught me anything. I was 15 at the time so he figured by that age, most guys already know the fundamentals.

My shot used to look like a set shot version of Leandro Barbosa or like Shawn Marion.

[Rake2204]

We kind of have to agree to disagree. I think having your feet point slightly to the side and squaring up your hips is a good way to shoot and I think it's something to think about as it helps keep the shoulders and neck relaxed while also helping your aim through the right eye for right handed shooters.

In all aiming sports, rifle, bow and darts contestants have their feet pointing away from the target and it helps them shoot straight, to me basketball is no different.

You know, I think we're both on the same page in at least one regard: the squaring of one's hips is an absolute necessity. And as I mentioned, the right foot may sometime turn slightly after someone has already squared themselves but at that point, I think it's not much of a problem.

However, I'd never teach my players to intentionally turn their feet away from their target as they're squaring up. The reason I would not teach this is because turning one's feet away from the target requires at least a small torque of the body, meaning every shot will require an accurate re-adjustment. As in, "Turn feet slightly, twist hips back toward target." I'd much prefer teaching my students to point both feet at the basket so there's no necessary re-aligning of the hips. One's feet are initially pointed to the hoop so we know our hips will be square. And again, if an off-foot ends up twisting after the square already occurs, so be it. I'm guilty of that.

Also, I find aiming systems vary greatly when from sport to sport. Each has their own intricacies that allow or require a different sort of execution. For instance, bow requires a sizeable amount of wind-up. I'm not sure if the body would allow the ability to hold a bow accurately while squared up perfectly. Ditto any non-hand gun. Further, darts is more of a throw than a shot. Also, in many cases, these other aiming sports often allow sufficient time to square one's hips as they see fit. Basketball does not provide the proper time to re-adjust one's hips to account for a crooked base. Similarly, if time or defense was not an issue, an accurate jumpshot could occur using just one hand. However, the need to find a quick, accurate, and consistent solution means using the off-hand to ensure the ball doesn't fall off the pedestal as we fire away. Point being, shot theory alters a little when time becomes a factor.

I think shooting a basketball has most in common with creating a common catapult. If we wanted to fire something from point A to point B, where would we point the base of our catapult? Directly toward the target. And how would the arm of the catapult be set up? Pointed outward and coming in at an angle? Or inward to allow a sling directly toward target (elbow in, follow through)? I believe the latter, clearly.

But again, the fact you believe in squaring one's shoulders mean we have more in common here than it may seem. i just happen to believe in simplifying the process.

[ralph_i_el]

I bend my arm into an L and try to point my elbow at the basket. extend arm and flick wrist. Try to get a medium amount of arc.

I bend my knees a lot when I take set shots

[ZenMaster]

You know, I think we're both on the same page in at least one regard: the squaring of one's hips is an absolute necessity. And as I mentioned, the right foot may sometime turn slightly after someone has already squared themselves but at that point, I think it's not much of a problem.

However, I'd never teach my players to intentionally turn their feet away from their target as they're squaring up. The reason I would not teach this is because turning one's feet away from the target requires at least a small torque of the body, meaning every shot will require an accurate re-adjustment. As in, "Turn feet slightly, twist hips back toward target." I'd much prefer teaching my students to point both feet at the basket so there's no necessary re-aligning of the hips. One's feet are initially pointed to the hoop so we know our hips will be square. And again, if an off-foot ends up twisting after the square already occurs, so be it. I'm guilty of that.

Also, I find aiming systems vary greatly when from sport to sport. Each has their own intricacies that allow or require a different sort of execution. For instance, bow requires a sizeable amount of wind-up. I'm not sure if the body would allow the ability to hold a bow accurately while squared up perfectly. Ditto any non-hand gun. Further, darts is more of a throw than a shot. Also, in many cases, these other aiming sports often allow sufficient time to square one's hips as they see fit. Basketball does not provide the proper time to re-adjust one's hips to account for a crooked base. Similarly, if time or defense was not an issue, an accurate jumpshot could occur using just one hand. However, the need to find a quick, accurate, and consistent solution means using the off-hand to ensure the ball doesn't fall off the pedestal as we fire away. Point being, shot theory alters a little when time becomes a factor.

I think shooting a basketball has most in common with creating a common catapult. If we wanted to fire something from point A to point B, where would we point the base of our catapult? Directly toward the target. And how would the arm of the catapult be set up? Pointed outward and coming in at an angle? Or inward to allow a sling directly toward target (elbow in, follow through)? I believe the latter, clearly.

But again, the fact you believe in squaring one's shoulders mean we have more in common here than it may seem. i just happen to believe in simplifying the process.

If you have your feet square to the rim you'll most often tense up in your back all but guaranteing a miss.
I guess we see things differently, like you say that some players will sometimes not square up their feet where I say they deliberately don't square them up meaning they practice not squaring them up.

Check these videos, basically I want my guys to shoot like the guys demonstrating in the video as I believe it makes for a better shot aligning your shoulder than your feet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5AtK...feature=relmfu

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bC_E...feature=relmfu


Edit: just found this, he shows very well what I mean by it being easier to aim with your feet turned: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SDVXmaEXWOI

[lilgodfather1]

I taught myself. Watched the way TMac shot the ball, and tried to replicate it with bad results. So I changed that into what I call a broken jumper, and it works better for me. In HS ball I never had to shoot, but now when I play games I shoot from 15 feet and in, and occassionally only when I am wide open I can drain a corner three rather consistantly. My right arm (right handed) goes from an L to a triangle with my left hand. When I shoot left handed my form is technically better as my left hand makes a perfect L, but my shot is far more inconsistant with my left hand.

[Raz]

How did your (former) coach teach you how to shoot? What kind of method did he want you to use?

Do you feel you were taught to shoot in a manner which resembles the pros?

I shoot like Ronnie Brewer - it looks like a chest pass. If I could shoot, no doubt I would have been repping my country at the senior level.

I shot under 50% from the free throw line one season in high school as the starting point guard, and I was fouled a lot. It became stressful to go to the line, and I became a pro at putting hard shots off the backboard, clipping the front rim and catching the rebound (occasionally).

I never understood why highly accurate passing came naturally to me, but shooting was such a problem. No amount of shooting coaching fixed my shot, I was either extremely cold, or would go on very hot streaks. Very Rondo-esque in a feast or famine way

[Rake2204]

If you have your feet square to the rim you'll most often tense up in your back all but guaranteing a miss.

As has been made clear throughout this thread, I suppose it's just a matter of there being numerous ways to reach a desired result when shooting. As someone who shoots with feet square to the rim however, I very much disagree with the notion that squaring will result in back tension and thus a guaranteed miss. That's very much untrue.

Many coaches will have different theories and some internet gurus will insist their way is the only way, but I think there's actually many effective ways to shoot very well. Just again, in my case, teaching a player to shoot is much easier and effective when simplifying the process as opposed to encouraging twists, turns, and shooting on the way down.

[AlphaWolf24]

below are my opinions....my opinions only...

#1. the often saying "shooting comes from the legs"....not really correct in a sense that most people think.

- the way the ball travels and how the ball is trajected mostly comes from your upper body and the way your technique ( arms hands follow through etc) guides the ball..

- your lower body/core does have a major effect on your ability to create power from a longer distance, create space to get your shot, generate a slightly different arc from a longer range.

- Yes in a game situation you need your legs to almost everything....jump, create space, provide power from a longer range...But from a pure technical standpoint...your leg strength does not provide much at all as far as bieng a " shooter"

- to be a great shooter you must be able to consistently put the ball on a good path/trajectory towards the ideal area for a made shot...(of course bieng able to dribble/catch have strong legs for lift/power helps tremendously....but IMO it has more upper body technique then lower.)

#2. Squaring your feet....I think good shooter practice squaring thier feet ( or one foot slightly ahead) because during a game you will not have time to always face the basket.....

but if you practice ( perfect practice makes perfect) squaring your body.....during game slippage you react naturally to get in a good position...

remember at the Prolevel 90% of the shooters have to constantly maintain thier technique...most great shooters are made...not born.


example: Right handed shooter....go left and pull up.....most of the time it feels natural to shoot because your guide hand seems to follow through pointing at the rim. ( your body/right shoulder is squared up nicely to the front of the basket)...great shooters practce getting in the habbit of feeling this naturaul at every pos on the court....everywhere they shoot they want to be sqaured up.

you can only do this by practicing perfect / sqauring up at every shot during drills

#3. there really is no right/wrong way to shoot...if it goes in...your doing it right....but having fundamentals that most use will help most players get much better.

[ZenMaster]

As has been made clear throughout this thread, I suppose it's just a matter of there being numerous ways to reach a desired result when shooting. As someone who shoots with feet square to the rim however, I very much disagree with the notion that squaring will result in back tension and thus a guaranteed miss. That very much untrue.

Many coaches will have different theories and some internet gurus will insist their way is the only way, but I think there's actually many effective ways to shoot very well. Just again, in my case, teaching a player to shoot is much easier and effective when simplifying the process as opposed to encouraging twists, turns, and shooting on the way down.

For me it's more than just some internet guru, I spent this summer changing my shot trying it out on myself because I too was taught to shoot with my feet square, I also changed my release and it worked out very well. I've also spent quite a bit of time watching video of shooters.
I don't miss much to the sides now, still have a little trouble with my lengt when I get tired but I think that's mostly due to not playing a whole lot.

I tried it out on myself so I can teach my players the same things, last year I was pretty much teaching the square feet and shoulders and to my disapointment very few of my players became better shooters, so I went looking for something new. I'm very excited in what kind of results we'll get with it and I know I preach it a lot but from my experience if you want to change something you have to go all the way, some of my players are still reluctant to change what they've been previously taught even though they don't really shoot well.

[Airball Ahead]

I have been to many clinics and camps but none of those really helped my shooting, it has just basically 'blossomed' with time. When hitting puberty and gaining strength to shoot from the 3pt line, it just somehow clicked; by focusing on the correct spin of the ball I learned a good release, by focusing to shoot from a far distance with the same pure form I learned to get the strength to the shot from my legs, and the correct ball position (slightly over the forehead) just came with these two as it was easier to aim from under the ball.

[Rake2204]

For me it's more than just some internet guru, I spent this summer changing my shot trying it out on myself because I too was taught to shoot with my feet square, I also changed my release and it worked out very well. I've also spent quite a bit of time watching video of shooters.
I don't miss much to the sides now, still have a little trouble with my lengt when I get tired but I think that's mostly due to not playing a whole lot.

I tried it out on myself so I can teach my players the same things, last year I was pretty much teaching the square feet and shoulders and to my disapointment very few of my players became better shooters, so I went looking for something new. I'm very excited in what kind of results we'll get with it and I know I preach it a lot but from my experience if you want to change something you have to go all the way, some of my players are still reluctant to change what they've been previously taught even though they don't really shoot well.

And I think that's kind of the conclusion I was trying to come to: different shooting strokes for different folks. I don't think there's going to be one single (and only) way to teach an effective jump shot. It just happens, for me, my shooting form (involving squaring up) has been very effective over time and the strategies I've taught have also made a significant positive difference in the jump shots of many of my players over time.

Also, for the sake of input, I think that video link you provided of proshotcoach stating that when squared up, the shooting elbow would be slightly askew, is not entirely accurate. Usually, when squaring up, the right foot will be slightly in front of the left, which will often nullify the supposed "off-mark" elbow idea. In the man's example in the video, both feet are even, which can lead to that variance in natural aim. When that right foot leads (again just slightly) this is where we'll often see it involuntarily bending a little bit, though it occurs well after one has already squared to the hoop so the shot itself is not negatively affected.

[Heilige]

For those experienced in playing basketball, who would you say made the best points in this thread? I am very new to basketball and want to get into it; playing it and becoming a good player.

[7_cody]

After reading G-Train's couple of posts on the last page, he convinced me to take a closer look at what you're saying and I'm not sure I'm in agreement with everything you mention. If nothing else, a few things may be unclear.

For starters, I initially thought you were saying I was not deriving very much energy from my legs on my shot, to which I would have agreed. However, upon re-reading, you say:
It now feels as if you're saying a jump shot should not use one's legs or jump to assist in the power of a shot. To that, I'd disagree.

In fact, again, that's something very important I teach my players each year (that shot power will primarily come from the legs when one's range extends, not the arms). In my experience, it is the players who are stuck on shooting with all arms who most frequently experience great struggles in achieving an effective jump shot. Using legs obviously doesn't always cure every jumpshot, but it surely goes a long way in eliminating the "heave" theatrics I tend to see when players first enter my program.

I also may disagree with the point at which a player should release a shot. You said:
I've personally never instructed a player to release the ball as they're coming down from their jump. The idea seems to go against all logic and physics in terms of shooting an effective and easy jumpshot. Perhaps you are saying the player will more or less fall to the ground after the shot is in the air?

To reiterate, I do not agree with these lines of shooting strategy. It is once again of my opinion that the "jump" part of a jumpshot is not just to elude an attacking defense. Rather, it can also very much help in providing the power behind one's shot.

I think I'm beginning to understand where you're coming from as I read through more of your post. You insist Ray Allen is the only player anyone should ever look to for emulating a jumpshot, more or less anointing him the Messiah of jumpshooting, and for good reason - he's an incredible shooter. However, there's been a lot of incredible shooters who came before Ray Allen and there'll be just as many who come after, and they will not follow the same patterns as Ray Allen. Therefore, I must largely disagree that players should only follow Allen's stroke. It's awesome and it works for him, but it's not the word of god and I do not envision it being effective for each of my players, most of whom will not grow up to be 6'5'' NBA prospects with 35'' verticals.

For instance, I'm not sure I could, in good faith, ever teach my players to shoot their free throws while using absolutely no legs (not even a little) as Allen has made a career of doing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3d_pOYFRVc. I believe there are many "correct" ways of teaching a person to shoot, so to suggest Ray Allen's form is the only way is way off the mark to me.

On the flip side, I've realized Steve Nash shoots free throws exactly how I do and that's essentially the form I teach my players (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pf0lAO21AZk), not so much because it's my form, but because I view it to be traditionally very effective. And contrary to what you maintain, I feel it is quite clear that Steve Nash uses his legs within the flow of his shot, both to power said shot and to create a natural one-process flow. In this next clip, it can once again be illustrated how a jump shot can be extremely standard and effective when a player utilizes their entire body in concert and releases the ball before they begin their downward descent: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_v_BN4XdR4Q. I feel this is a much more effective way of teaching young players to shoot than the slight freeze out at the top of the jump strategy that Allen has employed over the years (in combination with his stiff free throws). Again, it's obviously worked for Allen though, so there's no disputing that.

Lastly, I also disagree with:I believe everyone can and should alter their form if they feel it can lead to better overall success. For instance, I have a brother entering 9th grade who more or less pointed his feet 90 degrees away from the basket when he shot (a common problem). As a result, his body would always have to torque to correct the lack of a proper square up and even the simplest open jump shot turned into meticulous calculations on his part (did I compensate well enough for my crooked feet? Is my elbow angled correctly?)

To allow my boy to go through life with such a jumper would be an absolute travesty. Surely, he's comfortable with shooting like that, and he's experienced some success with it, but it won't last in the long run. As such, we've put in a serious amount of work re-tooling his jumper to at least get his elbow in and feet properly squared. And it was a struggle at first, because the proper squaring of his feet was so foreign, but it was a proverbial one-step-back, two-steps-forward situation. His new jumper is much, much more reliable and allows for quicker and more accurate shots. His situation and outcome is one of millions.

In summation, I respect most of your shot coaching techniques, but I do not find them to be as definitive as you insinuated them to be. In fact, I found many tips of yours to be in direct contrast to much of the basketball teachings I've been fortunate enough to garner throughout my life.

What Pauk was explaining was a jump shot. Unless you're a pro, there is no reason to elevate for a jump shot with that much space. You had the corner to yourself with all the space in the world and went with a push shot. You should always go for the higher percentage shot. If you don't have space, and need to shoot, use a jump shot since your release point will be higher and harder to block. The only different between the two is on the jump shot you elevate and time the release at the top of you jump, or delay the follow through part of the shot a few seconds longer then usual. The rest of the techniques should be the same for any set shot, jump shot, or free throw shot. Also, you never release the ball on your way down, you want to release on your way up but as close to the peak of your jump as possible. If you're moving the ball up, why would you wait for the ball to go the opposite direction (back down) in order to release the ball towards the hoop and away from the ball. Kind of hard to explain, but you want to keep the direction of the ball up high and towards the basket at all times, you should not bring the ball behind your head, for example, because your expanding energy in the wrong direction.

Anyway, your form is pretty good. You have a great follow through, and keep the ball in your shooting chamber. You also seem to be holding the ball correctly. The only thing I would change is to hold the ball higher for a higher release point. Also, you could always practice shooting quick. In the video you didn't shoot that fast, but maybe it's because you were so wide open that you figured you'd just square up and make sure you knock it down.