Lebron James in his 11th year is still at his peak

[SavageMode]

His post game, court vision and size will be a game changer when his athleticism slows down

[chocolatethunder]

It doesn't matter that you believe they were never on that level. We're just discussing improvement.

It matters that they started as 7's and only got to an 8 and never improved too much in any facet of the game.

Lebron started as an 8 and is now a 10. His jump shooting started at a 3 or whatever and now is an 8. His defense started at a 5 and now is a legit 8 or whatever.

What matters is that he will go down as one of the best of the best and has always approached the game that way. I don't understand why it's a surprise to anyone that he has a great work ethic. An overwhelming majority of the greatest players ever were the hardest workers on their teams. I would be surprised if he wasn't the hardest worker on his team or didn't add new things to his game.

[tmacattack33]

What matters is that he will go down as one of the best of the best and has always approached the game that way. I don't understand why it's a surprise to anyone that he has a great work ethic. An overwhelming majority of the greatest players ever were the hardest workers on their teams. I would be surprised if he wasn't the hardest worker on his team or didn't add new things to his game.

Okay, so you're trying to say that the great players have more of an incentive (than average players) to have great work ethics so must of them have it?

That is a good argument.

But i still think that there is a self filter working here...you are talking in 2013 past great players (you listed Magic, Jordan, Barkley, Hakeem) having great work ethics.

But if they didn't have great work ethics, they wouldn't be legendary players and so they wouldn't be in that list.

And there were many players with super-star potential that didn't have great work ethics and never became legends...T-mac, Vince Carter, and Stephon Marbury to name a few in the 2000s.

[0000000]

He just makes it look so easy. It's why it doesn't get talked about.

I can't ever imagine him losing his athleticism to the point where it will be disadvantage for him. Even at 40, he shouldn't be less athletic than most players. He"ll be able to cover PF's with no problem at 40.
If someone like Derek Fisher could look pretty good even at 37, I can't imagine LeBron being affected too much. Especially since he"ll be able to play a slower position (PF) with no problem, without giving up size.

He just has it all athletically. And he's a brilliant basketball player.

Guys like Kobe, Jordan and Bird just didn't have that luxury, that once they lost their athleticism they could just switch to a slower position.

[LA_Showtime]

After listening to Indian_Guy I expected LeBron to be out of the league by now.

[chocolatethunder]

Okay, so you're trying to say that the great players have more of an incentive (than average players) to have great work ethics so must of them have it?

That is a good argument.

But i still think that there is a self filter working here...you are talking in 2013 past great players (you listed Magic, Jordan, Barkley, Hakeem) having great work ethics.

But if they didn't have great work ethics, they wouldn't be legendary players and so they wouldn't be in that list.

And there were many players with super-star potential that didn't have great work ethics and never became legends...T-mac, Vince Carter, and Stephon Marbury to name a few in the 2000s.

No. What I'm saying is that's what it takes to be on that list. It's a prerequisite. It's not an incentive, it's what you have to do. It's what separates the great from the best ever. It's the combo of unbelievable talent paired with an unbelievable work ethic. Of course they wouldn't be legends without the work ethic because that's what it takes. No one on their teams worked harder than the best of the best. That's just how it is. I don't understand what you mean by self filter. Those names are ones that I just picked off the top of my head. We can talk about Kobe and Duncan if you want to talk about current players. Like look at dudes like Stockton. This a guy who missed only 22 games total and 18 of them were in the same season. As he aged (as do many top level players) he didn't really have an off season. He just worked year round to be able to compete against guys who were half his age. Where would AI be with that work ethic? I'm sure he'd still be tearing up the league. No one played harder than AI and no star player has ever practiced and worked out less. Or Derrick Coleman? We'd be talking about him as one of the best ever. I'm telling you right now that DC at his best was as good as anyone to ever play PF. The problem was that he just didn't care. So what I'm saying is that it's a given that you (almost) must have this work ethic regardless of how talented you are. So it's not surprising to watch players improve even until their early 30s. Barkley may not have been dunking on dudes left and right when he was 30 like he did when he was 24 but he was better. So were Jordan and Hakeem and Ewing and all of those guys. And that was a result of them never being satisfied and knowing that no matter what, no one was going to outwork them. You'll find this in all walks of life. The best of the best are the most talented and the most hard working at the same time. It's that rare combo that gets you there. Lots of guys who aren't as talented are relentless workers and get very far with that work but they are limited by their talent. And lots of guys have talent and get very far on talent alone but don't like to work.

[tmacattack33]

No. What I'm saying is that's what it takes to be on that list. It's a prerequisite. It's not an incentive, it's what you have to do. It's what separates the great from the best ever. It's the combo of unbelievable talent paired with an unbelievable work ethic. Of course they wouldn't be legends without the work ethic because that's what it takes. No one on their teams worked harder than the best of the best. That's just how it is. I don't understand what you mean by self filter. Those names are ones that I just picked off the top of my head. We can talk about Kobe and Duncan if you want to talk about current players. Like look at dudes like Stockton. This a guy who missed only 22 games total and 18 of them were in the same season. As he aged (as do many top level players) he didn't really have an off season. He just worked year round to be able to compete against guys who were half his age. Where would AI be with that work ethic? I'm sure he'd still be tearing up the league. No one played harder than AI and no star player has ever practiced and worked out less. Or Derrick Coleman? We'd be talking about him as one of the best ever. I'm telling you right now that DC at his best was as good as anyone to ever play PF. The problem was that he just didn't care. So what I'm saying is that it's a given that you (almost) must have this work ethic regardless of how talented you are. So it's not surprising to watch players improve even until their early 30s. Barkley may not have been dunking on dudes left and right when he was 30 like he did when he was 24 but he was better. So were Jordan and Hakeem and Ewing and all of those guys. And that was a result of them never being satisfied and knowing that no matter what, no one was going to outwork them. You'll find this in all walks of life. The best of the best are the most talented and the most hard working at the same time. It's that rare combo that gets you there. Lots of guys who aren't as talented are relentless workers and get very far with that work but they are limited by their talent. And lots of guys have talent and get very far on talent alone but don't like to work.

Hmm..im at work so i just skimmed this but it seems like you are on my side here...so i don't know why i'm trying to argue you then ...lol


I thought you were trying to discredit Lebron by saying something like "well all the great ones are supposed to have good work ethics...so who cares about lebron's work ethic, it's not really that great".

[KyleKong]

Pretty impressive that LeBron being a slasher mostly has had 11 straight seasons with no major injury.

Genetic freak of nature.

[MP.Trey]

After listening to Indian_Guy I expected LeBron to be out of the league by now.

[TheCorporation]

Career high last year for 3P % last year. Currently surpassing that mark during this season.

[Mr. Jabbar]

he's on a teammate-peak, yes.