#23 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

[NugzHeat3]

David robinson could put up 13/6 and lose in the first round with a 74 winteam while Dirk wins the title....next season starts....hes gonna be considered better than Dirk.

Dirk isnt Hakeem or....Shaq. he had a great run...but there was never a serious "Dirk is the best player" push league wide. Be kinda like Lebron.

Lebron played like ass in the finals....second the season starts...watch the basketball being played and be honest about it...he was still clearly the best player in the world. Not like he had to win the title to prove he was the best months earlier.

The playoffs matter. It doesnt mean someone who is one of the best defenders ever while also being a 30ppg scorer who can lead the league in rebounds, run the floor like a swingman, do eurostep dunks around Michael Jordan, pass his ass off and rack up quadruple doubles plays worse basketball than someone who shoots at an amazing rate.

Fair or not....David robinson is almost a lock to be considered the best or second best player in the NBA the last several years if he were around in his prime.

Dirk could win it all...he still wouldnt overtake him....just as he didnt Lebron and Durant. You get your month or two long bump....but people dont totally change who #1 is over who won it all.

Kinda like I remember wade being like half the boards #1 after 06 and now people act like Kobe had it beyond debate.. That ring winner love just doesnt last without the year after year dominance.

I think after the 1995 playoffs, Robinson's rep had fell of a cliff and he never quite recovered from that unlike say Dirk who redeemed himself after the dismal 2007 performance. Unfair because of Robinson's injury? To a certain extent but I'm not sure if would've ever really struck otu a couple of dominant playoff due to the nature of his game/personality (more so the former).

Robinson wasn't getting that best player in the league love anymore that he did during the regular seasons in 1994 and 1995 or even in the early 90s despite Jordan and Magic playing their best basketball/close to it. There's quotes of Don Nelson saying he was the best player in the league during his rookie year and the quote below by Cotton Fitzsimmons saying he had surpassed everybody in his second year.

Indeed, for all of Robinson's offensive limitations, Phoenix Sun coach Cotton Fitzsimmons says, "He is the greatest impact player the league has seen since Kareem Abdul-Jabbar." Fitzsimmons even believes Robinson has already surpassed Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson and Larry Bird as the game's most imposing player. "They're all MVPs," Fitzsimmons says. "This guy is more."

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vau...9758/index.htm

I believe the massacre that took place in the 1995 WCF forced people to re-evaluate their opinion on him because year in and year out, he wasn't quite getting the job done in the playoffs and the fact that it took a performance of that magnitude by Hakeem is also telling of the difference between the eras in regards to the microcosm in which players are talked about, criticized, ect.

In today's world, I believe he gets much more scrutiny for his performance in the 1994 playoffs for example. This is a guy coming out of a brilliant regular season, heavily debated for MVP and would've likely won it had SA won the midwest since division rivalry was big back then, putting up monster stat lines night in and night out, putting a quad double, having all sorts of responsibilities ect but when the playoffs came, he utterly folded. I'm just talking individually here since I believe Utah was a bit of a match up issue for SA as they were also 5-0 against them in the season but Robinson played much better in those games and I think that's mainly because Sloan didn't switch Malone onto him until the playoffs.

I saw a couple of those playoff games last year and Malone and his physical defense shook him a bit. He bothered him with his swipe, pushed him away from the basket and didn't let him get to his sweet spots. He looked even reluctant to exploit Tom Chambers when he came on. It also exposed more of less his back to basket skills where he was fairly limited relative to other elite back to basket players and I think it also showed his questionable desire and mentality as cliche and subjective as that may be. I'm sure you're aware.

Here's the best players survey from USA today done by GMs, coaches, players and staff and it was conducted in April 1996 at the end of the season.

This is a large sample size as you can see and Robinson only got one vote despite having a terrific regular season (basically doing the same stuff as usual). He might be a little different statistically but that's probably due to the nature of the game as Rodman's trade forced him to pick up more of a defensive load on the boards which I'm sure effected the amount of energy he exerted on the offensive end.

1996 USA TODAY surveyed NBA players, coaches, trainers and general managers in seven
different
categories. Of 435 ballots distributed, 301 (69%) were returned. Voters could
pick teammates, their own
coach or home arena. All selections were confidential. The results:
Best player
Player Team Points
1. Michael Jordan Chicago 132
2. Hakeem Olajuwon Houston 25
3. Scottie Pippen Chicago 19
4. Anfernee Hardaway Orlando 7
5. Shaquille O'Neal Orlando 3
6. Grant Hill Detroit 2
(Magic Johnson of the Los Angeles Lakers, David Robinson of San Antonio,
Charles Barkley of Phoenix,
Mitch Richmond of Sacramento and Shawn Kemp of Seattle each received one vote)

http://groups.google.com/group/tw.bb...rvey+usa+today

Note: Even though it says, 301 ballots were returned, I believe that's for the overall survey as they had quite a few other categories as well such as dirtiest player, toughest arena, favorite to win the title ect. In this particular poll, it's sample size of 193 people (you can add up all the player votes) but point being it's still good enough to base a conclusion on or notice a trend.

This is a pretty telling survey to me and I wouldn't be surprised if that one vote came from one of Robinson's teammates or Bob Hill.

If Penny, Shaq, Pippen ect are getting votes and much more love than Robinson did, I think it's evident that his rep amongst his peers had taken a a sizeable hit since this certainly wouldn't be the case in either 1994 or 1995 although obviously a guy like Penny improved in 1996 bulking up, maturing, having more of a role in the offense early in the year with Shaq out ect. But I doubt 1996 Penny does better in such a survey than Robinson would've done in 1994 or 1995.

So my question is do you think the perception of Robinson in the poll above is unfair or if Robinson had declined or because people finally started to realize his flaws and judge him accordingly?

To me, it's the very last one and one of the matters where all you can say is hindsight is 20/20. It doesn't mean that two years later in 1996, 1994 David Robinson became worse than he actually was in 1994 but just somebody that might not have been as good as you initially thought.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Oh and player of the months? Saying someone has the most ever? When they started in the early 80s and at the time only one was given out per month not one for each conference?

And you have guysl ike Kelvin Ransley, Freeman williams, and so on winning over Moses malone, Bird, Magic, and Kareem? And Jordan in a 67 win season doing disgusting numbers loses out to Hornacek, Rodman, Detlef, and Glen Rice so on? Mike puts up 39/5/5 one month on a 50 win team and loses to Fat Lever for player of the month? shaq puts up 36/13 and loses to Payton? Juwan Howard, Eddie Jones, and Cedric Ceballos winning over Jordan, Drob, Hakeem, Shaq, and company?

Its fairly clear here that this isnt or at least wasnt a "Best player" thing.

It is better than all star game MVP though........

2000-01 was the last season there was a Player of the Month award.
Since 2001-02 there is a Western and Eastern Conference POTM.

[Kblaze8855]

So my question is do you think the perception of Robinson in the poll above is unfair or if Robinson had declined or because people finally started to realize his flaws and judge him accordingly?

Id say it was for a similar reason things like this were written:

We're going to look back on "2007 NBA Most Valuable Player Dirk Nowitzki" and laugh. Hell, some of us were laughing before he even picked up his trophy.

Nowitzki, who wimped out of the playoffs and took Dallas down with him, as MVP of this NBA season is flat out wrong. It's criminal. Felonious.


But who's the felon? Who do we blame? We've got the crime nailed, but who do we convict?


Not Nowitzki. It's not his fault that he's a gutless fraud, a player with so much size and skill that the game comes easy to him right up to the point where the game gets hard. I'd call Nowitzki a bully, but he's not tough enough to be a bully. A bully would have taken the puny Golden State Warriors' lunch money, but Nowitzki hid behind Josh Howard, which is why the Mavericks became the first No. 1 seed to lose a best-of-7 playoff series to a No. 8 seed.

Timing.

Dirk was not a fraud and Drob was not worse in his prime than 1996 Magic Johnson.

Its just kinda...whatever. But really...

Say this past year was Drob in 96...his lowest point of respect...and Dirk comes off the ring as he did. You thinking 96 Drob is not considered better than 12 dirk? People were on here in large numbers ranking Kevin Love over Dirk. Im thinking Drob wouldnt have trouble just as Lebron didnt.

He would have that spot back before he even got to the playoffs.

[Eric Cartman]

[Colbertnation64]

Here's Mikan dominating a black man

[Doctor K]

Isn't kblaze the guy who hates on Karl Malone because he didn't get it done in the playoffs. And the fact is Karl Malone was A BETTER PLAYOFF PERFORMER than David Robinson, and it ain't even close.

Robinson is one of the worst playoff performers ever compared to how well he played in the regular season. Thats why he isn't Top 20


amen

[atljonesbro]

Kblaze is the type to praise Drob for 2 titles even though he couldn't even get close without Duncan and then turn around and say the only reason LeBron won is because Wade and Bosh.

[magnax1]

What about in the Playoffs?

What about it? Robinson was just better. They were both about 25 ppg scorers in the playoffs in their primes. Dirk might've have been a bit more efficient. But what about everything else? Dirk was a similar rebounder, but realistically not a single other thing was really close. Dirk was a great player, probably a bit below top 5 for about 5 years, but holy hell do people give him way to much credit for his scoring, which is really the only thing that he was truly elite at. Comparing him to Robinson, who was one of the best scorers, defenders, rebounders, and passers at his position is just stupid. It's not even a remotely reasonable position, and it's really just proof that people look way to much at one side of the game because it's the most easily visible.

[DirtySanchez]

George Mikan

[pauk]

Oh and player of the months? Saying someone has the most ever? When they started in the early 80s and at the time only one was given out per month not one for each conference?

And you have guysl ike Kelvin Ransley, Freeman williams, and so on winning over Moses malone, Bird, Magic, and Kareem? And Jordan in a 67 win season doing disgusting numbers loses out to Hornacek, Rodman, Detlef, and Glen Rice so on? Mike puts up 39/5/5 one month on a 50 win team and loses to Fat Lever for player of the month? shaq puts up 36/13 and loses to Payton? Juwan Howard, Eddie Jones, and Cedric Ceballos winning over Jordan, Drob, Hakeem, Shaq, and company?

Its fairly clear here that this isnt or at least wasnt a "Best player" thing.

It is better than all star game MVP though........

I agree (especially with those last words), but its probably best to just leave out POTM completely due to the difference of how and when it was handed out throughout the NBA eras. Would like to say the same about FMVP & DPOY aswell (when comparing players to Bill Russell for example).

[pauk]

Here's Mikan dominating a black man

[dyna]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xEoCsDKXPo


Robinson, Isiah > Mikan

[INDI]

Drob

[Sakkreth]

Dirk over Drob? Lebron over Moses, West, Oscar and Dr. J already?

thread fail since #11

It fails really hard since 8.

My vote is for Robinson.

[Kblaze8855]

Kblaze is the type to praise Drob for 2 titles even though he couldn't even get close without Duncan and then turn around and say the only reason LeBron won is because Wade and Bosh.

It really amazes me sometimes how different people think my opinions are. There are people here who think I delete all anti Lebron opinions and people who think I hate him too.

And like 90% of the people ive known a long time think I hate david robinson because of my reaction to them losing back in the day.

I dont even like David robinson. I dont believe he actually liked basketball much.

Doesnt mean he wouldnt likely be considered the best player in the league these days.