Wilt's averages for his 32 60+ point games

[-23-]

How about this...in Wilt's two title seasons...his teammates collectively shot .428 and then .414 from the field.

Put those numbers into context. Post season average FG% for the league in those seasons (67' .424% which is ABOVE the league, and .439 in 72' which ill give you) The numbers you put up look shocking in today's league (which is a testament to how it evolved), but back in the 60's, and early 70's a low 40% fg is not uncommon.

[-23-]

I have no problem with people who put Wilt in their top 10, but to have him as either #1, or #2 totally blows my mind. While a great regular season player, his successes never transcended the game, nor translated into post-season success. He is like David Robinson, and a early LBJ. Some hallmark performances, but when it came down to putting the dagger into someone's back, Wilt didn't have the killer instinct (which he ADMITS himself). That is what separates GOATS, and all time greats.

[CavaliersFTW]

I have no problem with people who put Wilt in their top 10, but to have him as either #1, or #2 totally blows my mind. While a great regular season player, his successes never transcended the game, nor translated into post-season success. He is like David Robinson, and a early LBJ. Some hallmark performances, but when it came down to putting the dagger into someone's back, Wilt didn't have the killer instinct (which he ADMITS himself). That is what separates GOATS, and all time greats.

When Wilt was referring to his 'killer instinct' he was specifically referring to his willingness to physically hurt people in comparison to say, Shaq who would routinely try to brutalize opponents with elbows and his body where as Wilt (who had similar capability) almost never directed his physical prowess towards physically hurting his opponents.

He wanted to win at everything he ever did though, just as much as the next guy. Competitiveness is what makes players GOAT candidates not willingness to physically hurt people. How many times did MJ or Magic try to physically hurt their opponents? Is Isiah Thomas and Bruce Bowen better than MJ or Magic because they WERE willing to physically hurt opponents?

Competitivenes (ones desire to win) = / = Killer Instinct (the way Wilt used phrase, a willingness to hurt opponents)

[-23-]

When Wilt was referring to his 'killer instinct' he was specifically referring to his willingness to physically hurt people in comparison to say, Shaq who would routinely try to brutalize opponents with elbows and his body where as Wilt (who had similar capability) almost never directed his physical prowess towards physically hurting his opponents.

He wanted to win at everything he ever did though, just as much as the next guy. Competitiveness is what makes players GOAT candidates not willingness to physically hurt people. How many times did MJ or Magic try to physically hurt their opponents? Is Isiah Thomas and Bruce Bowen better than MJ or Magic because they WERE willing to physically hurt opponents?

Competitivenes (ones desire to win) = / = Killer Instinct (the way Wilt used phrase, a willingness to hurt opponents)

"Boston's Russell, at 6ft 9ins, was a consummate competitor, who recognised that Chamberlain lacked the killer instinct."
http://www.theguardian.com/news/1999...ianobituaries2

"He actually admitted that he sometimes lacked motivation on the court and often had to set certain individual goals in order to keep things interesting for him"

Does this sound like someone who is a killer? Or a player who's never fouled out of a game because he avoids playing physical to keep a record? Keep twisting the facts.

[CavaliersFTW]

"Boston's Russell, at 6ft 9ins, was a consummate competitor, who recognised that Chamberlain lacked the killer instinct."
http://www.theguardian.com/news/1999...ianobituaries2

"He actually admitted that he sometimes lacked motivation on the court and often had to set certain individual goals in order to keep things interesting for him"

Does this sound like someone who is a killer? Or a player who's never fouled out of a game because he avoids playing physical to keep a record? Keep twisting the facts.

Your quoting a journalist how bout I dig up some Skip Bayless quotes about Lebron and rile up the Lebron fans with a "Does this sound like someone who is a killer?"

Journalists push narratives, if there is no story they will make one up or put their own spin on things. How bout these quotes from actual teammates and contemporaries of his?
http://youtu.be/zukRbA3y0qo?t=8m36s

[-23-]

Wilt: Just Like Any Other 7-Foot Black Millionaire Who Lives Next Door: "I

[-23-]

Your quoting a journalist

I had a old SI article where former teammates, and competitors of Wilt also complained about his passive style. I'll try and find to dig it out. And the link quoted Russell, FYI. Read my earlier post from Wilt's OWN autobiography.

[-23-]

Your quoting a journalist how bout I dig up some Skip Bayless quotes about Lebron and rile up the Lebron fans with a "Does this sound like someone who is a killer?"

Journalists push narratives, if there is no story they will make one up or put their own spin on things. How bout these quotes from actual teammates and contemporaries of his?
http://youtu.be/zukRbA3y0qo?t=8m36s

The funny thing is, contemporaries always change their mind about Wilt. In one article, they'll talk about his passive playstyle, and in another, glorify him. This adds inconsistency to Wilt, whereas it's never disputed that someone like Jordan is a killer.

[Psileas]

I love how anti-Wilt guys carefully apply any form of context when Wilt talks about how good he was at something and always point out the exaggerations, but when it comes to quotes like Wilt describing himself as non-competitive, they take everything at face value. This is the same Wilt who Russell also described as wanting to win as much as he wanted, the same Wilt who was called competitive in just about everything he set his mind on, who debated everything, who cheated like mad in cards, who probably gambled, not to mention the NBA records themselves (how can you set so many of them if you're not competitive?) etc.
Yeah, clearly samples of a meek, weak-willed, non-competitive individual...

[CavaliersFTW]

Wilt: Just Like Any Other 7-Foot Black Millionaire Who Lives Next Door: "I’m just not naturally competitive and aggressive. I don’t have a killer instinct". (page 187)

Game 7 1970 NBA finals, Willis Reed has one intact thigh, and Wilt scored only 21 pts, and the Lakers lost.

I guarantee your missing the point of this cherry picked quote - what's the chapter about, what else does he say? One quote of him saying he's not competitive is laughable based on all accounts. Wilt says a lot of stupid shit when he wants to prove a point, this is demonstrable with countless examples (20,000, 50 inch vert, do you believe these at face value too?). Outside testimonials describe Wilt mentally as one of the most competitive people to have ever played the game - he refused to lose little discussions or card games on his flights to games let alone the basketball games themselves. He pushed the record book to it's absolute limit and it's still untouchable. A guy who 'isn't competitive' did that!? Yeah ****ing right And I pointed out, he's talked about killer instinct before and the context of it when he's discussed it on other occasions was his willingness to hurt people. He did not want to hurt people - but that is very different than competitiveness.

[CavaliersFTW]

The funny thing is, contemporaries always change their mind about Wilt. In one article, they'll talk about his passive playstyle, and in another, glorify him. This adds inconsistency to Wilt, whereas it's never disputed that someone like Jordan is a killer.

Your probably lumping them all together and failing to absorb who said what, when, where and why that's why - don't try and add an element of ambiguity just because I lay out some examples of guys (former teammates actually) totally dismantling your assertion. The guys who rip Wilt generally fall into two categories: Journalists and Celtics.

I've got plenty more quotes on this topic, a ready supply of testimonial and examples of Wilt's all-time high competitiveness. Shouldn't even be in question to begin with, you don't shatter records and all preconceived notions of stardom if your not insanely competitive

[-23-]

I guarantee your missing the point of this cherry picked quote - what's the chapter about, what else does he say? One quote of him saying he's not competitive is laughable based on all accounts. Wilt says a lot of stupid shit when he wants to prove a point, this is demonstrable with countless examples (20,000, 50 inch vert, do you believe these at face value too?). Outside testimonials describe Wilt mentally as one of the most competitive people to have ever played the game - he refused to lose little discussions or card games on his flights to games let alone the basketball games themselves. He pushed the record book to it's absolute limit and it's still untouchable. A guy who 'isn't competitive' did that!? Yeah ****ing right And I pointed out, he's talked about killer instinct before and the context of it when he's discussed it on other occasions was his willingness to hurt people. He did not want to hurt people - but that is very different than competitiveness.

Missing the point of the quote? Is this the bible? Metaphors and parables? What you need to do is read it at FACE because his quote has no room for interpretation.

Wilt's greatest idiosyncrasy was not fouling out. He had never fouled out of highschool, college or professional game and that was one record he was determined to protect. When he got that fourth foul, his game would change. I don't know how many potential victories he may have cheated his team out of by not really playing after he got into foul trouble.

from Hondo (john havlicek's book)

When it comes down to the closing minutes of a tough game, an important game, he doesn't want the ball, he doesn't want any part of the pressure.

Rick Barry

Wilt was too consumed with records: being the first to lead the league in assists. Or to set a record for field goal percentage. --- Russell only asked one question: 'What can I do to make us win?'
Jerry Lucas

Do any of these quotes make Wilt sound like a killer competitor? You don't get these inconsistencies at ALL with players like Jordan.

[-23-]

Your probably lumping them all together and failing to absorb who said what, when, where and why that's why - don't try and add an element of ambiguity just because I lay out some examples of guys (former teammates actually) totally dismantling your assertion. The guys who rip Wilt generally fall into two categories: Journalists and Celtics.

I've got plenty more quotes on this topic, a ready supply of testimonial and examples of Wilt's all-time high competitiveness. Shouldn't even be in question to begin with, you don't shatter records and all preconceived notions of stardom if your not insanely competitive

Regular season records in a developing league. Why even bring up so-called records when he only has 2 rings?

[millwad]

How about this...




Wilt's scoring and FG%s would have been MUCH higher. Oh, and Chamberlain's post-season FG% were MUCH higher when compared to league eFG%'s.

That is just pure garbage and nonsense. Wilt lost in the playoffs to better teams and so did Hakeem plenty of seasons.

Your bogus about first round exits doesn't make any sense, you're actually owning yourself with that shit. It's actually the other way around, if you beat a team in the playoffs as a leading scorer, it's more likely that you'll have a better stat line in the series you win compared to the other way around.

Just because Wilt shrunk the further he went in the playoffs it doesn't give you the reason to claim such a ludacris thing.

[-23-]

"Wilt wanted to be involved in every half-court play, so he stood there in the middle and all of us would run around him and he tried to pile up his assists. You've got to remember that assists were kept much more strictly back then. There was none of this stuff like today where you can take three dribbles and a head-fake and it counts. You got assists if you caught the pass and made the shot. So that meant Wilt would only pass it to guys who could catch and shoot -- Luke, Billy sometimes, Wali, Hal and me. In my case, he'd try to get me to just go backdoor for a layup, because he didn't trust me to do much else. And he'd never pass it to Chet Walker, because Chet always had to be pump-faking or use a dribble and take away the assist."

http://www.nba.com/2012/news/feature...s=iref:nbahpt1

Stat-whore =/= Competitor. Breaking records is not "competitive" as your just dicking around your own ego at the expense of your teammates. Being a killer is stabbing your opponent when their down, and winning the game.