Scottie Pippen vs. John Havlicek

[oarabbus]

In one corner we got Scottie Pippen


6 Championships
7 Allstar selections
3 All-NBA 1st team
NBA Steals Leader
8x defensive first team

Career stats: 16/6/5 with 2spg (although lowered due to his twilight seasons)
Best season (he has several roughly like this): 22/9/5.5/3stl
And don't forget amazing point forward ability, all-time GOAT-level defensive ability (non-big), basically one of the most complete non-GOATs to ever play



And we have John Havlicek:

8 Championships
1 FMVP
13 Allstar selections
4 All-NBA 1st team
5x defensive first team
Celtics all time leading scorer (not an all NBA award but impressive nonetheless)

Career stats: 21/6/5 (steals and blocks not recorded for most of his career)
Best season: 29/9/7.5
And don't forget great handling/passing and rebounding ability, very good defense (not quite on the level of Pippen), and a contender for GOAT motor.

"In 1974, Bill Russell summed up Havlicek's career by saying "He is the best all-around player I ever saw."



I think I have to go with the legend... Hondo on this one. Real tough to choose but the FMVP does it for me.

[Smoke117]

You could probably find half a dozen threads on this in the first 30 pages. It's always been a retarded comparison, because the majority of people who have actually seen Havlicek play is maybe 5% on this board? Stats is all well and nice, but you can't compare players in general you haven't seen. (havlicek and Frankly Scottie really...i mean he was 34 already and past his prime in 2000, 14 years ago) It is just going to come down to numbers and no actual eye test. If you know anything about basketball, you know there is no true comparison unless you've given the eye test (no it is not fool proof, as a lot idiots have retard eyes) to each player and for a good amount of time.

[c5terror]

In one corner we got Scottie Pippen


6 Championships
7 Allstar selections
3 All-NBA 1st team
NBA Steals Leader
8x defensive first team

Career stats: 16/6/5 with 2spg (although lowered due to his twilight seasons)
Best season (he has several roughly like this): 22/9/5.5/3stl
And don't forget amazing point forward ability, all-time GOAT-level defensive ability (non-big), basically one of the most complete non-GOATs to ever play



And we have John Havlicek:

8 Championships
1 FMVP
13 Allstar selections
4 All-NBA 1st team
5x defensive first team
Celtics all time leading scorer (not an all NBA award but impressive nonetheless)

Career stats: 21/6/5 (steals and blocks not recorded for most of his career)
Best season: 29/9/7.5
And don't forget great handling/passing and rebounding ability, very good defense (not quite on the level of Pippen), and a contender for GOAT motor.

"In 1974, Bill Russell summed up Havlicek's career by saying "He is the best all-around player I ever saw."



I think I have to go with the legend... Hondo on this one. Real tough to choose but the FMVP does it for me.

I wasn't able to see more of Havlicek games so i can't judge him..
but due to my bias towards 80's-90's bulls, ill pick pippen..

[bizil]

GOAT and peak wise give me Hondo! In many ways Hondo was the precursor to what Pip represented later down the road. Point forward type skills and lockdown type D. Pip added Dr. J type size and athletic ability to it. The main thing that separates Hondo was he was a true alpha dog level player while Pippen never was. There is a reason why Hondo is a top 15-20 GOAT type player and top 4 GOAT SF.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Obviously I didn't see Havlicek play live and have seen very little footage of him but there are only like 15 players i've seen play (either on tape or live) I'd for sure take over Scottie Pippen.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Pippen:

Career stats: 16/6/5 with 2spg (although lowered due to his twilight seasons)

Havlicek:

Career stats: 21/6/5 (steals and blocks not recorded for most of his career)

They both played until age 37, so the qualifier for Pippen is moot imo.

[pudman13]

The main thing that separates Hondo was he was a true alpha dog level player while Pippen never was.

Absolutely true. Pippen obviously has a size advantage, but if it was a key game and a key moment I'd rather have the ball in Hondo's hands, and when it comes to making a key defensive play, despite Pippen's reputation I say it's a wash.

This is a weird comparison, really.

[3ball]

After watching that "Next 10" show, it appears to be common knowledge among some former players that Pippen was distinctly overrated..

So I'm going with the other guy anytime it's close with Pippen - give me Hondo.

[La Frescobaldi]

ish with a balanced view?? It's a world gone mad...

[mehyaM24]

pippen: he had no weaknesses.

as soon as pip came to town, he turned the bulls franchise around. a bulls franchise who were recently just 1-9 in the playoffs.

the all around exploits he and lebron were/are cabable of = truly understated.

[DatAsh]

Havlicek was the better player. I also agree with saying they were on different tiers defensively; both are in that very top tier of perimeter defenders.

[JellyBean]

GOAT and peak wise give me Hondo! In many ways Hondo was the precursor to what Pip represented later down the road. Point forward type skills and lockdown type D. Pip added Dr. J type size and athletic ability to it. The main thing that separates Hondo was he was a true alpha dog level player while Pippen never was. There is a reason why Hondo is a top 15-20 GOAT type player and top 4 GOAT SF.

This right here. Hondo gets my vote.

[oarabbus]

After watching that "Next 10" show, it appears to be common knowledge among some former players that Pippen was distinctly overrated..

So I'm going with the other guy anytime it's close with Pippen - give me Hondo.

What exactly is that? Although I'm not sure I should even bother since you are one of the biggest Jordan stans on this board and your agenda is clear. Anything to prop up Jordan, especially shitting on his teammates.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

GOAT and peak wise give me Hondo! In many ways Hondo was the precursor to what Pip represented later down the road. Point forward type skills and lockdown type D. Pip added Dr. J type size and athletic ability to it. The main thing that separates Hondo was he was a true alpha dog level player while Pippen never was. There is a reason why Hondo is a top 15-20 GOAT type player and top 4 GOAT SF.

LOL @ Hondo being top 15-20 GOAT or top 4 GOAT SF

Who is he better than out of these players

MJ
Russell
KAJ
Hakeem
Shaq
Bird
Kobe
Magic
Wilt
KG
Timmy
Dirk
Moses
Oscar
Jerry
Karl
Chuck
Robinson
Lebron
DrJ
Wade

[JimmyMcAdocious]

What exactly is that?

Open Court.

But it was pretty much Zeke who talked shit about Pippen and Zeke is always salty.